About Bonnie

[JohnDB]

Since I didn't see any connection between your story and Heb 6:4-6, there wasn't any identity to give credit to. Which is why I asked for clarification or explanation.


Yes, it's a great story. But what's the connection with Heb 6:4-6?


OK, it seems you're saying that those who have believed just can't really fall away. Is that the connection?

YES...with bells on.

The sentiments described in Hebrews 6 and my sentiments about Bonnie's singing are the same.
How can we fall away? We are too busy cheering, clapping, crying and whooping it up...especially when it comes to Salvation... Ours. It's just beyond the capabilities of reason to fall away.

And that's what the writer of Hebrews was trying to relate.

 

[JohnDB]

Yes. I'm trying to understand why this thread is in the A&T forum exactly. I haven't quite figured it out either. Would it be better in the Testimonies forum perhaps?

Tough crowd and I've been on my phone. No...it belongs here...sorry I'm not a good writer. I'm home and got my puter fired up now.

It's about the eternal security of a believer and one of the scriptures used to refute it.

 

[FreeGrace]

YES...with bells on.

The sentiments described in Hebrews 6 and my sentiments about Bonnie's singing are the same.
How can we fall away? We are too busy cheering, clapping, crying and whooping it up...especially when it comes to Salvation... Ours. It's just beyond the capabilities of reason to fall away.

And that's what the writer of Hebrews was trying to relate.

However, the Bible says that some will fall away. 1 Tim 4:1 - Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will depart from the faith by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons

Heb 3:12 - Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God.

And, of course, Heb 6:6 actually describes falling away.

And, Jesus specifically notes those who "believe for a while" and then "fall away" in Luke 8:13.

So, it's a real occurrence. And the Bible warns against it.

 

[JohnDB]

However, the Bible says that some will fall away. 1 Tim 4:1 - Now the Spirit expressly says that in later times some will depart from the faith by devoting themselves to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons

Heb 3:12 - Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God.

And, of course, Heb 6:6 actually describes falling away.

And, Jesus specifically notes those who "believe for a while" and then "fall away" in Luke 8:13.

So, it's a real occurrence. And the Bible warns against it.

Yes...of course.

John addresses this as those who were never really one of us to begin with.

People are not cars...but I can make a lot of noises to make you think that there's an automobile in the garage...But just because I can sound like a car doesn't mean that I am a car.

And just because some people are duped into believing that there is a car in the garage doesn't mean that I am an automobile...

 

[chessman]

Jesus is my friend. There ain't many who don't know that. I can't not be His friend.

Good point. I thought that’s what you were getting at in your OP also.

Imagine for a moment you’re this Hebrew guy (Barat, not Bonnie) living around 20 A.D. (pre-Easter) that loves God with all your heart and more importantly God loves you. You know each week that you are a sinner in need of God’s forgiveness each week, month, year. You need His grace and mercy (Heb 4:16) and forgiveness for your sins. You have throat cancer, so to speak, on a weekly basis. But you’ve literally never heard of Jesus Christ before because He’s not started his minister or fulfilled the Old Covenant just yet. So, you do what any good Hebrew does. You do what God’s told you to do up until Christ Jesus becomes your High Priest. You sacrifice regularly as required, follow all the Laws of Moses as required, support the various High Priests serving during that time as required, etc. etc. And you know what, it works! God imparts His Mercy, Grace and Forgiveness to you for those Old Covenant sacrifices. (they aren’t old just yet, remember this is pre-Easter). But over and over again, in just a week’s time (or less) you find yourself feeling that need for forgiveness yet again and again. Over and over. The cancer is back. So, you re-sacrifice yet again and again. And on and on it goes. Sin-Sacrifice-Forgiveness, Sin-Sacrifice-Forgiveness, … Why? Because you are still so weak, so sinful and obligated to do your routines (see Heb 5:3). The Holy Spirit is not sharing your life with you, just yet. And it works again and again. Remember, this is pre-Easter. I imagine that cyclic feeling to be about like having throat cancer that took your voice away but then you get cured and your voice back. Yet this all occurs on a weekly/monthly basis. Over and over again.

If you are like me, this is kind of a foreign idea (living like a pre-Easter Hebrew). It’s hard to imagine me sacrificing animals for the forgiveness of my sins, but important to the proper interpretation of this text, to do so, IMO.

