There are many mysteries about God.

[Bruce.Leiter]

God, as revealed in the Bible, is mysterious:
--THREE Persons as Father, Jesus, and Spirit but only ONE God.
--Jesus as all-God and all-human to be able BOTH to die and then rise permanently from the dead.
--invisible but revealed in his actions of creation and salvation.

There are many ways people have devised to sidestep these truths that the Bible reveals. In those ways, humans often want their reason to win out instead of accepting the Bible's witness that God is mysterious. Why? What do you think?

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

In eastern orthodox, God the Father has always been mysterious, and that's because He as the creator of the universe is OUTSIDE the universe he created, he's beyond time and space. We can perceive benevalent things that eminated from Him - marvels, wonders, wisdom, illumination, energy, all of his providence, but the Father himself, the source of all his benedictions are incomprehensible. One theologian once said that God is like the sun up in the sky, we can't live without it, yet we can't look at it directly. As far as I'm concerned, the holy trinity is not God's core identity, but a mechanism to communicate with us, a bridge across the chasm of sin. The bible is not exhaustive, it's not all what and who God is, says the bible itself (Jn. 21:25), yet it's sufficient, it's the special revelation of God, through which we get to know him.

 

[for_his_glory]

In many things God remains a mystery to us as all things are not yet revealed. Here is what scripture does reveal about Him as in the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

1. God is Spirit, John 4:24, not flesh and blood and in the OT either spoke directly to the prophets or by angels and also various objects like a burning bush or an Ass for example. Between the OT and NT God was silent towards Israel as when they returned to Israel from the Babylonian captivity they came back as merchants and not shepherds as they were disobedient to God going after other gods, Book of Malachi.

2. Jesus being the very Spirit of God before the foundation of the world as He and the Father are one was prophesied by the Prophets in the OT and spoken of by John the Baptist in the NT as John being the forerunner of Christ calling all to repent. As foretold Christ did come as the word of God made flesh (skin, bone, blood) to be that light that shines in darkness. He came as redeemer Savior through Gods grace as Christ is our faith that all can repent of their sins and have eternal life with the Father to all who will believe in Him as Lord and Savior. John 1:1-4; 1 Peter 1:13-21

3. After the sacrifice of Christ God raised Him from the grave and as He had to ascend back up to heaven the promise was that He would never leave us or forsake us as when He ascended He sent down the Holy Spirit (Spirit of God) to indwell all who will believe in Christ and His finished works on the cross. In the OT Gods Spirit fell on them for a time and purpose under heaven. Now we are indwelled with that power and authority through Gods grace that the Holy Spirit now works in us and through us teaching all things God wants us to learn. All three are Spiritual and Spiritual awaking's in us to know the will of God and walk in His statures. John 16:7-15

Ephesians 4: 5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism, 6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

1 John 5:6 This is he that came by water (word) and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth. 7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word (Jesus), and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. 8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water (word), and the blood: and these three agree in one.

God the Father, God the Son, God the Holy Spirit as all three coequal Gods Spirit.

Jesus being the right arm of God. Isaiah 53:1 Who hath believed our report? and to whom is the arm of the LORD revealed? 2 For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him. 3 He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.

Jesus is the word of God. John 12:49 For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. 50 And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.

Jesus is word, light and life that is God come in the flesh. John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. 4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

Gods Holy Spirit has come to indwell us and teach us. John 14: 26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.


Scriptures that reference Jesus being referred to as God:
John 1:1-14; John 10:30; Romans 9:5; Colossians 2:9; Hebrews 1:8, 9; 1 John 5:7, 8, 20; 1 Corinthians 8:6; 2 Corinthians 3:17; 13:14; Isaiah 9:6; 44:6; Luke 1:35; Matthew 1:23; 28:19; John 14:16, 17; Genesis 1:1, 2 (cross reference John 1:1-14); 1 Corinthians 12:4-6; Ephesians 4:4-6; Colossians 1:15-17; John 14:9-11; Philippians 2:5-8; Rev 1:8


Scriptures that refer the Holy Spirit as being God:
Psalms 139:7, 8; John 14:17; 16:13; Isaiah 40:13; 1 Corinthians 2:10, 11; Zechariah 4:6; Luke 1:35; Ephesians 4:4-6; Romans 5:5; 1 Corinthians 6:19; Ephesians 1:13; 1 Thessalonians 1:5; Titus 3:5; 2 Peter 1:21; Jude 1:20

 

[Bruce.Leiter]

In eastern orthodox, God the Father has always been mysterious, and that's because He as the creator of the universe is OUTSIDE the universe he created, he's beyond time and space. We can perceive benevalent things that eminated from Him - marvels, wonders, wisdom, illumination, energy, all of his providence, but the Father himself, the source of all his benedictions are incomprehensible. One theologian once said that God is like the sun up in the sky, we can't live without it, yet we can't look at it directly. As far as I'm concerned, the holy trinity is not God's core identity, but a mechanism to communicate with us, a bridge across the chasm of sin. The bible is not exhaustive, it's not all what and who God is, says the bible itself (Jn. 21:25), yet it's sufficient, it's the special revelation of God, through which we get to know him.

In large part, I agree with you, Carry_Your_Name. But when you say, "the holy trinity is not God's core identity," what exactly do you mean? I'm curious. The Bible is all we have to know God, and to me according to the Gospel of John, the Trinity seems to be God's identity.

 

[Johann!@#]

Scriptures that reference Jesus being referred to as God:

Explicit statements identifying Jesus as “God”

1. Is. 9:6; note 10:21. Translations which render the Hebrew el gibbôr here as “mighty hero” are inconsistent in their rendering of 10:21. Also note that Ezek. 32:21, which some try to cross-reference, is (a) not in the same context, as is Is. 10:21, and (b) speaking of false gods, cf. I.G.5. Some object that “mighty God” is simply theophoric (i.e., in which a person’s name says something about God, not about himself). However, this is not true of the rest of the compound name, which is descriptive of the Messiah himself (note especially “Prince of Peace”). It certainly makes no sense to argue both that the expression el gibbôr means merely “mighty hero” and that it is a theophoric description of God. In light of the NT, we should understand it as a description of the Messiah as God.

