"In the Spirit"

[Indentured Servant]

I. John, in Revelation, wrote four times, "I was in the Spirit." (1:10, 4:2, 17:3, & 21:10)

What did he mean by "in the Spirit?"


II. Jesus indicated that David was "in the Spirit" and quotes Psalm 110:1. (Matt 22:43)

What did He mean by "in the Spirit?"


III. In Paul's letter to the Ephesians (6:18), he instructs them to "pray in the Spirit."

What did he mean by "in the Spirit?"


I'm not so interested in hearing a theological dissertation in response to this... I really want to know what each of you personally, in your own words, understand this to mean.

What does it mean TO YOU to be "in the Spirit?" How do YOU PERSONALLY get "in the Spirit?"

 

[JLB]

I. John, in Revelation, wrote four times, "I was in the Spirit." (1:10, 4:2, 17:3, & 21:10)

What did he mean by "in the Spirit?"


II. Jesus indicated that David was "in the Spirit" and quotes Psalm 110:1. (Matt 22:43)

What did He mean by "in the Spirit?"


III. In Paul's letter to the Ephesians (6:18), he instructs them to "pray in the Spirit."

What did he mean by "in the Spirit?"


I'm not so interested in hearing a theological dissertation in response to this... I really want to know what each of you personally, in your own words, understand this to mean.

What does it mean TO YOU to be "in the Spirit?" How do YOU PERSONALLY get "in the Spirit?"

Under the influence of the Holy Spirit, which can mean being in the spirit realm, and even being caught up to heaven

It can also mean influence or inspired by the Spirit to speak a word from God such as a prophet or write scripture such as did David and Moses and Paul.

 

[Exeter]

I'm not so interested in hearing a theological dissertation in response to this... I really want to know what each of you personally, in your own words, understand this to mean.

What does it mean TO YOU to be "in the Spirit?" How do YOU PERSONALLY get "in the Spirit?"

Being in the Spirit requires not being in the flesh, which is something that needs to be crucified, metaphorically of course.

Gal 5:24-25 And those who are Christ's have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. (25) If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.

Live in the Spirit = Abide according to the Will of God.
Walk in the Spirit = Act according to the Will of God.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

What did he mean by "in the Spirit?"

In St. John's context, that means a vision, like a Virtual Reality. At that moment all the harsh and mundane surroundings in island of Patmos faded away, all he could see, feel and hear was this vision of God's revelation - of Christ.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

Being in the Spirit requires not being in the flesh, which is something that needs to be crucified, metaphorically of course.

Gal 5:24-25 And those who are Christ's have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. (25) If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.

Live in the Spirit = Abide according to the Will of God.
Walk in the Spirit = Act according to the Will of God.

This Will of God is the external force that overcomes your inertia and pushes you out of your comfort zone. Without it you're stuck, and you won't be able to give yourself that push. That's Newton's first law of motion, which is NOT limited to physical movement, but also spiritual movement.

 

[Indentured Servant]

This Will of God is the external force that overcomes your inertia and pushes you out of your comfort zone. Without it you're stuck, and you won't be able to give yourself that push. That's Newton's first law of motion, which is NOT limited to physical movement, but also spiritual movement.

That is a very thoughtful view.

 

[Hidden In Him]

I. John, in Revelation, wrote four times, "I was in the Spirit." (1:10, 4:2, 17:3, & 21:10)

What did he mean by "in the Spirit?"


II. Jesus indicated that David was "in the Spirit" and quotes Psalm 110:1. (Matt 22:43)

What did He mean by "in the Spirit?"


III. In Paul's letter to the Ephesians (6:18), he instructs them to "pray in the Spirit."

What did he mean by "in the Spirit?"


I'm not so interested in hearing a theological dissertation in response to this... I really want to know what each of you personally, in your own words, understand this to mean.

What does it mean TO YOU to be "in the Spirit?" How do YOU PERSONALLY get "in the Spirit?"

