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Fantasy is Fantasy is Fantasy

E

Eskarina

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Fantasy is Fantasy, is Fantasy. There's not point in denying it. It is what it is, allegorical or not. Since this is the undeniable case, at least that is how I see it, why is Harry Potter considered "evil" by much of Christian society when the Chronicles of Narnia are not?
 
...why is Harry Potter considered "evil" by much of Christian society when the Chronicles of Narnia are not?
I consider them the same but my opinion doesn't mean much :)
I haven't and won't see any of them.
 
Eskarina said:
Fantasy is Fantasy, is Fantasy. There's not point in denying it. It is what it is, allegorical or not. Since this is the undeniable case, at least that is how I see it, why is Harry Potter considered "evil" by much of Christian society when the Chronicles of Narnia are not?
Because prominent t.v. evangelists said so!

You are right on the money. It is a movie. The Wizard of Oz was a grand film and I don't think it destroyed anyone either.


I personally have not seen the HP movies. I am probably a little too old for them. But I have seen Narnia since I am so familiar with them from my childhood and it was fantastic. Maybe I will have to check out the HP movies and be a kid again for a while.
 
I am not a fan of allegory myself, but I think the argument can be made that in The Chronicles, the witch, and witchcraft, are properly (meaning according to Scripture) depicted as evil. It is when we glorify things that are called evil by God that we error. (I personally belive that this is exactly what the deceiver wants from the world, and christians) I am not saying that good morals can not be extracted from these stories, and that they are somehow completely void of merit, but rather when such an obvious error is subtly being included in a 'harmless' story, we are giving our children the impression that these things are not evil, or dangerous (even familiarizing them to be comfortable with this sin), and essentially giving satan a strong foothold in his deception. I believe at this point the error far outweighs the moral merit that might be present. It is up to individual parents to have discernment about these things. (I mean which movies or books do or do not contain this error) It is my preference that my children stick with true stories, but I also realize that strong truth can be depicted in an allegory...such as The Pilgrim's Progress. I know believers who do not prefer Lewis's Chronicles, and I do not judge them, nor do I judge those who do use them. As far as T.V. evangelists, (I had to giggle at Lyric here) I think we need to attend them with the same extreme discernment that we do Harry Potter. lol The Lord bless all of you today.
 
TYes, But anyone knows that witchcraft isn't real. Displaying it, regardless, shouldn't matter. We can prove it is not possible, So depicting fiction shouldn't matter. Same as "Lord of the rings" or "starwars"

Also, if you still stick that it is depicitng something the bible forbids, than wouldnt having an actor play the role of Jesus in Mel Gibson's movie, be worshipping a false idol, EVEN though we all know it is a movie, and they aren't actually doing it.
 
Read up everybody. Lovely put it all in perspective. Thanks sister. :-D

... Also, if you still stick that it is depicitng something the bible forbids, than wouldnt having an actor play the role of Jesus in Mel Gibson's movie, be worshipping a false idol,...
Er... No. 8-)
 
Some of my favorite movies as a child were:

The Neverending Story
Wizard of Oz
all the "magical" Disney movies
Ghostbusters
ET

I also enjoyed the first HP movie. I couldn't get into the others as much. Children have an imagination. I don't think that letting my kids watch a "magical" movie is going to harm them. It didn't harm me or anyone else that I know. I think some people take this stuff a bit too far.
 
^ agreed ^

also.. if you dont expose kids to things when they are young, as fiction, whats going to happen when they grow up?
 
I'm really happy with the responses I'm gettign here. I'm very used to a negative condemning tone when it comes to movies and books like Harry Potter and Lord of the Rings, as well a hipocritically positive view of the Chronicles.

Oh, by the way, in case it wasn't obvious, I'm a big fan of fantasy books, movies, role-playing games, video games (though I suck at them), and all that jazz.

Lovely, I can see your views on Harry Potter being reasonably justifiable, but the Chronicles of Narnia go beyond the close allegory of The Lion the Witch and the Wardrobe. The witch in that book is evil, but she is not evil because she practices magic. She is evil in he heart and her very nature. Magic is just her tool, so to speak. The Pevensie children make use of magical items (A horn that calls aid to whomever blows it, an ointment that cures any wound or affliction, etc). The animals throughout the book are all anthropomophic talking animals. In the later books a couple of the children read/cast a spell to remove a curse of invisibilty from a group of strange one-legged people. I could list more, but I doubt that's necessary.

