60 Questions Refuting Oneness Pentacostal Modalism

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60 Questions Refuting Oneness Pentecostal Modalism

The United Pentecostal Church International produces a tract called 60 Questions on the Godhead with Bible Answers in which it seeks to debunk the doctrine of the Trinity and defend the Oneness position of Modalism. I’m going to take the next week and a half to post and respond to all of their questions as well as the answers that they have provided. Expect 5 questions per post.

*Note that their questions are immediately followed by their answers. My answers will appear afterwards in red lettering.

QUESTIONS 1 THROUGH 5

1. Is the word trinity in the Bible? No.

This is absolutely true, the word ‘Trinity’ is not in the Bible—in the same respect that a plethora of other words we use to describe Biblical doctrines are not in the Bible (e.g. monotheism, incarnation, millennium, etc.). To quote F.F. Bruce, “Let us not be misled by the foolish argument that because the term ‘Trinity’ does not occur in scriptures, the doctrine of the Trinity is therefore unscriptural.â€

2. Does the Bible say that there are three persons in the Godhead? No.

This question is ambiguous. Do they mean does the Bible explicitly use the phrase, ‘there are three persons in the Godhead’ or are they asking if such a concept can be found in Scripture? In response to the former question, of course not—this phrase occurs no more in the Scriptures than does a statement from Jesus saying, ‘I am God almighty, maker of heaven and earth.’ But if they are asking if the Bible teaches the doctrine that within the one being of God there exists three eternally distinct Persons, then yes! The Bible does say such a thing! The doctrine of the Trinity is derived logically from observing no less than three self-evident truths of scripture:

• 1. Monotheism: There is only one eternal and immutable God that actually exists.
  
  2. There are three distinct Persons all shown to be eternal, namely the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.
  
  3. Each of the three Persons is identified as God (i.e. Deity).

The Hebrew Scriptures plainly declare that ‘Yahweh is God; there is no other besides him’ (Deut. 4:35). Israel’s declaration of faith the Shema says, ‘Hear O Israel, Yahweh our God, Yahweh alone’ (Deut. 6:4) in order to assert that Yahweh alone is the God of Israel and subsequently the rest of the universe. The book of Isaiah is replete with such comments as ‘I am the first and I am the last, beside me there is no God… Is there a God beside me? Yea, no Rock, I know not any’ (Is. 44:6-8 ) and ‘I am Yahweh there is no other; besides me there is no God…I am Yahweh, there is no other’ (Is. 45:5-6).

Father: In a prayer for help Isaiah speaks on behalf of Israel saying, ‘…Yahweh our father, our redeemer, from everlasting is thy name’ (Is. 63:16). Likewise the psalmist speaks of God saying, ‘from everlasting to everlasting, you are God’ (Ps. 90:2). From this we conclude that the Father is indeed eternal.

Son: Likewise the Son has been with the Father from all eternity as is seen from John 1:1; 17:5. John 1:1 tells us that ‘in the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God.’ The verb was (Gk. ?n) is the third person imperfect of the verb to be (Gk. eimi). The imperfect tense denotes continuous action in the past so no matter how far back our minds can conceive, the Word existed before that. But its use in all three clauses tells us three different things about the Word: (1) The Word pre-existed the beginning; (2) The Word was always with God (the Father); (3) The Word was always as to his essential nature God. John 17:5 again utilizes the imperfect tense when Jesus says, ‘Father glorify me alongside yourself with the glory that I possessed (Gk. h? eichon) with you before the world existed. The imperfect tense of I possessed (Gk. h? eichon) shows us that Jesus has always possessed this glory alongside the Father.

Holy Spirit: Hebrews 9:14 clearly calls the Holy Spirit the Eternal Spirit (Gk. pneumatos ai?niou), but this can further be substantiated in that the Holy Spirit was present in the beginning (Gen. 1:2). For the Spirit to be present in the beginning he must have existed prior to the beginning.

