Bible Study Bible Discussion about Biblical foods and Passages where Jesus spoke about the Great Feast.

[Betty]

Revelation 3:20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

This discussion started on another thread and as to not take away from the subject of that thread, I'm starting this thread based on the subject of biblical foods along with drinks, within the bible as well as the table, Thought's about what is on the table? Based on the word, "sup," in the verse above.

Anyone who wants to share on the subject of banquets, the last supper, along with the different foods in the scriptures please feel free to join in.

I know that the food subject sounds a little boring, but once we start, you'll see that there's a great deal of depth to it as each verse regarding the different foods will show. This is not only about foods, but the last supper, and the wedding banquet, and anything else that applies.

I'll start with a passage where Jesus speaks of who we should invite to our dinners and suppers, and then He speaks a parable about people who were bidden to come to a great feast and each made excuses, and the result of it. I'll post it, but feel free to read it in your bibles.

Luke 14:12 Then said he also to him that bade him, When thou makest a dinner or a supper, call not thy friends, nor thy brethren, neither thy kinsmen, nor thy rich neighbours; lest they also bid thee again, and a recompence be made thee.
Luke 14:13 But when thou makest a feast, call the poor, the maimed, the lame, the blind:
Luke 14:14 And thou shalt be blessed; for they cannot recompense thee: for thou shalt be recompensed at the resurrection of the just.
Luke 14:15 And when one of them that sat at meat with him heard these things, he said unto him, Blessed is he that shall eat bread in the kingdom of God.

Luke 14:16 Then said he unto him, A certain man made a great supper, and bade many:
Luke 14:17 And sent his servant at supper time to say to them that were bidden, Come; for all things are now ready.
Luke 14:18 And they all with one consent began to make excuse. The first said unto him, I have bought a piece of ground, and I must needs go and see it: I pray thee have me excused.
Luke 14:19 And another said, I have bought five yoke of oxen, and I go to prove them: I pray thee have me excused.
Luke 14:20 And another said, I have married a wife, and therefore I cannot come.

Luke 14:21 So that servant came, and shewed his lord these things. Then the master of the house being angry said to his servant, Go out quickly into the streets and lanes of the city, and bring in hither the poor, and the maimed, and the halt, and the blind.
Luke 14:22 And the servant said, Lord, it is done as thou hast commanded, and yet there is room.
Luke 14:23 And the lord said unto the servant, Go out into the highways and hedges, and compel them to come in, that my house may be filled.
Luke 14:24 For I say unto you, That none of those men which were bidden shall taste of my supper.

Verses 16-24 are sobering. All these people were bidden, and each one had an excuse to not go, so the master sent his servant into the streets and lanes of the city, to bring the poor, and the maimed, and the halt, and the blind.

The same that Jesus said we should invite when we have a dinner or supper.

Jesus finishes by saying, "For I say unto you, That none of those men which were bidden shall taste of my supper.

Considering what Jesus said in Revelation,
Revelation 3:20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

Who are those who were bidden that made excuses? "Why were they bidden before the poor, the maimed, and the halt and blind?

What are your thoughts on this passage?

 

[Eugene]

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Dear Sister Betty, I hope the following notes are of a comfort to your search.
Excerpt of the Study of Luke at http://www.gracegod.com/Study Books/Gospel of Luke.pdf
NOTE: The Grace and Glory Study books are in PDF format and can be read with the free Adobe Reader

“Blessed is he that shall eat bread in the Kingdom of God" (Lk 14:15). This comment sounds like one that came from a man who was trying to speak a language that he did not really understand. It is as though he would take the conversation away from the subject at hand, which may have pierced his own heart, and try to impress Jesus with saying something spiritual. To Jesus, it was an open door to declare who will actually eat bread in the Kingdom of God, and He spoke the following parable.

