Kids Fighting Back

[Boidae21]

hmm... when I finally fought back against the biggest bully that was messing with me, it didn't encourage him, he stopped after I fought back. As a matter of fact, all the bullying stopped when I fought back. I was no longer the punching bag.

When my son defended his little sister from the boy that was teasing and bullying her, the kids stopped and never did it again. As a matter of fact, she has not been teased or been picked on since. They know that my son's younger siblings are off limits because he will protect them.

 

[Lewis]

hmm... when I finally fought back against the biggest bully that was messing with me, it didn't encourage him, he stopped after I fought back. As a matter of fact, all the bullying stopped when I fought back. I was no longer the punching bag.

When my son defended his little sister from the boy that was teasing and bullying her, the kids stopped and never did it again. As a matter of fact, she has not been teased or been picked on since. They know that my son's younger siblings are off limits because he will protect them.

Somtimes that is what it takes.

 

[Ace1234]

Yes, if attacked fight back.

We can't confuse the "turn the other cheek" as an attack. In biblical days a slap on the cheek was meant as insult, not an attack. Usually after the first slap arrangments were made for a fight or duel, if the person stood there and did nothing often he got slapped again. Christ was teaching to offer the other cheek before slapped again, to try to avoid a fight, he wasn't teaching that if someone attacked you or bullied you to just stand there.

This tradition of slapping the cheek continued for hundreds of years. I'm sure you've seen the movies where in disgust a man slaps another man, then that man demands a duel, then the fight happens. In days of yore to just attack a man without warning was cowardly, the slap tradition was how gentlemen started fights, not the fight itself.

Our strongest bodily urge is self preservation, God put that in us for a reason. We should avoid fights, but when we're attacked it is natural to protect ourselves or the ones we love.

 

[Ace1234]

it's important to realize, Christ could have driven all his persecutors insane with merely his mind, blown their bodies into atoms, but he endured their bullying and persecution, because he knew that the vast majority of people who get bullied cannot fight back. The reason people bully you is because they are very aware, that you cannot fight back, and they WANT you to try to fight back.

When you fight back, it makes it so much more exciting for bullies, it becomes more thrilling for them, and encourages them.

When two cats hiss and growl and have a stand off, they are gauging eachother's adrenaline response. All animals do this, in a ritualized, practical territorial dispute for mates and food, but humans do it for a kind of psychological gratification, what we refer to as 'the ego'. The ego is really in this case, a sense of well being and confidence in securing one's feeding space and mating rights to females who pass into our territory.

In the case of homosexuals, which is really what the media is talking about, this is a kind of moral persecution of people, one could say sending murderers to jail is 'bullying', or arresting drunken drivers is 'bullying'.

Really, thought I think the whole 'bullying' media garbage is a public psyop, because the whole world regards the US as a bully for invading Iraq and Afghanistan, so they want people to think their government is against bullying. Kind of makes you want to throw up. We are being ruled by the most vile, deceitful, avaricious, diabolical snake like people the world has ever seen. Calling them 'satanic' is an appropriate use of the term.

I disagree, most bullies bully because they know the person won't fight back. That's why they often pick on weaker kids. Most bullies don't seek out an equal mate of size and fighting skill.

My son is 14 and in a new school. I've taught him how to fight over the years as he is tall and lanky. I was a golden gloves in the 80's. My son is a skilled fighter for his age, but he gets scared about fighting and often gets bullied until he can't take it. The last bout a bully stole his jacket, my son grabbed it back and got punched, that was enough, he put the bully down quickly and gave him a black eye and fat lip. He got suspended, which was OK.

I don't know that it's biblical, but I live by the John Wayne principle.
"I don't lay hands on people and I won't have them laying hands on me."

 

[handy]

Viola didn't "fight back" per se, but she did get the girl down on the ground and subdued.

Today the girl came and apologized for the whole thing, and the boy who had got everyone all worked up also apologized. Viola also hugged both the girl and the boy, and apologized for her own actions. Not only for her share in the gossip, but also for pulling the girl's hair. She honestly didn't remember pulling the girl's hair and it wasn't what she was trying to do...she was just wanting to get the girl down and the hair was right there. Once she realized that she did in fact pull the girl's hair, she apologized for doing so. Other girls came forward with apologies and by lunch, it was all cool. She they all had lunch together, including the girl who tried to beat her up and they all had a good time.