Each of the three persons is called God and performs the actions of God in Scripture, but this is not a point of disagreement as the Oneness Pentecostal acknowledges that all three are God, they simply believe these three persons to be manifestations of one person.

3. Does the Bible speak of the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost? Yes.

Obviously—and it speaks of them in terms of eternally distinct persons as indicated in the answer to question #2.

4. Do these titles as used in Matthew 28:19 mean that there are three separate and distinct persons in the Godhead? No, they refer to three offices, roles, or relationship to humanity.

The unorthodox language of ‘separate’ must first be discounted. We certainly do not believe that any separation exists within God—we do however recognize the distinction in persons which Matthew 28:19 clearly shows in its use of the definite article the (Gk. tou) before listing each person as well as the use of the conjunction and (Gk. kai) which connects all three. The claim that these are merely offices, roles, or relationships to humanity is unfounded. Fatherhood and Sonship are personal relationships. These relationships do not exist apart from persons. We have already established the eternal relationship between the Father and Son above in the answer to question #2. Likewise, the Son and the Holy Spirit’s pre-existence negate the claim that these are mere titles used in reference to their relationship to humanity. God enjoyed perfect fellowship within himself before the creation of all things.

5. Does the Bible use the word three in reference to God? Only one verse in the entire Bible does so-I John 5:7. It speaks of the Father, the Word (instead of Son), and the Holy Ghost, and it concludes by saying, “These three are one.â€

The Bible doesn’t need to use the word three in reference to God for it to teach the doctrine of the Trinity. This argument is akin to question #1 in regards to the word Trinity being found in Scripture. We don’t need the word three to count three divine persons. The answer provided for question #2 nullifies this argument.


6. Does the Bible use the word one in reference to God? Yes, many times. For example, see Zechariah 14:9; Malachi 2:10; Matthew 23:9; Mark 12:29, 32; John 8:41; 10:30; Romans 3:30; I Corinthians 8:4; Galatians 3:20; I Timothy 2:5; James 2:19.

No arguments here, the word ‘one’ is certainly used in reference to God which is completely consistent with Trinitarian belief in One God.

7. Can the mystery of the Godhead be understood? Yes. Romans 1:20; Colossians 2:9; I Timothy 3:16.

The question is not specific enough. Can the mystery of the Godhead (i.e. Deity) be understood in what way or to what degree? If by this question they are asking if we can fully understand God then the obvious answer is no. To fully understand God would require us being at the very least equal to God if not greater than him—this is not the case. Yahweh spoke through the prophet Isaiah saying, ‘For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.’ (Is. 55:9) Zophar the Naamathite asked the questions, ‘Can you fathom the mysteries of God? Can you probe the limits of the Almighty?’ (Job 11:7, NIV) If they are asking if God can be understood to a certain degree than the answer is yes—God can be understood to the degree that he has revealed himself in Scripture. It is from this that we know of his tri-personality. Remember, the saints are ‘the ministers of Christ and stewards of the mysteries of God’ (1Cor. 4:1).

8. Has the Christian only one Heavenly Father? Yes. Matthew 23:9.

No arguments here although it must be pointed out that the Father is one of three distinct persons of God. We know the Father in relation to the Son. Logically we would state the argument as follows:
One cannot be a Father without a child.


9. Then why did Jesus say to Philip, “He that hath seen me hath seen the Father†(John 14:9)? Because Jesus is the express image of God’s person. Hebrews 1:3. The Greek word for person in this verse literally means “substance.â€

I would agree with this assessment but qualify it further. Yes, Jesus is the exact representation of the Father’s substance because they share one and the same substance. But Jesus’ comment to Phillip must be understood in light of John’s prologue and the incarnation. John shows a distinction between the Persons of the Father and the Son in John 1:1-3. This is evident in that the ‘Word was with God’ (Gk. pros ton theon). The preposition pros (with the accusative) denotes intimacy, fellowship, a living union, a motion towards, or a facing (cf. Mat. 13:56; 26:55; Mk. 6:3; 9:16; 1Cor. 16:6; 2Cor. 5:8)—meaning that the Word was ‘with’ God in an intimate and personal sense which is only possible if there are multiple persons.

