SAINTS go through a great tribulation -- book of revelation

[Guest]

EVERY EYE WILL SEE -- EVERY TONGUE WILL CONFESS -- EVERY KNEE WILL BOW

BOOK OF Hebrews 1:6 ... "AND LET ALL THE ANGELS OF GOD WORSHIP HIM."
there is no SECRET rapture- no two phases of the coming of CHRIST - No 7 yrs of antichrist - THERE IS NO SECOND CHANCE for those who missed the rapture.
jehovah's witnesses ARE NOT THE ONLY ONES believe a second chance is possible.
BOOK OF 1 THESSALONIANS 5:3 - the unsaved will not escape the wrath of CHRIST'S coming.
rapture is the caught up of the saints THE trumpet will sound a great noise - the dead in CHRIST will rise 1st, and those who are alive will be RAPTURED (caught up) in the air.

the rapture takes place at the same time/ simultaneously with the 2ND COMING OF CHRIST

SAINTS go through a great tribulation -- book of revelation 7:14

MATTHEW 24:9 THIS IS PROOF SAINTS WILL GO THROUGH THE great tribulation
Revelation 7: verses 13-14 the 144,000 & A great multitude of people. more proof SAINTS WILL GO THROUGH THE great tribulation.
Revelation 12: verses 6 & 13-14 -- is this tribulation for saints?
6. And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.
13. And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.
14. And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.
1 thessalonian 4:14-17
MATTHEW 24:21
Daniel 9:25
2 Peter 3:10

many christians preach that NO SAINT GO THROUGH THE great tribulation
Stop teaching this SECRET rapture doctrine - its a sin to lie.
REVELATION 17: VERSE 6 And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.
MARTYRS FACE TRIBULATION.. PERSECUTION
?
REVELATION 18: verse 24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

REVELATION 18: verse 24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

All that were slain upon the earth?

Mt 23;35
That upon you may come all the rightous blood shed upo the earth,from the blood of rightous Abel unto the blood of Zechariah son of Barachias,whom ye slew between the temple and the alter.

Mt 23;37
O Jerusalem,Jerusalem,thou that killest the prophets,and stonest them which are sent unto thee,howoften would I have hatherd thy choldren together,even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings,and ye would not!

 

[waitinontheLamb]

Not a very convincing argument for your belief. You throw down a couple scriptures and think they somehow disprove the blessed hope. No, not a convincing argument at all. See you in the air, Maybe Today?

 

[XTruth]

Rapture and Second Coming
2 Separate events.

Greek: parousia (NT:3952), personal presence (note, Matthew 24:3). This refers to the rapture, not the second coming of Christ. It is the same as in 1 Thes. 3:13; 1 Thes. 4:13-17; 1 Thes. 5:8; 2 Thes. 2:7, note.

These two comings should not be confused. The scriptures that apply to one do not apply to the other. Not one passage refers to both events as if they were one. These two distinct comings are separated by several years, so they aren't two stages or phases of one coming.

The rapture is the first of the two comings, not a coming to earth but in the air. It could not be the second coming because Christ does not come to the earth to live here and fulfill a mission as He did at the first coming. When Christ meets the saints in the air He takes them back to heaven with Him and presents them before the Father's throne where they remain during the time the tribulation is running its course on the earth (1 Thes. 3:13; John 14:1-3). Christ does not remain in the air with the saints when they meet Him as in 1 Thes. 4:13-17. The marriage supper and the judgment of saints take place in heaven, then at the second coming after the tribulation Christ and the saints leave heaven together to come down to the earth (2 Cor. 5:10; Rev. 19). The rapture is the time Christ comes for the saints to take them to heaven.

The second coming is the time He comes to the earth to live here and fulfil a mission. This is the time He comes from heaven with the saints, having raptured them at least seven years before. The second coming cannot take place until all of Rev. 1:1-19:21 is fulfilled while the rapture can take place any moment without anything being fulfilled.

Scriptures on the Rapture-Christ's Coming FOR the Saints:

1. Pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things ... and to stand before the Son of man (Luke 21:34).

2. In My Father's house are many mansions ... I go to prepare a place for you ... I will come again, and receive you unto Myself; that where I am, there ye may be also (John 14:1-3).

3. We shall not all sleep (die physically), but we shall all be changed. In a moment ... at the last trump ... the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we (the living) shall be changed ... put on immortality ... then ... death is swallowed up in victory (1 Cor. 15:51-56).

4. Christ loved the church ... that He might present it to Himself (Ephes. 5:25-27).

5. From whence (heaven) also we look for ... Jesus Christ: Who shall change our vile body (Phil. 3:11,20-21; 2 Cor. 5:1-9).

6. For the Lord Himself shall descend from heaven ... the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air (note on earth, to go back to heaven with Him; 1 Thes. 4:13-18; 1 Thes. 2:19; 1 Thes. 3:13; 1 Thes. 5:9,23).

7. We beseech you ... by our gathering together unto Him ... until he be taken out of the way (2 Thes. 2:1,7-8, notes).

8. When Christ ... shall appear, then shall ye also appear with Him in glory (Col. 3:4; 1 John 2:28; 1 John 3:2; 1 Peter 5:4).

