Did Jesus perform sacrifices?

[Georges]

Did Jesus perform (give) sacrifices as required by the Torah?

If yes, why did he have to?

If no, why not?

 

[unred typo]

I don’t recall any that were mentioned. The sacrifices made at his birth were for his mother, not him:
Luke 2:22 And when the days of her purification according to the law of Moses were accomplished, they brought him to Jerusalem, to present him to the Lord;
23(As it is written in the law of the LORD, Every male that openeth the womb shall be called holy to the Lord;)
24And to offer a sacrifice according to that which is said in the law of the Lord, A pair of turtledoves, or two young pigeons.

I would guess ‘no’ and because he was sinless. He was baptized even though he was without sins to repent of but that was “to fulfill all righteousness.†I’m not sure what that means. :-?

 

[TanNinety]

He was baptized even though he was without sins to repent of but that was “to fulfill all righteousness.†I’m not sure what that means.

Sorry George, I might digress from the main topic a little, but I just couldn’t pass this up.

Matthew 3:13 Then cometh Yeshua from Galilee to Jordan unto John, to be baptized of him. 14 But John forbad him, saying, I have need to be baptized of thee, and comest thou to me?

It appears that John knew Yeshua already before he baptized Him.

John 1:31 And I knew him not: but that he should be made manifest to Israel, therefore am I come baptizing with water …33 And knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, the same is he which baptizeth with the Holy Ghost.

It appears that John did not know Yeshua before he baptized Him.

Is there a contradiction here? How can we reconcile the seemingly opposite records of Yeshua’s baptism?

Solution:
Let’s say John the Baptist didn’t really have a clue who the Messiah was even when he saw Yeshua, just like in the account of John 1:31-33. Now Yeshua walks down into the water where John is baptizing. John asks Yeshua if he repents of His sins and if He is ready to be baptized. To the surprise of John, Yeshua confesses no sin and tells John that He has always fulfilled God’s law. Now John gets a clue of who this man standing in the water with Him is. He says “You should be the one baptizing me and you come to me?â€Â. But Yeshua says no, go ahead and baptize me so that “all righteousness is fulfilledâ€Â. What is that righteousness that was fulfilled here? Yeshua, even though He was sinless, He still subjected Himself under baptism, recognizing that His sinless life was not His own, but with humility acknowledged that He just imitated what He saw His Father say and do. So He did not show any sin of pride of living a sinless life but acknowledged it the grace of God and what our Heavenly Father taught Him.

Now, is it righteous that God’s prophesies to not be fulfilled? One of the prophesies is that God would let John the Baptist know who the Messiah is by “Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, the same is he which baptizeth with the Holy Ghostâ€Â. If Yeshua didn’t get baptized John would have never gotten this confirmation from God, thus a prophecy would have been left unfulfilled. Thus Yeshua’s baptism had a lot of significance for “all rihteousness being fulfilledâ€Â, and that was when Yeshua received the fullness of the holy spirit on Him.

Back to the topic. :-D

 

[Georges]

Tan,

Digression apology accepted....and although I enjoyed the post very much, I don't really want this thread to deviate from the OP....

Geo.
.............

 

[Atonement]

Georges, this is a very good topic. Thank you for starting this. I'm not sure if the Bible gives us enough information about Jesus performing sacrifices. I'm on the fence sorta speak. I can not say He did or did not. I personaly do not know, only because Jesus came to fulfill the law of the prophects which would be performing sacrifices as in the OT. But on the other hand, if God thought that it was important, the Holy Spirit would have inspired the writers of the Gospels to speak on such a topic, so I'm on the fence. I look forward to hearing the responses on this. I'm not educated enough to speak on such a matter. But I am willing to learn and except what Scripture has to say about it. God Bless you George

 

[Georges]

I would guess ‘no’ and because he was sinless. He was baptized even though he was without sins to repent of but that was “to fulfill all righteousness.†I’m not sure what that means. :-?

But...if he didn't obey Torah and sacrifice as required, wouldn't he have sinned by not obeying the Law?

In trying to keep this line of questioning in the context of the OP question, can you provide a verse that states that Jesus was sinless? Would his parents not have sacrificed a lamb at passover (yearly) as the Torah required?

I hate to digress from my own topic, but you did raise an interesting issue.

Keep in mind that sinless and righteous are 2 different things. Sinless would mean "never sinned". Righteous would mean "sinner forgiven by atonement".

Red, you quoted:

Mat 3:15 And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer [it to be so] now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him.

This is most likely from the Jewish tradition of baptism....

...Accordingly, Baptism is not merely for the purpose of expiating a special transgression, as is the case chiefly in the violation of the so-called Levitical laws of purity; but it is to form a part of holy living and to prepare for the attainment of a closer communion with God.
http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/view. ... ch=baptism

It is also a way of washing away (cleansing the body) of sin. Before the baptism, was Jesus able to sin? He did heed the call of the Baptist. Jesus did say it was to "fulfill all righteousness". If one has to "fulfill all righteousness", then was he at one time unrighteous?

Can a man sin, and be made "white as snow" by the Torah's atonement standards?

Isa 1:16 Wash you, make you clean; put away the evil of your doings from before mine eyes; cease to do evil;
Isa 1:17 Learn to do well; seek judgment, relieve the oppressed, judge the fatherless, plead for the widow.
Isa 1:18 Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.

Can a man sin and by Torah's atonement regulations become righteous?

Eze 18:21 But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die.
Eze 18:22 All his transgressions that he hath committed, they shall not be mentioned unto him: in his righteousness that he hath done he shall live.

Once a man is made righteous can he be sinless? I think a man can, if aided by Jehovah's Holy Spirit (Isa 11:2). However, it was only accomplished once.

I believe that Jesus, upon his baptism, was made righteous. At that point, the Holy Spirit of Jehovah (Isa 11:2) empowered him to accomplish Jehovah's task for him, and as a result he remained sinless up to his crucifixion.

Back to the OP....if Jesus was sinless, I think he must have sacrificed. Whether he needed to or not...it was Jehovah's commandment for all men.

 

[TanNinety]

Thank you for accepting my apology, George.

I voted may be so. Primarily because the bible doesn’t say anything about Yeshua offering sacrifices. But absence of evidence might not be the presence of proof of the contrary.

What makes me think He did offer sacrifices, is the fact that He came to “fulfill the lawâ€Â. And fulfilling of the law does not come by breaking of the law. May be He did have to offer sacrifices, because (I am still discussing this in another of your threads) as Atonement, jgredline and oscar pointed out that He broke the law of Sabbath over and over again by working.

As for Yeshua being sinless, the following passages often have me thinking.
Mark 10:17-18: "And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life? And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God."
Matthew 19:16-17: "And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God..."
Luke 18:18-19: "And a certain ruler asked him, saying, Good Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God."

But these seem to set the record straight.
1 Peter 2:22 Who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth:
1John 3:5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
But is it after Isaiah 1:18, I dont know.

The point that Yeshua did not have the fullness of the Spirit of God on Him until His baptism is something that needs to considered also.

Once a man is made righteous can he be sinless? I think a man can, if aided by Jehovah's Holy Spirit (Isa 11:2). However, it was only accomplished once.

You could very well be true.