Grace at the expense of obedience?

[Grazer]

Do you think we've become so used to the concept of God's forgiveness and mercy that we've forgotten what it means to be obedient?

Interesting question. I think it's completely possible yes

 

[Slider]

If by the question you mean we can lean too much on grace that we forget God altogether, I can see that happening. Grace covers all sins of the flesh so we don't have to worry about "walking right" in the flesh. What that allows is more time to praise Him, worship him, pray, learn about Him, assemble together, give to God,meditate on his Word and love the brethren.

We must keep in mind that grace comes by faith. Faith comes only one way listed in the Bible (that I know of) and that's through hearing his Word. So if you don't hear his word (and it does say, "how can you hear without a preacher"?), you won't have faith, and if you don't have faith, you won't have grace. So we can't forget where that grace came from or we will lose it, or perhaps we never had it to begin with.

If you get to leaning on grace too much, people will look down on you. If you forget where that grace came from, God won't be looking at you at all!

You did use the term "obedient"... If by that you mean we must follow laws we were freed from, I'd disagree. If we are on the same page that we must never lose focus of Jesus Christ (and I mean that in an active sense, not just flippantly saying, Oh yea... God's first in my life!, then I'd agree with you... And yes, the spiritual life is bound to spill over into your fleshly life. It's just not a mark of faith like many believe.

Now, excuse me while I head for cover!

 

[Mitspa]

Real Grace is the Spirit of Grace! It empowers obedience!
No man has any obedience apart from grace and its power.

For sin will not have dominion over you because you are not under law but under grace. The flesh loves to think it is obeys God, and follows the rules. Look at the pharisees!

Paul said that he labored more abundantly than all! By the grace of God that was with him. Real grace, biblical grace is the Spirit that empowers us over the weaknesses of our flesh.

When one has been empowered by grace, they know that the things and the service they do for God, is not of themselves.

There is no room for boasting in their works, its all Gods grace and that given freely.

If a "christian" finds themselves lacking in good works? The reason is that they have forgotten the Grace of God and are trying to work for God by the flesh.

Many have not because they ask not! God will not give His Grace to labor, so we can get puffed up by religious works.

No! First go learn grace where no one will pat you on the back, and then God will bring your works of grace into the open where others may learn about GRACE! not religious or dead works.

 

[Mitspa]

I think this is a real danger that we should be mindful of always. My friend is so hung up on Romans 8 that he acts like he doesn't need to obey. I'm not sure how to approach it with him because he's easily offended and I could drive him away altogether.

obey what? dead works? or the life of the Spirit within him?
Because thats what Romans 8 is!

Life and love in the Spirit! How can anyone be offended at that? I get very offended when some attempt to point me back to the dead works of law and religion. But I rejoice and grow strong with the brother who helps me to draw out the life that is in me!

As Paul told Timothy, one must first partake of that which he would teach to others. If you live in Romans 8 ? You should know how to bring that truth out of your brother? Or it could be that he needs to be offended? If he is using the liberty of the gospel to justify his carnal lust?

 

[Carolyn]

Amen! The greek word for grace is the same as the word that discibes the gifts of the Spirit. They are grace gifts. God works through grace..
And, edward, you are right on about your friend.

 

[Dustoftheearth]

Real Grace is the Spirit of Grace! It empowers obedience!
No man has any obedience apart from grace and its power.

For sin will not have dominion over you because you are not under law but under grace. The flesh loves to think it is obeys God, and follows the rules. Look at the pharisees!

Paul said that he labored more abundantly than all! By the grace of God that was with him. Real grace, biblical grace is the Spirit that empowers us over the weaknesses of our flesh.

When one has been empowered by grace, they know that the things and the service they do for God, is not of themselves.

There is no room for boasting in their works, its all Gods grace and that given freely.

If a "christian" finds themselves lacking in good works? The reason is that they have forgotten the Grace of God and are trying to work for God by the flesh.

Many have not because they ask not! God will not give His Grace to labor, so we can get puffed up by religious works.

No! First go learn grace where no one will pat you on the back, and then God will bring your works of grace into the open where others may learn about GRACE! not religious or dead works.

^^^^^ This ^^^^^

Good post!

Let us also remember that God gives grace to the humble, but He resists the proud.

 

[Mitspa]

He is not following the spirit but holds Romans 8 to mean that he is released from the old law and has impunity to sin without conscience. He is using the liberty of the Gospel to justify sinning. Perhaps he does need to be offended.

I dont think some understand that we are under the law of Christ? That we will answer to Him for what He has given.

Paul gives us very good examples of how to deal with those who have the Spirit and refuse to live according to that which Christ Has given to them. Even to rejecting the fellowship of those who walk contrary to the turth. Save some by fear! So if one is walking in death and the flesh, we have many warnings for that kind of so-called faith. God will back up your warnings if you are walking in love of the spirit.

Love has a rod, just like dad and mom.

What we never see is Paul putting folks back under the yoke of Law. Now we can use the law as an example of how God sees all disobedience and rebellion. So it can be a fine line that the Holy Spirit must help us to help our brothers.

May God give you wisdom to help, or even to walk away and break fellowship for A season.

 

[Mitspa]

That's god advice Mitspa, thank you.

Will you pray for my friend for me also? Thanks.
He is a good man and has helped me and now he needs help.

I am in agreement with you. Father grant Edward wisdom to help his brother, in Jesus name Amen and so be it!

 

[Mitspa]

Grazer, In the first few chapters of Romans Paul addresses our need for grace and then expounds upon just what God's grace is. Then he says in 6:1-2a, "What shall we say, then? Shall we go on sinning so that grace may increase? By no means!" Paul goes on to explain that through Christ we died to sin and through Christ's reurrection we are alive to God and slaves of righteousness. In Ro 6:15, again he reiterates, "What then? Shall we sin beause we are not under the law but under grace? By no means." Paul does a pretty lengthy and maybe a little hard to fully grasp for a newer convert explanation but this chapeter 6 0f Ro should clear up where God is on your querry.

I agree. and how did you get a picture of my mother-in-law?
Lol!

 

[farouk]

Do you think we've become so used to the concept of God's forgiveness and mercy that we've forgotten what it means to be obedient?

Interesting question. I think it's completely possible yes

In Philippians 2, the Lord Jesus is recorded as being obedient unto death, even the death of the Cross.

So truly receiving forgiveness through faith in Christ's work at the Cross presupposes a conviction of one's own sin from the penalty and power of which He came to redeem His people.

Our obedience to Him is both in the light of our need having been fulfilled, but now also in the light of our eternal gratitude to the Savior.

Blessings.