Excellent questions. I'd qualify things initially by saying there is no way to avoid a doctrinal and scriptural dispute over the issue, but without even looking at the passages and going purely on memory (if it serves me correctly. I'm at work):

II. Jesus indicated that David was "in the Spirit" and quotes Psalm 110:1. (Matt 22:43)

What did He mean by "in the Spirit?"

Caught up in the Spirit, i.e. being spoken to while the Spirit rested heavily upon him. David was among other things a prophet.

III. In Paul's letter to the Ephesians (6:18), he instructs them to "pray in the Spirit."

What did he mean by "in the Spirit?"

Praying under the leading of the Holy Spirit. I'd have to look again but this is likely a reference to praying in tongues.

I. John, in Revelation, wrote four times, "I was in the Spirit." (1:10, 4:2, 17:3, & 21:10)

What did he mean by "in the Spirit?"

Taken up in Spirit, i.e. transported by the Spirit of God to where they are in another realm, whether 2nd Heaven, 3rd Heaven as Paul was, or simply transported to somewhere on earth (potentially in a different time as if they have been transported into the future, i.e. through a vision).

I didn't get a chance to welcome you yet, so blessings in Christ.
And welcome to ChristianForums.net.
Hidden In Him

 

[Exeter]

This Will of God is the external force that overcomes your inertia and pushes you out of your comfort zone. Without it you're stuck, and you won't be able to give yourself that push. That's Newton's first law of motion, which is NOT limited to physical movement, but also spiritual movement.

Opposition to the Will of God is the natural tendency of unregenerate humanity. It was first suggested to Eve by the Tempter in the Garden of Eden, and carried out by both her and Adam, the latter being the one who was expressly instructed by the Lord not to partake of the fruit of the Tree Of The Knowledge Of Good And Evil, so is the one who is held responsible for bringing sin and death into the world.

Rom 5:12 Therefore, even as through one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin, and so death passed on all men inasmuch as all sinned:
Rom 5:19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of One shall many be made righteous.

We do see something like your comment taking place in these verses, Carry_Your_Name

Gal 5:16-18 I say, then, Walk in the Spirit and you shall not fulfill the lusts of the flesh. (17) For the flesh lusts against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh. And these are contrary to one another; lest whatever you may will, these things you do. (18) But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under law.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

Opposition to the Will of God is the natural tendency of unregenerate humanity. It was first suggested to Eve by the Tempter in the Garden of Eden, and carried out by both her and Adam, the latter being the one who was expressly instructed by the Lord not to partake of the fruit of the Tree Of The Knowledge Of Good And Evil, so is the one who is held responsible for bringing sin and death into the world.

Rom 5:12 Therefore, even as through one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin, and so death passed on all men inasmuch as all sinned:
Rom 5:19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of One shall many be made righteous.

We do see something like your comment taking place in these verses, Carry_Your_Name

Gal 5:16-18 I say, then, Walk in the Spirit and you shall not fulfill the lusts of the flesh. (17) For the flesh lusts against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh. And these are contrary to one another; lest whatever you may will, these things you do. (18) But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under law.

Yes, our brain is wired with a pleasure-seeking and pain-avoiding system, prioritized for individual survival, this is known as the limbic system, also colloquially dubbed "lizard brain" because this is the only functional system in a lizard's brain. This is the lust of the flesh, already proven by science. It doesn't mean we should act recklessly and deny our basic physiological needs - that's pagan gnostic phylosophy; but if you're led by this lust of the flesh and that's all you have, then you'd be like a lizard, you'll live by bread only and not every word of God.

 

[Tenchi]

I. John, in Revelation, wrote four times, "I was in the Spirit." (1:10, 4:2, 17:3, & 21:10)

What did he mean by "in the Spirit?"

John explained what he meant, didn't he?