"Then said He unto him, A certain man made a great supper, and bade many" (Lk 14:16). Before we continue, it is interesting to note that while Luke wrote about a "man" giving a supper, Matthew, who presents Christ as the King, said, "The Kingdom of Heaven is like unto a certain king" (Matthew 22:2). Luke characteristically describes the character as a man who sent "his servant at supper time to say to them that were bidden, Come; for all things are now ready" (Lk 14:17). "All things which are ready" refer to all the provisions of redemption, and Matthew adds, "my oxen and fatlings are killed."

Those who were invited, immediately began to make excuses. The different attitudes presented by this parable can be found in many hearts today, but here, Jesus is speaking primarily of Israel's attitude of rejecting the provisions of Calvary. The first excuse was: "I have bought a piece of ground and I must needs go and see it" (Lk 14:18). This refers to Israel who was so occupied with their works, that they could in no wise give heed to the opportunity offered them. The second one said: "I have bought five yoke of oxen and I go to prove them." The ox is only a type of Christ as the sacrificial servant of God, but Israel was much more occupied with the shadow, or type, than with the Sub- stance who was walking among them. The third one asked to be excused because "I have married a wife, and therefore I cannot come" (Lk 14:20). This represents Israel who was joined to the daughters of religion rather than with Christ. God's order was "to the Jew first and also to the Gentile" (Romans 1:16). Paul followed this pattern in his ministry, as he said in Acts 13:46: "It was necessary that the Word of God should first have been preached to you (Jews), but seeing ye put it from you, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, lo, we turn to the Gentiles." This parable teaches the same truth. "That servant came and showed his lord these things. Then the master of the house being angry said to his servant, Go out quickly into the streets and lanes of the city and bring in hither the poor, and the maimed, and the halt and the blind" (Lk 14:21). The Jews were just as needy as the Gentiles described here, but they did not admit it. The conditions seen in this verse show just how depraved all men are in the sight of God. They are poor, or bankrupt, having no righteousness. They are maimed, having been wounded by sin and Satan, and they are halt, unable to walk in the paths of righteousness. Finally, they are blind, not being able to see the light of God's Word.

All of these people are invited to this great feast purely on the basis of Divine Grace, for there is no way that men can recompense God for such Favor. This is still the message for today, and not only do we receive it into our own lives, but as Jesus has already instructed in verse Lk 14:13, we are to show the same attitude of grace to others. But there is more to this parable. The house is still not full, and "the lord said unto the servant, Go out into the highways and hedges, and compel them to come in, that my house may be filled" (Lk 14:23).

This proclamation speaks of the time when the Gospel will be preached to "whosoever will," after the present Church Age is over. The first invitation carried into the city, corresponds with the commission in Mark 16:15, that the Gospel is to go to every creature. The second one reaches a much wider area to include the highways and hedges. This refers to the Gospel being preached to all nations (Matthew 28:19), and will be accomplished by Israel during the Millennium, when they will become God's world-wide evangelists, after they, as a nation, turn to the Lord. "For I say unto you, That none of those men which were bidden shall taste of my supper" (Lk 14:24). This verse presents another noteworthy contrast with the account given in Matthew, which tells about the one without a wedding garment, who was cast out into outer darkness where there is to be weeping and gnashing of teeth (Matthew 22:11-13). The difference is noted because Matthew presents the trespass offering, which demanded absolute satisfaction of God's government against Christ rejecters. Luke, on the other hand, emphasizes the blessings of the peace offering, as men are brought into fellowship with God on the basis of the sacrifice of Christ.”

 

[Betty]

"Then said He unto him, A certain man made a great supper, and bade many" (Lk 14:16). Before we continue, it is interesting to note that while Luke wrote about a "man" giving a supper, Matthew, who presents Christ as the King, said, "The Kingdom of Heaven is like unto a certain king" (Matthew 22:2). Luke characteristically describes the character as a man who sent "his servant at supper time to say to them that were bidden, Come; for all things are now ready" (Lk 14:17). "All things which are ready" refer to all the provisions of redemption, and Matthew adds, "my oxen and fatlings are killed."

“Blessed is he that shall eat bread in the Kingdom of God" (Lk 14:15). This comment sounds like one that came from a man who was trying to speak a language that he did not really understand. It is as though he would take the conversation away from the subject at hand, which may have pierced his own heart, and try to impress Jesus with saying something spiritual. To Jesus, it was an open door to declare who will actually eat bread in the Kingdom of God, and He spoke the following parable.