9. Be patient ... unto the coming of the Lord... until He receive the early and latter rain (James 5:7-8).

Scriptures on the Second Coming-Christ's Coming WITH the Saints:

1. One like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought Him near before Him. And there was given Him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages shall serve Him (Daniel 2:44-45; Daniel 7:13-14; Daniel 18; Daniel 27).

2. Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations ... His feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which ... shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west ... the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with Thee (Zech. 14:1-5,9,16-21).

3. Immediately after the tribulation ... then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory (Matthew 24:29-31).

4. When the Son of man shall come in His glory, and all the holy angels with Him, then shall He sit upon the throne of His glory. And before Him shall be gathered all nations (Matthew 25:31-46).

5. When the Lord shall be revealed from heaven with His mighty angels. In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God (2 Thes. 1:7-10; 2 Thes. 2:8).

6. The Lord cometh with ten thousands of His saints, to execute judgment upon all ... that are ungodly (Jude 1:14-15).

7. He cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see Him ... all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of Him ... the armies of heaven followed Him upon white horses (Rev. 1:7. See 1 Thes. 19:11-21; 1 Thes. 20:1-3; Isaiah 63:1-6; Joel 3).

—Dake's Topics

 

[XTruth]

20 CONTRASTS BETWEEN THE RAPTURE AND THE SECOND ADVENT

1. The rapture is a going up to heaven of all saved men of all past ages (John. 14:1-3; Col. 3:4; Jas. 5:7-8; Rev. 5:8-10; Rev 19:1-10), whereas the second advent is a coming down from heaven to earth of the same people (Rev. 19:11-21; Jude 14-15; 2 Thess. 1:7-10; Mt. 16:27; Mt 24:29-31; Mt 25:31-46; Zech. 14:1-9).

2. The rapture is a coming of Christ from heaven to the clouds (not to the earth) for the saints-both dead (who will be resurrected) and alive-to take them to heaven (1 Thess. 4:16), while the second advent is a coming from heaven with the previously raptured saints to set up a kingdom and rule eternally (Zech. 14:1-9; Jude 14-15; Rev. 11:15; Rev 19:11-21; Rev 22:4-5; 2 Thess. 1:7-10; Mt. 25:31-46; Isa. 9:6-7; Dan. 2:44-45;Dan 7:9-15,18,22,27; Lk. 1:32-36).

3. Our goal in the rapture is heaven to live with Christ in our mansions (John. 14:1-3; 1 Thess. 2:19-20; 1 Thess 3:13; 1 Thess 4:13-18; 1 Thess 5:1-11,23; Rev. 5:8-10; Rev 19:1-10; Col. 3:4; Jas. 5:7-8), while the goal in the second advent is to leave heaven for the earth to reign forever (Zech. 14; Jude 14-15; Rev. 11:15; Rev 19:11 - Rev 20:10).

4. At the rapture Christ does not come to destroy the Antichrist or any other wicked man but to remove the hinderer of lawlessness (the church, Chapter 10, Proof 1), so that the Antichrist can come (2 Thess. 2:7-8), while at the second advent Christ comes back to the earth with all saints of all ages to destroy Antichrist and multitudes of wicked men (2 Thess. 2:7-8; Dan. 7:11; Jude 14-15; Rev. 19:11-21; see also Mt. 24:37-42;Mt 25:31-46; Ezek. 38- Ezek. 39; Zech. 14).

5. At the rapture Christ comes from heaven to the clouds only (not to the earth) to take the good from among the bad (John. 5:28-29; John. 14:1-3; Lk. 21:34-36; 1 Cor. 15:23,51-54; Phil. 3:21; Col. 3:4; 1 Thess. 4:16-18; Jas. 5:7-8), while at the second advent-years later-He comes to the earth with His raptured saints to take the bad from among the good (Mt. 13:30,39-43,49-50;Mt 24:29-31,37-42; Jude 14-15; Ezek. 38- Ezek. 39; Zech. 14; Rev. 19:11-21).

6. At the rapture only those qualified for heaven will be raptured (John. 14:1-3; Lk. 21:34-36; 1 Cor. 15:23; 1 Thess. 4:16; Rev. 20:4-6); only those who are born again will be changed from mortality to immortality and go to heaven. At the second advent, on the other hand, any and all men qualified to live on the earth as citizens will be permitted to continue as natural people into the next age, without any change from mortality to immortality (Mt. 25:31-46; Zech. 8:23;Zech 14:1-21; Isa. 2:2-4;Isa 66:19-21; Dan. 2:44-45;Dan 7:9-14; 1 Cor. 15:24-28; Rev. 2:27-28; Rev 11:15; Rev 20:4-6).

7. At the rapture there will be no battle of Armageddon (John. 14:1-3; Lk. 21:34-36; 1 Cor. 15:23,51-54; 1 Thess. 4:16), while at the second advent Armageddon will be fought (Zech. 14; 2 Thess. 1:7-10; Jude 14-15; Rev. 16:13-16; Rev 19:11-21; Ezek. 38- Ezek. 39).

