[_ Old Earth _] Evolution and Plant LIfe and the odds

[KenEOTE]

OK I am just curious. What are the odds that plant life evolved at the same rate that animal life evolved? I would assume that the first life had to be herbivore or it would have eaten itself too quickly to reproduce. So can someone explain how plant life just happened to evolve at a rate in which life was evolving to keep it alive. I look at plant life and it is pretty vast with all the various types of plants out there some poisonous some good to eat. Its mind boggling to me that it could all happen by chance at a rate that would support life. So now argue about that for a while guys.

 

[Barbarian]

OK I am just curious. What are the odds that plant life evolved at the same rate that animal life evolved?

The odds are zero. For example, land plants evolved long, long before vertebrates came ashore. On the other hand, there is co-evolution; two organisms adapting to each other in an environment. In that case, changes to one can induce changes in the other.

I would assume that the first life had to be herbivore or it would have eaten itself too quickly to reproduce.

Autotrophs. They make their own food. The fossil record shows autotrophs had nearly a billion year head start on heterotrophs.

So can someone explain how plant life just happened to evolve at a rate in which life was evolving to keep it alive.

Didn't. For the reasons mentioned above.

I look at plant life and it is pretty vast with all the various types of plants out there some poisonous some good to eat. Its mind boggling to me that it could all happen by chance at a rate that would support life.

Darwin's discovery was that it wasn't by chance.

So now argue about that for a while guys.

Already settled. About 150 years ago.

 

[KenEOTE]

So what did Darwin believe did it all if it wasn't by chance?

Also it takes a lot of faith to believe it all occured by itself in the proper order to maintain life.

Autotrophs. They make their own food.

What were they making thier food out of? How do you make food if you have nothing to make it with? Were they eating themsleves and eachother?

 

[jmm9683]

Autotrophs. They make their own food.

What were they making thier food out of? How do you make food if you have nothing to make it with? Were they eating themsleves and eachother?

Come on man, I'm assuming you have at least took a high school level biology class. Ever hear of photosynthesis?

 

[Geth]

There are various possibilities of autotrophs for example bacteria using photosynthesis.

FYI: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autotroph

So what did Darwin believe did it all if it wasn't by chance?

What do you mean? I think it has been said often enough that evolution is NOT dictated by chance.
Please specifiy your question.

As Barbarian stated plants had quite a head start compared to (land)animals.

Greetings
Geth

 

[Barbarian]

Others have disposed of some misconceptions very well, but I'll take this one:

Also it takes a lot of faith to believe it all occured by itself in the proper order to maintain life.

That's the point, as I showed you, it didn't. Autotrophs don't need heterotrophs.

 

[KenEOTE]

Ever hear of photosynthesis?

But how did the organisms develop photosynthesis. How did nature dictate to show that they would need that? Some obviously came that didn't have that ability and died out quickly. Survival of the fittest and all.

What do you mean? I think it has been said often enough that evolution is NOT dictated by chance.
Please specifiy your question.

What do you feel dictates evolution? What is in control of it? What decides the order and how it all works together?

That's the point, as I showed you, it didn't. Autotrophs don't need heterotrophs.

It still takes some faith on your part to believe that it occurred.

 

[Snidey]

http://edmall.gsfc.nasa.gov/aacps/news/ ... hesis.html
http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/a ... /5485/1724
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 082404.htm
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11538390
http://arjournals.annualreviews.org/doi ... 301.135212

 

[KenEOTE]

Snidey don't send me stuff to read man!

By the way Patterson said:

Plants never evolved they were planted by God.

How do you deal with that?

 

[Snidey]

You are a jokester sir.

 

[John]

Lets not forget of all the fossil evideance that shows that plants never evolved at all :

Hello all from CFB Gagetown

 

[Snidey]

Lets not forget of all the fossil evideance that shows that plants never evolved at all :

Hello all from CFB Gagetown

What exactly are you referring to?