"Then said He unto him, A certain man made a great supper, and bade many" (Lk 14:16). Before we continue, it is interesting to note that while Luke wrote about a "man" giving a supper, Matthew, who presents Christ as the King, said, "The Kingdom of Heaven is like unto a certain king" (Matthew 22:2). Luke characteristically describes the character as a man who sent "his servant at supper time to say to them that were bidden, Come; for all things are now ready" (Lk 14:17). "All things which are ready" refer to all the provisions of redemption, and Matthew adds, "my oxen and fatlings are killed."

Hi Eugene

Thank you for your response. It was a good read, and contains some very good points.

I can see how it spoke for the provision to Israel, it ties directly to Proverbs 9. The same provision is for everyone who believes in Jesus.

Proverbs 9:1 Wisdom hath builded her house, she hath hewn out her seven pillars:
Proverbs 9:2 She hath killed her beasts; she hath mingled her wine; she hath also furnished her table.
Proverbs 9:3 She hath sent forth her maidens: she crieth upon the highest places of the city,
Proverbs 9:4 Whoso is simple, let him turn in hither: as for him that wanteth understanding, she saith to him,
Proverbs 9:5 Come, eat of my bread, and drink of the wine which I have mingled.
Proverbs 9:6 Forsake the foolish, and live; and go in the way of understanding.

In that consideration, and as tied with the original subject. As believers, we start out with believing in Jesus, accepting Him into our hearts, and then we study to show ourselves approved and by abiding in Jesus, and His word of truth.

proverbs 9 uses much of the same language that was referenced in the parable, "my oxen and fatling are killed.," and goes on to call the"simple, and those that want understanding." Which is where every Christian begins.

So yes, I do see that he was speaking to Israel, However, this was the starting point, the bread from heaven Is Jesus, both for the Jew and the Gentile, as Paul said, there is neither Jew, nor Gentile...all are one in Christ. Breaking the middle wall of partition between us.

Ephesians 2:14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;

Christ is the same, with all who come to Him, and all who seek Him. He was their bread, and he used an example that related to sacrifice, to show that He is the great final sacrifice. The Lamb of God. He is also our bread,He died for all who would believe, and all who would seek Him would find. He died and rose from the dead, making the way for all who would come to Him and all who would believe in Him.

Matthew 7:8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.

Were salvation and being in Christ is concerned, there is no difference. Everyone is saved in the same way, and everyone is called to seek, ask and find.

Jesus said, "Seek you first the Kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things will be added unto you."

And Jesus said: Luke 12:32 Fear not, little flock; for it is your Father's good pleasure to give you the kingdom.

The above passage actually lines up with giving and not expecting anything in return, just Jesus instructed within inviting the lame, the blind the maimed,' etc.. and not expecting "recompense," or anything in return. For He is our recompense, and our treasures are in heaven.

With that in mind, and the verse that says, "Blessed is he who will eat bread in the kingdom of God."

Which ties directly to Revelations, Revelation 3:20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

Which makes the passage not only for the Jews, but also for all who will hear. Because:

2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

Proverbs 30:5 Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him.

Psalms 12:6 The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.

 

[Betty]

With the subject going into, "bread,' which is a food mentioned in the bible, in several ways. I thought I'd post verses to consider that go into the subject of "Bread."

The book of Hebrews speaks of bread, in comparison to the Kingdom. This is a new testament passage that draws a comparison.

