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Is divorce always a sin?

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jillian.h

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I've been doing alot of thinking lately. I've been having problems with my marriage, and i'm definately not ready to get a divorce, but i was just thinking about whether or not its always a sin to get divorced. I know that God says never to get divorced, but its been not even one year, and my husband hates me. Also i just recently found out that he's more into men, and he's only with me as a cover up so other people wont find out about his issues. Now, i could probably put up with that, but must I? Does God require that i stay with a man who does not love me and cheats on me with other men?
Also, In Matthew 5:32, Jesus said,
But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.
Does that mean that if i ever were to get a divorce, would that mean It would be wrong of me to get married again? Anybody who gets divorced and then remarried is committing a sin? I'm not sure if i'm understanding this passage correctly or not.
 
Jillian, if he is cheating on you with other men or women, that is fornication. I will say only this. It is debatable whether or not divorce is always a sin. The same is true for remarraige. Pray for his will and that God would restore your marraige if it is His will.
 
I will pray for you as he needs to repent totally of his desire for men. Also if he has slept with men or had oral sex with them, neither you or him can donate blood for the rest of your lives. This is according to the fda, it doesnt mean that he has aids or you will. The fda has determined that bi(male) and homosexuals that have been sexually active with a man since 1977 are a high risk for aids. No matter even if that person tests clean. I'm in the category as i was bi.

Now then, theres more to being bi then just choice. He may have never had a good male role model, or like me for no reason had found men atractive. pray for his healing from that. It is hard road ahead for you, and no one should juddge for divorce as you may feel the need to leave him if he wont change. Whether with a man or woman its still adultery and is biblically supported.

i can only pray for you.
 
You can divorce for adultery, and sometimes you can pray all you want and God will not change him, and then sometimes God might.
 
Very sorry to hear about that situation. Keep in mind that your interpretation of why your husband married you is just that, your interpretation. If you and your husband is willing to seek counseling I would encourage you to get that started.

In regard to your question, here is a resource that might help answer.
http://www.gotquestions.org/divorce-remarriage.html
 
First of all I don't agree with the pray to God if it is his will. Of course it's his will. He don't want you to hurt at all. He don't want to see a broken covenant. It's the devil putting that not God. God gave us dominion over everything. I say you start speaking to the situation instead of letting the situation speak to you. I don't even remember if you said your other was cheating.

In some aspects I can see that being acceptable in the bible, but me personally I feel if your marriage was God ordained which about 95 percent of them are because that is why you fall in love with the person, then divorce would not happen. I know that my husband was sent to me from God and we will never part. It gets hard but we stand strong in faith and pray together.

That could be where lots of Christian marriages fail too. Often they don't pray together for their kids health, or finances, or even their marriage. Me and my husband do.
 
jmespinosa said:
First of all I don't agree with the pray to God if it is his will. Of course it's his will. He don't want you to hurt at all. He don't want to see a broken covenant. It's the devil putting that not God. God gave us dominion over everything. I say you start speaking to the situation instead of letting the situation speak to you. I don't even remember if you said your other was cheating.

In some aspects I can see that being acceptable in the bible, but me personally I feel if your marriage was God ordained which about 95 percent of them are because that is why you fall in love with the person, then divorce would not happen. I know that my husband was sent to me from God and we will never part. It gets hard but we stand strong in faith and pray together.

That could be where lots of Christian marriages fail too. Often they don't pray together for their kids health, or finances, or even their marriage. Me and my husband do.
people cant be made to stay in a marriage, we all fall into tempation and sometimes we sin (adultery).The person who has been faithful must then decide to want to stay and the other must want to fix the marriage, no amount of prayer and speaking to situation will change that person mind if they dont want to do it, yes the Lord can touch peoples heart. But what if that person knows that he is wrong and still wants to sin. God cant overide peoples will, he wont do that. Otherwise adam's choice to sin would be nullified as he well knew eating the fruit was against God's commandment.

