- Dec 13, 2019
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According to a couple of 2023 Gallup polls, 71% of Americans think same-sex “marriage” should be legal, and 64% believe gay relationships are morally acceptable.
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[__ Science __ ] Why Do More Christians Now Support Same-Sex “Marriage”?
- Thread starter AIG.com
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It is because they are not really Christians.
Uncle J
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Really? So someone merely holding the view that gay people should have basic freedoms disqualifies them from being a Christian?
Is the same true for other sins and sinners, like say....greed/love of money? If someone holds the view that rich people should be free to accumulate as much wealth as they can, does that disqualify them from being Christian?
Basic freedoms are awarded to all by the Bill of Rights.
Do I have the right to kill or steal from my neighbor ?
Being a Christian requires submission to a higher power than the government of a nation.
Yes, as those things of this world are of no importance to those with faith in God.
Nope.
I just hope their ways and means of accumulation glorify God.
Only sin will disqualify men from being a REAL Christian.
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Uncle J
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Well, I guess that supports the perception among many that some Christians make it seem as if there is only one sin described in the Bible.
I guess that means all those times Jesus condemned greed and the love of money were just.....suggestions? Voluntary guidelines? Funny too how Jesus never said a single word about being gay, given how important it apparently is in Christianity.
If some were out proclaiming the right to steal from their neighbors, they would get the same push-back as from what you just acknowledged was sin.
They were pointed observations of His present environment/audience.
They is nothing wrong with earning money.
Even lots of money, as it could be used to help others.
Had there been proponents of that sin in that time, the proponents would have been stoned.
Only recently has an evil minority pushed it into the spot-light.
Uncle J
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But if they proclaimed the right to accumulate money, that's just fine.
Exhibit A.
Whereas no one today ever promotes greed and the love of money......oh wait, they're the entire basis of our capitalistic economy!
You really don't see the problem here, do you?
1 Timothy 6:9-11 KJV - But they that will be rich fall into - Bible Gateway
9 But they that will(seek to) be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition. 10 For the love of money is the root of all evil:Is earning a living against any of God's wishes ?
Is excelling at a trade or craft against God's wishes ?
?
Plenty promote greed.
Plenty demonstrate against it.
Are those demonstrators "moneyphobic" ?
The problem is that you are offended by the fight against one kind of sin but propose the fight against another.
That is double-mindedness.
Homosexuality and greed are equally offensive to God.
Partakers of both will be cast into the lake of fire, if they don't repent of sin.
footnote for comparison:
"gotquestions.org › sin-against-your-own-body.html
"gotquestions.org › sin-against-your-own-body.html
Why is sexual immorality described as sin against your own body (1 ...
Jul 25, 2023All other sins a person commits are outside the body, but whoever sins sexually, sins against their own body" (1 Corinthians 6:18). "
Uncle J
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What about so-called "Christians" who support greed and the love of money? Does that automatically doom them to the lake of fire?
- Dec 11, 2010
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Not necessarily. What is done with the wealth can be sinful or not. Do you think greed does not exist with the poor? I would beg to differ. This is my own personal experience from years ago, circa 1982-1985. I've been poor and I can tell you without hesitation that poor people concentrate on gaining wealth maybe even more than rich people do in many cases. When I was living on public assistance I became acquainted and friends with quite a few others in the same boat. I honestly didn't know any that didn't milk the system for everything they could and none of them had any desire to better their position by finding work. They were more than content to just keep on keeping on. Just because a poor person hasn't figured out how to gain wealth, doesn't make them any less greedy.
Please remember that I am not painting with a broad brush for I know there are poor people that just don't have options and I do believe it is our Christian duty to help them. Jesus said that each of us are to help the poor, the widow, and the sick, etc. (see Matthew 25:31-46), He did not say that we should wait for our government to take care of them.
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Uncle J
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Sure.
Sure it does.
You may have missed my point. I'm not focused on the wealthy and what they do with their money. The point is about how some Christians make it seem as if being gay is the ultimate sin above all others, while they turn a blind eye (or worse) to greed and the love of money, even though Jesus spoke quite a bit about the love of money and never said a word about being gay.