2. John 1:1. Even if Jesus is here called “a god” (as some have argued), since there is only one God, Jesus is that God. However, the “a god” rendering is incorrect. Other NT passages using the Greek word for God (theos) in the same construction are always rendered “God”: Mark 12:27; Luke 20:38; John 8:54; Phil. 2:13; Heb. 11:16. Passages in which a shift occurs from ho theos (“the God”) to theos (“God”) never imply a shift in meaning: Mark 12:27; Luke 20:37-38; John 3:2; 13:3; Rom. 1:21; 1 Thess. 1:9; Heb. 9:14; 1 Pet. 4:10-11. In context, the preincarnate Christ (called “the Word”) is eternal (existing before creation, 1:1-2), is credited with creation (1:3, 10), is the object of faith (1:12), and has the divine glory (1:14)—all of which shows that he really is God.

3. John 1:18. The best manuscripts have “God” here, not “Son.” The word monogenês, frequently rendered “only-begotten,” actually means “one of a kind,” “unique,” though in the NT always in the context of a son or daughter. Even if one translates “only-begotten,” the idea is not of a “begotten god” as opposed to an “unbegotten god.” The best translation is probably “God the only Son” (NRSV).

4. John 20:28. Compare Rev. 4:11, in which the same author (John) uses the same construction in the plural (“our”) instead of the singular (“my”). See also Ps. 35:23. Note that Christ’s response indicates that Thomas’s acclamation was not wrong. Also note that John 20:17 does show that the Father was Jesus’ “God” (due to Jesus becoming a man), but the words “my God” as spoken by Thomas later in the same chapter must mean no less than in v. 17. Thus, what the Father is to Jesus in his humanity, Jesus is to Thomas (and therefore to us as well).

5. Acts 20:28: “the church of God which he purchased with his own blood.” The variant readings (e.g. “the church of the Lord”) show that the original wording was understood to mean “his own blood,” not “the blood of his own [Son]” (since otherwise no one would have thought to change it). (No one seems to have thought to understand the text to mean “the blood of his own” until about a hundred years ago.) Thus all other renderings are attempts to evade the startling clarity and meaning of this passage.

6. Rom. 9:5. While grammatically this is not the only possible interpretation, the consistent form of doxologies in Scripture, as well as the smoothest reading of the text, supports the identification of Christ as “God” in this verse.

7. Titus 2:13. Grammatically and contextually, this is one of the strongest proof texts for the deity of Christ. Sharp’s first rule, properly understood, proves that the text should be translated “our great God and Savior” (cf. same construction in Luke 20:37; Rev. 1:6; and many other passages). Note also that Paul always uses the word “manifestation” (“appearing”) of Christ: 2 Thess. 2:8; 1 Tim. 6:14; 2. Tim. 1:10; 4:1, 8. The view that Paul means that Jesus Christ is “the glory of our great God and Savior” has several difficulties. For example, construing “Savior” as someone other than “Jesus Christ” in this context is awkward and implausible. Such alternate explanations would never have been entertained had Paul written “the appearing of the glory of our great Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.” Thus, the root problem is the assumption that Paul could not have called Jesus God.

8. Heb. 1:8. The rendering, “God is your throne,” is nonsense—God is not a throne, he is the one who sits on the throne! Also, “God is your throne,” if taken to mean God is the source of one’s rule, could be said about any angelic ruler—but Hebrews 1 is arguing that Jesus is superior to the angels.

9. 2 Pet. 1:1. The same construction is used here as in Titus 2:13; see the parallel passages in 2 Pet. 1:11; 2:20; 3:2, 18. See comments above on Titus 2:13.

10. 1 John 5:20. Admittedly, biblical scholars are split on whether the “true God” in this text is the Father or the Son. Three considerations favor the Son. First, the closest antecedent for “this one” is Jesus Christ (“in his Son Jesus Christ. This one…”). Second, in 1:2 the “eternal life” is Jesus Christ (who was “with the Father”), an apparent example of inclusio (repetition of a theme or idea at the beginning and end of a text). Third, the confession form “This one is …” (houtos estin) strongly favors Jesus Christ, rather than the Father, as the subject, since John uses this language repeatedly with regard to Christ (John 1:30, 33, 34; 4:29, 42; 6:14, 42, 50, 58; 7:18, 25, 26, 40, 41; 1 John 5:6; of the man born blind, John 9:8, 9, 19, 20; of the disciple, John 21:24; of the anti-Christ, 1 John 2:22; 2 John 1:7), but not once for the Father. John has just used this formula for Christ earlier in the same chapter (1 John 5:6).

B. Jesus is Jehovah/Yahweh (the Lord)

1. Rom. 10:9-13: Note the repeated “for” (gar), which links these verses closely together. The “Lord” of 10:13 (where kurios, “Lord,” translates the HebrewYahweh) must be the “Lord” of 10:9, 12.

2. Phil. 2:9-11. In context, the “name that is above every name” is “Lord” (vs. 11), i.e., Jehovah.

3. Heb. 1:10: Here God the Father addresses the Son as “Lord,” in a quotation from Ps. 102:25 (cf. 102:24, where the person addressed is called “God”). Since here the Father addresses the Son as “Lord,” this cannot be explained away as a text in which a creature addresses Christ as God/Lord in a merely representational sense.

4. 1 Pet. 2:3-4: This verse is nearly an exact quotation of Ps. 34:8a, where “Lord” is Jehovah. From 1 Pet. 2:4-8 it is also clear that “the Lord” in v. 3 is Jesus.

5. 1 Pet. 3:13-15: these verses are a clear reference to Is. 8:12-13, where the one who is to be regarded as holy is Jehovah.

6. Texts where Jesus is spoken of as the “one Lord” (cf. Deut. 6:4; Mark 12:29): 1 Cor. 8:6; Eph. 4:5; cf. Rom. 10:12; 1 Cor. 12:5.

7. Many other texts that call Jesus “Lord” do so in ways that equate him with Yahweh: Matt. 3:3, Mark 1:3, and Luke 3:4 (cf. Is. 40:3); Matt. 7:21-22 and Luke 6:46; Matt. 8:25 and 14:30 (cf. Ps. 118:25); Acts 1:24 (addressing the Lord Jesus [cf. v. 21] in prayer and attributing to him divine knowledge); 2:21 (cf. Joel 2:32), 36; 7:59-60; 8:25; 1 Cor. 1:2 (calling on the Lord), 8 (the day of the Lord) [etc.], 31 (cf. Jer. 9:23-24); 2:16 (cf. Is. 40:13); 4:4-5; 5:4 (gathering in the name of the Lord); 6:11; 7:17, 32-35 (devotion to the Lord); 10:21-22; etc.