Bisexuallity and other like sins arent something that you are one its start at a young age and may not be acted upon later in life or a as soon as the oppurtunity arises.Can he be delivered? yes. BuT he has to want it and also it may not be imeediiately as you think. It may be a struggle for him to stop or not.
 
jillian.h said:
I've been doing alot of thinking lately. I've been having problems with my marriage, and i'm definately not ready to get a divorce, but i was just thinking about whether or not its always a sin to get divorced.

If you're a Christian then it would be a sin for you to initiate a divorce:

1 Corinthians 7:10-13 But to the married I give instructions, not I, but the Lord, that the wife should not leave her husband (but if she does leave, she must remain unmarried, or else be reconciled to her husband), and that the husband should not divorce his wife. But to the rest I say, not the Lord, that if any brother has a wife who is an unbeliever, and she consents to live with him, he must not divorce her. And a woman who has an unbelieving husband, and he consents to live with her, she must not send her husband away.

Does that mean that if i ever were to get a divorce, would that mean It would be wrong of me to get married again?

Absolutely. The Bible says that you are married to your husband for as long as you both shall live:

Matthew 19:4-6 And He answered and said, "Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE, and said, 'FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND BE JOINED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH'? "So they are no longer two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate."

1 Corinthians 7:39 A wife is bound as long as her husband lives; but if her husband is dead, she is free to be married to whom she wishes, only in the Lord.

Romans 7:2-3 For the married woman is bound by law to her husband while he is living; but if her husband dies, she is released from the law concerning the husband. So then, if while her husband is living she is joined to another man, she shall be called an adulteress; but if her husband dies, she is free from the law, so that she is not an adulteress though she is joined to another man.

Anybody who gets divorced and then remarried is committing a sin? I'm not sure if i'm understanding this passage correctly or not.

Yes, the Bible says that anyone who is divorced and remarries is actually committing adultery:

Mark 10: 6-12 "But from the beginning of creation, God MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE. "FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH; so they are no longer two, but one flesh. "What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate." In the house the disciples began questioning Him about this again. And He *said to them, "Whoever divorces his wife and marries another woman commits adultery against her; and if she herself divorces her husband and marries another man, she is committing adultery."

Luke 16:18 "Everyone who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery, and he who marries one who is divorced from a husband commits adultery.â€

This means that you are still bound to your original husband for as long as he lives, and any subsequent so-called "marriages" are actually extramarital relationships in the eyes of God:

Encarta® World English Dictionary
a·dul·ter·y [ ? dúlt?ree ] extramarital sex: voluntary sexual relations between a married person and somebody other than his or her spouse

Biblically, the marriage bond is for life, and therefore all subsequent relationships while ones spouse lives are regarded by God as being adultery, or the sin of a married person engaging in extramarital relations with someone who is not his or her spouse. This is a critical consideration for anyone who is a Christian:


Hebrews 13:4 Marriage is to be held in honor among all, and the marriage bed is to be undefiled; for fornicators and adulterers God will judge.

I Corinthians 6:9-11 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. Such WERE some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

SealedEternal
 
SealedEternal said:
jillian.h said:
I've been doing alot of thinking lately. I've been having problems with my marriage, and i'm definately not ready to get a divorce, but i was just thinking about whether or not its always a sin to get divorced.

If you're a Christian then it would be a sin for you to initiate a divorce:

1 Corinthians 7:10-13 But to the married I give instructions, not I, but the Lord, that the wife should not leave her husband (but if she does leave, she must remain unmarried, or else be reconciled to her husband), and that the husband should not divorce his wife. But to the rest I say, not the Lord, that if any brother has a wife who is an unbeliever, and she consents to live with him, he must not divorce her. And a woman who has an unbelieving husband, and he consents to live with her, she must not send her husband away.

Does that mean that if i ever were to get a divorce, would that mean It would be wrong of me to get married again?



Absolutely. The Bible says that you are married to your husband for as long as you both shall live:

Matthew 19:4-6 And He answered and said, "Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE, and said, 'FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND BE JOINED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH'? "So they are no longer two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate."