She told me that the vice-principal saw them all talking to each other and immediately went over to them wanting to know if there were any problems and they told him no, it was all cool and everything was fine. She said he just shook his head and said, "You kids just crack me up sometimes."

I had already talked to the principal by then and he downgraded the infraction so that it won't be on her permanent record, and, if there aren't any other incidents will be just a line on his computer by March. It won't even show in her student record.

Again, she didn't "fight back"...but, she put the girl down and kept her there.

I think the outcome is far better than if she had a: stood there and let the girl pummel her into a shattered mess, causing her to feel bad about herself or b: pummel the other girl into a shattered mess and causing that girl to have even more issues than she already has. The principal told me that the girl is very socially awkward and hasn't many friends. The girl told Viola that some people had been saying that Viola had been talking trash about her (more gossip). Viola told her that if anyone tells her anything in the future that concerns Viola...to just go and talk with her about it.

Subdue the attacker, but then go the extra mile of working to get it resolved.

I'm not saying that this approach would work with all bullies, but perhaps it should be the first thing tried, as opposed to being a punching bag or responding to violence with violence.

 

[jasoncran]

one cant always subdue an opponent like.

lets delve on a brief rabbit trail

and hypothetically speaking replace the violas assailent with a girl who wrestled. its is likely that such would bully? no but it can happen.

so in that guess all means to cease the attack would have to be used.

ie punches, then submit. or choke but the later is techinically use of deadly force.

 

[GojuBrian]

That was a good assessment about the slapping. I agree.

 

[Lewis]

If subduing works that is great but it won't work all the time. Kids will get into fights that is just what kids do.

 

[handy]

If subduing works that is great but it won't work all the time. Kids will get into fights that is just what kids do.

Sorry Lewis, but to me, that sounds too much like "Kid's will have sex, that is just what kids do."

 

[Lewis]

Sorry Lewis, but to me, that sounds too much like "Kid's will have sex, that is just what kids do."

Yeah they do my little grand kids fight each other over toys all the time. Kids in school have fights all the time and it is a everyday thing here in Philadelphia. Months ago I posted on this board the violence that goes on in the Philadelphia schools on this board, and when I find it I will post it again. But yes Dora that is what kids do they are not mature enough or have not had any home training to deal with conflict so they fight. Here in Philly the kids fight the teachers. And if you think that is not what kids do look at the below link. Here in Philly violence is a way of life, I hate it but what can I do. In one or 2 cases 5 year old,s attacked teachers here in Philly. We have cops stationed in our schools so what does that tell you.
http://search.yahoo.com/search?p=Philadelphia%20school%20violence&ei=UTF-8&fr=moz2-ytff-tyc

Teacher attacked
http://search.yahoo.com/search;_ylt... teacher attacked&fr2=sb-top&fr=moz2-ytff-tyc

 

[handy]

I guess what I'm getting at Lewis, isn't that kids won't fight or won't have sex for that matter, but rather that we need to teach them that it's unacceptable behavior. I worked in a day-care with 2-4 year old kids for years and yep, teaching the little ones better ways to handle conflicts that just grabbing and slugging was part of the job, just like it's part of the job of parents of teens to teach that sex is for marriage...alone.

 

[Lewis]

You are right Dora, but it seems like these stupid parents here in Philly and elsewhere will not teach the kids how to act in society. So the kids grow up thinking that violence should be the first step.

 

[St. Helens]

This violent behavior has been going on for about 15 years. I had a friend staying with my family for a while. her daughter would charge at adults and try to take out their knees. I see this behavior in three year olds. I know a three year old boy, the son of a friend that does this. Parents are not teaching children self control anymore.

 

[Drew]

you all really dont understand what he came to do? it was to redeem man, not change the law.

False choice.

Yes, Jesus came to redeem man, but that truth does not mean that Jesus did not also abolish the law. Jesus clearly challenged the Law of Moses many times:

1. He represented Himself, not the temple as the "location" for forgiveness of sin. This directly contradicts the Law!!!

2. He indicated that all foods are clean. This directly contradicts the Law!!!

3. He came into contact with lepers and other unclean persons - intentionally making Himself "ritually unclean". This violates the Law!!!!

4. He worked on the Sabbath - again, a challenge to the Law;

5. He declared Himself to be the "true temple" - if not a violation of the Law, this was a radical challenge to it.

....and I suspect there are other examples as well.