10. Does the Bible say that there are two persons in the Godhead? No.

Again, the Bible doesn’t have to explicitly state that there are two persons in the Godhead for there to be two persons in the Godhead. Now obviously if the Bible teaches that there are three persons in the Godhead (which it does) then that necessarily includes two, but the question is phrased as to suppose binitarianism which the Bible does not teach.

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60 Questions Refuting Oneness Pentecostal Modalism (Continued from previous post):

11. Does the Bible say that all the Godhead is revealed in one person? Yes, in Jesus Christ. II Corinthians 4:4; Colossians 1:19; 2:9; Hebrews 1:3.

Colossians 2:9 seems the most relevant passage here and it merely states that all the fullness of deity dwells bodily in Christ Jesus. The key term here is not deity (Gk. theotetos) but rather bodily (Gk. s?matik?s) for we could accurately say that the fullness of deity is within any one of the three persons of the Trinity, but it is the Son alone whom we can say it dwells bodily.

12. Is the mystery of the Deity hidden from some people? Yes. Luke 10:21-22.

I don’t believe that any defense can be made of Luke 10:21-22 having reference to the mystery of Deity. The plain sense of the passage is that no one intimately knows (Gk. gin?skei) the Son except the Father and no one intimately knows the Father except the Son—and it is the Son who chooses to reveal the Father to others. This is a very apt presentation of the distinction between the persons of the Father and the Son.

13. Who is the Father? The Father is the one God, particularly as revealed in parental relationship to humanity. Deuteronomy 32:6; Malachi 2:10.

This was explained in the response to question #8 but it merits a few more comments. We’ve already seen that the Son has been with the Father since before the beginning of creation from passages such as John 1:1-18; 17:5. The problem with this interpretation is that it makes the Fatherhood of God dependant upon his creation. But the Creator is not dependant upon the creation for anything. The Father is the Father in relation to the Son as is the case with every Father. The Son is begotten by an eternal generation. To draw an analogy, the Sun generates rays of Sunlight… There was never a time when the Sun was not generating Sunlight nor was there a time when Sunlight was not generated from the Sun. Now let’s suppose the Sun were eternal—this would mean that it has always been from all eternity generating Sunlight.

14. Where was God the Father while Jesus was on earth? The Father was in Christ. John 14:10; II Corinthians 5:19. He was also in heaven, for God is omnipresent.

Again, these comments need to be qualified because as they stand they can be agreed upon by Trinitarians. What must be made clear is that there is a definite distinction in Person as is evidenced from many Jesus’ statements throughout the Gospel of John. One example will suffice. In John 5:30 Jesus says, “I can do nothing on my own. As I hear, I judge, and my judgment is just, because I seek not my own will but the will of him who sent me.†Jesus makes it clear in the plainest of language that he can do nothing on his own as well as speaking of the one who sent him (i.e. the Father, vs. 26). For the oneness position to be correct in asserting that Jesus is both Father and Son then they would have to discount this verse. Their attempt to solve the problem by saying that the Father is the divine nature and the Son is the human nature does not work because it then depersonalizes God or separates God into two persons which is self-contradictory to their position on his oneness. I will point out that natures do not send natures to do anything, persons send persons.

15. Did the prophet Isaiah say that Jesus would be the Father? Yes. Isaiah 9:6; 63:16.

Isaiah 63:16 says nothing about Jesus so we can dismiss that verse immediately. But Isaiah 9:6[5 MT] is probably one of the most abused verses in all of Scripture when dealing with oneness theology. The argument first relies on equivocation in that it asserts that ‘father’ is being used consistently when in fact it is not. In this verse we are told of a name that the Messiah shall be called—it is very important to note that this is a prophecy foretelling a future event—this is completely contrary to the oneness position of the Father being the Father in the OT but the Son in the NT.

