Eddie42
Member
In recent years I've obtained a more historically accurate KJV that includes the translator's notes in the margin and the full and entire "The Translators to the Readers" preface which is many pages long and includes the restrictions, bias or slant used by the translators of the KJV, so you are aware of the perspective. I've also received the KJV with the original Apocrypha that used to be included. But more recently, I've found how valuable the 1828 Webster's Dictionary can be to understand the various English words the KJV translators chose to use.
I always found it puzzling why the KJV used "sodomites" several places in the OT, but not in the NT; where many more modern or literal versions use "sodomites" in the NT but not the OT, the NT being 1 Cor. 6:9 & 1 Tim. 1:10. Upon looking at the Margin note on Deut. 23:17, I came to see that the KJV translators know what the names or labels meant for the note reads "whore: or, sodomitess". The use of the word "sodomites" in 1 Kings and especially 2 Kings 23:7 made it clear they knew this was about idolatrous temple prostitutes. In 1 Kings 14:24 this wickedness is called an "abomination", the Hebrew being to ebah.
In Gen. 13:10 Lot saw that the plain of Jordan and Sodom was like "the garden of the LORD", in other words, bountiful in all ways to produce wealth and well being. The way Ezekiel 16:48-50 reads, it seems to be the root of the extreme wickedness of Sodom. In Genesis 13 we come to v13 -
"But the men of Sodom were wicked and sinners before the LORD exceedingly." (Gen 13:13, KJV)
MEN, plu. of man. Two or more males, individuals of the human race. 1828W
Some versions today render "men" as "people" in this verse, including all the "people" as in Gen. 19:4, "all the people". It is interesting how the Jewish Targum of Jonathan renders this verse, Gn. 13:13 -
"And the men of Sedom were depraved in their wealth one with another, and they sinned in their bodies; they sinned with open nakedness, and the shedding of innocent blood, and practiced strange worship, and rebelled greatly against the name of the Lord."
www.sefaria.org
The Hebrew to ebah translated "abomination" is defined in Strong's as: "properly something disgusting (morally), that is, (as noun) an abhorrence; especially idolatry or (concretely) an idol"
This Hebrew word to ebah is used in Ezekiel 41 times and overwhelmingly referring to idolatry and things connected to idols. Then we have an idea what the word means in the following passage in Ezekiel.
"As I live, saith the Lord GOD, Sodom thy sister hath not done, she nor her daughters, as thou hast done, thou and thy daughters. Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy. And they were haughty, and committed abomination before me: therefore I took them away as I saw good." (Ezek 16:48-50, KJV)
From the prior uses of "abomination" it would seem that the abomination here in v50 would be referring to idolatrous male prostitutes, temple prostitutes, the "sodomites", the "strange worship" mentioned in the Targum. In Genesis 19 it is clearly connected with violence and attempted rape.
In the two places that the Greek arsenokoites is translated as "sodomites" in many more modern NT translations, the KJV used phrases instead of a single word. In 1 Cor. 6:9 "abusers of themselves with mankind" and in 1 Tim. 1:10 "them that defile themselves with mankind". If you check the Young's Analytical Concordance to the Bible, the key English words to look up for the phrases are "abusers" and "defile". How are those to be understood? Again the Websters 1828
ABU'SER, n. s as z. One who abuses, in speech or behavior; one that deceives; a ravisher; a sodomite. 1 Cor 6.
RAV'ISHER, n. 1. One that takes by violence. 2. One that forces a woman to his carnal embrace.
DEFILE, v.t. ...5. To corrupt chastity; to debauch; to violate; to tarnish the purity of character by lewdness.
Schechem defiled Dinah. Gen 34.
It seems that the definitions of the two key words in 1 Cor. 6:9 and 1 Tim. 1:10 fit the modern concept of a "sodomite", found in synonyms in Roget's Thesaurus, 7th Edition -
"75.16 sexual pervert; pervert, perve <nf>, deviant, deviate, sex pervert, sex fiend, sex criminal, sexual psychopath; sodomist, sodomite, sob <Brit nf>, bugger; pederast; paraphiliac; zoophiliac; pedophiliac; sadist; masochist; sadomasochist...."
The 1828W is interesting in how it defines "effeminate" which is in 1 Cor. 6:9 -
EFFEM'INATE, a. [L. effoeminatus, from effoeminor, to grow or make womanish, from foemina, a woman. See Woman.]
1. Having the qualities of the female sex; soft or delicate to an unmanly degree; tender; womanish; voluptuous.
The king, by his voluptuous life and mean marriage, became effeminate, and less sensible of honor.
2. Womanish; weak; resembling the practice or qualities of the sex; as an effeminate peace; an effeminate life.
3. Womanlike, tender, in a sense not reproachful.
I know these verses can become involved with emotional hot button issues, so I will not reply and cause it to become a debate. But I would be interested in real questions about my approach, exegesis, interpretation whatever; but opinions I'll leave to the opinionator.
