Isaiah 53:11

[Scotth1960]

Would you consider reading Isaiah 53:11 in the ESV, HCSB, OSB, etc. (English Standard Version, Holman Christian Standard Bible, Orthodox Study Bible).

I read: "Isaiah 53:11 Many recent translations, including the NIV, NAB, NEB/REB, and NRSV, accept the addition of the word "wr" "light", in both 1QIsa-a and 1QIsa-b. Not only is the weight of the manuscript convincing to these translators, but the balance of the parallelism is improved as well. HOTTP agrees that translators should follow the Qumran reading here. Morrow (1973:143), however, disagrees, calling attention to the fact that "light" plays a significant role in the theology of the Qumran community. The assumption that the Qumran scribes would have added "light" to the text presupposes that both copies were made at Qumran, which is not necessarily the case". [page 132:
Harold Scanlin. The Dead Sea Scrolls & Modern Translations of the Old Testament. Wheaton, IL: Tyndale House Publishers, Inc., copyright 1993.].

Note: The Greek OT LXX has "light" and so does the DSSB (Dead Sea Scrolls Bible). In Erie PA Scott R. Harrington:nod

 

[farouk]

Could you explain in one or two lines what you mean, please?

 

[Scotth1960]

Could you explain in one or two lines what you mean, please?

Isaiah 53:11 ESV with commentary.
"Out of the anguish of his soul he shall see light and be satisfied; by his knowledge shall the righteous one, my servant, make many to be accounted righteous, and he shall bear their iniquities."

Who is being referred to here in this verse? Jesus Christ "the righteous one" (the only righteous one). The Messiah of Israel. What does he see? Light. What does that mean? He is risen from the dead, trampling down death by His death. And he "bears their iniquities", the sins of all sinners throughout the world. This verse comments on the suffering of the Messiah, Jesus Christ and His resurrection ("light", seeing light of life). The NIV has the phrase "the light of life".
:nod

 

[Hitch]

Isaiah 53:11 ESV with commentary.
"Out of the anguish of his soul he shall see light and be satisfied; by his knowledge shall the righteous one, my servant, make many to be accounted righteous, and he shall bear their iniquities."

Who is being referred to here in this verse? Jesus Christ "the righteous one" (the only righteous one). The Messiah of Israel. What does he see? Light. What does that mean? He is risen from the dead, trampling down death by His death. And he "bears their iniquities", the sins of all sinners throughout the world. This verse comments on the suffering of the Messiah, Jesus Christ and His resurrection ("light", seeing light of life). The NIV has the phrase "the light of life".
:nod

Interesting it says make many , rather than make all.

 

[Scotth1960]

Interesting it says make many , rather than make all.

Actually, there is a verse in the NT that says, "And not for our sins only, but for the sins of the whole world." Christ's atonement is unlimited, not limited, as Calvinists falsely preach. Go figure. John Calvin was a hateful bigot. Anything wrong in myself I want to repent of. In Erie Scott H.
:nod

 

[Hitch]

Actually, there is a verse in the NT that says, "And not for our sins only, but for the sins of the whole world." Christ's atonement is unlimited, not limited, as Calvinists falsely preach. Go figure. John Calvin was a hateful bigot. Anything wrong in myself I want to repent of. In Erie Scott H.
:nod

Interesting thing coming from you

 

[Alabaster]

Of course, my NLT says:

When he sees all that is accomplished by his anguish,
he will be satisfied.
And because of his experience,
my righteous servant will make it possible
for many to be counted righteous,
for he will bear all their sins.

 

[Scotth1960]

Of course, my NLT says:

When he sees all that is accomplished by his anguish,
he will be satisfied.
And because of his experience,
my righteous servant will make it possible
for many to be counted righteous,
for he will bear all their sins.