C. Jesus has many other names or titles of God

1. Titles belonging only to God

a. The First and the Last (Beginning and End, Alpha and Omega): Rev. 1:7-8, 17b-18; 2:8; 22:13; cf. Is. 41:4; 44:6; 48:12; Rev. 21:6

b. King of kings and Lord of lords: Rev. 17:14; 19:16; cf. Dan. 4:37; 1 Tim. 6:15

2. Titles belonging in the ultimate sense only to God

a. Savior: Luke 2:11; John 4:42; Phil. 3:20; 2 Tim. 1:10; Titus 2:13, cf. v. 10; 2 Pet. 1:11; 2:20; 3:2, 18; 1 John 4:14; cf. Is. 43:11; 45:21-22; 1 Tim. 4:10; on Jesus becoming the source of salvation; Heb. 5:9, cf. Ex. 15:2; Ps. 118:14, 21

b. Shepherd: John 10:11; Heb. 13:20; cf. Ps. 23:1; Is. 40:11

c. Bridegroom/Husband: Matt. 22:2; 25:1-13; Mark 2:19; John 3:29; 2 Cor. 11:2; Eph. 5:25-27; Rev. 19:7-9; 21:2, 9; cf. Is. 54:5; 62:5; Jer. 31:32

d. Rock: 1 Cor. 10:4; cf. Is. 44:8

3. Jesus’ self-declarations—his “I am” sayings

a. Jesus’ “I am” (egô eimi) sayings with a predicate declare his divine functions: “I am the bread of life” (John 6:35, 48; cf. 6:41, 51), “I am the light of the world” (John 8:12), “I am the gate” of the sheep (John 10:7, 9), “I am the good shepherd” (10:11, 14), “I am the resurrection and the life” (John 11:25), “I am the way and the truth and the life” (John 14:6), “I am the [true] vine” (John 15:1, 5). In these sayings Jesus essentially claims to be everything his people need for eternal life.

b. Jesus’ “I am” (egô eimi) sayings without a predicate declare his divine identity as the divine Son come to be the Messiah: “I am [he]; do not fear” (Matt. 14:27; Mark 6:50; John 6:20; cf. Is. 43:2, 5); “I am [he]” (Mark 14:62); “I am [he], the one speaking to you” (John 4:26, cf. Is. 52:6); “unless you believe that I am [he] you will die in your sins…then you will know that I am [he]” (John 8:24, 28, cf. Is. 43:10-11); “before Abraham came into being, I am” or “I am [he]” (John 8:58, note v. 59); “I know the ones I have chosen…you will believe that I am [he]” (John 13:18-19, cf. Is. 43:10); “I am [he]” (John 18:5, cf. vv. 6-8). Note the many parallels to the “I am” sayings of God in Isaiah, which virtually all biblical scholars agree are echoed by Jesus’ “I am” sayings in John. Some scholars also see at least an indirect connection to God’s declaration “I am who I am” in Ex. 3:14 (especially for John 8:58).

The Biblical Basis of the Doctrine of the Trinity, Part IV: The Son, Jesus Christ, Is God

Part IV of an outline study of the doctrine of the Trinity; this part shows that the Bible identifies Jesus Christ as God and that it attributes to him the works, attributes, and honors characteristic of God.

bib.irr.org

J.

 

[Bruce.Leiter]

Explicit statements identifying Jesus as “God”

1. Is. 9:6; note 10:21. Translations which render the Hebrew el gibbôr here as “mighty hero” are inconsistent in their rendering of 10:21. Also note that Ezek. 32:21, which some try to cross-reference, is (a) not in the same context, as is Is. 10:21, and (b) speaking of false gods, cf. I.G.5. Some object that “mighty God” is simply theophoric (i.e., in which a person’s name says something about God, not about himself). However, this is not true of the rest of the compound name, which is descriptive of the Messiah himself (note especially “Prince of Peace”). It certainly makes no sense to argue both that the expression el gibbôr means merely “mighty hero” and that it is a theophoric description of God. In light of the NT, we should understand it as a description of the Messiah as God.

2. John 1:1. Even if Jesus is here called “a god” (as some have argued), since there is only one God, Jesus is that God. However, the “a god” rendering is incorrect. Other NT passages using the Greek word for God (theos) in the same construction are always rendered “God”: Mark 12:27; Luke 20:38; John 8:54; Phil. 2:13; Heb. 11:16. Passages in which a shift occurs from ho theos (“the God”) to theos (“God”) never imply a shift in meaning: Mark 12:27; Luke 20:37-38; John 3:2; 13:3; Rom. 1:21; 1 Thess. 1:9; Heb. 9:14; 1 Pet. 4:10-11. In context, the preincarnate Christ (called “the Word”) is eternal (existing before creation, 1:1-2), is credited with creation (1:3, 10), is the object of faith (1:12), and has the divine glory (1:14)—all of which shows that he really is God.

3. John 1:18. The best manuscripts have “God” here, not “Son.” The word monogenês, frequently rendered “only-begotten,” actually means “one of a kind,” “unique,” though in the NT always in the context of a son or daughter. Even if one translates “only-begotten,” the idea is not of a “begotten god” as opposed to an “unbegotten god.” The best translation is probably “God the only Son” (NRSV).

4. John 20:28. Compare Rev. 4:11, in which the same author (John) uses the same construction in the plural (“our”) instead of the singular (“my”). See also Ps. 35:23. Note that Christ’s response indicates that Thomas’s acclamation was not wrong. Also note that John 20:17 does show that the Father was Jesus’ “God” (due to Jesus becoming a man), but the words “my God” as spoken by Thomas later in the same chapter must mean no less than in v. 17. Thus, what the Father is to Jesus in his humanity, Jesus is to Thomas (and therefore to us as well).

5. Acts 20:28: “the church of God which he purchased with his own blood.” The variant readings (e.g. “the church of the Lord”) show that the original wording was understood to mean “his own blood,” not “the blood of his own [Son]” (since otherwise no one would have thought to change it). (No one seems to have thought to understand the text to mean “the blood of his own” until about a hundred years ago.) Thus all other renderings are attempts to evade the startling clarity and meaning of this passage.