8. At the rapture there will be no change of home lands on earth among the nations (John. 14:1-3), while at the second advent there will be a general separation of nations back to their original home lands, including Israel (Isa. 11:11-12; Deut 32:8; Ezek. 37; Mt. 24:31; Acts 17:26).

9. At the rapture no man will be sent to hell, but all saints will be taken to heaven (John. 14:1-3; Lk. 21:34-36; 1 Thess. 4:16; Rev. 5:8-10; Rev 19:1-10), while at the second advent millions of men will be sent to hell and none taken to heaven (Mt. 13:30,43-50;Mt 25:31-46; Isa. 14:9-15; Rev. 14:9-11; Rev 19:20; Rev 20:10).

10. At the rapture all saints will "escape all these things that shall come to pass" during the tribulation, and will "stand before the Son of man" (Lk. 21:34-36; John. 14:1-3; 1 Thess. 4:16;1 Thess 5:1-11; Rev. 5:8-10; Rev 19:1-10; see Chapter 10), whereas at the second advent no man who is subject to punishment will escape (Rev. 19:1-21; Mt. 24:29-31;Mt 25:31-46; 2 Thess. 1:7-10).

11. The rapture will take place before the revelation of the Antichrist (2 Thess. 2:7-8) and before the tribulation and fulfillment of Rev. 4:1 - Rev 22:21, while the second advent will take place after these events (Mt. 24:29-31; 2 Thess. 2:7-8; Rev. 5:8-10; Rev 19:11-21). See Chapter 10.

12. At the rapture there will be a resurrection of all the righteous dead (1 Thess. 4:16; 1 Cor. 15:23,51-54; Phil. 3:21), while at the second advent there will be no resurrection of any righteous man, for the first resurrection will then be over (Rev. 20:4-6).

13. At the time of the rapture no man on earth will know who the Antichrist is (2 Thess. 2:7-8), whereas at the second advent all men on earth in the civilized parts will know who he is (Rev. 13:16-18).

14. At the rapture the church and all others who are redeemed saints at that time will be presented to God in heaven (Eph. 5:27; 1 Thess. 3:13;1 Thess 5:23), while at the second advent all raptured saints will be presented to men on earth as their new rulers (Rev. 2:27; Rev 5:10; Rev 20:4-6; Dan. 7:9-27).

15. Before the rapture there will be no marriage supper of the Lamb, whereas just before the second advent there will be such a supper of Christ with all the redeemed of all ages past (Rev. 19:1-21).

16. There will be a seven-year period of tribulation after the rapture (2 Thess. 2:7-8; Dan. 9:27; Rev. 6:1 - Rev 19:21), whereas there will be no tribulation at all after the second advent, for the second coming of Christ ends all tribulation (Mt. 24:29-31;Mt 25:31-46; Rev. 19-20).

17. There will be no end of the world (age) at the time of the rapture, while the age will definitely end at the time of the second advent of Christ to the earth (Mt. 24:1-3,29-31;Mt 25:31-46; 2 Thess. 2:7-8; Rev. 19:1 - Rev 20:10).

18. The rapture is an event that can take place any day without any prophecy being fulfilled or any sign coming to pass (1 Cor. 1:7; Phil. 3:21; Tit. 2:13; 1 Thess. 1:10), while the second advent cannot take place until all of the predictions in Mt. 24 - Mt. 25; Mk 13; Lk. 21:1-11,25-33; 2 Thess. 2:7-8; and Rev. 4:1 - Rev 19:10 have been fulfilled.

19. There will be no reign of the Antichrist before the rapture, but there will be such a reign before the second advent (Dan. 9:27; 2 Thess. 2:7-8; Rev. 6:1 - Rev 19:21).

20. There will be no martyrdoms of saints after the second advent, while there will be multitudes of martyrs after the rapture and between the time of the rapture and the second advent (Rev. 6:9-11; Rev 7:9-17; Rev 13:7; Rev 14:9-13; Rev 15:1-4; Rev 17:6; Rev 18:24; Rev 20:4-6).



We conclude then, that if the church and all other raptured saints are to eat a marriage supper with Christ in heaven (as in Rev. 19:1-10), which happens just before the second advent begins (as in Rev. 19:11-21), then the church cannot remain on earth through the tribulation period. It must arrive in heaven prior to the time of the second advent. Furthermore, if the saints are to leave with Christ at the second advent they must already be up in heaven before that time so as to be able to return with Him. And since the rapture can take place at any moment (as taught in 1 Cor. 15:51-54; Phil. 3:21 and Tit. 2:13)-since it could have happened even in Paul's day according to these passages of Scripture-then we can be certain that the rapture will not take place at a specified time as in the case of the second advent which is predicted to happen at a particular time-that is, at the end of the tribulation period (Mt. 24:29-31; Rev. 19:11-21). This, to us, is truly conclusive proof that the rapture of the church and O.T. saints will take place before the tribulation begins.



—Dake's Topics