My point is that I remain unconvinced that the church should differentiate between one fantasy and another.
 
Vic said:
... Also, if you still stick that it is depicitng something the bible forbids, than wouldnt having an actor play the role of Jesus in Mel Gibson's movie, be worshipping a false idol,...
Er... No. 8-)
I wouldn't label it with such a simple no. It is, of course, silly to say that having an actor depict Jesus is idol worship, but it is still falls close to the silly line drawn in the sand as to what is sacreligious and what is not.

My previous church, for example, backed me up, or was ambivalent, when I wanted to be part of the Shakespearean play, As You Like It. There was no complaint about the fact that my character would have been a member of a polythiestic religion, and would be cross-dressing for most of the play, and would be married to her lover by the god of marriage, Hymen, from Greek mythology. They take issue however, with the fact that I play Dungeons & Dragons*.

*Dungeons & Dragons is a role-playing game in which you take on the roles of characters in a story led/made-up by another player (the DM, or Dungeon Master). Everything is run on rules, paper, dice roles, and imagination. You just sit around a table and talk.
 
Oh, by the way, in case it wasn't obvious, I'm a big fan of fantasy books, movies, role-playing games, video games (though I suck at them), and all that jazz.

Hey do you know of Warhammer Fantasy by Gamesworkshop?

I am working on a Wood Elf Army right now.....

Painting takes a lot of time!

You are correct that if you are going to condemn Potter, you have to throw out old Narinia and LOTR as well.....

I have been asking this question for years....
 
Soma-Sight said:
Oh, by the way, in case it wasn't obvious, I'm a big fan of fantasy books, movies, role-playing games, video games (though I suck at them), and all that jazz.

Hey do you know of Warhammer Fantasy by Gamesworkshop?

I am working on a Wood Elf Army right now.....

Painting takes a lot of time!

You are correct that if you are going to condemn Potter, you have to throw out old Narinia and LOTR as well.....

I have been asking this question for years....

I know of the Warhammar stuff and have friends who are into it, but I've not been involved. I'm a classic Dungeons & Dragons girl.
 
I think that if you are well grounded in your Christian walk the Wizard OF Oz is ok to view, I love that movie, and I am a big Dracula movie fan and in those movies it is always good versing evil. but for some reason I don't want to see Harry Potter. But I love horror flicks to the max. And it does nothing to my Christianity at all, because I know that it is just a movie, but some things in those movies are real in the evil realm. But hey you see evil everyday. And I am going to buy me a copy of the Wizard Of Oz, was going to do it a few months ago, but they wanted to much. Why do I want it, because it is fun to watch, and it takes me back to my childhood. And the movie is harmless, my wife and I watched Alien vs Predator the other week, do you really think that can harm my Christian walk. But there are movies that we should not view. And that is porno movies, and movies with a bunch of cussing. But my Dracula movies does nothing to me at all.
 
Lewis W said:
I think that if you are well grounded in your Christian walk the Wizard OF Oz is ok to view, I love that movie, and I am a big Dracula movie fan and in those movies it is always good versing evil. but for some reason I don't want to see Harry Potter. But I love horror flicks to the max. And it does nothing to my Christianity at all, because I know that it is just a movie, but some things in those movies are real in the evil realm. But hey you see evil everyday. And I am going to buy me a copy of the Wizard Of Oz, was going to do it a few months ago, but they wanted to much. Why do I want it, because it is fun to watch, and it takes me back to my childhood. And the movie is harmless, my wife and I watched Alien vs Predator the other week, do you really think that can harm my Christian walk. But there are movies that we should not view. And that is porno movies, and movies with a bunch of cussing. But my Dracula movies does nothing to me at all.

Hehe, I watched Alien vs. Predator. It was funny. Totally a buddy cop movie. I don't like gory horror, or gratuitous nudity, or unnecessarilly poor language, etc.

I don't see Harry Potter as depicting anything "real". "Real" witches aren't people who are born with magical powers a la HP. They're people involved in a religion that believes in magic-like power granted through prayer-like rituals. It often invokes spirits or essences or the divine. That, however, is beside the point. The point is that the magic of HP is pretend. Just as pretend as the talking vegetables of Veggie Tales.
 