Hebrews 9:1 Then verily the first covenant had also ordinances of divine service, and a worldly sanctuary.
Hebrews 9:2 For there was a tabernacle made; the first, wherein was the candlestick, and the table, and the shewbread; which is called the sanctuary.
Hebrews 9:3 And after the second veil, the tabernacle which is called the Holiest of all;
Hebrews 9:4 Which had the golden censer, and the ark of the covenant overlaid round about with gold, wherein was the golden pot that had manna, and Aaron's rod that budded, and the tables of the covenant;
Hebrews 9:5 And over it the cherubims of glory shadowing the mercyseat; of which we cannot now speak particularly.
Hebrews 9:6 Now when these things were thus ordained, the priests went always into the first tabernacle, accomplishing the service of God.
Hebrews 9:7 But into the second went the high priest alone once every year, not without blood, which he offered for himself, and for the errors of the people:
Hebrews 9:8 The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing:
Hebrews 9:9 Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;
Hebrews 9:10 Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.
Hebrews 9:11 But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by a greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this building;

Of course, there are mentions of actual bread, in the NT.

2 Thessalonians 3:8 Neither did we eat any man's bread for nought; but wrought with labour and travail night and day, that we might not be chargeable to any of you:
2 Thessalonians 3:9 Not because we have not power, but to make ourselves an ensample unto you to follow us.
2 Thessalonians 3:10 For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat.
2 Thessalonians 3:11 For we hear that there are some which walk among you disorderly, working not at all, but are busybodies.
2 Thessalonians 3:12 Now them that are such we command and exhort by our Lord Jesus Christ, that with quietness they work, and eat their own bread.

In the next passage, Paul speaks of the "seed to the sower, and minister of Bread for your food." Speaking of Jesus.

2 Corinthians 9:10 Now he that ministereth seed to the sower both minister bread for your food, and multiply your seed sown, and increase the fruits of your righteousness;)
2 Corinthians 9:11 Being enriched in every thing to all bountifulness, which causeth through us thanksgiving to God.
2 Corinthians 9:12 For the administration of this service not only supplieth the want of the saints, but is abundant also by many thanksgivings unto God;

The next passage is based on communion, which I believe ties directly to supping with Christ as stated Revelations 3:20.

1 Corinthians 11:28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup.
1 Corinthians 11:29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.
1 Corinthians 11:30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.
1 Corinthians 11:31 For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.

There are several examples within the scriptures that go into communing.

We commune with each other as well. This is why I believe that Paul went into the table that we are seated at. 1 Corinthians 10:21 Ye cannot drink the cup of the Lord, and the cup of devils: ye cannot be partakers of the Lord's table, and of the table of devils.

Daniel 1:19 And the king communed with them; and among them all was found none like Daniel, Hananiah, Mishael, and Azariah: therefore stood they before the king.

Luke 24:15 And it came to pass, that, while they communed together and reasoned, Jesus himself drew near, and went with them.

The above verse is the subject that was gone into on another thread, the two disciple on the road to Emmaus, "communed together," and Jesus Himself drew near and went with them.

When we're communing in HIM, I believe that HE is with us as well.

And there's a difference in communing together in Christ at His table, and communing together in unrighteousness and wickedness.

In Luke, as well as other passages, the Pharisees were always watching for ways to accuse Jesus. In Luke 6, Jesus healed a man on the Sabbath, and it angered them, and they "communed one with another what they might do to Jesus."

Luke 6:11 And they were filled with madness; and communed one with another what they might do to Jesus.

In regards to Judas:

Luke 22:1 Now the feast of unleavened bread drew nigh, which is called the Passover.
Luke 22:2 And the chief priests and scribes sought how they might kill him; for they feared the people.
Luke 22:3 Then entered Satan into Judas surnamed Iscariot, being of the number of the twelve.
Luke 22:4 And he went his way, and communed with the chief priests and captains, how he might betray him unto them.

The feast of unleavened bread was taking place when Judas betrayed Jesus.^^^

There are several examples throughout the bible that go into "communing."

One of the earliest God tells Moses that HE will meet with Him, in the Holy of Holies, within the temple where the ark was behind the curtain, "before the curtain was torn in two in the NT.

Exodus 25:22 And there I will meet with thee, and I will commune with thee from above the mercy seat, from between the two cherubim which are upon the ark of the testimony, of all things which I will give thee in commandment unto the children of Israel.