Secondly, ‘eternal father’ is not the best rendering of the Hebrew avi ad. ‘Father of eternity’ or ‘father of the age to come’ would be more appropriate. If we understand this to mean father of eternity then this fits perfectly with the Biblical presentation of the Son as the creator of all things (Jo. 1:3; Col. 1:16; Heb. 1:2) but it is more likely that we should take it in the sense of ‘father of the age to come’ because this fits with the overall theme of the passage. This is a Messianic prophecy speaking directly of the Messianic Kingdom/Age. The Messiah will usher in this kingdom/age and can rightly be described as ‘father of the age to come’ in the same sense that we could describe Martin Luther as ‘father of the reformation.’

16. When God said, “Let us make man in our image†(Genesis 1:26), was He speaking to another person in the Godhead? No. Isaiah 44:24; Malachi 2:10.

God was absolutely conversing within himself. The use of plural pronouns here and elsewhere is clear enough in pointing this out. The alternative view that God was speaking to angels is contradicted by Isaiah 44:24 or that God was speaking using the ‘royal we’ is based on an anachronistic reading of the text. Ecclesiastes 12:1 uses the word for creator in the plural (Heb. bor’ekha) while Psalm 149:2 uses the word maker in the plural (Heb. b’osav). All of this coupled with the fact that there is one creator argues highly in favor of a multi-personal God.

17. How many of God’s qualities were in Christ? All. Colossians 2:9.

Trinitarians would agree although we recognize that certain prerogatives were laid aside in the incarnation. The Son cooperated fully with the humanity that he added to himself (see Phil. 2:5ff).

18. How may we see the God who sent Jesus into the world? By seeing Jesus. John 12:44-45; 14:9.

The question implies a recognizable distinction in persons. We have the Son who is sent and the Father who sends. One wonders how the oneness believer can ignore such a blatant reality.

19. Does the Bible say that Jesus is the Almighty? Yes. Revelation 1:8

Agreed.

20. Whom do some designate as the first person in the trinity? God the Father.

Absolutely—the Father is the first person in the Trinity because it is the Father who begets the Son and spirates the Spirit. The Father is unbegotten while the Son is begotten by the Father by an eternal generation (see response to question # 13) yet the Son does not beget or spirate—the Spirit proceeds forth from the Father by an eternal procession (Jo. 15:26) yet the Spirit is not begotten nor does he beget or spirate.

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60 Questions Refuting Oneness Pentecostal Modalism (Continued from previous post):

21. Whom do some designate as the last person in the trinity? The Holy Ghost. But Jesus said that He was the first and last. Revelation 1:17-18

The response given to this question is completely disconnected from the question itself. We speak of the Holy Spirit as the third person of the Trinity because it is the Spirit who proceeds from the Father through the Son. ‘First and Last’ is merely a title of Yahweh.

22. How many persons did John see sitting on the throne in heaven? One. Revelation 4:2.

It is here assumed that ‘one’ must mean ‘one person’ but this is nothing more than circular reasoning. There is nothing in the text to suggest one and only one person as it would be just as easy to assume ‘one being’ upon the throne, which is what the book of Revelation supports. John sees at least two persons on the throne in Revelation, the Father and the Lamb. Jesus said in Revelation 3:21, “The one who conquers, I will grant him to sit with me on my throne, as I also conquered and sat down with my Father on his throne†(ESV). Notice how Jesus makes a definite distinction between himself and the Father as well as explicitly stating that they share the same throne.

23. If Jesus is the first and the last, why did God say in Isaiah 44:6 that He was the first and the last? Because Jesus is the God of the Old Testament incarnate.