1 Corinthians 7:39 A wife is bound as long as her husband lives; but if her husband is dead, she is free to be married to whom she wishes, only in the Lord.

Romans 7:2-3 For the married woman is bound by law to her husband while he is living; but if her husband dies, she is released from the law concerning the husband. So then, if while her husband is living she is joined to another man, she shall be called an adulteress; but if her husband dies, she is free from the law, so that she is not an adulteress though she is joined to another man.

[quote:2pp4h5y7]Anybody who gets divorced and then remarried is committing a sin? I'm not sure if i'm understanding this passage correctly or not.

Yes, the Bible says that anyone who is divorced and remarries is actually committing adultery:

Mark 10: 6-12 "But from the beginning of creation, God MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE. "FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH; so they are no longer two, but one flesh. "What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate." In the house the disciples began questioning Him about this again. And He *said to them, "Whoever divorces his wife and marries another woman commits adultery against her; and if she herself divorces her husband and marries another man, she is committing adultery."

Luke 16:18 "Everyone who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery, and he who marries one who is divorced from a husband commits adultery.â€

This means that you are still bound to your original husband for as long as he lives, and any subsequent so-called "marriages" are actually extramarital relationships in the eyes of God:

Encarta® World English Dictionary
a·dul·ter·y [ ? dúlt?ree ] extramarital sex: voluntary sexual relations between a married person and somebody other than his or her spouse

Biblically, the marriage bond is for life, and therefore all subsequent relationships while ones spouse lives are regarded by God as being adultery, or the sin of a married person engaging in extramarital relations with someone who is not his or her spouse. This is a critical consideration for anyone who is a Christian:


Hebrews 13:4 Marriage is to be held in honor among all, and the marriage bed is to be undefiled; for fornicators and adulterers God will judge.

I Corinthians 6:9-11 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. Such WERE some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

SealedEternal[/quote:2pp4h5y7]

Don't you know that you can't just take one passage and nullify the rest of the Bible with it? What do you say about the passages that say it is permissible in cases of adultery? I wish people would stop laying unbiblical burdens on people who are seeking God's word and will in their life. Give the woman scripture and let her decide. Don't try to twist it to make her out to be an adulteress when it is her husband who is the adulterer (if that is the case with them).

I encourage counseling, as has been suggested already. If he is willing to work it out with you and if he wants to be delivered from his attraction to men, then I believe you have the responsibility to help him and pray for him. Ultimately, however, it is his choice to make it right. You are not held accountable for his sin, and the Bible says you are free to remarry.
 
Caroline H said:
Don't you know that you can't just take one passage and nullify the rest of the Bible with it?]

Yes I do, and I'd ask that you hold yourself to that same standard. Every verse in the Bible consistently teaches that the marriage union is joined by God for life, and that all subsequent relationships while a spouse lives is the sin of adultery.

What do you say about the passages that say it is permissible in cases of adultery?

No such passage exists. Perhaps you're referring to the situation where Jesus was asked by the Pharisees about an Old Covenant Law pertaining to fornication. For one thing we are not under the Laws of Moses, and secondly this fornication clause was for a woman who had fornicated prior to the marriage, and her husband discovered this on the wedding night:

Deuteronomy 22: 13 "If any man takes a wife and goes in to her and then turns against her, 14 and charges her with shameful deeds and publicly defames her, and says, 'I took this woman, but when I came near her, I did not find her a virgin,' 15 then the girl's father and her mother shall take and bring out the evidence of the girl's virginity to the elders of the city at the gate. 16 "The girl's father shall say to the elders, 'I gave my daughter to this man for a wife, but he turned against her; 17 and behold, he has charged her with shameful deeds, saying, "I did not find your daughter a virgin." But this is the evidence of my daughter's virginity.' And they shall spread the garment before the elders of the city. 18 "So the elders of that city shall take the man and chastise him, 19 and they shall fine him a hundred shekels of silver and give it to the girl's father, because he publicly defamed a virgin of Israel. And she shall remain his wife; he cannot divorce her all his days. 20 "But if this charge is true, that the girl was not found a virgin, 21 then they shall bring out the girl to the doorway of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her to death because she has committed an act of folly in Israel by playing the harlot in her father's house; thus you shall purge the evil from among you.

