Born Again Atheists?

[Vince]

Thirty years ago, a friend of mine had a large and successful ministry, and today he is an atheist. He is actually a kinder, calmer person than he used to be.

2 Peter 1:9 is sometimes used to teach that a genuine Christian can become an atheist. "For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins."

In researching the verse, I noticed that the next verse says:

"Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if you do these things you will never stumble;" It seems that Peter is warning them that if they aren't diligent about making their calling and election sure, they could forget that they were purged from their old sins.

I would appreciate intelligent comments on this passage.

 

[glorydaz]

Thirty years ago, a friend of mine had a large and successful ministry, and today he is an atheist. He is actually a kinder, calmer person than he used to be.

2 Peter 1:9 is sometimes used to teach that a genuine Christian can become an atheist. "For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins."

In researching the verse, I noticed that the next verse says:

"Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if you do these things you will never stumble;" It seems that Peter is warning them that if they aren't diligent about making their calling and election sure, they could forget that they were purged from their old sins.

I would appreciate intelligent comments on this passage.

Hi Vince,
I'm not sure how intellegent this will be, but I did want to respond. You mention he's a kinder, calmer person than he was. Having a large and successful ministry could mean he was putting himself under a lot of pressure. If he had an image to live up to, he could have come under condemnation because he wasn't reaching the perfection he thought he should have. I say this because I know people this has happened to. They come across the "Sea of Despond" and "cannot see afar off". They chuck it all and can finally relax...becoming the person they should have been when they believed. Now he claims to be an atheist. He may just be refusing to acknowledge God. But, it's easy to forget how patient and long suffering God can be with His children. Many, many years can go by, but I wonder what this man will do when his wife is dying or he himself? Will he have to eat with the pigs like the prodigal son before he returns to the father? It could be. It's a shame, but the show's not over until life is over.

We're reminded of not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together for the same reason. You take a coal from the fire and set it off by itself and it will grow cold. But one thing I am confident of...if he was the Lord's, he is not forgotten.

 

[Vince]

Glorydaz, you've explained one theory for how this could happen. A Christian advances heavily with a wrong concept of God, realizes his concept is false, and then decides that God does not exist.

Now, free of the false concept, he grows spiritually.

 

[Physicist]

Thirty years ago, a friend of mine had a large and successful ministry, and today he is an atheist. He is actually a kinder, calmer person than he used to be.

2 Peter 1:9 is sometimes used to teach that a genuine Christian can become an atheist. "For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins."

In researching the verse, I noticed that the next verse says:

"Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if you do these things you will never stumble;" It seems that Peter is warning them that if they aren't diligent about making their calling and election sure, they could forget that they were purged from their old sins.

I would appreciate intelligent comments on this passage.

Hi Vince,
I'm not sure how intellegent this will be, but I did want to respond. You mention he's a kinder, calmer person than he was. Having a large and successful ministry could mean he was putting himself under a lot of pressure. If he had an image to live up to, he could have come under condemnation because he wasn't reaching the perfection he thought he should have. I say this because I know people this has happened to. They come across the "Sea of Despond" and "cannot see afar off". They chuck it all and can finally relax...becoming the person they should have been when they believed. Now he claims to be an atheist. He may just be refusing to acknowledge God. But, it's easy to forget how patient and long suffering God can be with His children. Many, many years can go by, but I wonder what this man will do when his wife is dying or he himself? Will he have to eat with the pigs like the prodigal son before he returns to the father? It could be. It's a shame, but the show's not over until life is over.

We're reminded of not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together for the same reason. You take a coal from the fire and set it off by itself and it will grow cold. But one thing I am confident of...if he was the Lord's, he is not forgotten.

Glorydaz,

Your comments with regard to the man facing death remind me of the old saw that there are no atheists in foxholes. The saying is not true, of course. The degree of religious belief in the military is not much different than the outside community. However, it is true that people facing severe crisis, e.g. combat, serious illness, financial ruin, will turn to desperate measures to alleviate that crisis. While prayer may increase in combat, so does drug use. An ill person may return to church and/or seek out out a quack medicine cure. Unscrupulous individuals from quick money con artists to tv preachers pray on such persons.

However, the real question should be whether the religion is true, the medicine is effective or the investment is sound. These are objective facts that are not changed by the individual's state of mind. Perhaps the person described in the OP rationally concluded, based upon the evidence, that his religious beliefs were wrong.

Regards,

Physicist

 

[archangel_300]

Thirty years ago, a friend of mine had a large and successful ministry, and today he is an atheist. He is actually a kinder, calmer person than he used to be.

2 Peter 1:9 is sometimes used to teach that a genuine Christian can become an atheist. "For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins."

In researching the verse, I noticed that the next verse says:

"Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if you do these things you will never stumble;" It seems that Peter is warning them that if they aren't diligent about making their calling and election sure, they could forget that they were purged from their old sins.

I would appreciate intelligent comments on this passage.

I honestly believe the passages in 2 Peter are just telling us to check our lives to make sure we are definitely in the faith. There are many that may deceive themselves into thinking they are saved when they have not been. The evidence we have been saved is that we will produce the fruits of good works and the fruits of the spirit will be manifest in our lives.

That's the thing that really confuses me about your friend. If one's belief in God is really true how in the world do they go back to being an atheist? Being an atheist means you believe there is no God.
I can see that happening to a person who has never truly come to faith in Jesus Christ but I cannot see that happening to a true born again believer.

Does your friend really believe there is no God or does he believe there is a God but doesn't want to deal with him anymore?

For instance using myself as an example, the only reason why I believe in God is because I am completely convinced the scriptures are not man made. This came after many years of carefully studying the Bible. It's impossible for me to disbelieve God exists and if I ever did state I disbelieved in God I'd be lying. Once I was blind and now I see. I just don't see how a person can turn atheist if they truly believed God exists and their belief was deeply rooted in the scriptures.

 

[Vince]

Archangel, more than one Christian has told my friend that they don't believe that he is really an atheist. I think that he got messed up by the half-insane person he used to work for.

 

[Danus]

Ministry can be a powerful attractive thing. After all people listen to you, look up to you, many pastors are pillars of society. A lot of people are attracted to it because of the influence and prestige it can hold.

I think to be called into it and be pure, one should go into it kicking and screaming. Look at Moses. He did not want anything to do with the task God asked of him. He argued and complained; "Who I'm I?" he said.

If you have not seen it, a Good movie to watch is "Billy the Early Years".

Billy Graham had a friend named Charles Templeton who was a supper star evangelist. Templeton claimed to have lost his faith after WWII seeing footage of concentration camps in Germany and Poland. No God would allow this, he thought. He soon left the ministry. Billy's faith strengthened during this time and he took off to become one of the most well respected evangelist of our time. Not because he wanted to, but because he had to. He had to spread the word of God, it was his duty and he knew it. That's a calling, that's being pure.