No argument from Trinitarians here. But it must be pointed out that the title is appropriate for any of the three persons of Yahweh.

24. Did Jesus tell Satan that God alone should be worshipped? Yes. Matthew 4:10

Again, no argument from Trinitarians on this point—God alone should be worshipped, but it is imperative that we worship the God of Scripture which is the Triune God, Yahweh.

25. Does the devil believe in more than one God? No. James 2:19.

James 2:19 actually has reference to demons (Gk. daimonia) which is a plural noun, not specifically the devil (i.e. Satan). But Trinitarians share in monotheism.
26. Does the Bible say that God, who is the Word, was made flesh? Yes John 1:1, 14.

The Greek text of John 1:1 tells us that the Word is distinct from the God he is with in the second clause (kai ho logos pros ton theon). The lack of the article before theos in the third clause (kai theos ?n ho logos) tells us that the Word is not the Father. See answer to question #2. John 1:14 draws as clear if not a clearer distinction in saying that the Word made flesh is the only begotten of the Father.

27. For what purpose was God manifested in the flesh? To save sinners. Hebrews 2:9, 14.

Trinitarians would agree.

28. Was Jesus God manifested in the flesh? Yes. I Timothy 3:16.

The textual evidence argues in favor of reading hos as opposed to theos in 1Timothy 3:16 but this variant is insignificant to what the passage is teaching. Trinitarians would once again agree that Jesus is God manifest in the flesh; we simply deny that he is the Father manifest in the flesh.

29. Could Jesus have been on earth and in heaven at the same time? Yes. John 3:13.

The question and answer given here are too simplistic—Jesus is the Son/Word incarnate—this is important in understanding the question. There was a time before the Son/Word was Jesus—in other words, prior to the incarnation Jesus was not Jesus. With this understanding of Jesus as the incarnate Word/Son we need to realize that ‘Jesus’ is not separate from his humanity or body. He was not ‘physically’ present in heaven at the moment of John 3:13.

Every believer must grapple with the questions concerning the times when Jesus lacks knowledge of certain events, or when he is only in one place at one time, or his being given power/authority—all of these things would seem to contradict God’s omniscience, omnipresence, and omnipotence. But they are answered in the incarnation and the hypostatic union. Too often the position is taken that ‘in Jesus’ humanity’ he did this or ‘in Jesus’ deity’ he did that but this misses the point of the incarnation and the hypostatic union. This tendency leads towards Nestorianism which was an ancient heresy that stated that Jesus was two persons.

The truth of the matter is that Jesus in his incarnation united two natures perfectly and completely in his one person, but willfully laid aside certain prerogatives of deity. This is not to say that he did not possess these prerogatives but rather that he willingly opted to cooperate with the limitations of humanity. So in answer to the question, the answer is no. Jesus could only be physically present where he was, although his nature of deity which is shared equally with the Father and Holy Spirit is all-pervasive and fills the known universe and beyond.

The oneness believer answers the question affirmatively because they create a division in the natures of deity and humanity which logically results in a Nestorian understanding of a divine and human Christ (although they would vehemently reject such a description of their belief). The result is Nestorian because they are forced to personalize the two natures of Jesus. They have the human nature on earth with the divine nature in heaven—the human nature prays to the divine nature—the human nature was sent by the divine nature—the human nature does the will of the divine nature, etc. (see David K. Bernard’s The Oneness of God, [Hazelwood, MO: Word Aflame, 2000], 176-78).

30. Does the Bible say that there is but one Lord? Yes. Isaiah 45:18; Ephesians 4:5.

Again, Trinitarians would agree with this statement although we would qualify it by saying that the one Lord exists as three eternally distinct persons.

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60 Questions Refuting Oneness Pentecostal Modalism (Continued from previous post):

31. Does the Bible say that Christ is the Lord? Yes. Luke 2:11.

Trinitarians agree. For the record, Arians do as well.