This is the fornication (porneia) that Jesus was referring to to the Pharisees which He acknowledged was in the Law of Moses.

Matthew 19:3-6 Some Pharisees came to Jesus, testing Him and asking, "Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any reason at all?" And He answered and said, "Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE, and said, 'FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND BE JOINED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH'? "So they are no longer two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate."

First of all, the entire claim that God allows divorce and remarriage is refuted by Jesus immediately when the Pharisees ask Him the question, because His answer was an unequivocal NO! The Pharisees then go on to question Him about the Old Covenant Law and an apparent “exception†offered there:

Matthew 19:7-9 They *said to Him, "Why then did Moses command to GIVE HER A CERTIFICATE OF DIVORCE AND SEND her AWAY?" 8 He *said to them, "Because of your hardness of heart Moses permitted you to divorce your wives; but from the beginning it has not been this way. 9 "And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for fornication (porneia), and marries another woman commits adultery."

The obvious fact that many people ignore when reading this passage, is that the context of the “exception†is in the Old Covenant Law for Old Covenant people. It is irrelevant therefore for New Covenant believers regardless of what it was referring to, but when we look at what the Law being referred to in Deuteronomy actually says, it is clear that even this provision was not for “divorce†as it is practiced today. The types of divorce that people today are committing are called "adultery by Jesus, which by definition means that they are extramarital relationships, and they are still bound to their original spouse:

Luke 16:18 "Everyone who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery, and he who marries one who is divorced from a husband commits adultery."

This explains why in the book of Mark we have additional information about what Jesus taught to His disciples after they had left the Pharisees and gone back home. To them Jesus explicitly and unequivocally stated that there are no such exceptions for New Covenant people of any kind:

Mark 10:2-9 Some Pharisees came up to Jesus, testing Him, and began to question Him whether it was lawful for a man to divorce a wife. 3 And He answered and said to them, "What did Moses command you?" 4 They said, "Moses permitted a man TO WRITE A CERTIFICATE OF DIVORCE AND SEND her AWAY." 5 But Jesus said to them, "Because of your hardness of heart he wrote you this commandment. 6 "But from the beginning of creation, God MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE. 7 "FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER, 8 AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH; so they are no longer two, but one flesh. 9 "What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate."

Clearly this is the same incident, but if you read on it is clear that the statement Jesus made is to His disciples afterward and not to the Pharisees about the Old Covenant Law, which explains why His answer does not include the "porneia" provision, but instead specifically says there are no exceptions whatsoever to New Covenant people:

Mark 10:10-12 In the house the disciples began questioning Him about this again. 11 And He *said to them, "Whoever divorces his wife and marries another woman commits adultery against her; 12 and if she herself divorces her husband and marries another man, she is committing adultery."

We actually have a Biblical example of the Old Covenant provision almost being implemented by Jesus’ earthly father Joseph:

Matthew 1:18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was as follows: when His mother Mary had been betrothed to Joseph, before they came together she was found to be with child by the Holy Spirit. 19 And Joseph her husband, being a righteous man and not wanting to disgrace her, planned to send her awaysecretly.

We see that Joseph mistakenly assumed that Mary had fornicated during his betrothal to her, and intended to implement the Old Covenant Law to dissolve the covenant. Obviously he was informed that the child was from God’s Spirit and never carried out the Law, but nevertheless this passage confirms how it was meant to be applied. If he had opted to imloy this law, then the Law of Moses declared that he couldn't take her back later if she remarried:

Deuteronomy 24: 1 "When a man takes a wife and marries her, and it happens that she finds no favor in his eyes because he has found some indecency in her, and he writes her a certificate of divorce and puts it in her hand and sends her out from his house, 2 and she leaves his house and goes and becomes another man's wife, 3 and if the latter husband turns against her and writes her a certificate of divorce and puts it in her hand and sends her out of his house, or if the latter husband dies who took her to be his wife, 4 then her former husband who sent her away is not allowed to take her again to be his wife, since she has been defiled; for that is an abomination before the LORD, and you shall not bring sin on the land which the LORD your God gives you as an inheritance.