As you can see, God's word doesn't leave us wondering, and also covers different aspects to different subjects. The two here, being "bread, and communing." There's no shortage of bread. Just like when Jesus fed the multitude with only a few loaves of bread and a few fish.

In the above account, Jesus brought home the point, by even telling the disciples to go and gather the left-overs from the loaves and fish.

There's no lack in HIM.

 

[Betty]

So Betty whats your thoughts on why the king did not include the unwanted people in the first invitation, but invited them that turned him down first instead?

Do you suppose the king did not have enough to feed everyone? (me thinks not :wink)

I stated in the post that there is no lack of in Christ. It was the very last statement. I don't know what would make that question arise, because that would be untrue, and that is not an impression that I intended to give. I wanted to show how all scripture is profitable.

It likely has to do with the Jews who were cut off, and being grafted back in, (In Christ.)

Romans 11:17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;

John 15:1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
John 15:2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
John 15:3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
John 15:4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.

Romans 11:24 For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be graffed into their own olive tree?

There's another parable about garments that reminds a lot of the wedding feast and guests coming in but it's more about what they're wearing.

Matthew 22:1 And Jesus answered and spake unto them again by parables, and said,
Matthew 22:2 The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made a marriage for his son,
Matthew 22:3 And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come.

In this parable Jesus makes a comparison to the Kingdom of Heaven, being like a King, who made a marriage for his son.
He sent his servants who were bidden to the wedding; and they would not come.

This also could very well be tied to Jesus entering in and the rejection from the Jews.

Matthew 22:4 Again, he sent forth other servants, saying, Tell them which are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriage.

He even uses the same wording in the above verse.

Matthew 22:5 But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise:

Matthew 22:6 And the remnant took his servants, and entreated them spitefully, and slew them.

Which the Jews did to the prophets that were sent to them, and could also have something to do with some of the last day passages. Like one we talked about recently.

John 16:2 They shall put you out of the synagogues: yea, the time cometh, that whosoever killeth you will think that he doeth God service.

See how things repeat?

Matthew 22:7 But when the king heard thereof, he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city.

Matthew 22:8 Then saith he to his servants, The wedding is ready, but they which were bidden were not worthy.

Matthew 22:9 Go ye therefore into the highways, and as many as ye shall find, bid to the marriage.

Matthew 22:10 So those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together all as many as they found, both bad and good: and the wedding was furnished with guests.

This reminds me of the parable of the ten virgins. I also kinda see the wheat and tares in the above verse.

Matthew 22:11 And when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man which had not on a wedding garment:

(The garment,) Paul to said to "put on Christ." That's another study.

I think, one thing that I will never understand is, Paul said, 2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

When Paul spoke about the Bereans being more noble, because searched the scriptures to see if everything was so.

What Scriptures were they searching, at that point in time? As they were being directly taught what would be the NT?

Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

We have the full bible today, and we're so blessed to have it.

Why is it an issue at times, to examine the scriptures throughout the bible?

I personally believe that every word that God spoke, and every thing that is written is very valuable to every believer. I don't believe that any man can alter God's written word, regardless of what some might say. I believe that God is powerful and has no issue with sustaining His word.

We have the full bible for a reason.

Hebrews 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

 

[Betty]

"Nathan, post: 1313881, member: 909"]Please don't take my statement/question as an accusation, or as directed at a comment you made. It was kind of a standalone question.

Still Nathan, I gave my answer to that before the question was asked.

Jumping around it like that, as though I didn't say it, is dishonest.

Here is what I think. When we go back to the beginning we see God put man in a "Garden". He surrounded man with all kinds of food, but told him not to eat of one certain kind. Then, God allowed the great tempter to enter the garden. And the tempter used the thought of some great 'tasting' fruit to tempt Adam and Eve into sinning. Interesting.

Fast forward to Abraham. God sets His plans for mankind out in the open, reveals them. Move down the line a generation and we see even more clarity, and a distinction take place - two lines. The wanted and the unwanted - Jacob and Esau.

Yes, I agree God did surround them with all kinds of foods. And they were told not to eat one certain kind. This makes seeing the differences within the scriptures, (the very passages show what kind of food it is.) To ignore those passages would be to not recognize the difference. I do see what you were trying to say there, and it is interesting that you stated that.