32. Does the Bible say that the Lord is God? Yes. I kings 18:39; Zechariah 14:5; Acts 2:39; Revelation 19:1.

The NT uses the title lord (Gk. kyrios) for both the Father and the Son, making a distinction between the two. Luke 10:21 says, “In that same hour he rejoiced in the Holy Spirit and said, “I thank you, Father, Lord (Gk. kyrie) of heaven and earth, that you have hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to little children; yes, Father, for such was your gracious will.†The Son clearly calls the Father Lord.In Acts 2:36 we are plainly told, “Let all the house of Israel therefore know for certain that God [the Father] has made him both Lord (Gk. kyrion) and Christ, this Jesus whom you crucified.â€The verse immediately before this makes reference to Psalm 110:1 in which Yahweh (LORD) tells Adonai (Lord) to sit at his right hand until he makes his enemy his footstool. This is without question in reference to the Father and the Son as it is applied in the NT (see Heb. 10:13)

33. How could the church belong to Jesus (Matthew 16:18) and yet be the church of God (I Corinthians 10:32)? Because Jesus is God in the flesh.

While Trinitarians certainly agree that Jesus is God in the flesh, this conclusion is not necessary to answer the question. The Church can belong to Jesus in the same sense that it belongs to the Father because those who make up the Church have been given to Jesus (Jo. 6:37) by the Father.

34. Will God give His glory to another? No. Isaiah 42:8.

Again, Trinitarians affirm the full deity of Christ—he shares the essential nature of deity with the Father and the Holy Spirit. The glory is properly ascribed to all three persons.

35. Was there a God formed before Jehovah, or will there be one formed after? No. Isaiah 43:10.

Yet another proposition that Trinitarians affirm. Yahweh is the only God in existence, there were none before and there will be none after.

36. What is one thing that God does not know? Another God. Isaiah 44:8.

How is this question relevant to the ‘Godhead’? One could infer from the question that oneness Pentecostals equate Trinitarianism with Tritheism (which is obviously the case with David K. Bernard in his book The Oneness of God)—but this is a straw man argument since Trinitarians are firmly monotheistic.

37. What is one thing that God Cannot do? Lie. Titus 1:2.

Again, how is this question relevant?

38. How many Gods should we know? Only one. Hosea 13:4.

The same inference of Tritheism is made—to know the Triune God Yahweh is to know only one God.

39. How many names has the Lord? One. Zechariah 14:9.

Yes, and the name as given in Zechariah 14:9 is Yahweh.
60 Questions Refuting Oneness Pentecostal Modalism (Continued from previous post):

40. Is it good to think upon the name of the Lord? Yes. Malachi 3:16.

Relevance?

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60 Questions Refuting Oneness Pentecostal Modalism (Continued from previous post):

41. Does the Bible say that God alone treads upon the waves of the sea? Yes. Job 9:8

Agreed, but this question is asked in order to set up the next one which doesn’t necessitate that Jesus is God (although Trinitarians fully affirm the deity of Christ).

42. Why, then, was Jesus able to walk upon the Sea of Galilee (Matthew 14:25)? Because He is God the Creator. Colossians 1:16.

Peter walked on the water as well, does it follow that he was God the creator? Of course not. Job 9:8 has nothing to do with Matthew 14:25, 29.

43. Is God the only one who can forgive sin? Yes. Isiah 43:25; Mark 2:7.

Again, Trinitarians would agree with this but these questions maintain the same uni-personal assumptions that we have seen throughout. The argument is that if the Father is God and Jesus is God then Jesus must be the Father. If God does something and Jesus does something then Jesus is God and because there is only one person who is God Jesus must be the Father. But there is nothing to these actions that cannot be explained in light of the Trinity—in fact these things cannot be rationally explained apart from the Trinity.