Dear Alabaster, For your faith, I would recommend the ESV. It has a common text. I would also recommend the Oxford University Press version with the Apocrypha. If you reject them, you should do so with good reason, and not reject them just because some Church accepts them. Anyway, I take it on the word of the Apostolic Church that these books are Scripture. In any case, the ESV has the word "light" as a footnote. The NIV has it even better, "light of life". Instead of the NLT, which is a translation based on a paraphrase, and not a translation proper, I would recommend for your Bible study the NIV and the ESV. The ESV is good in some places. The NIV has a good version of Galatians. "The righteousness for which we hope" is more accurate that the KJV's "the hope of righteousness". ISTM. Take care.
In Erie PA Scott H.

 

[Alabaster]

Dear Alabaster, For your faith, I would recommend the ESV. It has a common text. I would also recommend the Oxford University Press version with the Apocrypha. If you reject them, you should do so with good reason, and not reject them just because some Church accepts them. Anyway, I take it on the word of the Apostolic Church that these books are Scripture. In any case, the ESV has the word "light" as a footnote. The NIV has it even better, "light of life". Instead of the NLT, which is a translation based on a paraphrase, and not a translation proper, I would recommend for your Bible study the NIV and the ESV. The ESV is good in some places. The NIV has a good version of Galatians. "The righteousness for which we hope" is more accurate that the KJV's "the hope of righteousness". ISTM. Take care.
In Erie PA Scott H.

Forget about recommending me any bible version. I cross reference. I know what I know based on decades of walking with Jesus. His word rings through no matter what translation I use.

 

[Scotth1960]

Interesting thing coming from you

Friends, It is not bigoted to form an opinion based on history. I burn no one at the stake. I am not perfect, or without sin, true. But how anyone could call themselves a Calvinist as a Christian is beyond me. After all, Calvin did persecute Servetus, and people should not go around persecuting others for differing beliefs. We can strongly disagree and have our own minds about what is the "mind of Christ", but until we come to the unity of the faith (John 17), let us be charitable. Calvin was anything but charitable toward Servetus and others, is my point. I guess some people love being a Calvinist more than being a "mere Christian" (C.S. Lewis). I guess it does depend on what a mere Christian is. One will invariably eventually follow some church tradition on that. In Erie Scott H.

 

[Scotth1960]

Forget about recommending me any bible version. I cross reference. I know what I know based on decades of walking with Jesus. His word rings through no matter what translation I use.

DEAR ALABASTER.Use the NLT if you like, just remember, it doesn't have the word "light" in it, so something is missing from whatever you call "God's Word" if your NLT doesn't include the word "light". See Isaiah 8:16,20 KJV.
GOD BLESS YOU AND GOOD NIGHT. Scott In Erie

 

[Alabaster]

DEAR ALABASTER.Use the NLT if you like, just remember, it doesn't have the word "light" in it, so something is missing from whatever you call "God's Word" if your NLT doesn't include the word "light". See Isaiah 8:16,20 KJV.
GOD BLESS YOU AND GOOD NIGHT. Scott In Erie

There is nothing missing, thanks.

 

[Scotth1960]

There is nothing missing, thanks.

Dear Alabaster, The NLT doesn't have 1 2 3 Maccabees, Baruch, Judith, Tobit, Wisdom, Sirach, Esther, the rest of Daniel, Esther, 2 Esdras, and so on, the REST OF THE BIBLE THAT PROTESTANTS TOOK OUT ON THEIR OWN AUTHORITY, in DEFIANCE OF HISTORIC CHRISTIAN CHURCH TRADITION. These men listened to THE JEWS, who do NOT believe in Christ. How would the Jews know what is in the Bible, when they do not even UNDERSTAND their own OT in Hebrew? In Erie Scott H.

 

[Alabaster]

Dear Alabaster, The NLT doesn't have 1 2 3 Maccabees, Baruch, Judith, Tobit, Wisdom, Sirach, Esther, the rest of Daniel, Esther, 2 Esdras, and so on, the REST OF THE BIBLE THAT PROTESTANTS TOOK OUT ON THEIR OWN AUTHORITY, in DEFIANCE OF HISTORIC CHRISTIAN CHURCH TRADITION. These men listened to THE JEWS, who do NOT believe in Christ. How would the Jews know what is in the Bible, when they do not even UNDERSTAND their own OT in Hebrew? In Erie Scott H.