I am frankly astonished that, given the wealth of evidence that Jesus was announcing a new "order" that replaced the system of the Law of Moses, that anyone would suggest that Jesus affirmed the Law of Moses.

 

[Hitch]

On a related note...

Several years ago we were remodeling and the contractor brought in his nephew to help. One night about 2 am there was a crash in the hallway. By morning we discovered that who ever made the noise must have been familiar with the remodel and realized a lap top was missing.
You know what is next.
The contractor hears through family grapevine that nephew is bragging about how well he is doing on a computer game. Of course he cant afford the new computer and gives up in the ensuing confrontation.
The boys mother blamed us for leaving the computer out where he would be tempted.
The police, upon hearing the computer had been recovered declined any further action, despite the the fact that the boy crossed a state line with the aid of someone who could drive, with the intent to steal the property and take it back to another state. We had already supplied name, address ,times and dates etc.

 

[Drew]

hmm... when I finally fought back against the biggest bully that was messing with me, it didn't encourage him, he stopped after I fought back. As a matter of fact, all the bullying stopped when I fought back. I was no longer the punching bag.

Again, what seems to "work" in terms of making our lives better is not the appropriate criteria!!!

Jesus said the way of the gospel was one of bearing our own crosses. So why do you seem to think that if using force enabled you to escape a problem, that this is what Jesus would approve of?

Did Jesus "fight back"?

 

[Hitch]

False choice.

Yes, Jesus came to redeem man, but that truth does not mean that Jesus did not also abolish the law. Jesus clearly challenged the Law of Moses many times:

1. He represented Himself, not the temple as the "location" for forgiveness of sin. This directly contradicts the Law!!!

Not if He was telling the truth Sweetie

2. He indicated that all foods are clean. This directly contradicts the Law!!!

3. He came into contact with lepers and other unclean persons - intentionally making Himself "ritually unclean". This violates the Law!!!!

4. He worked on the Sabbath - again, a challenge to the Law;

5. He declared Himself to be the "true temple" - if not a violation of the Law, this was a radical challenge to it.

See above

....and I suspect there are other examples as well.

I am frankly astonished that, given the wealth of evidence that Jesus was announcing a new "order" that replaced the system of the Law of Moses, that anyone would suggest that Jesus affirmed the Law of Moses.

You mean like when Jesus let the woman caught in adultery go because there were no willing witnesses? :toofunny:toofunny:toofunny

 

[Drew]

I don't know that it's biblical, but I live by the John Wayne principle.
"I don't lay hands on people and I won't have them laying hands on me."

I would suggest that this philosophy is indeed not Biblical.

 

[Hitch]

I would suggest that this philosophy is indeed not Biblical.

Its vastly more biblical than the silly notion that Jesus radically challenged the Law of Moses.ed!

 

[St. Helens]

On a related note...

Several years ago we were remodeling and the contractor brought in his nephew to help. One night about 2 am there was a crash in the hallway. By morning we discovered that who ever made the noise must have been familiar with the remodel and realized a lap top was missing.
You know what is next.
The contractor hears through family grapevine that nephew is bragging about how well he is doing on a computer game. Of course he cant afford the new computer and gives up in the ensuing confrontation.
The boys mother blamed us for leaving the computer out where he would be tempted.
The police, upon hearing the computer had been recovered declined any further action, despite the the fact that the boy crossed a state line with the aid of someone who could drive, with the intent to steal the property and take it back to another state. We had already supplied name, address ,times and dates etc.

This is also related:

When my son was in high school he had a number of friends. I got to know them when they would come over. Here is a listing of the bad ones. Here are some examples of their behavior. I am not posting their real names.

Starla - she would get high then throw dishes, utensils and cigarettes ash down the laundry chute. She also tried to dig a devil out of the ceiling with a steak knife.

Lisa - She would climb on top of the garage roof and 'make out' with her girlfriend. :verysick

Devin - He stole a dinner fork, CDs and DVD's from the house.

Garza - He would get high and try to get my son to do the same.

Rick - Would steal from people houses. Stole a baby car seat and left it in my garage. This kid ended up in jail.

Jeff - He would shoot at cars with a pellet gun.

Needless to say I banned these individuals from coming over again. Not all of my son's friends were losers but I was surprised at the number of kids that lacked discipline and self control.