44. Why, then, could Jesus forgive sin in Mark 2:5-11? Because He is God the Savior.

Yes, Jesus is God the Savior but remember that he was given authority (Mat. 28:18).**Note that this authority was given to the Son in eternity, not at any point of time—it has always been his but the fact that the Father gave it to him shows a distinction in person.

45. Is Jesus the true God? Yes. I John 5:20.

Agreed—but again, Jesus is NOT the Father.

46. If God and the Holy Ghost are two separate persons, which was the Father of Christ? Matthew 1:20 says that the Holy Ghost was the Father, while Romans 15:6, II Corinthians 11:31, and Ephesians 1:3 say that God was the Father. There is no contradiction when we realize that God the Father and the Holy Ghost are one and the same Spirit. Matthew 10:20; Ephesians 4:4; I Corinthians 3:16.

To begin with, the Holy Spirit and the Father are two DISTINCT (not separate) persons—there is no separation within the being of God. Secondly, the Father is the Father of the Son and this is an eternal distinction, not a temporal one. The Father was the Father in relation to the Son before the incarnation (see Jo. 1:1-18; 17:5). To say that the Father and the Holy Spirit are the same Spirit is ambiguous as a Trinitarian could say the same thing but define it differently. ‘Same Spirit’ need not mean ‘same person’ as it can have reference to ‘same being/substance’.

47. When Paul asked the Lord who He was, what was the answer? :I am Jesus.†Acts 9:5.

Jesus is Lord. Trinitarians affirm this.

48. When Stephen was dying, did he call God Jesus? Yes. Acts 7:59.

Jesus is God. Trinitarians affirm this.

49. Did Thomas ever call Jesus God? Yes. John 20:28.

Same answer as above.

50. How could Jesus be the Savior, when God the Father said in Isaiah 43:11, “Beside me there is no Savior?†Because “God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself.†II Corinthians 5:19.


Jesus can be the savior because within the one being of Yahweh there exists three eternally distinct persons. All three persons were active in the redemptive plan.

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60 Questions Refuting Oneness Pentecostal Modalism (Continued from previous post):

51. Does the Bible say that Jesus was God with us? Yes. Matthew 1:23.

Technically, ???????? ??? means ‘God IS with us’ (cf. Is. 8:10), but yes, Matthew does apply the name to Jesus.

52. Did Jesus ever say, “I and my Father are one?†Yes. John 10:30.

Yes and the Greek reads, eg? kai pat?r hen esmen. Esmen is the 2nd person plural of the verb eimi and translates literally as ‘we are’ while hen is the neuter form of the numeral one signifying that it is not ‘one person’ but rather ‘one thing’ that the Father and the Son are (which agrees perfectly with the doctrine of the Trinity)—Jesus literally said, ‘I and my father we are one [thing]’

53. Can it be proved scripturally that Jesus and the Father are one in the same sense that husband and wife are one? No. The Godhead was never compared to the relationship of a husband and wife. Jesus identified Himself with the Father in a way that husband and wife cannot be identified with each other. John 14:9-11.

The Trinitarian argument is not that the Father and Jesus are one the same way that a husband and wife are one. The only comparison that would possibly be made here by a Trinitarian is that the Hebrew word for ‘one’ (echad) is used to describe both. This is actually two logical fallacies in one. First they have created a faulty analogy and secondly they attribute this fallacious argument to Trinitarians and then attempt to knock it down when in fact we don’t hold this argument to begin with. Trinitarians do believe that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are one as nothing else in existence is one. There is no perfectly analogous picture of the intimate relationship shared within the Trinity.

54. Does the Bible say that there is only one wise God? Yes. Jude 25.

And again, Trinitarianism is monotheism—the barrage of questions concerning ‘one God’ are pointless in that proving monotheism doesn’t prove modalism nor does it disprove Trinitarianism.

55. Does the Bible call the Holy Ghost a second or third person in the Godhead? No. The Holy Ghost is the one Spirit of God, the one God Himself at work in our lives. John 4:24; I Corinthians 3:16-17; 6:19; 12:13.