Good!

 

[Ed the Ned]

Instead of the NLT, which is a translation based on a paraphrase, and not a translation proper

I would disagree that that the NLT is a paraphrase, it is a translation into contempory english. Whereas the Living Bible which was paraphrased by Kenneth Taylor is. Please purchase yourself a NLT edition and read the introduction to how the NLT bible was translated. The Message (Eugene Peterson)which is a new age mockery of the Bible can also be considered a paraphrase. In Isaiah 53:11 'The Message" states:

"Out of that terrible travail of soul, he'll see that it's worth it and be glad he did it. Through what he experienced, my righteous one, my servant, will make many "righteous ones," as he himself carries the burden of their sins."

Can you see how this emphasizes how we can become little gods because of Christ.

Isaiah 53:11 ESV with commentary.
"Out of the anguish of his soul he shall see light and be satisfied; by his knowledge shall the righteous one, my servant, make many to be accounted righteous, and he shall bear their iniquities."

I have a copy of the ESV and it does not contain the word light, I have checked both electronic versions I have and they seem to conflict with yours. I have also been on the online version and the text is as follows:

" Out of the anguish of his soul he shall see [9] and be satisfied;
by his knowledge shall the righteous one, my servant,
make many to be accounted righteous,
and he shall bear their iniquities."

The online version does make reference to the Masoteric text and dead sea scrolls, but it is not printed in the text as you have listed above. and if no reference was made it would not say light.

I have extended to what I wanted to say about paraphrase.

 

[Scotth1960]

I have a copy of the ESV and it does not contain the word light, I have checked both electronic versions I have and they seem to conflict with yours. I have also been on the online version and the text is as follows:

" Out of the anguish of his soul he shall see [9] and be satisfied;
by his knowledge shall the righteous one, my servant,
make many to be accounted righteous,
and he shall bear their iniquities."

The online version does make reference to the Masoteric text and dead sea scrolls, but it is not printed in the text as you have listed above. and if no reference was made it would not say light.

I have extended to what I wanted to say about paraphrase.



Friend, I believe the NLT says it is based on TLB (The Living Bible), a paraphrase, and the original Bible texts Greek and Hebrew. So it is updating a paraphrase and is in the mold of the TLB. That's why it is called the "New" Living Translation. Yes, it is a translation, but it looks to a paraphrase, TLB, for support. And really, is it a good translation? I think not. It could do better. What is worse than the NLT, however, or maybe worse, is the NRSV. It uses "inclusive" language and tries to update the Bible for feminism. Take care. The Message could be read with caution, but in some places it may teach false doctrine. Almost any Bible can be considered the word of God, because it contains some truth. But no version in English can yet be considered perfect and without bias or error of some kind. The Question is, how serious is the error in any given version of the English Bible, for example? In Erie Scott H.

PS The ESV does have the word light as a footnote. Check the Crossway Bible Good News Publishers Wheaton IL edition.



[/QUOTE]

 

[TRUTH over TRADITION]

A translation of the LXX reads thusly:

It was Jehovah’s will to remove, the misery in that life with His hand, for this showed him light and shaped his understanding, and proved this righteous one just… this good one who was serving for many, so as to bear all their sins.

That is rendered a lot different than most other more recent translations.

 

[Ed the Ned]

Scott, I truly understand your perspective on this. I use the NLT for reading purposes and do not use it when I am trying to do an indepth study. I do take your warnings to heart. The NLT has a lot of footnotes and I find I do refer to the ESV, NKJV and The KJV when I have questions in my normal reading. I do not read The Message, as far as I am concerned it is a mockery of Gods Word.

I also feel it is wrong to criticize others in regards to versions that they do read. I feel it is important to warn when there are difference in meaning and as you mentioned earlier, a feminine or occultic newage theme to the translation and to stand fast in defending the truth. The problem I do have with modern versions of the Bible is that the language tends to be sociably acceptable. Thus opening the door for strange teachings in the Church.