Exceptional cases

[PrimFinallyFoundGod!]

What do you think God does in exceptional cases either in your personal opinion or what the bible says on it?

Stillborn, miscarriage, infant deaths

People who were murdered, meaning died not on God's timing and therefore didn't have the time to find God (especially children/teens murdered who were not raised religious or exposed to it)

Brainwashed individuals eg being born and raised in a cult, manipulated into following Satanism unknowingly (popular modern media condoning abortion, promiscuity, drugs, the attempted destruction of gender and influencing our children and school learning material)

People who died whilst they were in the process of conversion eg had begun to believe in God but hadn't been baptized yet

People who lived completely without worshipping God but prayed to him accepting him and asking for forgiveness on their death beds.

People who believe but cannot worship in a conventional way due to circumstances eg Christian living in an Islamic state etc

Christians who still sin such as gay Christians, addicts, lustful etc... 1. those who repent but still sin and 2. those who don't repent because they've been baptised and worship God so they believe they're instantly forgiven now.

There's probably tons of other examples but those are just what I could come up with

 

[WIP]

What do you think God does in exceptional cases either in your personal opinion or what the bible says on it?

Stillborn, miscarriage, infant deaths

People who were murdered, meaning died not on God's timing and therefore didn't have the time to find God (especially children/teens murdered who were not raised religious or exposed to it)

Brainwashed individuals eg being born and raised in a cult, manipulated into following Satanism unknowingly (popular modern media condoning abortion, promiscuity, drugs, the attempted destruction of gender and influencing our children and school learning material)

People who died whilst they were in the process of conversion eg had begun to believe in God but hadn't been baptized yet

People who lived completely without worshipping God but prayed to him accepting him and asking for forgiveness on their death beds.

People who believe but cannot worship in a conventional way due to circumstances eg Christian living in an Islamic state etc

Christians who still sin such as gay Christians, addicts, lustful etc... 1. those who repent but still sin and 2. those who don't repent because they've been baptised and worship God so they believe they're instantly forgiven now.

There's probably tons of other examples but those are just what I could come up with

I leave those up to God. Who am I to judge Him?

 

[Hidden In Him]

Stillborn, miscarriage, infant deaths

People who were murdered, meaning died not on God's timing and therefore didn't have the time to find God (especially children/teens murdered who were not raised religious or exposed to it)

Brainwashed individuals eg being born and raised in a cult, manipulated into following Satanism unknowingly (popular modern media condoning abortion, promiscuity, drugs, the attempted destruction of gender and influencing our children and school learning material)

People who died whilst they were in the process of conversion eg had begun to believe in God but hadn't been baptized yet

People who lived completely without worshipping God but prayed to him accepting him and asking for forgiveness on their death beds.

People who believe but cannot worship in a conventional way due to circumstances eg Christian living in an Islamic state etc

Christians who still sin such as gay Christians, addicts, lustful etc... 1. those who repent but still sin and 2. those who don't repent because they've been baptised and worship God so they believe they're instantly forgiven now.

I don't have six months to answer all this, Lol.

Try narrowing it down when you start a thread, sister. This is like the kid at that learning stage where they completely wear you out with the question "why?" so many times that you want them to go find a sandbox to play in somewhere.

 

[WIP]

Sometimes I think we ask "Why" because we want to put God in our own box. Then, if we don't get the answer WE want, we rebel against God because He is "unfair." In my view, ours is not to ask why but rather seek God for "in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to His purpose." Romans 8:28 NKJV

We shouldn't burden ourselves with asking why but just trust God and leave it in His hands.

Just my .

 

[Hidden In Him]

Sometimes I think we ask "Why" because we want to put God in our own box. Then, if we don't get the answer WE want, we rebel against God because He is "unfair." In my view, ours is not to ask why but rather seek God for "in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to His purpose." Romans 8:28 NKJV

We shouldn't burden ourselves with asking why but just trust God and leave it in His hands.

Just my .

WIP, I think this question is answered differently by different saints, depending on their gifts and their calling. For those operating in gifts like exorcism or helps or healing or works of power, there may be no great desire or need for answering every conceivable question under the sun. They simply trust God, which is first and foremost what we are called to do in Christ.

For those called to apologetics or any of the teaching ministries, however, they have a gift for sorting through complex issues and making them simple, and coming up with sound refutations to every argument that exalts itself against the knowledge of God. There are many like Prim who have curiosities, maybe not about everything, but about certain things, and this is when those called to teach can alleviate doubts. In this, they serve some of their greatest purposes, by increasing the faith of those seeking to believe in the God of Love.

 

[PrimFinallyFoundGod!]

Well I understand it is a big question. I'm mostly asking because it is one of the go-to questions non-believers ask, so I was interested to see what others think.

I didn't really mean answer every example I gave lol

I was giving examples to show that there are "exceptional circumstances"

Any of these type of examples atheists and agnostics use as a reason not to believe

 

[PrimFinallyFoundGod!]

I already have my own answer for it I just wanted to see how others feel about the topic. You must of been asked this by non-believers very often. What about X situation?