John 4:24 is clearly in reference to the Father which can be seen easily from reading the verse immediately before it. Also, John 4:24 shows us the three persons of the Trinity in the worship for it is the Father who seeks our worship in Spirit (i.e. the Holy Spirit) and Truth (i.e. the Son, see Jo. 14:6). As far as the title ‘third person’ is concerned, again… the title doesn’t need to present for the doctrine to be taught. The Father begets, the Son is begotten, the Spirit proceeds. It’s that simple.

56. Can Trinitarians show that three divine persons were present when Jesus was baptized by John? Absolutely not. The one, omnipresent God used three simultaneous manifestations. Only one divine person was present–Jesus Christ the Lord.

Notice that all they have done here is re-state their premise in the conclusion without actually having shown this to be true. They’ve assumed that one God means one divine person and therefore conclude that three divine persons can not be shown at Jesus’ baptism. But because Trinitarians can show the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit to be three persons and Trinitarians can show the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit to be present at Jesus’ baptism, it then logically follows that Trinitarians can show three divine persons present at Jesus’ baptism. It is a common argument from the modalist that the omnipresence of God accounts for all three modes or manifestations being at Jesus’ baptism but this claim is light on substance.

The fact is that God is omnipresent, but this is a trait shared by each member of the Godhead. It is illogical to claim that Jesus in his deity (as the Father) spoke to Jesus in his humanity (as the Son) from heaven while Jesus as the Spirit (his omnipresent deity) descended upon himself (in his humanity). This violates the law of non-contradiction as the modalist would have one person being three persons at the same time and in the same sense. They might claim that these are not ‘persons’ at all but rather ‘three manifestations of one person’ but this is shown false in that each ‘manifestation’ exhibits the qualities of personhood. In the account of Jesus’ baptism alone we see at the very least the Father speaking and the Son being the subject of the words spoken as irrefutable proof of at least two personalities. Omnipresence does not account for such nonsense and the burden of proof is on the modalist to show such.

57. Then what were the other two of whom Trinitarians speak? One was a voice from heaven; the other was the Spirit of God in the form of a dove. Matthew 3:16-17.

Voices come from persons and the Holy Spirit is shown to be a person all throughout Scripture.

58. What did the voice say at Jesus’ baptism? “Thou art my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.†Mark 1:11. As the Son of God, Jesus was the one God incarnate.

Again, a definite and clear distinction is seen in the Father in heaven speaking about the Son on earth at Jesus’ baptism. Yes, Jesus is God incarnate, but it is the Son who was incarnated, not the Father!

59. Does the Bible say that God shed His blood and that God laid down His life for us? Yes. Acts 20:28; I John 3:16. God was able to do this because He had taken upon Himself a human body.

Textual variants in Acts 20:28 aside, the Trinitarian can certainly affirm that God added a human nature and was incarnate in a human body for the purpose of redeeming mankind on the cross.

60. The Bible says that God is coming back with all his saints (Zechariah 14:5) and also that Jesus is coming back with all his saints (I Thessalonians 3:13). Are two coming back? No. Only one is coming back–our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ. Titus 2:13.

Again, Jesus is God. The Father and Jesus are two persons, not two Gods. Questions like this are straw man arguments in that they keep assuming a bi/tri-theism on the part of Trinitarians.

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[seekandlisten]

Just a quick question, what is this 'oneness position?' Is it simply the Pentacostals way of describing the Godhead? I've never heard this oneness term before so I was just wondering.

 

[Free]

Just a quick question, what is this 'oneness position?' Is it simply the Pentacostals way of describing the Godhead? I've never heard this oneness term before so I was just wondering.

Oneness theology, or Jesus Only, is a form of modalism--Jesus is God and the Father, Son and Holy Spirit are all roles, or different modes, that Jesus plays. But this clearly denies the obvious distinctions in persons of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.