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Bible Study Conflicting messages for Paul

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I hope you don't take this the wrong way - at all - it is not my intention. We get ourselves into trouble when we deny the power of God, and with your question, it seems this is what you are doing. In fact, it is quit unbelievable that you have asked not only this question, but the question previous - what did it profit?

How many times was Paul able to share his testimony? We should never deny God's power when it comes to sharing our testimony and what it does supernaturally to people's hearts, even to unbelievers.

Have you personally learned anything from Paul's example from Jerusalem to the rest of his ministry? If not, then I can see why you would ask those questions.

Besides Christ, Paul was the forerunner of spreading the gospel, he not only spread it among Gentiles, but he also spread it among the Jews. We are taken on Paul's journey, to learn what it means to truly be a disciple of Christ. If you are not suffering for the sake of the cross, then you are doing something wrong.

I am not taking anything wrong and thank you for considering my feelings.

I think you are not understanding that I am not talking of Paul's overall ministry.
I am speaking in terms of just this specific trip to Jerusalem. I have never negated what Paul's ministry accomplished and I would not dare.

We will never have to suffer to the point Paul or any of the earlier apostles and disciples of Christ suffered due to the day and time in which we live. They were the forerunners of the gospel of Christ and they were in a time and place when legalism abounded. To the Jews, here are these ignorant and unlearned men telling them that Christ has made a way for the Gentiles to be included in the plan of salvation and that circumcision profited nothing, etc. Tearing down what they had been zealous for for many years, but I do digress.

As I said I am just talking in regard to this one trip to Jerusalem because that is what this thread concerns. Basically this whole trip he was defending himself before the people and the councils. I, myself, did not see anyone taught the gospel to the point of salvation during this trip to Jerusalem. The closest reference, at least recorded in scripture, would be: Acts 26:27,28 King Agrippa believest thou the prophets? I know that thou believest. Then Agrippa said unto Paul Almost thou persuadest me to be a Christian.
 
I am not taking anything wrong and thank you for considering my feelings.

I think you are not understanding that I am not talking of Paul's overall ministry.
I am speaking in terms of just this specific trip to Jerusalem. I have never negated what Paul's ministry accomplished and I would not dare.

Like I mentioned, he was able to share his testimony several times, it was the catalyst to begin this part of his missionary trip.
We will never have to suffer to the point Paul or any of the earlier apostles and disciples of Christ suffered due to the day and time in which we live.

I can not believe you even said this! You really need to get out of your corner of the world and take a look around. People are killed ALL THE TIME for the sake of His name! Where have you been?!?
 
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Like I mentioned, he was able to share his testimony several times, it was the catalyst to begin this part of his missionary trip.
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I can not believe you even said this! You really need to get out of your corner of the world and take a look around. People are killed ALL THE TIME for the sake of His name! Where have you been?!?

Thank God I live in America where there is freedom to be a Christian. I try to keep up on world events but I rarely see any of what you are talking about especially to the extent as in the early church.

Have enjoyed conversing.

God bless,
patience7
 
Thank God I live in America where there is freedom to be a Christian. I try to keep up on world events but I rarely see any of what you are talking about especially to the extent as in the early church.

Have enjoyed conversing.

God bless,
patience7
You too, patience! Here is some information on Christians being killed worldwide in the 20th century, I thought you might like to read.

MUSKOGEE, OK (ANS) --More Christians have been killed for their faith in the 20th century than have been martyred in the total history of Christianity. As you sit in a comfortable pew and worship this beautiful Sunday morning, there are Christian men, women, and children in sixty countries around the world who are imprisoned, tortured, and sold into slavery for the same privilege.