 

[Geth]

What do you feel dictates evolution? What is in control of it? What decides the order and how it all works together?

Evolution is driven by natural selection. Organisms better adapted to their surroundings are more likely to reproduce in greater magnitude. So i.e. when a organism develops a better way of using given ressources he's going to produce more descendants than other organisms which is finally resulting in changes in the entire genepool of this species and even in transformation into another species once enough "micro evolutions" (IDers term) occured.

Snidey don't send me stuff to read man!

This is just so damn ignorant I can't believe it. You ask for answers to your question. You're given the answers but you refuse to read them. That's just "dumb on purpose" as Kent Hovind used to say.

It still takes some faith on your part to believe that it occurred.

Why does it need faith? There are fossils showing this organisms. They can also easyly be observed today. Just look up Cyanobacteria. But I think you just want to ignore the facts.

Greetings
Geth

 

[KenEOTE]

Ok Most plants come from seeds or spores or need creatures such as birds and bugs to help them pollinate. How did theses first plants arrive? Where they a spore first then a seed. Even Algae requires tiny spores. I am just trying to figure out what happened in the plant world.

 

[KenEOTE]

"micro evolutions" (IDers term) occured.

Actually this term was around before "IDers"

This is just so damn ignorant I can't believe it. You ask for answers to your question. You're given the answers but you refuse to read them. That's just "dumb on purpose" as Kent Hovind used to say.

Once again Geth you have proven my point that "Evolutionist and Atheists " seem to have no room for humor. This proves how Ignorant you must be that I would be serious about something like that. Maybe one day your humor gland will evolve.

As Paterson said in a letter written right before his death:

Evolutionist have no sense of Humor, and it saddens me, so much so that I am going to die from it.

He died moments later

 

[KenEOTE]

Evolution is driven by natural selection.

So Nature does it. Then Nature is your god? Cause Nature controls all things and keeps things moving in the right order.

 

[Geth]

Ok - since you're so interested in plants I got the perfect website for you:
http://curriculum.calstatela.edu/course ... Vles8.html

If you start with the first point you should understand how plants developed on land.

Off-Topic:
This site is brilliant. It's worth spending some time browsing through it. Go for it .

Greetings
Geth

 

[lordkalvan]

Lets not forget of all the fossil evideance that shows that plants never evolved at all :

What exactly are you referring to?

I confess myself a luttle puzzled as well. Wiki has a detailed article on plant evolution at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolutionary_history_of_plants, which includes several references to fossil evidence. Google Scholar returns over 87,000 references for the search terms plant evolution fossil.

 

[Geth]

Well some people see nature as a godly, i.e. one of the most brilliant minds ever, Albert Einstein.
But that has nothing to do with the term of a religious god. Natur can be observed directly, measured, explored and explained by scientific theories wich can't be done with a supernatural beeing.

Once again Geth you have proven my point that "Evolutionist and Atheists " seem to have no room for humor. This proves how Ignorant you must be that I would be serious about something like that. Maybe one day your humor gland will evolve.

First of all I haven't seen any post of you stating Atheists have no humor. Secondly I am a very humorous person. I love to make jokes and laugh. In my opinion you're post had no indicator to be meant as a joke. And even if it would I just don't think it's funny to play stupid. I have seen many creationists/ IDers realy that are really that ignorant.

Greetings
Geth

 

[Snidey]

Once again Geth you have proven my point that "Evolutionist and Atheists " seem to have no room for humor. This proves how Ignorant you must be that I would be serious about something like that. Maybe one day your humor gland will evolve.

As Paterson said in a letter written right before his death:

Evolutionist have no sense of Humor, and it saddens me, so much so that I am going to die from it.

He died moments later

Remarkably, I actually did get your humor (and very much enjoy any swipe at Bob, the local intellectual punching bag). It's still annoying. This is mainly because when you can't address a point, like the fact that I showed you several examples of our working knowledge on the evolution of photosynthesis, you just dodge with a joke.