You continue to say this but I have yet to see you post a passage that I've repeatedly asked for
Your statement here suggests to me that you really don't either see or understand the difference between God doing a miracle and the first century gifts.
This statement again shows me you don't understand the issue. God doing miracles is not the same thing as the gifts.
It also shows me that you've not understood my argument either.
Do you want to talk about thinking the way one's always thought? I told you when I began searching for truth I changed about 75% of what I believed. How exactly is that thinking what one's always thought? The difference is that I give the Scriptures priority. If Paul said the gifts would stop I believe him. I've looked at the history of the gifts and seen their fading away. I gave you my paper to read so you would know where I stood on this subject and reading your post I seriously doubt that you've read it, yet it is full of Scripture. You said I relied on a single verse of Scripture and I showed you that I relied on quite a few passages. In the paper I showed the purpose of the gifts. I've yet to see any one of you guys who claim the gifts to show me their purpose. I suspect you guys don't know the purpose of the gifts. Here you guys argue the gifts, if you don't know their purpose how do know they haven't ceased.
Couldn't I say the same thing to you? I study "Alot". There have been days that I've listened to the Scriptures for 10 hrs or more. Then there is study of the early church, then there is in depth study of the Scriptures themselves. I can assure you, I study and in that study I have studied the gifts. I have looked at this subject many times. Isaiah prophesies about the gifts.
11 For the LORD spake thus to me with a strong hand, and instructed me that I should not walk in the way of this people, saying, {with...: Heb. in strength of hand} 12 Say ye not, A confederacy, to all them to whom this people shall say, A confederacy; neither fear ye their fear, nor be afraid. 13 Sanctify the LORD of hosts himself; and let him be your fear, and let him be your dread. 14 And he shall be for a sanctuary; but for a stone of stumbling and for a rock of offence to both the houses of Israel, for a gin and for a snare to the inhabitants of Jerusalem. 15 And many among them shall stumble, and fall, and be broken, and be snared, and be taken. 16 Bind up the testimony, seal the law among my disciples. 17 And I will wait upon the LORD, that hideth his face from the house of Jacob, and I will look for him. 18 Behold, I and the children whom the LORD hath given me are for signs and for wonders in Israel from the LORD of hosts, which dwelleth in mount Zion. 19 And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead? (Isa 8:11-19 KJV)
Notice his words. He prophesies the words of Jesus. He says "I and the children the Lord hath given me are for signs and wonders in Israel."
Did you see that? They were for signs and wonders "IN ISRAEL."
KJV Isaiah 28:1 Woe to the crown of pride, to the drunkards of Ephraim, whose glorious beauty is a fading flower, which are on the head of the fat valleys of them that are overcome with wine! {overcome: Heb. broken} 2 Behold, the Lord hath a mighty and strong one, which as a tempest of hail and a destroying storm, as a flood of mighty waters overflowing, shall cast down to the earth with the hand.
3 The crown of pride, the drunkards of Ephraim, shall be trodden under feet: {under...: Heb. with feet} 4 And the glorious beauty, which is on the head of the fat valley, shall be a fading flower, and as the hasty fruit before the summer; which when he that looketh upon it seeth, while it is yet in his hand he eateth it up. {eateth: Heb. swalloweth} 5 In that day shall the LORD of hosts be for a crown of glory, and for a diadem of beauty, unto the residue of his people, 6 And for a spirit of judgment to him that sitteth in judgment, and for strength to them that turn the battle to the gate. 7 But they also have erred through wine, and through strong drink are out of the way; the priest and the prophet have erred through strong drink, they are swallowed up of wine, they are out of the way through strong drink; they err in vision, they stumble in judgment. 8 For all tables are full of vomit and filthiness, so that there is no place clean. 9 Whom shall he teach knowledge? and whom shall he make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts. {doctrine: Heb. the hearing?} 10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little: {must be: or, hath been} 11 For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people. {stammering...: Heb. stammerings of lip} {will...: or, he hath spoken} 12 To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear. 13 But the word of the LORD was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken. 14 Wherefore hear the word of the LORD, ye scornful men, that rule this people which is in Jerusalem. 15 Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death, and with hell are we at agreement; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, it shall not come unto us: for we have made lies our refuge, and under falsehood have we hid ourselves:
16 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD, Behold, I lay in Zion for a foundation a stone, a tried stone, a precious corner stone, a sure foundation: he that believeth shall not make haste. 17 Judgment also will I lay to the line, and righteousness to the plummet: and the hail shall sweep away the refuge of lies, and the waters shall overflow the hiding place. 18 And your covenant with death shall be disannulled, and your agreement with hell shall not stand; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, then ye shall be trodden down by it. {trodden...: Heb. a treading down to it} 19 From the time that it goeth forth it shall take you: for morning by morning shall it pass over, by day and by night: and it shall be a vexation only to understand the report. {to...: or, when he shall make you to understand doctrine}
(Isa 28:1-19 KJV)
Isaiah said, speaking of the time of Christ, that God would speak to "This People." (This people is Israel) with stammering lips and another tongue. Both of these passages are speaking about the judgment of Israel. That was the purpose of tongues. It was a sign of the coming Judgment upon Israel. Paul quotes this passage in 1 Cor 14.
21 In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord.
22
Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying
serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe. (1Co 14:21-22 KJV)
You also didn't address my question. Is your theology without error?
“‘In the
last days, God says,
I will pour out my Spirit on all people.
Your sons and daughters will prophesy,
your young men will see visions,
your old men will dream dreams.
18Even on my servants, both men and women,
I will pour out my Spirit in those days,
and they will prophesy.
19I will show wonders in the heaven above
and signs on the earth below,
blood and fire and billows of smoke.
20The sun will be turned to darkness
and the moon to blood
before the coming of the great and glorious day of the Lord.
21And everyone who calls
on the name of the Lord will be saved." Acts 2:17
"But understand this, that in the
last days there will come times of difficulty. 2For people will be lovers of self, lovers of money, proud, arrogant, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, 3heartless, unappeasable, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not loving good, 4treacherous, reckless, swollen with conceit, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, 5having the appearance of godliness, but denying its power.
Avoid such people. 6For among them are those who creep into households and capture weak women, burdened with sins and led astray by various passions, 7always learning and never able to arrive at a knowledge of the truth." 2Timothy 3:1-7
I do not say that I know everything, but I acknowledge what I don't know. My studies aren't perfect I'm sure as I'm still being taken from glory to glory. Though, you kept saying I'm off topic when our discussion is clearly "Does the Holy Spirit move after Acts". Whether you think I have a "gift" or not, I still have "faith with deeds" - James 2. I pray for people and they get healed, to God be the glory! No reason to get huffy puffy about the whole thing as you'd think this would make a believer happy to hear of such things.
I see miracles every week, and healings are powerful, but not as powerful as prophesies that've come true
I'm sure I just opened a big can of worms now, as I believe God's people still prophesy. But again, this should excite you if your "Spirit filled" as it edifies the whole church.
P.S. I'm not claiming to be a prophet, so please don't twist my words. I've seen God use many people speak things that God has told them to say. Are they prophets? Again, I don't know, but I do know God used them!