There was a recent survey that showed one of the main reasons the "nones" (people with no religion) aren't Christians is because of how Christians treat LGBTQs.
If I were a Christian, I'd take note of that.
Because by becoming one with another person, you lose a little bit of yourself.
It does, if they don't "turn from" those actions. (REPENT)
Uncle J
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Well I guess that means (at least according to you) all Trump supporters, followers of the prosperity gospel, followers of televangelists, and the like are doomed to the lake of fire.
If men have something to "turn from", but don't do it, they will not see eternal life.
Blind are leading the blind all over the world? There is no one, not one, greedy person in the heavens or world to come. No liars. No adulterers. No perverts/gays/homos/nor child molestors and no idolators , no one serving demons , no one worshiping any other god, will be in heaven ever.
If someone emphasizes one or more , or another, so what ? As Jesus says in Scripture - unless ye each repent, ye shall never see heaven. Ye all will perish like those on whom the tower fell.
- Dec 11, 2010
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I agree with most of what you say. How others feel or judge me has nothing to do with my beliefs. It is what God says that matters.
Jesus says plenty about LGBTQ+ lifestyles. First, one must understand who Jesus is.
Jesus was God in human form.
“Behold, the virgin shall be with child, and bear a Son, and they shall call His name Immanuel,” which is translated, “God with us.” Matthew 1:23 NKJV
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. John 1:1-2 NKJV
Jesus did the will of the Father and spoke what the Father gave Him to say.
"I can of Myself do nothing. As I hear, I judge; and My judgment is righteous, because I do not seek My own will but the will of the Father who sent Me."
John 5:30 NKJV
“If you had known Me, you would have known My Father also; and from now on you know Him and have seen Him.” Philip said to Him, “Lord, show us the Father, and it is sufficient for us.” Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you so
long, and yet you have not known Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father in Me? The words that I speak to you I do not speak on My own authority; but the Father who dwells in Me does the works. Believe Me that I am in the Father and the Father in Me, or else believe Me for the sake of the works themselves."
John 14:7-11 NKJV
As he was saying these things, a cloud came and overshadowed them, and they were afraid as they entered the cloud. And a voice came out of the cloud, saying, “This is my Son, my Chosen One; listen to him!”
Luke 9:34-35 ESV
This is what God says...
You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination.
Leviticus 18:22 ESV
If a man lies with a male as he lies with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination.
Leviticus 20:13 NKJV
"From the beginning of the creation, God ‘made them male and female.' For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, 8 and the two shall become one flesh’; so then they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let not man separate.”
Mark 10:6-9 NKJV
God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah because of their debauchery and sexual immorality including homosexual behaviors. Abraham even tried to stop God from destroying them. You can read all about it in Genesis, chapters 18 and 19. Here are a few highlights.
Then the men rose from there and looked toward Sodom, and Abraham went with them to send them on the way. And the Lord said, “Shall I hide from Abraham what I am doing, since Abraham shall surely become a great and mighty nation, and all the nations of the earth shall be blessed in him?"
Genesis 18:16-18 NKJV
And the Lord said, “Because the outcry against Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grave, I will go down now and see whether they have done altogether according to the outcry against it that has come to Me; and if not, I will know.”
Genesis 18:20-21 NKJV
Abraham came near and said, “Would You also destroy the righteous with the wicked? Suppose there were fifty righteous within the city; would You also destroy the place and not spare it for the fifty righteous that were in it?
Genesis 18:24 NKJV
Abraham tried negotiating to spare Sodom and Gomorrah about a half-dozen more times as recorded in chapter 18. But, it was no use because...
Now before they lay down, the men of the city, the men of Sodom, both old and young, all the people from every quarter, surrounded the house. And they called to Lot and said to him, “Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us that we may know them carnally.”
Genesis 19:4-5 NKJV
Lot even offered his daughters to the men but they would not have it.
So Lot went out to them through the doorway, shut the door behind him, and said, “Please, my brethren, do not do so wickedly! See now, I have two daughters who have not known a man; please, let me bring them out to you, and you may do to them as you wish; only do nothing to these men, since this is the reason they have come under the shadow of my roof.”
Genesis 19:6-8 NKJV
The Bible has much more to say but I'll stop here.
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