It sounds as if you think that what God told them was actually given to them by the devil? That's what it sounds like.

More clarity into God's plan is then revealed when one line is 'confined' within tight restrictions - not least of which were a lot of 'food' laws. While the other line was not held to the standard - seemingly getting worse and worse in all they consume.

Yes, there are a lot of food laws, and even those laws bring clarity to NT statements. The line was not confined, the masses were. Many knew more than I think they are given credit. Jesus even said: John 8:56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad. I personally believe that some knew who Jesus is even in the OT.

Then, at the right moment, God sent His Son to bring the guests to the feast. But didn't God know that they would not come? Yes, He did know they wouldn't come. That was apart of His plan. He sent His Servant at the time when He saw they were preoccupied with their own things. So instead, He gathers the 'other' line - the ones that were 'unwanted' and 'consumed' all the detestable things of the world. He invited them to the feast where He provides good food - He does have plenty after all(He is the King).

I agree, but there's also the wedding feast, where Jesus tells some, as with the parable of the ten virgins, I never knew you. And with the "garment," passage that was in the last post, the only way to have that Garment is in Christ. This is to Christians as well. Because many of them say this. "Didn't I do all these great things in your name?"

Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

The reason why, is so His great majesty would be even more glorified. If the ones who had been invited to come first, had come, then they would have 'thought' they were getting to go because they were 'better' than the unwanted. But because He called the invitation when He did, it was purposeful to do so when the original invites seemed 'busy' with their own stuff - in order that the ones who never would think they could be apart of something so wonderful, to eat such glorious 'kings' food, would give such honor and majesty to the king who invited them.

That's what they did think. Even today, some do, but I would ask you if you've looked at the OT passages that involve "strangers," and those strangers that were among them?" God accepted them way back then too. Go read about King Cyrus, and how he wasn't a Jew, God used this man even saying that HE chose him.

The other invited ones, the original ones, ate somewhat like the king ate already - they did not care so much for his food. It was not appealing to them. But the unwanted ones were constantly eating 'garbage' and leftovers, so that the kings feast sounded great. So now, the others who are apart of the original group, the 'upper class', they see all of these unwanted people going in and enjoying the kings food. What does that do? It makes them jealous.

If you are referring to any part of God's word as being "garbage, and leftover,' I will straight out say, that is error.

Romans 11:11 I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.
Romans 11:12 Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness?

They stumbled at the stumbling block, Christ in this case. There are many other things that cause a person to stumble within the scriptures as well.

The Jealousy isn't because of garbage, because nothing God ever said is that. In fact, nowhere in the scriptures does it call the OT or any passage "garbage."

Ah, but they care not about the kings food still - they just care that the unwanted ones are getting to eat what they don't deserve - what belongs to upper class people. Hmmmmmmmm - me thinks - after a while, the food of the upper class, starts to go bad - rot and spoil. Then they see this great feast taking place and think - surely if the king let in the unwanted ones, maybe the king will take us back and at least let us serve him - and we can at least eat some good food rather than our rotting and spoiled food.

They don't understand about the food at Christ's table, they can't see it. The veil is only removed IN Christ.

So they go to the king, and what happens? The king is glad - and orders even a greater feast! So then all in the kings house dine together - as one.

The parable of the prodigal son. What did the son find himself eating?

The son was literally eating the swines food. How are you associating anything that God ever said with swines food? If someone was bringing in the Koran, or some other religious book, I'd say that is swines food. NOTHING that God ever said is garbage.

The parable of the prodigal son is one of my favorites! It not only has to do with the Jews, but every Christian who walked away, deciding to turn back to Jesus. God's word is deep, and covers every aspect. That's the mercy of God. There's hope as long as we have breath.

With the statements made here, you actually answered the question of why some go into defensive mode when the OT is even spoken of. Somehow some think that it's not of God, or that it's waste?

So the original study, examining the scriptures, can't go forward, since half of the bible has to be left out.