In the last six months, more than 25 evangelical pastors have been killed and up to 300 churches destroyed in Colombia. In January of this year, Australian missionary Graham Staines and his two sons Philip and Timothy were brutally murdered. In Sudan, Christians are sold into slavery. In Sri Lanka, churches are burned and pastors fear for their lives.
A few months ago, members of Voice of the Martyrs, founded by Richard Wurmbrand, who was imprisoned for fourteen years for his participation in the Romanian underground church, traveled to Sudan, Vietnam, and Indonesia to film testimonies. Their first interview was with a group of young boys whose village had been attacked by Islamic soldiers. The elderly and infants were killed on the spot. Twenty-seven children, 14 boys and 13 girls, were taken to a military camp about 9 miles from their village. That evening, the boy's hands and feet were tied behind their backs and they were ordered to deny Christ. Each refused. Burning coals were piled on the ground in front of the boys. As they refused to deny their faith, they were held over the burning embers. Still, they refused to deny their faith. The older boys escaped that night and were placed in a refugee camp. The younger boys died. No one knows what happened to the girls. These boys lifted their dirty shirts and showed t! he terrible scars on their stomachs
Another Sudanese Christian named Alex stopped the crew and begged for a Bible. He had been praying for two years to receive a Bible. He shared that in his village, there was one Bible for 200 believers. A difficult concept for American Christians who own several Bibles, which might be carelessly tossed under the bed or lie unread on the shelf.
November 14 marks the International Day of Prayer for the Persecuted Church. An estimated 100,000 churches will take part. Perhaps it can be taken a step further and taught in Sunday school or in our families. Blankets, clothing, medicine, and encouraging letters could be sent to organizations such as Voice of the Martyrs -- Persecution.com). Others who work with the Suffering Church include Open Doors with Brother Andrew - Open Doors USA - Serving Persecuted Christians Worldwide - and ASSIST Ministries --- Aid to Special Saints In Strategic Times (ASSIST). In a day that Christianity is increasingly mocked and held up as intolerant and outdated, Janet Reno and even our towns and cities must understand that persecution has a new face in America. It is not inconceivable that there will come a day we have to prove we belief in our faith, especially in light of recent events -- events, which have caused me to look deep inside myself and at the state of Christianity in America. 1 Peter 1:7 (NIV) says "These (trials) have come so that your faith - of greater worth than gold, which perishes even though refined by fire - may be proved genuine and may result in praise, glory and honor when Jesus Christ is revealed." I wonder. If American Christians were put on trial today for our faith, would there be enough evidence?


MORE CHRISTIANS HAVE BEEN KILLED FOR THEIR FAITH IN THE 20th CENTURY THAN HAVE BEEN MARTYRED ...
 
Beeson Divinity School at Samford University in Birmingham, AL has a chapel called Hodges Chapel which is absolutely beautiful and has a painted dome of great Christian figures in history and also has dedicatory busts of modern 20th Century Martyrs from six different continents. Look at pages 24-25 in the Chapel's guide for detail on who they were (Dietrich Bonhoeffer is one of them). If you want to see the inside of the chapel watch the videos of this page: Virtual Tours. They also have a Christian history/timeline museum that records general Church history and those who were also martyred. I have been to Beeson many times and actually attended a New Testament Greek class at Beeson (not for credit though).

And for those who are not actually martyred there is still great persecution of Christians, especially in former Soviet Bloc countries and in Communist China. There was a book written by one such person brutally tortured for being a Christian called Tortured for His Faith: An Epic of Christian Courage and Heroism in Our Day by Haralan Popov.
 
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Beeson Divinity School at Samford University in Birmingham, AL has a chapel called Hodges Chapel which is absolutely beautiful and has a painted dome of great Christian figures in history and also has dedicatory busts of modern 20th Century Martyrs from six different continents. Look at pages 24-25 in the Chapel's guide for detail on who they were (Dietrich Bonhoeffer is one of them). If you want to see the inside of the chapel watch the videos of this page: Virtual Tours. They also have a Christian history/timeline museum that records general Church history and those who were also martyred. I have been to Beeson many times and actually attended a New Testament Greek class at Beeson (not for credit though).

And for those who are not actually martyred there is still great persecution of Christians, especially in former Soviet Bloc countries and in Communist China. There was a book written by one such person brutally tortured for being a Christian called Tortured for His Faith: An Epic of Christian Courage and Heroism in Our Day by Haralan Popov.
Thanks for the addition, Josh.
We may never experience what these experienced, but even if we do, and through whatever we suffer for Him, we must continue running the race to win Christ!
God bless -
Jake
 
Well Rockie, 'i' often wonder about the e-mails that float back & forth behind the scenes in these forums pertaining to the posters? But see what your take on Paul & Peter is here?? ;) Hey, even see Gen. 49:17?

Good Bible study! Read & consider the required reason behind this.
Gal. 2 finds Paul & Peter at odds, but what is the REAL issue seen here?

Gal.