As you can see, the Law of Moses only allowed a man to divorce his wife if he found indecency in her, “WHEN HE MARRIED HER.†This means that she had fornicated prior to him marrying her, which is why Jesus said that the Old Covenant Law allowed “divorce†for the cause of “fornication.â€

In Old Covenant marriages, the family of the man would normally make a covenant with the family of the bride offering a dowry. If it was accepted the two were regarded as husband and wife from that day forward, but they still continued to live separately for a period of time called the “betrothal.†Therefore they were husband and wife because they made a binding covenant, but not yet “married†which means they actually lived together as one flesh. It was during this point of time that he could divorce her, but only for this one specific cause. As Deuteronomy 22:19 specifically said: If she hadn't been found guilty of this one specific sin (fornication) that "she shall remain his wife; he cannot divorce her all his days". So the perminency of marriage has always been in effect under both covenants, except for this very limited provision which has nothing to do with "divorce" as we know it today. These have never been lawful anywhere in scripture under any covenant.

The Laws in Deuteronomy stated that he could dissolve this covenant, if when he married her, he found that she had already fornicated with someone else. In other words, she had defrauded him of the virgin bride that he agreed to marry when the covenant was made, so he could dissolve the covenant and marry someone else, but he could not ever take her back if she married again.

This context is entirely different than "divorces" that are not done according to the Laws of Moses, which is what Jesus was condemning the Pharisees as "adulterers" for performing. Even though they were under the Laws of Moses, their divorces and subsequent remarriages were adultery because they weren't done for the cause of premarital fornication only as the Law stated. Therefore it is important to distinguish between legal Old Covenant divorces, and illegal ones that do not separate the marriage bond. One cannot remarry a spouse that was done legally under the Laws of Moses, but any other "divorce" is not recognized by God as legal, so those marriages are never dissolved as far as He is concerned. It cannot therefore be immoral to return to someone whom one is legally bound to, so that provision is not applicable to this discussion.

SealedEternal
 
Caroline H said:
I wish people would stop laying unbiblical burdens on people who are seeking God's word and will in their life.

I wish people would stop twisting God's Words to encourage others to live in sin. If people are truly seeking His Word they will immediately see that He teaches repeatedly that the marriage bond is joined by God for life, and man cannot separate this union. They will also see that to do so and remarry is to enter into an extramarital relationship in rebellion against God. To ignore these commands and look for verses to take out of context to create loopholes, is not seeking God's word and will in one's life.

Give the woman scripture and let her decide.

That's why I meticulously post all of the scriptures on the subject, instead of making vague unfounded claims like others tend to do.

Don't try to twist it to make her out to be an adulteress when it is her husband who is the adulterer (if that is the case with them).

The Bible specifically says that both are adulterers if they remarry, as well as anyone who marries them:

Matthew 5: 31 "It was said, 'WHOEVER SENDS HIS WIFE AWAY, LET HIM GIVE HER A CERTIFICATE OF DIVORCE'; 32 but I say to you that everyone who divorces his wife, except for the reason of unchastity, makes her commit adultery; and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery.

Mark 10:11-12 And He (Jesus) *said to them, "Whoever divorces his wife and marries another woman commits adultery against her; and if she herself divorces her husband and marries another man, she is committing adultery."

Luke 16:18 (Jesus said)"Everyone who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery, and he who marries one who is divorced from a husband commits adultery.â€

Jesus specifically says that:

1. Whoever divorces his wife and marries another woman commits adultery against her
2. Everyone who divorces his wife, except for the reason of unchastity, makes her commit adultery
3. Whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery
4. If she herself divorces her husband and marries another man, she is committing adultery


Because the marriage is joined by God for life, both parties are committing adultery to remarry, as well as anyone who marries them.