Eskarina said:
The point is that the magic of HP is pretend. Just as pretend as the talking vegetables of Veggie Tales.
HEY!!!! Bob and Larry are REAL!! :evil:
 
Eskarina said:
The point is that the magic of HP is pretend. Just as pretend as the talking vegetables of Veggie Tales.

Indeed. It's a harmless flight of fancy. Magic as depicted in some movies can be problematic for young children - I'm thinking of things like "The Craft", where the execution of magic requires dark rituals, or other things that attempt to accurately portray the occult. But then, these movies aren't aimed at children, anyway.

As long as parents tell their kids that this is fantasy, and that magic doesn't exist, there's no harm that can be done. And if the children want to run around and pretend that they're flying on broomsticks and fighting dragons? Awesome, let them. Imagination is a wonderful thing, and this exercise of their creativity is so far removed from the realities of the real occult that nothing bad can come of it.

Me, I can't wait until the 7th book comes out, and I highly recommend that anyone who enjoys bouts of fancy read these books. They're well written, and just plain fun. Or see the movies if you must, but the books are better.
 
Lyric's Dad said:
Eskarina said:
The point is that the magic of HP is pretend. Just as pretend as the talking vegetables of Veggie Tales.
HEY!!!! Bob and Larry are REAL!! :evil:
:smt045 Of course they are...
 
ArtGuy said:
[...]I highly recommend that anyone who enjoys bouts of fancy read these books. They're well written, and just plain fun. Or see the movies if you must, but the books are better.
Oh, the books are better by far!
 
Peace, I understand your perspective on the witchcraft issue, but I think this is because you are an unbeliver. Put yourself in the shoes of a believer, and ask yourself what you would do. If you are a believer, and you believe the Word of God, then does that alone not dictate that your desire would be to represent your beliefs with integrity by living them with your life? I think an argument can be made that if you are a believer, and if God says that witchcraft, and the like, is an abomination, then why glorify it, or familiarize yourself, or your children, with it at all in way of recreation, or imaginary play, respectively? God does not say it is harmless if in the form of a children's movie because it is entertaining, and watered down with good moral lessons. As far as Gibson's movie, I think an argument CAN be made for not having this 'image' of Christ, but I know that generally speaking most Christians do not consider this an image of worship unless they are worshipping the movie, or the actor. I think the key element here is the individual, honest, discernment of the beliver, or the family of believers, based on the Word of God, and the heart motive to sincerely please God.

A few here have listed the movies that they enjoy, and I do not prefer any of them, to be honest. I do not prefer fantasy, too much at all. That doesn't make me a legalist, or judgemental, as some may think. I do not judge others for their decision to allow these things, and I do not think that they are somehow more Christian, or less, because of it. I certainly do not believe that NOT exposing my children to these things is going to harm them. I do not feel I take it too far (that would imply that is has something to do with me trying to elevate myself), and I am not sure by whom's standards that would even be measured for any believer, and for any issue, other that God who is the judge of the hearts of men. I am who I am in the Lord by His doing, and it is a blessing to me, not a burden, even if I happen to fall into Nikki's "some people take this stuff a bit too far" category.

Eskarina, I have no views on Harry Potter, or on Narnia, other than I simply do not prefer them in general, and that the witchcraft is a red flag for me. I am not defending either of them, personally, but I was merely throwing out an argument (used by some believers) that I believe is justifiable, and is sensible to apply here. I would not use it, because I do not prefer either of them based on the witchcraft factor alone. I do enjoy some other of Lewis's works, however. I mentioned Pilgrim's Progress, and I believe that the truths that are depicted in this work, as with Holy War far outweigh my own lack of enthusiasim for fantasy, or allegory, so I do enjoy them completely, and allow my children to as well. The Lord bless you all.
 
I don't know how much to read into your tone there Lovely, but it seemed a little restrained. I hope I didn't offend you. I respect your opinions and, from what I can tell, you aren't "taking it too far". People do what they think is right, hopefully in accordance with scripture, to raise their children and when the children are old enough to make their own choices then they can choose. Hopefully they will remember the values instilled in them as children and it will guide their lives.
 
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