Bible Study Does James 2 Teach Works for Salvation?

[JLB]

All of my old-self was destroyed at my water baptism into Jesus Christ, and into His death, burial, and His resurrection.

If you were born again, your spirit was born again of the Spirit, not your flesh.


That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. John 3:6


How is it you have come to believe water baptism made your physical body born again?


Please explain.





JLB

 

[GodsGrace]

Thanks Wonder, long gone now, was very nice one that I profited on greatly, I purchased a 4 yr old 2013 Mustang convertible and a 2003 Jeep Liberty for what I sold the Ford for. I would have given difference for the Mustang, but ended up getting difference. I sold the Mustang as well a couple of years ago, but still have the Jeep. My wife agreed we should sell the Mustang, then was mad when I did. I do admit I miss it, but had to clean it every time you took it out, that is why I like my beater Geo Metro that I drive everywhere, I rarely even wash it.

Maybe you don't wash it because you don't care for it as much as your other cars.
My son had a Camaro, 1987 I think. It was a beauty.
He sold it for the Mustang . can't remember the year. Early 90's I think.
5,000 cc - i never really cared for it.
They're both gone now - he has a family and the cars are family oriented.
He still keeps them clean though!

We had a little Fiat 126 from the 80's.
Had to get rid of it. I'm so sorry we couldn't keep it, but we couldn't have 3 cars.
It was cute and a classic.

 

[Hopeful]

There’s no sin in God, but there is sin in you.

If there were sin in me, I would be one of those walking in darkness.
Thankfully though, I have confessed my sins and been washed of them by the blood of Christ.

You keep trying to change what the scripture so plainly says.
Why?
But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin. 1 John 1:7
Those who walk in the light are the ones who are cleansed of sin.

I agree that if we walk in God we will have fellowship with Him, and I agree that those who have been cleansed of sin by the blood of Christ are walking in God.

This truth will never change.

Would that be the "truth" Jesus said could make us free from committing sin, in John 8:32-34 ?
"And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
33 They answered him, We be Abraham's seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how sayest thou, Ye shall be made free?
34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin."

 

[Hopeful]

Plainly there is no mention of Enoch being sinless.

What sin did he commit?

I guess you just make up whatever you want, and claim that is what the scriptures say.

Somethings don't need long drawn out explanations when one has the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Only Jesus was sinless, having never sinned.

Thanks be to God we have Him as our example.
It is written..."He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked." (1 John 2:6)

 

[Hopeful]

If you were born again, your spirit was born again of the Spirit, not your flesh.

Your POV makes 2 Cor 5:17a lie.

That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. John 3:6

Thanks be to God.
I and those others in Christ are no longer walking in or after the "flesh".
We walk in and after the Spirit since our rebirth from God's seed.

How is it you have come to believe water baptism made your physical body born again?

My water baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of past sins was where my old body was destroyed and buried with Christ. (Rom 6:3-6, Gal 5:24)
From there, I was raised with Christ to walk in newness of life.
A new life gendered by God. (1 John 3:9)

 

[JLB]

What sin did he commit?

Somethings don't need long drawn out explanations when one has the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Thanks be to God we have Him as our example.
It is written..."He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked." (1 John 2:6)

Again you continue to deny and ignore what is stated in God’s word.


But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin. 1 John 1:7


Who does this verse say is cleansed of sin?


Those who walk in the light or those who walk in darkness?



JLB

 

[JLB]

Your POV makes 2 Cor 5:17a lie.

Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new.
2 Corinthians 5:17


Where in this verse does it say your flesh is born again?


That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. John 3:6


Your flesh is not born again of the Spirit.

• that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

I asked you where you got the idea that your flesh is born again by the Spirit?



Can you answer this question?






JLB

 

[Highway54]

Maybe you don't wash it because you don't care for it as much as your other cars.
My son had a Camaro, 1987 I think. It was a beauty.
He sold it for the Mustang . can't remember the year. Early 90's I think.
5,000 cc - i never really cared for it.
They're both gone now - he has a family and the cars are family oriented.
He still keeps them clean though!

We had a little Fiat 126 from the 80's.
Had to get rid of it. I'm so sorry we couldn't keep it, but we couldn't have 3 cars.
It was cute and a classic.