Revelation 1:10-18
10 I was in the Spirit on the Lord’s day, and I heard behind me a loud voice like a trumpet
11 saying, “Write what you see in a book and send it to the seven churches, to Ephesus and to Smyrna and to Pergamum and to Thyatira and to Sardis and to Philadelphia and to Laodicea.”
12 Then I turned to see the voice that was speaking to me, and on turning I saw seven golden lampstands,
13 and in the midst of the lampstands one like a son of man, clothed with a long robe and with a golden sash around his chest.
14 The hairs of his head were white, like white wool, like snow. His eyes were like a flame of fire,
15 his feet were like burnished bronze, refined in a furnace, and his voice was like the roar of many waters.
16 In his right hand he held seven stars, from his mouth came a sharp two-edged sword, and his face was like the sun shining in full strength.
17 When I saw him, I fell at his feet as though dead. But he laid his right hand on me, saying, “Fear not, I am the first and the last,
18 and the living one. I died, and behold I am alive forevermore, and I have the keys of Death and Hades.

"In the Spirit," in context, means, "I had a vision (of the ascended, glorified Jesus in heaven, who spoke to me)." This is the case in each of the instances you've cited from the Book of the Revelation of John. Whenever John is "in the Spirit" he describes some heavenly vision:

Revelation 4:1-3
1 After this I looked, and behold, a door standing open in heaven! And the first voice, which I had heard speaking to me like a trumpet, said, “Come up here, and I will show you what must take place after this.”
2 At once I was in the Spirit, and behold, a throne stood in heaven, with one seated on the throne.
3 And he who sat there had the appearance of jasper and carnelian, and around the throne was a rainbow that had the appearance of an emerald.

Revelation 17:3
3 And he carried me away in the Spirit into a wilderness, and I saw a woman sitting on a scarlet beast that was full of blasphemous names, and it had seven heads and ten horns.

Revelation 21:9-10
9 Then came one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls full of the seven last plagues and spoke to me, saying, “Come, I will show you the Bride, the wife of the Lamb.”
10 And he carried me away in the Spirit to a great, high mountain, and showed me the holy city Jerusalem coming down out of heaven from God,

So, then, in John's case, "in the Spirit" simply means "I had a supernatural vision."

II. Jesus indicated that David was "in the Spirit" and quotes Psalm 110:1. (Matt 22:43)

What did He mean by "in the Spirit?"

Psalm 110:1
1 The LORD says to my Lord: “Sit at my right hand, until I make your enemies your footstool.”

Matthew 22:43-44
43 He said to them, “How is it then that David, in the Spirit, calls him Lord, saying,
44 “‘The Lord said to my Lord, “Sit at my right hand, until I put your enemies under your feet”’?

Just as John received something from God (a vision), David received something also from God (inspired words). In both cases, then, "in the Spirit" entailed "receiving something from God." Neither the apostle John nor Jesus described "in the Spirit" as some ecstatic emotional experience and/or convulsive physical condition where they were aggressively overwhelmed by the Holy Spirit. David indicated nothing of this sort, either, when he wrote Psalm 110:1, which suggests he may have been entirely unaware that he had received something from God when he wrote the verse.

III. In Paul's letter to the Ephesians (6:18), he instructs them to "pray in the Spirit."

What did he mean by "in the Spirit?"

Ephesians 6:18
18 praying at all times in the Spirit, with all prayer and supplication. To that end keep alert with all perseverance, making supplication for all the saints,

Can a Christian who is only a Christian because they are indwelt by the Holy Spirit (Romans 8:9-16; 1 John 4:13; Titus 3:5; 1 Corinthians 6:19-20), readily move in and out of the Spirit? Are they saved and then not, back and forth, throughout a day? Does the Holy Spirit come and go from the born-again person, as he did in the OT? Absolutely not.

Hebrews 13:5
5 Keep your life free from love of money, and be content with what you have, for he has said, “I will never leave you nor forsake you.”

John 14:16-17
16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Helper, to be with you forever,
17 even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him. You know him, for he dwells with you and will be in you.

1 Corinthians 6:19-20
19 Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God? You are not your own,
20 for you were bought with a price. So glorify God in your body.

John 10:27-29
27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me.
28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand.
29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand.