I’ve never sacrificed an animal before. Never even thought about actually doing it, frankly. But they did and received the benefits of it each time they did. Obviously if done sincerely, though. My point is, put yourself in a Hebrew’s situation back then (1st Century) for a moment and think about Heb 4, 6 and 10 from their perspective for a moment. It’s called the book of Hebrews for a reason!

Then along comes Jesus Christ, your Messiah, His Passion and Easter. You are enlightened (Heb 6:4) about this new High Priest (Jesus, Heb 5:10) who has just recently become your new source of forgiveness, Mercy and Grace and better yet-Eternal Salvation (Heb 5:9). You truly come to realize that He is the fulfillment of all the Old Law you’ve been following your whole life up until this point. No more scarifying over and over again to obtain God’s Mercy, forgiveness and Grace. The author of Hebrews calls that way of receiving forgiveness “dead works”, Heb 6:1, 9:14 now that you’ve been enlightened to the New Way. You have Christ now as your High Priest and you have Eternal Salvation and complete sin forgiveness as a result. The old ways of forgiveness is done away with, but they are still fresh on your mind, so to speak. But now (having Christ) you are permanently cured of that dreaded cancer. It would be “impossible” to want to go back to that old cycle of having cancer, getting cured, having it again, getting cured again, etc.

For the life of me, I’ve never understood way people think Heb 6:4-6 is an anti-OSAS passage at all. It’s actually quite clear that it’s an OSAS encouragement, not anti-OSAS proof text. For goodness sake, just read v9 or v15, and v19, etc. The whole chapter (and the ones before it an after it) is about God’s giving a newly converted Hebrew believer; “powerful encouragement”, that’s “like an anchor of the soul”, “steadfast and firm”.

But more directly to the OP, He says what is impossible in these verses (A Hebrew turned Christian going back to the old covenant), not what’s possible (de-salvation). What could be more OSAS?

Heb 6:4-6 (LEB) 4 For it is impossible concerning those who have once been enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and become sharers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the coming age, 6 and having fallen away, to renew them again to repentance, because they have crucified again for themselves the Son of God and held him up to contempt.​

To turn a passage that tells us so clearing what’s impossible (re-crucify Christ is impossible) into what’s possible (it’s possible to become de-saved) seems fundamentally inappropriate to this passage. Not to mention that nowhere in this text does it say anything about losing salvation. People mis-interpret (in my opinion) “having fallen away” into ‘de-salvation’ or something like that, I guess. It’s odd really and shows just what a lack of clear anti-OSAS teaching there is in the rest of the Bible to resort to pointing to “having fallen away” as somehow meaning loss of salvation.

If you want to know what the author means by “having fallen away”, just read the context. Don’t insert your own context into it, Is my belief. If the author of Hebrews had meant “loss of salvation”, he could have easily said so. I don't see where he did mean that at all.

The context of the whole discussion (from chapters prior and after 6:4-6) is about a recent 1st Century Hebrew convert to Christianity (which none of us are anyway). I assume none of us have ever sacrificed animals IAW the Old Law. This particular passage is about potentially turning back (falling away from the new to the old, to the Old Covenant ways of repeated sacrifices, dead works as he calls it in v1) in my opinion. Which he says is impossible to do. Just as impossible as it is to crucify Christ again. It's called a ‘reductio ad absurdum’ (it’s Latin, I think reducing another's argument to the absurd by taking their premise(s) to their logical conclusion). Paul uses this form of logical argumentation often throughout his letters. (see 1 Cor 15:11-17) for example.

His point is that a Hebrew who’s turned Christian, i.e. “been enlightened and shares the Holy Spirit (by that I mean one that truly loves the Lord and the Lord loves him, for goodness sake he “shares the Holy Spirit”) can no more turn back to the Old Covenant ways (repentance from dead works, see v1) anymore than you can re-crucify Christ. It’s absurd and thus impossible.

It's most definitely not a passage about a 21st Century Christian turning from back from Christianity into Atheism. Which is how the anti-OSAS person presents it so often.

 

[FreeGrace]

Yes...of course.

John addresses this as those who were never really one of us to begin with.

Do you mean "not really saved"?? Luke noted that there were believers "of the circumcision group" (meaning Pharisees) who taught that one must be circumcised in order to be saved and wanted Gentiles who came to faith to be circumcised (similar to those who advocate baptism in order to be saved).