Wow, that is a cutie pie. I would love that one myself. Actually I love my Metro, it is the best car I have ever owned, I drive it way more than any other I own. It has 406k miles on it. I call it my Armageddon car, expecting to have it till Armageddon, or the end of my life if possible. It is rather sad looking paintwise, and I intend to paint it in the near future. Then I will have to take better care of the outside, which will involve more work. I do keep the inside of it clean, but definitely nice not having to keep it clean outside.

I just noticed you were from Italy, my wife is an Italian import, two generations back. Her mom's first husband died, but she was married to an Italian as well, his last name was Fiorino, the last name of her two oldest siblings.

This is a great site to post on, meet people from all over the world. Bob

 

[Hopeful]

Again you continue to deny and ignore what is stated in God’s word.
But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin. 1 John 1:7
Who does this verse say is cleansed of sin?
Those who walk in the light or those who walk in darkness?

You keep insisting that there is darkness/sin in God, which verse 5 says isn't so.
It is written..."This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all."
The blood of Christ doesn't wash away that which is not present.
The washing happens before one can even walk in the light.

What do you think "darkness" is?
Pro. 4:19 says "the way if the wicked is as darkness,"
Their way is sinful, so darkness is sin.

 

[Hopeful]

Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new.
2 Corinthians 5:17
Where in this verse does it say your flesh is born again?

The "flesh" is one of the old things that have "passed away".
If one part of you remained, the "all things" would be a lie.

That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. John 3:6
Your flesh is not born again of the Spirit.

Why do you suppose you were only partially reborn?
Could it be because only part of you died with Christ at your water baptism into His death?

• that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

I asked you where you got the idea that your flesh is born again by the Spirit?
Can you answer this question?

The new me that was reborn of God's seed after the old me was crucified with Christ is spirit.
It is not reborn of a woman.
Remember, God is Spirit, and was manifested in the flesh. (1 Tim 3:16)
Why cannot we make the same claim?

 

[Jethro Bodine]

The blood of Christ doesn't wash away that which is not present.
The washing happens before one can even walk in the light.

10Jesus told him, “Whoever has already bathed needs only to wash his feet, and he will be completely clean.
John 13:10

Hmm...the already bathed person has dirty feet. Clean, just not completely clean.

(Hopeful feverously searches for his 'old testament' card, lol)

 

[Hopeful]

10Jesus told him, “Whoever has already bathed needs only to wash his feet, and he will be completely clean.
John 13:10

Hmm...the already bathed person has dirty feet. Clean, just not completely clean.

(Hopeful feverously searches for his 'old testament' card, lol)

The parameters of your subject have nothing to do with mine.
Different covenants, to start with.
You are trying to say there is sin in God.
There isn't any.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

The parameters of your subject have nothing to do with mine.
Different covenants, to start with.
You are trying to say there is sin in God.
There isn't any.

The Bible plainly says sin is in, and comes from, THE FLESH.

You're living in a delusion if you think you have not sinned in 16 years, and won't ever sin again for the rest of your natural life.

 

[JLB]

The "flesh" is one of the old things that have "passed away".
If one part of you remained, the "all things" would be a lie.

Sorry but you still have a physical body.


There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit. Romans 8:1


So then, with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin. Romans 7:25


I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. Galatians 5:16


Those who are “in Christ” must choose to live according to the Spirit who dwells within our Spirit; our holy of holies.


Our flesh is defiled with sin, so if we walk according to the lustful desires of our flesh, then we are serving the law of sin.


Which is why Paul tells us to walk in the Spirit.

When we walk in the Spirit, we are exercising the dominion of Jesus Christ over the sin that is in our flesh, rather than allowing the sin in our physical body to rule us as we once were, before we were in Christ.


Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body, that you should obey it in its lusts. Romans 6:12


Sin is in your mortal body, as Paul so plainly states, and admonishes us to not let it rule us and make us obey it’s lusts.



So no, absolutely not, your flesh has not passed away… as we all see from the scriptures.







JLB

 

[JLB]

The Bible plainly says sin is in, and comes from, THE FLESH.

You're living in a delusion if you think you have not sinned in 16 years, and won't ever sin again for the rest of your natural life.