SealedEternal
 
This topic has been discussed extensively on this forum, and I do not wish to make this thread into another debate thread, when the OP is asking for advice.

Jillian, I encourage you to read through this thread, Subject: The conditional marriage covenant., which deals with many questions that you may have. Also, in the second post there is this link, http://studies.assembly-ministries.org/ ... m.php?f=12, which has many studies on the issue of divorce and remarriage in the Bible.

The most sound advice anyone can give you, however, is to pray...pray hard, that the Lord save your marriage and change hearts where they need to be changed. I pray for the Lord's guidance for you and your husband, and His blessings on your family :pray
 
Welcome to the site, sealed.

I'm curious as to how we constantly see remarraige as an unforgivable sin? How is it that we can equate remarraige with Blaspheme of the Spirit?

Mark 10:2-9 Some Pharisees came up to Jesus, testing Him, and began to question Him whether it was lawful for a man to divorce a wife. 3 And He answered and said to them, "What did Moses command you?" 4 They said, "Moses permitted a man TO WRITE A CERTIFICATE OF DIVORCE AND SEND her AWAY." 5 But Jesus said to them, "Because of your hardness of heart he wrote you this commandment. 6 "But from the beginning of creation, God MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE. 7 "FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER, 8 AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH; so they are no longer two, but one flesh. 9 "What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate."

This passage has a key that many people who call remarraige a sin forget. God is the one who joins a man to a woman as husband and wife. Consider this, if a man takes a woman to be his legal wife when it is not God's will, are they truly joined by God?

In the old testament, the law allowed for divorce, if this is the case, then the law allowed for sin! This is surely not the God we know from scripture. If God is the giver of the law he allowed them to sin without the need to return to God for repentance. If God is the same yesterday, today, and forever, how could he allow for a sin one day and then decide it is sin the next?

Lastly, if our sins are forgiven in Christ, we are a new creation. If we sinned before God before we knew him calling a relationship that did not have him in it a marraige, and then we divorce. If we are made completely new in Christ, then remarraige must be allowed or we are not completely renewed in Christ.

Just because we call a relationship marraige in our eyes, doesn't mean that's how God see it. Since we cannot see as God does, why not let him judge us and our action rather than our imperfect interpretations of his word. Keep this in mind, if the unforgivable sin is not remarraige, then it can be forgiven and used by God.

Mark 3:28-29

"I tell you the truth, all the sins and blasphemes of men will be forgiven them. But whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; he is guilty of an eternal sin." NIV

Even if remarraige is a sin, which clearly has just as much ground for as it does against, it can be forgiven. Perhaps man is not the one only responsible for the ending of what we call "marraige." Maybe God himself ends Godless relationships that got a legal title to bring about a greater change in their life through a true marraige before God.

I'm sure you will reply, but I will not debate you in this thread.
 
Caroline H said:
Jillian, I encourage you to read through this thread, Subject: The conditional marriage covenant., which deals with many questions that you may have. Also, in the second post there is this link, http://studies.assembly-ministries.org/ ... m.php?f=12, which has many studies on the issue of divorce and remarriage in the Bible.

The author of those articles has been divorced and remarried several times himself, and has an obvious agenda. I have debated with him countless times myself on the issue. Jillian, I advise that you read the Bible, and seek God's will, rather than looking to people to try to make the Bible say what they need it to to fit their own lifestyle.

SealedEternal
 
Blazin Bones said:
Welcome to the site, sealed.

I'm curious as to how we constantly see remarraige as an unforgivable sin? How is it that we can equate remarraige with Blaspheme of the Spirit?

I never said it was unforgivable. The Bible says that it is adultery, and therefore like all sins it needs to be repented of.