Acts 15:1 - But some men came down from Judea and were teaching the brothers, “Unless you are circumcised according to the custom of Moses, you cannot be saved.”
15:5 - But some believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees rose up and said, “It is necessary to circumcise them and to order them to keep the law of Moses.”

Since the Bible decribes them as "believers" I see no reason to discount their faith or that they were saved.

We see the same thing today; various views all by people who believe in Jesus Christ as Savior.

People are not cars...but I can make a lot of noises to make you think that there's an automobile in the garage...But just because I can sound like a car doesn't mean that I am a car.

True. In the same way, when the Bible calls people "believers", we must believe that they are what the Bible says they are.

 

[JohnDB]

Do you mean "not really saved"?? Luke noted that there were believers "of the circumcision group" (meaning Pharisees) who taught that one must be circumcised in order to be saved and wanted Gentiles who came to faith to be circumcised (similar to those who advocate baptism in order to be saved).

Acts 15:1 - But some men came down from Judea and were teaching the brothers, “Unless you are circumcised according to the custom of Moses, you cannot be saved.”
15:5 - But some believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees rose up and said, “It is necessary to circumcise them and to order them to keep the law of Moses.”

Since the Bible decribes them as "believers" I see no reason to discount their faith or that they were saved.

We see the same thing today; various views all by people who believe in Jesus Christ as Savior.


True. In the same way, when the Bible calls people "believers", we must believe that they are what the Bible says they are.

But the Bible also doesn't say that those of the " circumcision group " fell away either. We can't go beyond what is written. So obviously they held to a wrong theology... But that doesn't mean that they were not saved nor that they fell away....
And by "fall away" I mean into a loss of salvation.

 

[JohnDB]

Good point. I thought that’s what you were getting at in your OP also.

Imagine for a moment you’re this Hebrew guy (Barat, not Bonnie) living around 20 A.D. (pre-Easter) that loves God with all your heart and more importantly God loves you. You know each week that you are a sinner in need of God’s forgiveness each week, month, year. You need His grace and mercy (Heb 4:16) and forgiveness for your sins. You have throat cancer, so to speak, on a weekly basis. But you’ve literally never heard of Jesus Christ before because He’s not started his minister or fulfilled the Old Covenant just yet. So, you do what any good Hebrew does. You do what God’s told you to do up until Christ Jesus becomes your High Priest. You sacrifice regularly as required, follow all the Laws of Moses as required, support the various High Priests serving during that time as required, etc. etc. And you know what, it works! God imparts His Mercy, Grace and Forgiveness to you for those Old Covenant sacrifices. (they aren’t old just yet, remember this is pre-Easter). But over and over again, in just a week’s time (or less) you find yourself feeling that need for forgiveness yet again and again. Over and over. The cancer is back. So, you re-sacrifice yet again and again. And on and on it goes. Sin-Sacrifice-Forgiveness, Sin-Sacrifice-Forgiveness, … Why? Because you are still so weak, so sinful and obligated to do your routines (see Heb 5:3). The Holy Spirit is not sharing your life with you, just yet. And it works again and again. Remember, this is pre-Easter. I imagine that cyclic feeling to be about like having throat cancer that took your voice away but then you get cured and your voice back. Yet this all occurs on a weekly/monthly basis. Over and over again.

If you are like me, this is kind of a foreign idea (living like a pre-Easter Hebrew). It’s hard to imagine me sacrificing animals for the forgiveness of my sins, but important to the proper interpretation of this text, to do so, IMO.

I’ve never sacrificed an animal before. Never even thought about actually doing it, frankly. But they did and received the benefits of it each time they did. Obviously if done sincerely, though. My point is, put yourself in a Hebrew’s situation back then (1st Century) for a moment and think about Heb 4, 6 and 10 from their perspective for a moment. It’s called the book of Hebrews for a reason!

Then along comes Jesus Christ, your Messiah, His Passion and Easter. You are enlightened (Heb 6:4) about this new High Priest (Jesus, Heb 5:10) who has just recently become your new source of forgiveness, Mercy and Grace and better yet-Eternal Salvation (Heb 5:9). You truly come to realize that He is the fulfillment of all the Old Law you’ve been following your whole life up until this point. No more scarifying over and over again to obtain God’s Mercy, forgiveness and Grace. The author of Hebrews calls that way of receiving forgiveness “dead works”, Heb 6:1, 9:14 now that you’ve been enlightened to the New Way. You have Christ now as your High Priest and you have Eternal Salvation and complete sin forgiveness as a result. The old ways of forgiveness is done away with, but they are still fresh on your mind, so to speak. But now (having Christ) you are permanently cured of that dreaded cancer. It would be “impossible” to want to go back to that old cycle of having cancer, getting cured, having it again, getting cured again, etc.