6. Rom. 9:5. While grammatically this is not the only possible interpretation, the consistent form of doxologies in Scripture, as well as the smoothest reading of the text, supports the identification of Christ as “God” in this verse.

7. Titus 2:13. Grammatically and contextually, this is one of the strongest proof texts for the deity of Christ. Sharp’s first rule, properly understood, proves that the text should be translated “our great God and Savior” (cf. same construction in Luke 20:37; Rev. 1:6; and many other passages). Note also that Paul always uses the word “manifestation” (“appearing”) of Christ: 2 Thess. 2:8; 1 Tim. 6:14; 2. Tim. 1:10; 4:1, 8. The view that Paul means that Jesus Christ is “the glory of our great God and Savior” has several difficulties. For example, construing “Savior” as someone other than “Jesus Christ” in this context is awkward and implausible. Such alternate explanations would never have been entertained had Paul written “the appearing of the glory of our great Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.” Thus, the root problem is the assumption that Paul could not have called Jesus God.

8. Heb. 1:8. The rendering, “God is your throne,” is nonsense—God is not a throne, he is the one who sits on the throne! Also, “God is your throne,” if taken to mean God is the source of one’s rule, could be said about any angelic ruler—but Hebrews 1 is arguing that Jesus is superior to the angels.

9. 2 Pet. 1:1. The same construction is used here as in Titus 2:13; see the parallel passages in 2 Pet. 1:11; 2:20; 3:2, 18. See comments above on Titus 2:13.

10. 1 John 5:20. Admittedly, biblical scholars are split on whether the “true God” in this text is the Father or the Son. Three considerations favor the Son. First, the closest antecedent for “this one” is Jesus Christ (“in his Son Jesus Christ. This one…”). Second, in 1:2 the “eternal life” is Jesus Christ (who was “with the Father”), an apparent example of inclusio (repetition of a theme or idea at the beginning and end of a text). Third, the confession form “This one is …” (houtos estin) strongly favors Jesus Christ, rather than the Father, as the subject, since John uses this language repeatedly with regard to Christ (John 1:30, 33, 34; 4:29, 42; 6:14, 42, 50, 58; 7:18, 25, 26, 40, 41; 1 John 5:6; of the man born blind, John 9:8, 9, 19, 20; of the disciple, John 21:24; of the anti-Christ, 1 John 2:22; 2 John 1:7), but not once for the Father. John has just used this formula for Christ earlier in the same chapter (1 John 5:6).

B. Jesus is Jehovah/Yahweh (the Lord)

1. Rom. 10:9-13: Note the repeated “for” (gar), which links these verses closely together. The “Lord” of 10:13 (where kurios, “Lord,” translates the HebrewYahweh) must be the “Lord” of 10:9, 12.

2. Phil. 2:9-11. In context, the “name that is above every name” is “Lord” (vs. 11), i.e., Jehovah.

3. Heb. 1:10: Here God the Father addresses the Son as “Lord,” in a quotation from Ps. 102:25 (cf. 102:24, where the person addressed is called “God”). Since here the Father addresses the Son as “Lord,” this cannot be explained away as a text in which a creature addresses Christ as God/Lord in a merely representational sense.

4. 1 Pet. 2:3-4: This verse is nearly an exact quotation of Ps. 34:8a, where “Lord” is Jehovah. From 1 Pet. 2:4-8 it is also clear that “the Lord” in v. 3 is Jesus.

5. 1 Pet. 3:13-15: these verses are a clear reference to Is. 8:12-13, where the one who is to be regarded as holy is Jehovah.

6. Texts where Jesus is spoken of as the “one Lord” (cf. Deut. 6:4; Mark 12:29): 1 Cor. 8:6; Eph. 4:5; cf. Rom. 10:12; 1 Cor. 12:5.

7. Many other texts that call Jesus “Lord” do so in ways that equate him with Yahweh: Matt. 3:3, Mark 1:3, and Luke 3:4 (cf. Is. 40:3); Matt. 7:21-22 and Luke 6:46; Matt. 8:25 and 14:30 (cf. Ps. 118:25); Acts 1:24 (addressing the Lord Jesus [cf. v. 21] in prayer and attributing to him divine knowledge); 2:21 (cf. Joel 2:32), 36; 7:59-60; 8:25; 1 Cor. 1:2 (calling on the Lord), 8 (the day of the Lord) [etc.], 31 (cf. Jer. 9:23-24); 2:16 (cf. Is. 40:13); 4:4-5; 5:4 (gathering in the name of the Lord); 6:11; 7:17, 32-35 (devotion to the Lord); 10:21-22; etc.

C. Jesus has many other names or titles of God

1. Titles belonging only to God

a. The First and the Last (Beginning and End, Alpha and Omega): Rev. 1:7-8, 17b-18; 2:8; 22:13; cf. Is. 41:4; 44:6; 48:12; Rev. 21:6

b. King of kings and Lord of lords: Rev. 17:14; 19:16; cf. Dan. 4:37; 1 Tim. 6:15

2. Titles belonging in the ultimate sense only to God

a. Savior: Luke 2:11; John 4:42; Phil. 3:20; 2 Tim. 1:10; Titus 2:13, cf. v. 10; 2 Pet. 1:11; 2:20; 3:2, 18; 1 John 4:14; cf. Is. 43:11; 45:21-22; 1 Tim. 4:10; on Jesus becoming the source of salvation; Heb. 5:9, cf. Ex. 15:2; Ps. 118:14, 21

b. Shepherd: John 10:11; Heb. 13:20; cf. Ps. 23:1; Is. 40:11

c. Bridegroom/Husband: Matt. 22:2; 25:1-13; Mark 2:19; John 3:29; 2 Cor. 11:2; Eph. 5:25-27; Rev. 19:7-9; 21:2, 9; cf. Is. 54:5; 62:5; Jer. 31:32

d. Rock: 1 Cor. 10:4; cf. Is. 44:8

3. Jesus’ self-declarations—his “I am” sayings

a. Jesus’ “I am” (egô eimi) sayings with a predicate declare his divine functions: “I am the bread of life” (John 6:35, 48; cf. 6:41, 51), “I am the light of the world” (John 8:12), “I am the gate” of the sheep (John 10:7, 9), “I am the good shepherd” (10:11, 14), “I am the resurrection and the life” (John 11:25), “I am the way and the truth and the life” (John 14:6), “I am the [true] vine” (John 15:1, 5). In these sayings Jesus essentially claims to be everything his people need for eternal life.