What a shock he will have when he stands before the Lord, and hears how He paid the price with His blood for him to be washed and cleansed of all unrighteousness, but he refused to believe His word, and thereby exalting the teaching of his denomination over the truth.



For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that each one may receive the things done in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad. Knowing, therefore, the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are well known to God, and I also trust are well known in your consciences. 2 Corinthians 5:10-11





JLB

 

[Hopeful]

The Bible plainly says sin is in, and comes from, THE FLESH.

Perhaps that is why Jesus made the way for us to kill the "flesh", and be reborn from His Father's seed?
It is written..."And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts." (Gal 5:24)
And,,, "Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin." (Rom 6:6)
I suggest rebirth to alleviate the "flesh" problem.

You're living in a delusion if you think you have not sinned in 16 years, and won't ever sin again for the rest of your natural life.

Love conquers sinning.

 

[Hopeful]

Sorry but you still have a physical body.

Nothing to be sorry about, as Jesus had one too.
The vessel that moves me about is the temple of the Holy Ghost now, and there is no evil coming forth from it.
Thanks be to God.

There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit. Romans 8:1

Amen to that.
Thank God we can now walk after the Spirit.

So then, with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin. Romans 7:25

The mind controls what the vessel does.
As Paul said in Ro 7:5..."For when we WERE in the flesh...".
Those in Christ aren't in the flesh anymore, since we started walking in the Spirit.

I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. Galatians 5:16

So true.

Those who are “in Christ” must choose to live according to the Spirit who dwells within our Spirit; our holy of holies.

So true, and thankfully, possible !

Our flesh is defiled with sin, so if we walk according to the lustful desires of our flesh, then we are serving the law of sin.

It was defiled indeed, but, as Rom 8:2 says..."For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death."
Free of the law of sin !
Thanks be to God !

Which is why Paul tells us to walk in the Spirit.

Thanks for the doable exhortation, Paul.

When we walk in the Spirit, we are exercising the dominion of Jesus Christ over the sin that is in our flesh, rather than allowing the sin in our physical body to rule us as we once were, before we were in Christ.

If you are in the Spirit, there is no sin in you, as there is no sin in the Spirit ! (1 John 1:5)

Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body, that you should obey it in its lusts. Romans 6:12

Thank God our mortal body is Christ's now and has no sin in it.

Sin is in your mortal body, as Paul so plainly states, and admonishes us to not let it rule us and make us obey it’s lusts.

Not if it was killed with Christ and raised a new creature.
Like Jesus said in Matt 9:17..."Neither do men put new wine into old bottles: else the bottles break, and the wine runneth out, and the bottles perish: but they put new wine into new bottles, and both are preserved."
You are alluding to old mortal bodies with new Spirits in them.
It won't work !

So no, absolutely not, your flesh has not passed away… as we all see from the scriptures.

I am thankful for the gift of the Holy Spirit, and the scriptures that show I am now free from what you continue to submit to.

 

[Hopeful]

What a shock he will have when he stands before the Lord, and hears how He paid the price with His blood for him to be washed and cleansed of all unrighteousness, but he refused to believe His word, and thereby exalting the teaching of his denomination over the truth.

If one has been washed of all unrighteousness, why can't he say he has no unrighteousness in him?

For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that each one may receive the things done in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad. Knowing, therefore, the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are well known to God, and I also trust are well known in your consciences. 2 Corinthians 5:10-11

Thank God our mind gets to decide the path we walk, and not the skin and bones.

 

[JLB]

Nothing to be sorry about, as Jesus had one too.
The vessel that moves me about is the temple of the Holy Ghost now, and there is no evil coming forth from it.
Thanks be to God.

You continue to ignore the truth of the scriptures in favor of your denominational ”doctrine”, which has formed a stronghold in your mind that exalts itself against the knowledge from God.


There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit. Romans 8:1


So then, with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin. Romans 7:25


I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. Galatians 5:16


Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body, that you should obey it in its lusts. Romans 6:12


Sin is in your mortal body, as Paul so plainly states, and admonishes us to not let it rule us and make us obey it’s lusts.





JLB

 

[JLB]

If one has been washed of all unrighteousness, why can't he say he has no unrighteousness in him?

You are cleansed of all unrighteousness when you confess your sin.

• If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 1 John 1:7-9





JLB