 

[Riven]

To help narrow it down, what about the billions of Muslims in the world? What happens to them?

 

[WIP]

Well I understand it is a big question. I'm mostly asking because it is one of the go-to questions non-believers ask, so I was interested to see what others think.

I didn't really mean answer every example I gave lol

I was giving examples to show that there are "exceptional circumstances"

Any of these type of examples atheists and agnostics use as a reason not to believe

Even if you are able to answer those questions, it will not "make" them believe. The best any of us can do is to share the gospel of Christ with those around us and then be ready to give a defense for the hope that is in us. (1 Peter 3:15)

 

[Fastfredy0]

Stillborn, miscarriage, infant deaths

Generally, people think they go to heaven. Scripture is in explicit on the subject. We conceived in sin so not like being sinless is an excuse.

People who were murdered, meaning died not on God's timing and therefore didn't have the time to find God (especially children/teens murdered who were not raised religious or exposed to it)

Two theories... one is FREE WILL where the FREE WILL of the murderer cancels the potential FREE WILL of the person murdered .... and the other that the person was not a chosen lamb of God so the murder doesn't matter in regards to eternal destiny.

Brainwashed individuals eg being born and raised in a cult, manipulated into following Satanism unknowingly (popular modern media condoning abortion, promiscuity, drugs, the attempted destruction of gender and influencing our children and school learning material)

Same as previous answer.

People who died whilst they were in the process of conversion eg had begun to believe in God but hadn't been baptized yet

Hmmm... conversion is instanteous, though a person may not recognize the moment he is born again ... otherwise, same as previous answer.

People who lived completely without worshipping God but prayed to him accepting him and asking for forgiveness on their death beds.

They made it by the skin of their teeth... Example: Thief on the cross.

People who believe but cannot worship in a conventional way due to circumstances eg Christian living in an Islamic state etc

Belief saves you, not what you do. Aside: what you do is an indication of belief, but your question stipulates the person believed.

Christians who still sin such as gay Christians, addicts, lustful etc... 1. those who repent but still sin and 2. those who don't repent because they've been baptised and worship God so they believe they're instantly forgiven now.

Invalid premise. There is no such thing as a 'gay' or 'drug addict' Christian per 1 Cor. 6:9. Now, if the person stopped these things and believes he's in (adopted, born again) ...

Go to gotquestions.org ...they have good answers to most questions

 

[Hidden In Him]

Well I understand it is a big question. I'm mostly asking because it is one of the go-to questions non-believers ask, so I was interested to see what others think.

Any of these type of examples atheists and agnostics use as a reason not to believe

I would agree with WIP here.

If you are asking for your own sake that's one thing, but if you are wanting to know how to respond to atheists and agnostics, I hate to dampen your enthusiasm but the likelihood is that they wouldn't actually be "asking" you anyway. They will be looking to refute you, and in such cases it is best to remember that attempting to "talk" them into believing is going to be futile. This is not how Christianity turned the world upside down. Christianity is not a philosophy. It conquered the Roman world because it is and always has been a religion of supernatural power. We don't operate in as much of it today primarily because of bad teaching, but the time is coming when greater works will be done than were done during New Testament times.

Until that time, unless you have prophetic insight that someone you are talking to is specifically being called by God, or they are showing clear signs of being receptive to the truth, I wouldn't waste much time trying to convince them of anything.

Pray for them? Yes. Spend time or energy trying to convince them by mere words only? No.

 

[for_his_glory]

We always ask God the "why" and "what" kind of questions, but yet disregard what God has already given us in His word that answers our questions. Babies whether they are still born, aborted or before they come to the age of knowing the difference between good and evil, IMO, are innocent in the eyes of God. Let God be God in all His righteous judgements as He knows our beginning and ending and for us we just need to be about our Fathers business taking the Gospel message out into the world.

 

[PrimFinallyFoundGod!]

I would agree with WIP here.

If you are asking for your own sake that's one thing, but if you are wanting to know how to respond to atheists and agnostics, I hate to dampen your enthusiasm but the likelihood is that they wouldn't actually be "asking" you anyway. They will be looking to refute you, and in such cases it is best to remember that attempting to "talk" them into believing is going to be futile. This is not how Christianity turned the world upside down. Christianity is not a philosophy. It conquered the Roman world because it is and always has been a religion of supernatural power. We don't operate in as much of it today primarily because of bad teaching, but the time is coming when greater works will be done than were done during New Testament times.

Until that time, unless you have prophetic insight that someone you are talking to is specifically being called by God, or they are showing clear signs of being receptive to the truth, I wouldn't waste much time trying to convince them of anything.

Pray for them? Yes. Spend time or energy trying to convince them by mere words only? No.

I avoid direct interaction with athiests. I'm mostly exposed to them when they infiltrate Christian spaces just to be hateful and make sure we all know that they think we are beneath them. I've seen some try coming on here before, and very often in the comment spaces of Christian spaces like youtube channels etc. I don't reply directly because they're very angry people with an agenda. I'm just a curious person, there wasn't much deep to my post lol

 

[PrimFinallyFoundGod!]