b. Jesus’ “I am” (egô eimi) sayings without a predicate declare his divine identity as the divine Son come to be the Messiah: “I am [he]; do not fear” (Matt. 14:27; Mark 6:50; John 6:20; cf. Is. 43:2, 5); “I am [he]” (Mark 14:62); “I am [he], the one speaking to you” (John 4:26, cf. Is. 52:6); “unless you believe that I am [he] you will die in your sins…then you will know that I am [he]” (John 8:24, 28, cf. Is. 43:10-11); “before Abraham came into being, I am” or “I am [he]” (John 8:58, note v. 59); “I know the ones I have chosen…you will believe that I am [he]” (John 13:18-19, cf. Is. 43:10); “I am [he]” (John 18:5, cf. vv. 6-8). Note the many parallels to the “I am” sayings of God in Isaiah, which virtually all biblical scholars agree are echoed by Jesus’ “I am” sayings in John. Some scholars also see at least an indirect connection to God’s declaration “I am who I am” in Ex. 3:14 (especially for John 8:58).

The Biblical Basis of the Doctrine of the Trinity, Part IV: The Son, Jesus Christ, Is God

Part IV of an outline study of the doctrine of the Trinity; this part shows that the Bible identifies Jesus Christ as God and that it attributes to him the works, attributes, and honors characteristic of God.

bib.irr.org

J.

An excellent description of Bible truth, Johann!@#!

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

In large part, I agree with you, Carry_Your_Name. But when you say, "the holy trinity is not God's core identity," what exactly do you mean? I'm curious. The Bible is all we have to know God, and to me according to the Gospel of John, the Trinity seems to be God's identity.

God the Father's core identity is the Eternal Creator of the universe - YHWH, I am who I am, everything else derives from there. Jesus the Son is the Father's incarnate on earth, born of God's spirit, and acting as the gateway through which we can have access to God. The holy trinity is a mechanism for communication, not God's core identity. It's like your avatar on this forum, a mechanism to communicate with others on the same forum. Of course, Jesus the Son was there at the beginning as well, but he didn't become flesh and dwell among men at the beginning, right? He was the Prophet like Moses, shrouded in mystery until his incarnation at God's appointed time and place, which was in first century Nazareth, that's what I meant.

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. (Gen. 1:1)
God, who made the world and everything in it, since He is Lord of heaven and earth, does not dwell in temples made with hands. (Acts 17:24)
And God said to Moses, “I AM WHO I AM.” And He said, “Thus you shall say to the children of Israel, ‘I AM has sent me to you.’ ”Moreover God said to Moses, “Thus you shall say to the children of Israel: ‘The Lord God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you. This is My name forever, and this is My memorial to all generations.’ (Ex. 3:15-16)
The Lord your God will raise up for you a Prophet like me (Moses) from your midst, from your brethren. Him you shall hear ... I will raise up for them a Prophet like you from among their brethren, and will put My words in His mouth, and He shall speak to them all that I command Him. (Deut. 18:15-18)

 

[Free]

God the Father's core identity is the Eternal Creator of the universe - YHWH, I am who I am, everything else derives from there. Jesus the Son is the Father's incarnate on earth, born of God's spirit, and acting as the gateway through which we can have access to God. The holy trinity is a mechanism for communication, not God's core identity. It's like your avatar on this forum, a mechanism to communicate with others on the same forum. Of course, Jesus the Son was there at the beginning as well, but he didn't become flesh and dwell among men at the beginning, right? He was the Prophet like Moses, shrouded in mystery until his incarnation at God's appointed time and place, which was in first century Nazareth, that's what I meant.

Being triune is most certainly the core of God’s identity. It is the whole reason he created in the first place. You’ve put the cart before the horse.

And to say “The holy trinity is a mechanism for communication,” is Modalism, not Trinitarianism.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

Being triune is most certainly the core of God’s identity. It is the whole reason he created in the first place. You’ve put the cart before the horse.

And to say “The holy trinity is a mechanism for communication,” is Modalism, not Trinitarianism.

You're the one who put the cart before the horse, not me. God's core identity is defined in Gen. 1:1, the first verse of the whole bible, his personal name revealed to Moses in Ex. 3:14-15, any correct understanding must derive from these, not Jn. 1:1 or Matt. 19:28.

And let me be crystal clear, I'm a trinitarian as much as you are, the difference is that I don't idolize or weaponize the doctrine of trinity like you do. If you wanna further discussion on the holy trinity, please go somewhere else.

 

[for_his_glory]

Explicit statements identifying Jesus as “God”

1. Is. 9:6; note 10:21. Translations which render the Hebrew el gibbôr here as “mighty hero” are inconsistent in their rendering of 10:21. Also note that Ezek. 32:21, which some try to cross-reference, is (a) not in the same context, as is Is. 10:21, and (b) speaking of false gods, cf. I.G.5. Some object that “mighty God” is simply theophoric (i.e., in which a person’s name says something about God, not about himself). However, this is not true of the rest of the compound name, which is descriptive of the Messiah himself (note especially “Prince of Peace”). It certainly makes no sense to argue both that the expression el gibbôr means merely “mighty hero” and that it is a theophoric description of God. In light of the NT, we should understand it as a description of the Messiah as God.

2. John 1:1. Even if Jesus is here called “a god” (as some have argued), since there is only one God, Jesus is that God. However, the “a god” rendering is incorrect. Other NT passages using the Greek word for God (theos) in the same construction are always rendered “God”: Mark 12:27; Luke 20:38; John 8:54; Phil. 2:13; Heb. 11:16. Passages in which a shift occurs from ho theos (“the God”) to theos (“God”) never imply a shift in meaning: Mark 12:27; Luke 20:37-38; John 3:2; 13:3; Rom. 1:21; 1 Thess. 1:9; Heb. 9:14; 1 Pet. 4:10-11. In context, the preincarnate Christ (called “the Word”) is eternal (existing before creation, 1:1-2), is credited with creation (1:3, 10), is the object of faith (1:12), and has the divine glory (1:14)—all of which shows that he really is God.