Mark 10:2-9 Some Pharisees came up to Jesus, testing Him, and began to question Him whether it was lawful for a man to divorce a wife. 3 And He answered and said to them, "What did Moses command you?" 4 They said, "Moses permitted a man TO WRITE A CERTIFICATE OF DIVORCE AND SEND her AWAY." 5 But Jesus said to them, "Because of your hardness of heart he wrote you this commandment. 6 "But from the beginning of creation, God MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE. 7 "FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER, 8 AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH; so they are no longer two, but one flesh. 9 "What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate."

This passage has a key that many people who call remarraige a sin forget. God is the one who joins a man to a woman as husband and wife. Consider this, if a man takes a woman to be his legal wife when it is not God's will, are they truly joined by God?

God never said He would choose our spouses for us. He only said that He will join us to the one we make that commitment to for life, because He is the author and arbitor of the institution. Therefore once we enter into His institution, we are subject to His rules. He says we cannot divorce and remarry because we are bound to that person for life, and therefore it is adultery if we rebel against that command.

In the old testament, the law allowed for divorce, if this is the case, then the law allowed for sin! This is surely not the God we know from scripture. If God is the giver of the law he allowed them to sin without the need to return to God for repentance. If God is the same yesterday, today, and forever, how could he allow for a sin one day and then decide it is sin the next?

I explained that in great detail in my previous post. That was not divorce of fully married couples as we know it today, and it actually said in the Old Covenant Law that if a woman was a virgin when her husband married her, that he could not divorce her all his days:

Deuteronomy 22:13-19 "If any man takes a wife and goes in to her and then turns against her, and charges her with shameful deeds and publicly defames her, and says, 'I took this woman, but when I came near her, I did not find her a virgin,' then the girl's father and her mother shall take and bring out the evidence of the girl's virginity to the elders of the city at the gate. "The girl's father shall say to the elders, 'I gave my daughter to this man for a wife, but he turned against her; and behold, he has charged her with shameful deeds, saying, "I did not find your daughter a virgin." But this is the evidence of my daughter's virginity.' And they shall spread the garment before the elders of the city. "So the elders of that city shall take the man and chastise him, and they shall fine him a hundred shekels of silver and give it to the girl's father, because he publicly defamed a virgin of Israel. And she shall remain his wife; he cannot divorce her all his days.

Lastly, if our sins are forgiven in Christ, we are a new creation. If we sinned before God before we knew him calling a relationship that did not have him in it a marraige, and then we divorce. If we are made completely new in Christ, then remarraige must be allowed or we are not completely renewed in Christ.

That's a whole separate topic that perhaps we can address in another thread. The concise answer as far as marriage is concerned, is that if one is in a relationship that God calls adulterous, then it doesn't magically become not adultery because the person supposedly accepts Christ. It's quite the opposite. If someone truly accepts Christ as their Lord, then they will stop willfully living in adultery and start walking according to His will. When the Bible speaks of a "new creation" or being "renewed"it means that God has given us a new heart that we don't desire to commit what He calls adultery anymore, and not that we somehow have a license to commit it with impunity.


Just because we call a relationship marraige in our eyes, doesn't mean that's how God see it. Since we cannot see as God does, why not let him judge us and our action rather than our imperfect interpretations of his word. Keep this in mind, if the unforgivable sin is not remarraige, then it can be forgiven and used by God.

It can be forgiven if it is repented of. No sin is forgiven if we continue to practice it. If someone is in a relationship that God calls adultery, then they have not repented until they end the extramarital relationship.

SealedEternal
 
Blazin Bones said:
In the old testament, the law allowed for divorce, if this is the case, then the law allowed for sin! This is surely not the God we know from scripture. If God is the giver of the law he allowed them to sin without the need to return to God for repentance. If God is the same yesterday, today, and forever, how could he allow for a sin one day and then decide it is sin the next?

I wanted to also add that the Old Testament did not allow for divorce, and the marriage for life doctrine has been in effect from the beginning:

Genesis 2:21 So the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and he slept; then He took one of his ribs and closed up the flesh at that place. 22 The LORD God fashioned into a woman the rib which He had taken from the man, and brought her to the man. 23 The man said, "This is now bone of my bones, And flesh of my flesh; She shall be called Woman, Because she was taken out of Man." 24 For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother, and be joined to his wife; and they shall become one flesh.