If, then, Paul was not indicating by the phrase "in the Spirit" that the Holy Spirit would repeatedly leave and return to a born-again person, what did he mean? Well, consider what Paul wrote to the believers at Rome:

Romans 8:9
9 You, however, are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if in fact the Spirit of God dwells in you. Anyone who does not have the Spirit of Christ does not belong to him.

According to Paul, "in the Spirit" means "the Spirit of God dwells in you," which is another way of saying, "Saved," or "belongs to Christ." Praying in the Spirit, then, means nothing more than praying as one who is a born-again child of God, as one who has, by trusting in Christ as Savior and Lord (Romans 10:9-10), "put on Christ" (Galatians 3:27; Romans 13:14) and the "armor" that he is spiritually.

I'm not so interested in hearing a theological dissertation in response to this... I really want to know what each of you personally, in your own words, understand this to mean.

??? How can I, as a Christian, not conform my understanding of "in the Spirit" to what God's word says? Personal experience, personal understanding, of spiritual things only has any value insofar as it aligns with what God has said in His word. Any other subjective experience not doing so may be interesting, but cannot be spiritually prescriptive or useful.

What does it mean TO YOU to be "in the Spirit?" How do YOU PERSONALLY get "in the Spirit?"

Getting "in the Spirit" is simply to be born-again. Fundamentally, it has no greater meaning than this. But being "in the Spirit," that is, born-again, is the doorway to "walking in/by the Spirit." This is to be the constant, normal state in which every Christian person lives. Do you "walk in/by the Spirit" every day? Do you know what it is to do so?

Galatians 5:16
16 But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh.

Galatians 5:25
25 If we live by the Spirit, let us also walk by the Spirit.

 

[hawkman]

What does it mean TO YOU to be "in the Spirit?" How do YOU PERSONALLY get "in the Spirit?"

More than once when I was praying I would say I was in the spirit but this is controlled by the Holy Spirit .

Just as John received something from God (a vision), David received something also from God (inspired words). In both cases, then, "in the Spirit" entailed "receiving something from God." Neither the apostle John nor Jesus described "in the Spirit" as some ecstatic emotional experience and/or convulsive physical condition where they were aggressively overwhelmed by the Holy Spirit. David indicated nothing of this sort, either, when he wrote Psalm 110:1, which suggests he may have been entirely unaware that he had received something from God when he wrote the verse.

Thanks for sharing this Tenchi . I was unaware too but my understanding came later , I saw letters on a painting where there had never been any letters before , I was not praying . Three of my relatives in the room with me did not see any letters on the painting . I just thought I was seeing something I had never been able to see before on the painting but the letters were there only for me to see . I did not understand it was a vision till later . My relatives were taken aback by my seeing the letters on the painting that they did not see .
Years later a friend revealed a dream he had to me and it too spoke of the same letters I saw in my vision , then I understood what it was about .

Getting "in the Spirit" is simply to be born-again.

I can't agree with you on this . My three relatives that were in the room with me are Christians and they did not see the letters on the painting .
There were no other sensations out of the ordinary present for me when I saw the letters on the painting , everything seemed normal to me . Yet I would say I was in the Spirit .

 

[Tenchi]

More than once when I was praying I would say I was in the spirit but this is controlled by the Holy Spirit .

I'd certainly hope you were in the Spirit when you were praying! God only hears one prayer from those who aren't in the Spirit: A prayer of repentance, confession, submission to, and trust in, Christ as Savior and Lord.

I can't agree with you on this . My three relatives that were in the room with me are Christians and they did not see the letters on the painting .

Hmmm. I have pointed out what God's word offers in explanation of the phrase "in the Spirit." So long as your experience and mine align with what Scripture says, our experiences are useful in supporting God's truth and encouraging fellow believers. But other experiences - like the one you had with the painting that has no such alignment with Scripture - cannot be definitive in regards to what it is to be "in the Spirit."

You see, what you've described is, at bottom, one of those "because I said so" stories that are purely subjective, unable to be objectively tested and verified. We just have to take your word for it that what you experienced actually happened and was what you think it was. Anyone, though, can say almost anything about being "in the Spirit" on this basis.