For the life of me, I’ve never understood way people think Heb 6:4-6 is an anti-OSAS passage at all. It’s actually quite clear that it’s an OSAS encouragement, not anti-OSAS proof text. For goodness sake, just read v9 or v15, and v19, etc. The whole chapter (and the ones before it an after it) is about God’s giving a newly converted Hebrew believer; “powerful encouragement”, that’s “like an anchor of the soul”, “steadfast and firm”.

But more directly to the OP, He says what is impossible in these verses (A Hebrew turned Christian going back to the old covenant), not what’s possible (de-salvation). What could be more OSAS?

Heb 6:4-6 (LEB) 4 For it is impossible concerning those who have once been enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and become sharers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the coming age, 6 and having fallen away, to renew them again to repentance, because they have crucified again for themselves the Son of God and held him up to contempt.​

To turn a passage that tells us so clearing what’s impossible (re-crucify Christ is impossible) into what’s possible (it’s possible to become de-saved) seems fundamentally inappropriate to this passage. Not to mention that nowhere in this text does it say anything about losing salvation. People mis-interpret (in my opinion) “having fallen away” into ‘de-salvation’ or something like that, I guess. It’s odd really and shows just what a lack of clear anti-OSAS teaching there is in the rest of the Bible to resort to pointing to “having fallen away” as somehow meaning loss of salvation.

If you want to know what the author means by “having fallen away”, just read the context. Don’t insert your own context into it, Is my belief. If the author of Hebrews had meant “loss of salvation”, he could have easily said so. I don't see where he did mean that at all.

The context of the whole discussion (from chapters prior and after 6:4-6) is about a recent 1st Century Hebrew convert to Christianity (which none of us are anyway). I assume none of us have ever sacrificed animals IAW the Old Law. This particular passage is about potentially turning back (falling away from the new to the old, to the Old Covenant ways of repeated sacrifices, dead works as he calls it in v1) in my opinion. Which he says is impossible to do. Just as impossible as it is to crucify Christ again. It's called a ‘reductio ad absurdum’ (it’s Latin, I think reducing another's argument to the absurd by taking their premise(s) to their logical conclusion). Paul uses this form of logical argumentation often throughout his letters. (see 1 Cor 15:11-17) for example.

His point is that a Hebrew who’s turned Christian, i.e. “been enlightened and shares the Holy Spirit (by that I mean one that truly loves the Lord and the Lord loves him, for goodness sake he “shares the Holy Spirit”) can no more turn back to the Old Covenant ways (repentance from dead works, see v1) anymore than you can re-crucify Christ. It’s absurd and thus impossible.

It's most definitely not a passage about a 21st Century Christian turning from back from Christianity into Atheism. Which is how the anti-OSAS person presents it so often.

Yes....someone finally understands.

:woot

 

[FreeGrace]

But the Bible also doesn't say that those of the " circumcision group " fell away either. We can't go beyond what is written. So obviously they held to a wrong theology... But that doesn't mean that they were not saved nor that they fell away....
And by "fall away" I mean into a loss of salvation.

I don't believe that "fall away" refers to loss of salvation. There just isn't any evidence of that.

The best verse on falling away is from Jesus Himself, and He said this: And the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear the word, receive it with joy. But these have no root; they believe for a while, and in time of testing fall away. Luke 8:13

Unless someone can exegete this verse and prove that Jesus meant fell from their salvation, it seem much more likely that the "fall away" was from their believing for a while.

iow, they believed for a while, and then because of testing, fell away from their faith.

So, they believed, and then, because of testing, ceased to believe.

I haven't found any verse that teaches that ceasing to believe results in ceasing to be saved.

There is a verse about believers being sealed with the Holy Spirit for the day of redemption. I don't know how else to take that, except eternal security.

 

[JohnDB]

I don't believe that "fall away" refers to loss of salvation. There just isn't any evidence of that.

The best verse on falling away is from Jesus Himself, and He said this: And the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear the word, receive it with joy. But these have no root; they believe for a while, and in time of testing fall away. Luke 8:13

Unless someone can exegete this verse and prove that Jesus meant fell from their salvation, it seem much more likely that the "fall away" was from their believing for a while.

iow, they believed for a while, and then because of testing, fell away from their faith.