3. John 1:18. The best manuscripts have “God” here, not “Son.” The word monogenês, frequently rendered “only-begotten,” actually means “one of a kind,” “unique,” though in the NT always in the context of a son or daughter. Even if one translates “only-begotten,” the idea is not of a “begotten god” as opposed to an “unbegotten god.” The best translation is probably “God the only Son” (NRSV).

4. John 20:28. Compare Rev. 4:11, in which the same author (John) uses the same construction in the plural (“our”) instead of the singular (“my”). See also Ps. 35:23. Note that Christ’s response indicates that Thomas’s acclamation was not wrong. Also note that John 20:17 does show that the Father was Jesus’ “God” (due to Jesus becoming a man), but the words “my God” as spoken by Thomas later in the same chapter must mean no less than in v. 17. Thus, what the Father is to Jesus in his humanity, Jesus is to Thomas (and therefore to us as well).

5. Acts 20:28: “the church of God which he purchased with his own blood.” The variant readings (e.g. “the church of the Lord”) show that the original wording was understood to mean “his own blood,” not “the blood of his own [Son]” (since otherwise no one would have thought to change it). (No one seems to have thought to understand the text to mean “the blood of his own” until about a hundred years ago.) Thus all other renderings are attempts to evade the startling clarity and meaning of this passage.

6. Rom. 9:5. While grammatically this is not the only possible interpretation, the consistent form of doxologies in Scripture, as well as the smoothest reading of the text, supports the identification of Christ as “God” in this verse.

7. Titus 2:13. Grammatically and contextually, this is one of the strongest proof texts for the deity of Christ. Sharp’s first rule, properly understood, proves that the text should be translated “our great God and Savior” (cf. same construction in Luke 20:37; Rev. 1:6; and many other passages). Note also that Paul always uses the word “manifestation” (“appearing”) of Christ: 2 Thess. 2:8; 1 Tim. 6:14; 2. Tim. 1:10; 4:1, 8. The view that Paul means that Jesus Christ is “the glory of our great God and Savior” has several difficulties. For example, construing “Savior” as someone other than “Jesus Christ” in this context is awkward and implausible. Such alternate explanations would never have been entertained had Paul written “the appearing of the glory of our great Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.” Thus, the root problem is the assumption that Paul could not have called Jesus God.

8. Heb. 1:8. The rendering, “God is your throne,” is nonsense—God is not a throne, he is the one who sits on the throne! Also, “God is your throne,” if taken to mean God is the source of one’s rule, could be said about any angelic ruler—but Hebrews 1 is arguing that Jesus is superior to the angels.

9. 2 Pet. 1:1. The same construction is used here as in Titus 2:13; see the parallel passages in 2 Pet. 1:11; 2:20; 3:2, 18. See comments above on Titus 2:13.

10. 1 John 5:20. Admittedly, biblical scholars are split on whether the “true God” in this text is the Father or the Son. Three considerations favor the Son. First, the closest antecedent for “this one” is Jesus Christ (“in his Son Jesus Christ. This one…”). Second, in 1:2 the “eternal life” is Jesus Christ (who was “with the Father”), an apparent example of inclusio (repetition of a theme or idea at the beginning and end of a text). Third, the confession form “This one is …” (houtos estin) strongly favors Jesus Christ, rather than the Father, as the subject, since John uses this language repeatedly with regard to Christ (John 1:30, 33, 34; 4:29, 42; 6:14, 42, 50, 58; 7:18, 25, 26, 40, 41; 1 John 5:6; of the man born blind, John 9:8, 9, 19, 20; of the disciple, John 21:24; of the anti-Christ, 1 John 2:22; 2 John 1:7), but not once for the Father. John has just used this formula for Christ earlier in the same chapter (1 John 5:6).

B. Jesus is Jehovah/Yahweh (the Lord)

1. Rom. 10:9-13: Note the repeated “for” (gar), which links these verses closely together. The “Lord” of 10:13 (where kurios, “Lord,” translates the HebrewYahweh) must be the “Lord” of 10:9, 12.

2. Phil. 2:9-11. In context, the “name that is above every name” is “Lord” (vs. 11), i.e., Jehovah.

3. Heb. 1:10: Here God the Father addresses the Son as “Lord,” in a quotation from Ps. 102:25 (cf. 102:24, where the person addressed is called “God”). Since here the Father addresses the Son as “Lord,” this cannot be explained away as a text in which a creature addresses Christ as God/Lord in a merely representational sense.

4. 1 Pet. 2:3-4: This verse is nearly an exact quotation of Ps. 34:8a, where “Lord” is Jehovah. From 1 Pet. 2:4-8 it is also clear that “the Lord” in v. 3 is Jesus.

5. 1 Pet. 3:13-15: these verses are a clear reference to Is. 8:12-13, where the one who is to be regarded as holy is Jehovah.

6. Texts where Jesus is spoken of as the “one Lord” (cf. Deut. 6:4; Mark 12:29): 1 Cor. 8:6; Eph. 4:5; cf. Rom. 10:12; 1 Cor. 12:5.

7. Many other texts that call Jesus “Lord” do so in ways that equate him with Yahweh: Matt. 3:3, Mark 1:3, and Luke 3:4 (cf. Is. 40:3); Matt. 7:21-22 and Luke 6:46; Matt. 8:25 and 14:30 (cf. Ps. 118:25); Acts 1:24 (addressing the Lord Jesus [cf. v. 21] in prayer and attributing to him divine knowledge); 2:21 (cf. Joel 2:32), 36; 7:59-60; 8:25; 1 Cor. 1:2 (calling on the Lord), 8 (the day of the Lord) [etc.], 31 (cf. Jer. 9:23-24); 2:16 (cf. Is. 40:13); 4:4-5; 5:4 (gathering in the name of the Lord); 6:11; 7:17, 32-35 (devotion to the Lord); 10:21-22; etc.