 

[hawkman]

You see, what you've described is, at bottom, one of those "because I said so" stories that are purely subjective, unable to be objectively tested and verified. We just have to take your word for it that what you experienced actually happened and was what you think it was. Anyone, though, can say almost anything about being "in the Spirit" on this basis.

Let me ask , how do you test and verify the supernatural events of God ?

 

[Tenchi]

Let me ask , how do you test and verify the supernatural events of God ?

Good question.

If a believer wants to tell me they have had, say, an "in the Spirit" vision, like the apostle John, I'd want to know why they think so and what biblical grounds they stand on in thinking so. Why should I be convinced they have had such an experience on the basis of their mere say-so? And why should what persuades them they've had such an experience also persuade me?

Do I see in God's word any similar "in the Spirit" event?

Are God's priorities for His Church and His individual children, set out in Scripture, well-served by the event?

Is the event in keeping with the character of God?

Has the person claiming to have had the experience demonstrated over an extended period of time a Spirit-controlled-and-filled life, after the manner described in the Bible? Are they holy, well-versed in Scripture, clearly manifesting the fruit of the Spirit in their living?

Has the subject of the "in the Spirit" event claimed to have had other such events that have proved in some way to be false, perhaps even demonic?

These are the essential questions I would apply to anyone claiming to have had an "in the Spirit" vision.

 

[hawkman]

If a believer wants to tell me they have had, say, an "in the Spirit" vision, like the apostle John, I'd want to know why they think so and what biblical grounds they stand on in thinking so.

The vision I saw combined with a friends dream gave me the details of a future event . My friend dismissed his dream and laughed it off even when I understood it was from God within the first sentence of his retelling the dream . His denomination does not believe in the signs Gifts are for today .

Do I see in God's word any similar "in the Spirit" event?

Why do you think an event has to be similar to what has happened already in scripture ? Do you have God confined to what he has already done ? So was my event similar as you say , God has communicated with letters on a wall before .

Are God's priorities for His Church and His individual children, set out in Scripture, well-served by the event?

The power that was present in the first century church is still with us today and the event I had shows that to me but maybe no one else .

Is the event in keeping with the character of God?

Without a doubt it did .

Has the person claiming to have had the experience demonstrated over an extended period of time a Spirit-controlled-and-filled life, after the manner described in the Bible? Are they holy, well-versed in Scripture, clearly manifesting the fruit of the Spirit in their living?

Yes .

Has the subject of the "in the Spirit" event claimed to have had other such events that have proved in some way to be false, perhaps even demonic?

No I have not but I have had dreams that gave me warning of dangers to come in my life .

 

[Exeter]

The vision I saw combined with a friends dream gave me the details of a future event . My friend dismissed his dream and laughed it off even when I understood it was from God within the first sentence of his retelling the dream . His denomination does not believe in the signs Gifts are for today .

Why do you think an event has to be similar to what has happened already in scripture ? Do you have God confined to what he has already done ? So was my event similar as you say , God has communicated with letters on a wall before .

The power that was present in the first century church is still with us today and the event I had shows that to me but maybe no one else .

Without a doubt it did .

Yes .

No I have not but I have had dreams that gave me warning of dangers to come in my life .

When testimonies of God's Providence and Intervention, be it through miracles, promptings, parlance, dreams, or visions, are given, it is wise they be accompanied with humility. Paul knew that after God explained it to him.

2Co 12:7 And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, . . .

 

[hawkman]

Has the person claiming to have had the experience demonstrated over an extended period of time a Spirit-controlled-and-filled life, after the manner described in the Bible? Are they holy, well-versed in Scripture, clearly manifesting the fruit of the Spirit in their living?

I am not sure where your requirements are coming from , are they your requirements or God's requirements ?

Holiness is something I am working on , are you not working on holiness too ?

We will never be perfect in this world .

When testimonies of God's Providence and Intervention, be it through miracles, promptings, parlance, dreams, or visions, are given, it is wise they be accompanied with humility. Paul knew that after God explained it to him.