So, they believed, and then, because of testing, ceased to believe.

I haven't found any verse that teaches that ceasing to believe results in ceasing to be saved.

There is a verse about believers being sealed with the Holy Spirit for the day of redemption. I don't know how else to take that, except eternal security.

One scripture at a time.

I just went through a lengthy explanation process of the Hebrews passages...
I will get to Jesus' explanation of the four soils at another time. (Another lengthy process).

 

[FreeGrace]

One scripture at a time.

I just went through a lengthy explanation process of the Hebrews passages...
I will get to Jesus' explanation of the four soils at another time. (Another lengthy process).

To save time, just provide what Jesus meant regarding the 2nd soil, from Luke 8:13. As I just did.

If He was referring to loss of salvation by the phrase "fell away", I'd be interested in how one comes to that conclusion.

 

[reba]

most of us just read scripture so it fits our mind set.

 

[By Grace]

We went nuts cheering and clapping and crying.
Hebrews. "…It is impossible for those who have tasted of Christ's goodness to fall away to ever come back because to their shame they would be crucifying him again"
Now....no one would ever think to tell Bonnie she shouldn't sing because her voice stinks and isn't any good and God let her have cancer because of her sinfulness....
The two relate perfectly. There are some things people just don't do. And this is one of them

I celebrate the grace of God, and the miracle of healing that happened in the life of Bonnie.

However, I think that you may be not connecting the dots here, and using the miracle to "attack" something that is not relevant to the story of Bonnie, and that may be Arminianism or the "losing one's salvation" possibility theology.

Perhaps you are attacking the theology of "health and prosperity gospel" of some groups, such as WoF; I an really attempting to find an unmentioned link here (as are others). I get that from this sentence: " God let her have cancer because of her sinfulness...."

It is true that sin is the ultimate cause of all disease in the world, but that does not mean that her personal sin caused her cancer. That is a FALSE, AND HORRID MESSAGE! The God of the Bible is a covenant-keeeping God, Who loves and cares for His children unconditionally, and forever. Therefore, the yahoo who says such a thing knows neither God, nor His salvation because it is based upon grace, alone

But frankly because you are giving an incident that happened without any dates given, and because you were very mysterious about your relationship to you, I am wondering if she is your wife, or daughter-- strangers would not permit another person hold onto their falling-out hair.

Because this place is different than other sites, you will not have some sanctimonious bully attempting to make you feel inferior or insecure. Here is a 10 verse table of something very precious to the child of God, and they all come from the OT. Rather than react to the sanctimonious yahoos who know neither the grace of God, nor His salvation, comfort yourself with the fact that these "golden nuggets" are repeated so often during the worst times in the history of Israel:

7 I will give them a heart to know that I am the Lord, and they shall be my people and I will be their God, for they shall return to me with their whole heart.
Jeremiah 24:6–7

I will put my law within them, and I will write it on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they shall be my people
Jeremiah 31:33

37 Behold, I will gather them from all the countries to which I drove them in my anger and my wrath and in great indignation. I will bring them back to this place, and I will make them dwell in safety. 38 And they shall be my people, and I will be their God
Jeremiah 32:37–38

19 And I will give them one heart, and a new spirit I will put within them. I will remove the heart of stone from their flesh and give them a heart of flesh, 20 that they may walk in my statutes and keep my rules and obey them. And they shall be my people, and I will be their God.
|Ezekiel 11:19–21

10 And they shall bear their punishment—the punishment of the prophet and the punishment of the inquirer shall be alike— 11 that the house of Israel may no more go astray from me, nor defile themselves anymore with all their transgressions, but that they may be my people and I may be their God, declares the Lord God
Ezekiel 14:10–11).

29 And I will provide for them renowned plantations so that they shall no more be consumed with hunger in the land, and no longer suffer the reproach of the nations. 30 And they shall know that I am the Lord their God with them, and that they, the house of Israel, are my people, declares the Lord God. 31 And you are my sheep, human sheep of my pasture, and I am your God, declares the Lord God.”
Ezekiel 34:29–31

23 They shall not defile themselves anymore with their idols and their detestable things, or with any of their transgressions. But I will save them from all the backslidings in which they have sinned, and will cleanse them; and they shall be my people, and I will be their God.
Ezekiel 37:22–23

26 I will make a covenant of peace with them. It shall be an everlasting covenant with them. And I will set them in their land and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in their midst forevermore. 27 My dwelling place shall be with them, and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. 28 Then the nations will know that I am the Lord who sanctifies Israel, when my sanctuary is in their midst forevermore.”
Ezekiel 23:27

7 Thus says the Lord of hosts: Behold, I will save my people from the east country and from the west country, 8 and I will bring them to dwell in the midst of Jerusalem. And they shall be my people, and I will be their God, in faithfulness and in righteousness.”
Zechariah 8:6–8
All verses The Holy Bible: English Standard Version. (2001).