C. Jesus has many other names or titles of God

1. Titles belonging only to God

a. The First and the Last (Beginning and End, Alpha and Omega): Rev. 1:7-8, 17b-18; 2:8; 22:13; cf. Is. 41:4; 44:6; 48:12; Rev. 21:6

b. King of kings and Lord of lords: Rev. 17:14; 19:16; cf. Dan. 4:37; 1 Tim. 6:15

2. Titles belonging in the ultimate sense only to God

a. Savior: Luke 2:11; John 4:42; Phil. 3:20; 2 Tim. 1:10; Titus 2:13, cf. v. 10; 2 Pet. 1:11; 2:20; 3:2, 18; 1 John 4:14; cf. Is. 43:11; 45:21-22; 1 Tim. 4:10; on Jesus becoming the source of salvation; Heb. 5:9, cf. Ex. 15:2; Ps. 118:14, 21

b. Shepherd: John 10:11; Heb. 13:20; cf. Ps. 23:1; Is. 40:11

c. Bridegroom/Husband: Matt. 22:2; 25:1-13; Mark 2:19; John 3:29; 2 Cor. 11:2; Eph. 5:25-27; Rev. 19:7-9; 21:2, 9; cf. Is. 54:5; 62:5; Jer. 31:32

d. Rock: 1 Cor. 10:4; cf. Is. 44:8

3. Jesus’ self-declarations—his “I am” sayings

a. Jesus’ “I am” (egô eimi) sayings with a predicate declare his divine functions: “I am the bread of life” (John 6:35, 48; cf. 6:41, 51), “I am the light of the world” (John 8:12), “I am the gate” of the sheep (John 10:7, 9), “I am the good shepherd” (10:11, 14), “I am the resurrection and the life” (John 11:25), “I am the way and the truth and the life” (John 14:6), “I am the [true] vine” (John 15:1, 5). In these sayings Jesus essentially claims to be everything his people need for eternal life.

b. Jesus’ “I am” (egô eimi) sayings without a predicate declare his divine identity as the divine Son come to be the Messiah: “I am [he]; do not fear” (Matt. 14:27; Mark 6:50; John 6:20; cf. Is. 43:2, 5); “I am [he]” (Mark 14:62); “I am [he], the one speaking to you” (John 4:26, cf. Is. 52:6); “unless you believe that I am [he] you will die in your sins…then you will know that I am [he]” (John 8:24, 28, cf. Is. 43:10-11); “before Abraham came into being, I am” or “I am [he]” (John 8:58, note v. 59); “I know the ones I have chosen…you will believe that I am [he]” (John 13:18-19, cf. Is. 43:10); “I am [he]” (John 18:5, cf. vv. 6-8). Note the many parallels to the “I am” sayings of God in Isaiah, which virtually all biblical scholars agree are echoed by Jesus’ “I am” sayings in John. Some scholars also see at least an indirect connection to God’s declaration “I am who I am” in Ex. 3:14 (especially for John 8:58).

The Biblical Basis of the Doctrine of the Trinity, Part IV: The Son, Jesus Christ, Is God

Part IV of an outline study of the doctrine of the Trinity; this part shows that the Bible identifies Jesus Christ as God and that it attributes to him the works, attributes, and honors characteristic of God.

bib.irr.org

J.

 

[for_his_glory]

Hi Johann!@# I do appreciate your post #5

Thank you for your post #5 as I do appreciate this, but this is way to confusing for me and would take me forever to digest all of this. I would rather keep what I teach others in a simple form that even a child could understand. For the most part I will let the scriptures speak for itself so others can study this for themselves.

 

[Johann!@#]

Hi Johann!@# I do appreciate your post #5

Thank you for your post #5 as I do appreciate this, but this is way to confusing for me and would take me forever to digest all of this. I would rather keep what I teach others in a simple form that even a child could understand. For the most part I will let the scriptures speak for itself so others can study this for themselves.

for_his_glory

I appreciate your honesty, sister--there’s certainly nothing wrong with your method of studying the Scriptures. As for me, I tend to lean toward a more structured approach involving hermeneutics and exegesis, since I find myself daily engaged in what Paul called "the good fight of faith" (1 Timothy 6:12). I need to be ready to give a solid defense-an apologia-for the hope that is in me, as Peter exhorts in 1 Peter 3:15.

In these times, where Gnosticism and subtle distortions of truth abound, it’s vital that we remain rooted and grounded in the Word. As Paul warned in Ephesians 4:14, we must not be "tossed here and there by waves and carried about by every wind of doctrine." Without the anchoring of Scripture and the guidance of the Holy Spirit, there truly is a risk of being led astray (2 Timothy 3:13–17).

That said, I won’t tag you again, but I do appreciate your engagement and your pursuit of truth.

God bless.

Johann

 

[Free]

You're the one who put the cart before the horse, not me. God's core identity is defined in Gen. 1:1, the first verse of the whole bible, his personal name revealed to Moses in Ex. 3:14-15, any correct understanding must derive from these, not Jn. 1:1 or Matt. 19:28.

No, God is triune and that is why he is the Creator. His triunity is just as core to who he is as his name.

And let me be crystal clear, I'm a trinitarian as much as you are, the difference is that I don't idolize or weaponize the doctrine of trinity like you do.

I don't do either of those things. If you want to attack and misrepresent others, then please go somewhere else.

If you wanna further discussion on the holy trinity, please go somewhere else.

No. The Trinity is brought up in the OP; it's a part of the topic.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

No, God is triune and that is why he is the Creator. His triunity is just as core to who he is as his name.

God is the creator first and foremost, the "why" is beyond your comprehension.

I don't do either of those things. If you want to attack and misrepresent others, then please go somewhere else.

Yes you do, otherwise acknowledge God as the creator first. I don't worship the trinity, triunity or triune nature, I worship God through Jesus, to whom the Holy Spirit points. You're misrepresenting God by naming the trinity as his core identity.

No. The Trinity is brought up in the OP; it's a part of the topic.

Then it's a part of the mystery beyond your comprehension.

 

[Free]

God is the creator first and foremost, the "why" is beyond your comprehension.

No, the why is because he is love (1 John 4:8, 16). He didn't need to create but he did because it is an overflow of love that the persons of the Trinity have for one another. He created to show his glory, including to humans who are created in his image, so that we would glorify him and live in loving relationship with him forever.

Yes you do, otherwise acknowledge God as the creator first.

So, believe as you say or else what you erroneously say about me is true. Great reasoning.

I don't worship the trinity, triunity or triune nature, I worship God through Jesus, to whom the Holy Spirit points. You're misrepresenting God by naming the trinity as his core identity.

No, it is at the core of his identity, along with his attributes.

Then it's a part of the mystery beyond your comprehension.

Stop with personal attacks as they're violations of the ToS.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

No, the why is because he is love (1 John 4:8, 16). He didn't need to create but he did because it is an overflow of love that the persons of the Trinity have for one another. He created to show his glory, including to humans who are created in his image, so that we would glorify him and live in loving relationship with him forever.