P.S. How would one even know about the garden temptation, without the very first book in the OT.

AND, go and read about the temptation of Christ, pay close attention to his responses, not only "It is written," but the actual responses of what is written. Each response comes out of the OT directly. Here's one before that you'll find there. "Man shall not live on bread alone but on every word that proceeds from the mouth of God."

I would rather be called the worst names, than have it insinuated that studying foods within the bible is some kind of deception.

Seriously Nathan, be honest about your intentions.

Sugarcoating accusations still makes them accusations. Say it straight out, if that's your goal.

 

[Nathan]

Still Nathan, I gave my answer to that before the question was asked.

Jumping around it like that, as though I didn't say it, is dishonest.


Yes, I agree God did surround them with all kinds of foods. And they were told not to eat one certain kind. This makes seeing the differences within the scriptures, (the very passages show what kind of food it is.) To ignore those passages would be to not recognize the difference. I do see what you were trying to say there, and it is interesting that you stated that.

It sounds as if you think that what God told them was actually given to them by the devil? That's what it sounds like.


Yes, there are a lot of food laws, and even those laws bring clarity to NT statements. The line was not confined, the masses were. Many knew more than I think they are given credit. Jesus even said: John 8:56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad. I personally believe that some knew who Jesus is even in the OT.



I agree, but there's also the wedding feast, where Jesus tells some, as with the parable of the ten virgins, I never knew you. And with the "garment," passage that was in the last post, the only way to have that Garment is in Christ. This is to Christians as well. Because many of them say this. "Didn't I do all these great things in your name?"

Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.



That's what they did think. Even today, some do, but I would ask you if you've looked at the OT passages that involve "strangers," and those strangers that were among them?" God accepted them way back then too. Go read about King Cyrus, and how he wasn't a Jew, God used this man even saying that HE chose him.



If you are referring to any part of God's word as being "garbage, and leftover,' I will straight out say, that is error.

Romans 11:11 I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.
Romans 11:12 Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness?

They stumbled at the stumbling block, Christ in this case. There are many other things that cause a person to stumble within the scriptures as well.

The Jealousy isn't because of garbage, because nothing God ever said is that. In fact, nowhere in the scriptures does it call the OT or any passage "garbage."



They don't understand about the food at Christ's table, they can't see it. The veil is only removed IN Christ.



The son was literally eating the swines food. How are you associating anything that God ever said with swines food? If someone was bringing in the Koran, or some other religious book, I'd say that is swines food. NOTHING that God ever said is garbage.

The parable of the prodigal son is one of my favorites! It not only has to do with the Jews, but every Christian who walked away, deciding to turn back to Jesus. God's word is deep, and covers every aspect. That's the mercy of God. There's hope as long as we have breath.

With the statements made here, you actually answered the question of why some go into defensive mode when the OT is even spoken of. Somehow some think that it's not of God, or that it's waste?

So the original study, examining the scriptures, can't go forward, since half of the bible has to be left out.

P.S. How would one even know about the garden temptation, without the very first book in the OT.

AND, go and read about the temptation of Christ, pay close attention to his responses, not only "It is written," but the actual responses of what is written. Each response comes out of the OT directly. Here's one before that you'll find there. "Man shall not live on bread alone but on every word that proceeds from the mouth of God."

I would rather be called the worst names, than have it insinuated that studying foods within the bible is some kind of deception.

Seriously Nathan, be honest about your intentions.

Sugarcoating accusations still makes them accusations. Say it straight out, if that's your goal.

Oh boy. I think this has turned down the wrong road. I have not made any accusations against you nor intended anything negative toward you. I honestly was just asking a question - almost rhetorical in nature. It was not meant to cause you any grief and I apologize if it was taken that way.

I never, ever, never, intended to make it seem like God's word is garbage. I guess my post is being viewed negatively for some reason and I have no idea how to respond to it. I was simply saying that God's Word to the Jews was good food, and the Gentiles feast on words of man which are garbage. Then, when the Gentiles come to the feast they get to eat of the good food that God gives, where as the food the Jews eat after rejecting the kings food, now becomes spoiled and rotten because of their own adding and subtracting of it.