2Co 12:7 And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, . . .

Thank you for the comment .

For whom much is given much is required .

Am I here to boast and glory in what I have seen or experienced of God's power ? God forbid that is my purpose .

2 Corinthians 12​

1 It is not expedient for me doubtless to glory. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord.

2 I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up to the third heaven.

3 And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;)

4 How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.

5 Of such an one will I glory: yet of myself I will not glory, but in mine infirmities.

6 For though I would desire to glory, I shall not be a fool; for I will say the truth: but now I forbear, lest any man should think of me above that which he seeth me to be, or that he heareth of me.

7 And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.

8 For this thing I besought the Lord thrice, that it might depart from me.

9 And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

10 Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong.

 

[Exeter]

Am I here to boast and glory in what I have seen or experienced of God's power ? God forbid that is my purpose .

I am not sure where your requirements are coming from , are they your requirements or God's requirements ?

Holiness is something I am working on , are you not working on holiness too ?

We will never be perfect in this world .


Thank you for the comment .

For whom much is given much is required .

Am I here to boast and glory in what I have seen or experienced of God's power ? God forbid that is my purpose .

2 Corinthians 12​

1 It is not expedient for me doubtless to glory. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord.

2 I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up to the third heaven.

3 And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;)

4 How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.

5 Of such an one will I glory: yet of myself I will not glory, but in mine infirmities.

6 For though I would desire to glory, I shall not be a fool; for I will say the truth: but now I forbear, lest any man should think of me above that which he seeth me to be, or that he heareth of me.

7 And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.

8 For this thing I besought the Lord thrice, that it might depart from me.

9 And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

10 Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong.

I hope you don't mind me using Copilot to continue this conversation hawkman .

Quote:
In the 13 chapters of 2 Corinthians, the word “boast” appears 21 times. Paul uses this term to emphasize various aspects of his ministry, experiences, and relationship with God. Interestingly, he also acknowledges that boasting is acceptable when it reflects an understanding and knowledge of God, as seen in 2 Corinthians 10:17-18: “Let one who boasts, boast in the Lord” So, while Paul’s frequent use of the word might seem excessive, it serves a purpose in conveying his message and defending his apostleship. [Copilot]

Some translations have "glory" for "boast". This is from the Berean Study Bible:
Jer 9:23-24 This is what the LORD says: “Let not the wise man boast in his wisdom, nor the strong man in his strength, nor the wealthy man in his riches. (24) But let him who boasts boast in this, that he understands and knows Me, that I am the LORD, who exercises loving devotion, justice and righteousness on the earth— for I delight in these things,” declares the LORD.

 

[Tenchi]

The vision I saw combined with a friends dream gave me the details of a future event . My friend dismissed his dream and laughed it off even when I understood it was from God within the first sentence of his retelling the dream . His denomination does not believe in the signs Gifts are for today .

So, how were God's priorities for the Church and His children, individually, served by your vision?

Why do you think an event has to be similar to what has happened already in scripture ?

Constraints or boundaries seem particularly vital in this business of claims of divine action/communication. False prophets abound. From where do we derive limits on what we can expect from God if not from His own word?

So was my event similar as you say , God has communicated with letters on a wall before .

Are you a wicked king under divine judgment? No. And everyone saw the hand and the writing on the wall. Not really like your story, is it?

The power that was present in the first century church is still with us today and the event I had shows that to me but maybe no one else .

God is with us, yes. His Spirit is with us, yes. But we aren't the first century Church, just getting established in a powerfully antagonistic, multi-religious culture.

In any case, what you wrote above doesn't address the question to which it was responding.

Without a doubt it did .

I don't see how...

I am not sure where your requirements are coming from , are they your requirements or God's requirements ?

Holiness is something I am working on , are you not working on holiness too ?

We will never be perfect in this world .

Psalm 66:18
18 If I regard wickedness in my heart, The Lord will not hear me;

Isaiah 59:2
2 But your iniquities have made a separation between you and your God, And your sins have hidden His face from you so that He does not hear.