Does that help? So what else are you getting at here, other than providing a nice, but non-detailed story?

 

[JohnDB]

I celebrate the grace of God, and the miracle of healing that happened in the life of Bonnie.

However, I think that you may be not connecting the dots here, and using the miracle to "attack" something that is not relevant to the story of Bonnie, and that may be Arminianism or the "losing one's salvation" possibility theology.

Perhaps you are attacking the theology of "health and prosperity gospel" of some groups, such as WoF; I an really attempting to find an unmentioned link here (as are others). I get that from this sentence: " God let her have cancer because of her sinfulness...."

It is true that sin is the ultimate cause of all disease in the world, but that does not mean that her personal sin caused her cancer. That is a FALSE, AND HORRID MESSAGE! The God of the Bible is a covenant-keeeping God, Who loves and cares for His children unconditionally, and forever. Therefore, the yahoo who says such a thing knows neither God, nor His salvation because it is based upon grace, alone

But frankly because you are giving an incident that happened without any dates given, and because you were very mysterious about your relationship to you, I am wondering if she is your wife, or daughter-- strangers would not permit another person hold onto their falling-out hair.

Because this place is different than other sites, you will not have some sanctimonious bully attempting to make you feel inferior or insecure. Here is a 10 verse table of something very precious to the child of God, and they all come from the OT. Rather than react to the sanctimonious yahoos who know neither the grace of God, nor His salvation, comfort yourself with the fact that these "golden nuggets" are repeated so often during the worst times in the history of Israel:

7 I will give them a heart to know that I am the Lord, and they shall be my people and I will be their God, for they shall return to me with their whole heart.
Jeremiah 24:6–7

I will put my law within them, and I will write it on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they shall be my people
Jeremiah 31:33

37 Behold, I will gather them from all the countries to which I drove them in my anger and my wrath and in great indignation. I will bring them back to this place, and I will make them dwell in safety. 38 And they shall be my people, and I will be their God
Jeremiah 32:37–38

19 And I will give them one heart, and a new spirit I will put within them. I will remove the heart of stone from their flesh and give them a heart of flesh, 20 that they may walk in my statutes and keep my rules and obey them. And they shall be my people, and I will be their God.
|Ezekiel 11:19–21

10 And they shall bear their punishment—the punishment of the prophet and the punishment of the inquirer shall be alike— 11 that the house of Israel may no more go astray from me, nor defile themselves anymore with all their transgressions, but that they may be my people and I may be their God, declares the Lord God
Ezekiel 14:10–11).

29 And I will provide for them renowned plantations so that they shall no more be consumed with hunger in the land, and no longer suffer the reproach of the nations. 30 And they shall know that I am the Lord their God with them, and that they, the house of Israel, are my people, declares the Lord God. 31 And you are my sheep, human sheep of my pasture, and I am your God, declares the Lord God.”
Ezekiel 34:29–31

23 They shall not defile themselves anymore with their idols and their detestable things, or with any of their transgressions. But I will save them from all the backslidings in which they have sinned, and will cleanse them; and they shall be my people, and I will be their God.
Ezekiel 37:22–23

26 I will make a covenant of peace with them. It shall be an everlasting covenant with them. And I will set them in their land and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in their midst forevermore. 27 My dwelling place shall be with them, and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. 28 Then the nations will know that I am the Lord who sanctifies Israel, when my sanctuary is in their midst forevermore.”
Ezekiel 23:27

7 Thus says the Lord of hosts: Behold, I will save my people from the east country and from the west country, 8 and I will bring them to dwell in the midst of Jerusalem. And they shall be my people, and I will be their God, in faithfulness and in righteousness.”
Zechariah 8:6–8
All verses The Holy Bible: English Standard Version. (2001).


Does that help? So what else are you getting at here, other than providing a nice, but non-detailed story?

No...but Chessman got the point.