I always found it puzzling why the KJV used "sodomites" several places in the OT, but not in the NT; where many more modern or literal versions use "sodomites" in the NT but not the OT, the NT being 1 Cor. 6:9 & 1 Tim. 1:10. Upon looking at the Margin note on Deut. 23:17, I came to see that the KJV translators know what the names or labels meant for the note reads "whore: or, sodomitess". The use of the word "sodomites" in 1 Kings and especially 2 Kings 23:7 made it clear they knew this was about idolatrous temple prostitutes. In 1 Kings 14:24 this wickedness is called an "abomination", the Hebrew being to ebah.
In Gen. 13:10 Lot saw that the plain of Jordan and Sodom was like "the garden of the LORD", in other words, bountiful in all ways to produce wealth and well being. The way Ezekiel 16:48-50 reads, it seems to be the root of the extreme wickedness of Sodom. In Genesis 13 we come to v13 -
"But the men of Sodom were wicked and sinners before the LORD exceedingly." (Gen 13:13, KJV)
MEN, plu. of man. Two or more males, individuals of the human race. 1828W
Some versions today render "men" as "people" in this verse, including all the "people" as in Gen. 19:4, "all the people". It is interesting how the Jewish Targum of Jonathan renders this verse, Gn. 13:13 -
"And the men of Sedom were depraved in their wealth one with another, and they sinned in their bodies; they sinned with open nakedness, and the shedding of innocent blood, and practiced strange worship, and rebelled greatly against the name of the Lord."
Targum Jonathan on Genesis 13:13
And the men of Sedom were depraved in their wealth one with another, and they sinned in their bodies; they sinned with open nakedness, and the shedding of...
www.sefaria.org
The Hebrew to ebah translated "abomination" is defined in Strong's as: "properly something disgusting (morally), that is, (as noun) an abhorrence; especially idolatry or (concretely) an idol"
This Hebrew word to ebah is used in Ezekiel 41 times and overwhelmingly referring to idolatry and things connected to idols. Then we have an idea what the word means in the following passage in Ezekiel.
"As I live, saith the Lord GOD, Sodom thy sister hath not done, she nor her daughters, as thou hast done, thou and thy daughters. Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy. And they were haughty, and committed abomination before me: therefore I took them away as I saw good." (Ezek 16:48-50, KJV)
From the prior uses of "abomination" it would seem that the abomination here in v50 would be referring to idolatrous male prostitutes, temple prostitutes, the "sodomites", the "strange worship" mentioned in the Targum. In Genesis 19 it is clearly connected with violence and attempted rape.
In the two places that the Greek arsenokoites is translated as "sodomites" in many more modern NT translations, the KJV used phrases instead of a single word. In 1 Cor. 6:9 "abusers of themselves with mankind" and in 1 Tim. 1:10 "them that defile themselves with mankind". If you check the Young's Analytical Concordance to the Bible, the key English words to look up for the phrases are "abusers" and "defile". How are those to be understood? Again the Websters 1828
ABU'SER, n. s as z. One who abuses, in speech or behavior; one that deceives; a ravisher; a sodomite. 1 Cor 6.
RAV'ISHER, n. 1. One that takes by violence. 2. One that forces a woman to his carnal embrace.
DEFILE, v.t. ...5. To corrupt chastity; to debauch; to violate; to tarnish the purity of character by lewdness.
Schechem defiled Dinah. Gen 34.
It seems that the definitions of the two key words in 1 Cor. 6:9 and 1 Tim. 1:10 fit the modern concept of a "sodomite", found in synonyms in Roget's Thesaurus, 7th Edition -
"75.16 sexual pervert; pervert, perve <nf>, deviant, deviate, sex pervert, sex fiend, sex criminal, sexual psychopath; sodomist, sodomite, sob <Brit nf>, bugger; pederast; paraphiliac; zoophiliac; pedophiliac; sadist; masochist; sadomasochist...."
The 1828W is interesting in how it defines "effeminate" which is in 1 Cor. 6:9 -
EFFEM'INATE, a. [L. effoeminatus, from effoeminor, to grow or make womanish, from foemina, a woman. See Woman.]
1. Having the qualities of the female sex; soft or delicate to an unmanly degree; tender; womanish; voluptuous.
The king, by his voluptuous life and mean marriage, became effeminate, and less sensible of honor.
2. Womanish; weak; resembling the practice or qualities of the sex; as an effeminate peace; an effeminate life.
3. Womanlike, tender, in a sense not reproachful.
I know these verses can become involved with emotional hot button issues, so I will not reply and cause it to become a debate. But I would be interested in real questions about my approach, exegesis, interpretation whatever; but opinions I'll leave to the opinionator.