1 Peter 3:12
12 For the eyes of the Lord are on the righteous, and his ears are open to their prayer. But the face of the Lord is against those who do evil.”

I have very serious doubt that God is giving visions, or any divine communication, to the believer who is not holy. The above verses make it clear that one's sin cuts one off from fellowship with God, as it did in the case of the Prodigal Son. And when that fellowship (not relationship) is broken, communication from God ceases. He goes deaf to the believer who regards wickedness in their heart; He stands apart from the believer who lives in iniquity and sin; His face is against those believers who do evil.

Somehow, though, Christians think all of this is undone or dissolved by the statement, "No one's perfect." God does not yield at all, to our sin, however. In satisfaction of God's unyielding holy justice, every single sin we have committed, or will commit, was paid for by Christ, with his shed blood and his broken body on the cross. God never says, "Well, none of you are perfect, so some sin is okay." When we sin - especially willfully - as a child of God, knowing the terrible price paid in atonement for our sin, we "trample under foot the Son of God" and "despise the Spirit of grace," and "count the blood of the covenant an unholy thing" (Hebrews 10:26-29). Those who live like this have this promise from God:

Hebrews 10:30-31
30 For we know him who said, “Vengeance is mine; I will repay.” And again, “The Lord will judge his people.”
31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

For such a believer there aren't divine visions but only divine discipline! (Hebrews 12:5-11; Romans 1:18-32) And God doesn't distinguish between what we think are lesser and greater sins, winking at the the sin we think is "not so bad."

James 2:10
10 For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles in one point, he has become guilty of all.

Proverbs 6:16-19
16 There are six things which the LORD hates, Yes, seven which are an abomination to Him:
17 Haughty eyes, a lying tongue, And hands that shed innocent blood,
18 A heart that devises wicked plans, Feet that run rapidly to evil,
19 A false witness who utters lies, And one who spreads strife among brothers.

God puts in the same list of abominations both a proud look (haughty eyes) and murder (shed innocent blood)! But, too often, I hear Christians making room for sin that doesn't bother them, sin that seems trivial to them. These same Christians are trying to tell fellow believers that God has given them a special "word," or "dream," or "vision" though their marriage is a terrible mess, or they're addicted to their cell phone, or food, or porn, or they fall into mad tempers, swearing like a sailor when they do, and so on.

I'm not saying that any of this is true of you hawkman, however. I couldn't, knowing nothing, really, about you.

 

[hawkman]

So, how were God's priorities for the Church and His children, individually, served by your vision?

I am not lead at this time to share all the details of the vision and dream shared with me .

Why did God give me the vision , my timing is not God's timing . It was @ 5 years before I had any idea what the vision connected to .

Constraints or boundaries seem particularly vital in this business of claims of divine action/communication.

Know this Tenchi you do not have to believe me . I am not here to convince anyone , if God wants to He will . But only to share what is STILL possible in the age we live in .

From where do we derive limits on what we can expect from God if not from His own word?

I serve a God that is unlimited in power . The limits you would place on God are foreign to me .

Are you a wicked king under divine judgment? No.

Glad that is cleared up !

And everyone saw the hand and the writing on the wall. Not really like your story, is it?

Similar you said . Letters on a wall , letters on a painting on a wall . Not English letters in either case .

Who am I to question the way God would communicate with me ! Am I to say , no God don't communicate with me in this form it ain't in the Bible .

But it still baffles me as to why you confine God to what has happened before and even then we do not know ALL that has happened , everything is NOT in the Bible !

In any case, what you wrote above doesn't address the question to which it was responding.

I don't see how...

And that is ok . I did not expect you would . You are an admitted "soft" cessationist if I remember correctly .

Now I have something to say about me , I have been a Christian for over 3 decades and I have seen God work miracles of healing , I have seen evidence God's Devine protection over my life and family more than once , I have had dreams of my future that came true . I believe this was preparing me for even more of the power of God to be revealed to me , pray for me that I will be ready to perform the task God desires of me .