This idead is reiterated several times in the New Testament, and clarified to mean that the marriage covenant is joined by God for as long as the two shall live:

Ephesians 5:28 So husbands ought also to love their own wives as their own bodies. He who loves his own wife loves himself; 29 for no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as Christ also does the church, 30 because we are members of His body. 31 FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND SHALL BE JOINED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH. 32 This mystery is great; but I am speaking with reference to Christ and the church. 33 Nevertheless, each individual among you also is to love his own wife even as himself, and the wife must see to it that she respects her husband.

Matthew 19:4-6 And He answered and said, "Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE, and said, 'FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND BE JOINED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH'? "So they are no longer two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate."

As I showed earlier, the Old Covenant Law taught that if a woman was a virgin when her husband married her, that "she shall remain his wife; he cannot divorce her all his days." That is why Jesus said that anyone under the Old Covenant who divorced his wife who hadn't fornicated, was committing adultery to remarry, as well as making his wife commit adultery when she remarried. Marriage for life has always been the Law of God under both covenants, and Malachi illustrated this as well:

Malachi 2:13-17 "This is another thing you do: you cover the altar of the LORD with tears, with weeping and with groaning, because He no longer regards the offering or accepts it with favor from your hand. "Yet you say, 'For what reason?' Because the LORD has been a witness between you and the wife of your youth, against whom you have dealt treacherously, though she is your companion and your wife by covenant. "But not one has done so who has a remnant of the Spirit And what did that one do while he was seeking a godly offspring? Take heed then to your spirit, and let no one deal treacherously against the wife of your youth.. "For I hate divorce," says the LORD, the God of Israel, "and him who covers his garment with wrong," says the LORD of hosts. "So take heed to your spirit, that you do not deal treacherously." You have wearied the LORD with your words Yet you say, "How have we wearied Him?" In that you say, "Everyone who does evil is good in the sight of the LORD, and He delights in them," or, "Where is the God of justice?"

The woman who this man supposedly "divorced" was still his wife by covenant after he "divorced" her. This concept has been in effect since the creation of Adam and Eve, and never changed. That's why Jesus was calling the Pharisees adulterers for their illegal divorces and remarriages in Matthew 19. People turn that passage completely on its head, and claim it gives them a license to do the very thing that Jesus was condemning the Pharisees for.

SealedEternal
 
jasoncran said:
then read deutermony 24, and then restate that it dont.

I've already explained that. Yes the Law did allow a man to divorce his wife if she was discovered to have fornicated when he married her. That has nothing to do with "divorce" as we are defining it.

In the Old Covenant they made marriage covenants about a year before the two actually came together as "one flesh". The presumption when the contract was made, was that the woman would be a virgin when he received her to be his wife. The Law allowed him to reject her if she was proven to have fornicated, while if she hadn't then "He could not divorce her all his days". That's why Jesus said that any Old Covenant person divorcing apart from fornication, and subsequently remarrying, was committing adultery, as well as making his wife commit adultery when she remarried.

SealedEternal
 
so when its then if he's man who isnt a virgin which he isnt, then she has cause. if we live by that ot so literally then we should also kill our children who rebel. after Jesus didnt do away with that stuff, just fulfilled the punishement, should we then slay the witches as well, or the lbgt?
 
jasoncran said:
so when its then if he's man who isnt a virgin which he isnt, then she has cause. if we live by that ot so literally then we should also kill our children who rebel. after Jesus didnt do away with that stuff, just fulfilled the punishement, should we then slay the witches as well, or the lbgt?

I have said repeatedly that I am not under the Laws of Moses. It is those on the other side of the issue that appeal to this clause, and not me. What's interesting to me is that I doubt that they keep them either, but only appeal to them when it serves their need.

SealedEternal
 
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