How else is a person to say they don't mean something than to plainly say they don't mean something? I do not see how I am trying to sugar coat anything. I was enjoying your study and simply thought I was adding to it. I am not sure why you took personal offense to it. I love to read the OT and believe it is wonderful to feast on.

Honestly, I am not sure how to proceed. I am going to delete my posts because they are being taken way wrong and I do not want them to be interpreted in a different manner than I posted them. Again, I apologize - I am just not sure how else to say this.

 

[Betty]

Oh boy. I think this has turned down the wrong road. I have not made any accusations against you nor intended anything negative toward you. I honestly was just asking a question - almost rhetorical in nature. It was not meant to cause you any grief and I apologize if it was taken that way.

I never, ever, never, intended to make it seem like God's word is garbage. I guess my post is being viewed negatively for some reason and I have no idea how to respond to it. I was simply saying that God's Word to the Jews was good food, and the Gentiles feast on words of man which are garbage. Then, when the Gentiles come to the feast they get to eat of the good food that God gives, where as the food the Jews eat after rejecting the kings food, now becomes spoiled and rotten because of their own adding and subtracting of it.

How else is a person to say they don't mean something than to plainly say they don't mean something? I do not see how I am trying to sugar coat anything. I was enjoying your study and simply thought I was adding to it. I am not sure why you took personal offense to it. I love to read the OT and believe it is wonderful to feast on.

Honestly, I am not sure how to proceed. I am going to delete my posts because they are being taken way wrong and I do not want them to be interpreted in a different manner than I posted them. Again, I apologize - I am just not sure how else to say this.

I didn't view it negatively "for some reason," I did because some of the things that you said, and insinuating that even discussing food within the bible can be related to the garden of Eden temptation.

I do realize that it's a largely held belief that somehow looking at OT scriptures makes one "legalistic."

I assure you, my faith is in Christ alone. I have studied OT principles, but not in an effort to earn salvation but to more clearly understand different statements within the scriptures. I am not afraid of any passage within the bible, because I trust Jesus to teach me. Well, with the exception that I pray that i never hear, 'I never knew you." That scares me.

But once it's insinuated, there's not a lot of hope of any biblical conversation on the subject, when doubt is there.

It can be difficult to discuss God's word at times, He teaches us in a way that is difficult to put into words in certain areas.

The different foods for the most part that I was going to bring into this discussion, are all within the NT, not the law.

Grapes, wine, bread, oil, milk, and several more. can be found in the law, but my focus was mainly on the NT, with some OT examples for edification and clarification.

I'm not mad at you. No need to apologize.

Although, this is likely my last post here. As the last few days, I've seen this with a few. I'm moving along.

I hope that everyone prayerfully considers everything within the scriptures always.

That is my heart.

 

[Nathan]

Betty
I do not hold to the idea that OT study is legalistic. I think its actually sad that more people don't do it. I never meant for it to be insinuated, and so that's what I found so shocking.

I apologized because you were very forthcoming in thinking I was insinuating something I really was not. If I could have specifically apologized for something I would have, but I had no idea where I went wrong?

I'm sorry you feel the need to move on. Its been my experience that just about anywhere I have been I will always find something I don't like. I just made the decision a few years back that from that point forward I will always look for the best in a person or situation instead of the worst. Some say that I am an optimist, but I like to think I am a realist. I figure if God who see's all the hidden things of mankind, can look down on us and love us the way He does, then I can love Him back and my fellow man.

 

[Jim Parker]

Who are those who were bidden that made excuses?

Jesus was making reference to those Jews who considered themselves to be righteous but, in fact were not. He was speaking against the scribes, Pharisees and Sadducees who opposed him.

If they would have listened to Jesus and believed Him (and some of them did) then they would have been guaranteed a seat at the "Wedding feast of the Lamb" in the kingdom of heaven.

Since they did not believe Him, they would not enter but anyone who did would be welcomed by "the King" who represents God.

iakov the fool