The same God is also an all consuming fire that hates evil and judges all. Preaching God the Father without justice, the Son without the cross, the Spirit without conviction, and the ideal of "image of God" without the reality of image of Adam is lying by omission.

So, believe as you say or else what you erroneously say about me is true. Great reasoning.

You're putting God in a box, using human reasoning to perceive his motivation.

No, it is at the core of his identity, along with his attributes.

His core identity is the eternal creator, anything else is his attributes.

Stop with personal attacks as they're violations of the ToS.

Then stop lecturing trinity on me, by doing so you're proven your weaponization of that doctrine, in spite of your denial.

 

[Free]

You're putting God in a box, using human reasoning to perceive his motivation.

It‘s reasoning based on Scripture. How have I put God in a box? What does that box look like?

His core identity is the eternal creator, anything else is his attributes.

You do realize that he really isn’t an “eternal creator,” don’t you? He is eternal, but creation is not. He created time and space, so how can being Creator be at the core of his identity? Should it not be something regarding the nature of his being, something(s) to do with his eternal self-existence prior to creation?

See, you’ve put the cart before the horse. Or, maybe you’ve put him in a box.

Then stop lecturing trinity on me, by doing so you're proven your weaponization of that doctrine, in spite of your denial.

I’m not and I haven’t. The Trinity is at the core of his identity. It is his self-existent nature; it is one of the reasons, or the reason, he created; it is what is behind the plan of salvation and redemption; it is what is behind the mystery of the incarnation.

 

[onlysaved]

"There is a way that seems right to a man but the end thereof is death."

Trying to rationalize things about God that you do not understand so that you can understand them is nothing more than creating a god in your own image. God is mysterious in some ways however He is also made Himself known in clear and tangible ways both through His creation and more importantly through His word.
There is enough in His word that is easily understood that we fail to apply that we ought not to spend a great deal of time speculating about mysteries. It's much more valuable to figure out how to stop sinning and love obedient lives than it is to understand every detail of the trinity.

 

[Johann!@#]

His core identity is the eternal creator, anything else is his attributes.

Brother, I respectfully disagree with the claim that “God’s core identity is the eternal Creator, and everything else is just His attributes.” That statement collapses an important biblical and theological distinction between who God is in Himself and what God does in relation to creation.

To say that “eternal Creator” is God's core identity confuses what is ontologically intrinsic to God with what is economically expressed by God in time. Scripture reveals that God is indeed the Creator (Genesis 1:1; Isaiah 40:28; Romans 1:25), but creation had a beginning.

Prior to Genesis 1:1, there was no creation--yet God was. He was not lacking, incomplete, or undefined before He created. So to root His “core identity” in something that began in time is to tether His essence to something non-eternal, which violates His very aseity and unchangeability (Malachi 3:6; Psalm 90:2).

What is eternal in God is not His role as Creator, but His essence: “God is Spirit” (John 4:24), “God is Light” (1 John 1:5), “God is Love” (1 John 4:8). These are not just “attributes” in the sense of external traits--they are ontological declarations of what God is in Himself, prior to and independent of creation. The Church has historically referred to these as essential properties, not contingent roles.

To call “Creator” His core identity would mean that He was not fully Himself until creation existed—an idea flatly contradicted by John 17:5, where Jesus speaks of the Father’s glory before the world was. God did not become complete by creating. He is eternally sufficient, needing nothing, lacking nothing. The act of creating reveals His power, wisdom, and goodness--but those actions flow from who He already was.

The early Church Fathers were clear on this. Basil the Great writes: “It is not His being the Creator that makes God who He is, but it is because He is who He is that He creates.” (cf. On the Holy Spirit 8.19). Augustine likewise distinguishes between God’s essence (what He is in Himself) and His works (what He does toward creation)—a distinction foundational to classical theism.

So in short--
God is indeed eternal, and He is the Creator.
But “Creator” is a title that depends on the existence of creation—it is a relational distinction, not an essential one.
His core identity is not defined by creation but by His eternal, uncreated being—self-existent, omnipotent, triune, and wholly independent of what He has made.

Reducing all else to “attributes” while elevating “Creator” as the core is, ironically, a form of putting God in a box.

It binds His being to an act that had a beginning, rather than worshiping Him as the Ἐγώ εἰμι—the “I AM” who is before all things and through whom all things came into being (Exodus 3:14; John 8:58; Colossians 1:16–17).

Regards.

J.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

It‘s reasoning based on Scripture. How have I put God in a box? What does that box look like?

It's based on human doctrine, not Scripture. You're putting God in the box of trinitarian theology. Mine on the other hand is based on Gen. 1:1 and Ex. 3:14, anything else, including his triune nature, derives from there.

You do realize that he really isn’t an “eternal creator,” don’t you? He is eternal, but creation is not. He created time and space, so how can being Creator be at the core of his identity? Should it not be something regarding the nature of his being, something(s) to do with his eternal self-existence prior to creation?

You do realize I've never said "eternal creation", don't you? How can creator NOT be at the core of his identity when He created time and space out of nothing, ex nihilo? I cling to his identity revealed by himself in Gen. 1:1 and Ex. 3:14 instead of speculating with my own intellect. If there's a pre-existing nature of His being, that's the mystery OP talks about, it's not for you or I to speculate.

See, you’ve put the cart before the horse. Or, maybe you’ve put him in a box.

No surprise, typical tactics, accusing your opponent of your own guilt.

I’m not and I haven’t. The Trinity is at the core of his identity. It is his self-existent nature; it is one of the reasons, or the reason, he created; it is what is behind the plan of salvation and redemption; it is what is behind the mystery of the incarnation.

Again, you're not in a place to speculate God's motive of creating the universe. You were not there, and you are not self-existent. The Trinity is a mechanism to know his identity, in and of itself it's NOT his core identity. Enlighten me on one thing, was Gen. 1:1 written first or Jn. 1:1? If you admit it's Gen. 1:1, then his core identity is the eternal creator. I cling to apostle Paul's teaching when he preached God to the Areopagus, wherein God's identity, according to Paul, is the eternal Creator.

God, who made the world and everything in it, since He is Lord of heaven and earth, does not dwell in temples made with hands. (Acts. 17:24)