Generally, people think they go to heaven. Scripture is in explicit on the subject. We conceived in sin so not like being sinless is an excuse.



Two theories... one is FREE WILL where the FREE WILL of the murderer cancels the potential FREE WILL of the person murdered .... and the other that the person was not a chosen lamb of God so the murder doesn't matter in regards to eternal destiny.



Same as previous answer.



Hmmm... conversion is instanteous, though a person may not recognize the moment he is born again ... otherwise, same as previous answer.



They made it by the skin of their teeth... Example: Thief on the cross.



Belief saves you, not what you do. Aside: what you do is an indication of belief, but your question stipulates the person believed.





Invalid premise. There is no such thing as a 'gay' or 'drug addict' Christian per 1 Cor. 6:9. Now, if the person stopped these things and believes he's in (adopted, born again) ...

Go to gotquestions.org ...they have good answers to most questions

Very insightful thought-provoking responses, thank you very much
Personally I hold the same views on most of those.
Thanks for sharing

 

[PrimFinallyFoundGod!]

To help narrow it down, what about the billions of Muslims in the world? What happens to them?

That would be another example I suppose
I have not so popular opinions on that myself lol, virtually all of my asian side family are Muslim

 

[Riven]

That would be another example I suppose
I have not so popular opinions on that myself lol, virtually all of my asian side family are Muslim

What do you think, Prim?

 

[Hidden In Him]

I avoid direct interaction with athiests. I'm mostly exposed to them when they infiltrate Christian spaces just to be hateful and make sure we all know that they think we are beneath them.

LoL.

I don't reply directly because they're very angry people with an agenda.

Not all of them. Some are fairly good-hearted, intellectuals who don't really have an ax to grind but have simply accepted atheism for lack of anything substantial to prove otherwise.

 

[WIP]

I avoid direct interaction with athiests. I'm mostly exposed to them when they infiltrate Christian spaces just to be hateful and make sure we all know that they think we are beneath them. I've seen some try coming on here before, and very often in the comment spaces of Christian spaces like youtube channels etc. I don't reply directly because they're very angry people with an agenda. I'm just a curious person, there wasn't much deep to my post lol

I try not to paint any one group with a broad brush for that is prejudice at its core but rather give others a benefit of doubt. I've been around on this earth for over 64 years and here on CFnet for over 12 years and during most of that time I have also served on our staff. I can tell you that not all unbelievers are here to cause strife and chaos, even when their initial contact sounds like it. Most of the time, the hostility is not with us believers but rather with God for that is who they are in rebellion against. Our task is to "sanctify the Lord God in (our) hearts, and always be ready to give a defense to everyone who asks (us) a reason for the hope that is in (us), with meekness and fear;" (1 Peter 3:15 NKJV)

In fact, unbelievers are the ones we are called to interact with. Jesus said, "Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.”
Matthew 28:19-20 NKJV

 

[Blade]

What do you think God does in exceptional cases either in your personal opinion or what the bible says on it?

Stillborn, miscarriage, infant deaths

People who were murdered, meaning died not on God's timing and therefore didn't have the time to find God (especially children/teens murdered who were not raised religious or exposed to it)

Brainwashed individuals eg being born and raised in a cult, manipulated into following Satanism unknowingly (popular modern media condoning abortion, promiscuity, drugs, the attempted destruction of gender and influencing our children and school learning material)

People who died whilst they were in the process of conversion eg had begun to believe in God but hadn't been baptized yet

People who lived completely without worshipping God but prayed to him accepting him and asking for forgiveness on their death beds.

People who believe but cannot worship in a conventional way due to circumstances eg Christian living in an Islamic state etc

Christians who still sin such as gay Christians, addicts, lustful etc... 1. those who repent but still sin and 2. those who don't repent because they've been baptised and worship God so they believe they're instantly forgiven now.

There's probably tons of other examples but those are just what I could come up with

I like what Christ said.. I know to whom He was talking yet its truth. He said if you were bind you would have no sin. You say you see your sin remains. So easy to be found saved very hard to be lost. Most are blind. If someone always sinning can simply say "remember me" thats it your with me today in paradise. I heard a story of someone that said they went to heaven. Now I take this with a grain of salt. He said he saw this very young boy from India in heaven. Here on earth he never heard of Christ but saw somethings in this earth and wanted the one that created all of it there is only ONE that did it.

Again I know how it was written yet its still HIs word so anyone that calls on the name of the lord shall be saved.

 

[miamited]

Hi PrimFinallyFoundGod!

I'm not one to believe that there are many ways to go to God. Therefore, I'm one who believes that unless someone makes a true confession of Jesus as Lord and then strives to live as he lived, they will not be with those who receive God's eternal life with Him.

Yes, that means that aborted babies, newborn babies, and pretty much everyone else on your list, won't be with the saints. The death bed confession will have to be left up to God. Only He knows one's heart's intention. I'm not sure there are any 'exceptional' cases. Either one has professed faith in the Lord...or they haven't.

For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved.

It is with your mouth that you profess your faith and are saved.

God bless,
Ted