[11] But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.
[12] For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come,
he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision.
[13] And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch
that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation.
[14] But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?


OK:
Why did Paul rebuke Peter in public? Was that with/in Christ's Command of Matt. 18?

Matt. 18
[15] Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.

OK. One writer puts it this way:
'The rebuke was public because the offence was public.'

Meaning..
Many times things are said outright wrong to a group who might never again be together to hear the one on one 'trespass' (or offence) rebuke being straightened out, and we see here a whole group being taught wrong who would just go on believing the falsehood. And this is what Paul was faced with!

And the whole group required this to be set right. And would not the trespassing person their self be going against the Command of Christ doing or saying such against another brother in public in the first place?

One say's things, and when the person that was talked about speaks up, we just might hear the Matt. 18:15 verse
quoted to them out of context?

--Elijah
 
Well Rockie, 'i' often wonder about the e-mails that float back & forth behind the scenes in these forums pertaining to the posters? But see what your take on Paul & Peter is here?? ;) Hey, even see Gen. 49:17?
--Elijah
I really hope you aren't accusing me of sending pms that speak ill of you, Elijah, that is not cool to accuse someone of doing that.
Be assured, if I had an issue with you, I would confront you. I've confronted you before, so not sure why the paranoia.
 
Well Rockie, 'i' often wonder about the e-mails that float back & forth behind the scenes in these forums pertaining to the posters? But see what your take on Paul & Peter is here?? ;) Hey, even see Gen. 49:17?

Good Bible study! Read & consider the required reason behind this.
Gal. 2 finds Paul & Peter at odds, but what is the REAL issue seen here?

Gal.

[11] But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.
[12] For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision.
[13] And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation.
[14] But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?


OK:
Why did Paul rebuke Peter in public? Was that with/in Christ's Command of Matt. 18?

Matt. 18
[15] Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.

OK. One writer puts it this way:
'The rebuke was public because the offence was public.'

Meaning..
Many times things are said outright wrong to a group who might never again be together to hear the one on one 'trespass' (or offence) rebuke being straightened out, and we see here a whole group being taught wrong who would just go on believing the falsehood. And this is what Paul was faced with!

And the whole group required this to be set right. And would not the trespassing person their self be going against the Command of Christ doing or saying such against another brother in public in the first place?

One say's things, and when the person that was talked about speaks up, we just might hear the Matt. 18:15 verse
quoted to them out of context?

--Elijah
:thumbsup I agree, he was rebuked in public because it it was a public offense. There is a Bible verse about that somewhere. :)
 
I really hope you aren't accusing me of sending pms that speak ill of you, Elijah, that is not cool to accuse someone of doing that.
Be assured, if I had an issue with you, I would confront you. I've confronted you before, so not sure why the paranoia.

Hey, No!
Reread the posting. NEVER IN MY LIFE HAVE I EVER EVEN HINTED AT that 'i' could READ ANOTHERS MIND! (let alone an email that one has sent to anyone else:screwloose and that is for me & not you, if I had even thought of such a thing!)

But, are you telling me that my personal inbox has not had replies of ones doing just that?? And remember that I have been around posting for a number of years & on many forums.

And the personal stuff of names in postings?? Rarely do I try to 'see' any person of posts when posting. I always try to only reply to the [posted] material. And when any name is used, it is usally & rarely done unless the person is believed by me as VERY SINCERE. And don't get the big head over that one either, because most on these forums have no good idea of where Christ & His were coming from anyway! Matt. 10:25:study

--Elijah
 
Hey, No!
Reread the posting. NEVER IN MY LIFE HAVE I EVER EVEN HINTED AT that 'i' could READ ANOTHERS MIND! (let alone an email that one has sent to anyone else:screwloose and that is for me & not you, if I had even thought of such a thing!)

But, are you telling me that my personal inbox has not had replies of ones doing just that?? And remember that I have been around posting for a number of years & on many forums.

And the personal stuff of names in postings?? Rarely do I try to 'see' any person of posts when posting. I always try to only reply to the [posted] material. And when any name is used, it is usally & rarely done unless the person is believed by me as VERY SINCERE. And don't get the big head over that one either, because most on these forums have no good idea of where Christ & His were coming from anyway! Matt. 10:25:study

--Elijah
Ok, sorry, I misunderstood you then.
 
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