Holy Spirit groanings, what do they sound like?

[Dave Slayer]

May I please have some thoughts on the following video? Thanks and God Bless!

[youtube:2nnugezx]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GMCMfZXdPrY[/youtube:2nnugezx]

 

[cyberjosh]

Unutterable - Romans 8:26.

Why do you continue to watch videos like this if you do not agree with them? At some point that has to become spiritually unhealthy and unbeneficial to continue watching unbiblical teachings and actions. We do not grow stronger by looking at falsehood, but by looking at the truth. And Christ is the truth, as is His word.

God Bless,

~Josh

 

[Dave Slayer]

Unutterable - Romans 8:26.

Why do you continue to watch videos like this if you do not agree with them? At some point that has to become spiritually unhealthy and unbeneficial to continue watching unbiblical teachings and actions. We do not grow stronger by looking at falsehood, but by looking at the truth. And Christ is the truth, as is His word.

God Bless,

~Josh

I agree. I post these videos to challege anyone who holds to these beliefs. I agree they are un-utterable as Romans 8:26 says. However, many of those who utter the groanings use that verse to support their expierences, even though the verse teaches the entire opposite. Why does it happen?

 

[cyberjosh]

I agree. I post these videos to challege anyone who holds to these beliefs. I agree they are un-utterable as Romans 8:26 says. However, many of those who utter the groanings use that verse to support their expierences, even though the verse teaches the entire opposite. Why does it happen?

I would say that it happens when people want to base their beliefs primarily upon their experiences rather than on proper doctrine, and as a consequence inevitably human experience can be mislead and wrong conclusions are reached. Often once one's mind is set on a particular interpretation the Scriptures will be selected and crafted to suit the understanding of the person. The truly honest person would open their Bible not to read into it but rather to allow it to open you, with an effectiveness greater than a double-edged sword, and teach you the truth through the working of the Spirit as you pray over it. Honest seeking, like the Bereans, is the first step to correctly dividing the word of God.

God Bless,

~Josh

 

[Aurora]

It sounds like a lie, to me.
Never in the word of God does the Holy Spirit make one out of control.

The only time in the Bible two were slain in the spirit was,
when they lied ,and they carried them out and buried them.

I do not believe this is of God.

 

[whirlwind]

I agree. I post these videos to challege anyone who holds to these beliefs. I agree they are un-utterable as Romans 8:26 says. However, many of those who utter the groanings use that verse to support their expierences, even though the verse teaches the entire opposite. Why does it happen?

I would say that it happens when people want to base their beliefs primarily upon their experiences rather than on proper doctrine, and as a consequence inevitably human experience can be mislead and wrong conclusions are reached. Often once one's mind is set on a particular interpretation the Scriptures will be selected and crafted to suit the understanding of the person. The truly honest person would open their Bible not to read into it but rather to allow it to open you, with an effectiveness greater than a double-edged sword, and teach you the truth through the working of the Spirit as you pray over it. Honest seeking, like the Bereans, is the first step to correctly dividing the word of God.

God Bless,

~Josh

Then do you believe all those folks are just "putting on a show?" I shake my head when I see it and yet I think...how can so many be so :crazy . Is it that I'm not getting it? Is it just that it is "different strokes for different folks?" It truly puzzles me.

 

[Aurora]

I would venture to say it is a counterfeit of the real.
Satan is only a mimicker, and does his best to deceive people , and it
seems he does a fairly good job.
We need to be in the word more, and not depend on feelings, and experience alone.
Then when we do have an experience, make sure it checks out with scripture.

God is the same, yesterday today and forever.

 

[turnorburn]

I call foul Dave, its this way Dave, Jesus said all manner of sin is forgivable save one.
""Blaspheme Of Gods Holy Spirit"

Can you hear me now Dave.



turnorburn

 

[Aurora]

No one is blaspheming the Holy Spirit, but trying to recognize what spirit we are dealing with.

We are to judge between good,and evil, and do so in recognition, not condemnation.
We are also to try the spirits whether they are of God, or not......The most sure way to do that, is
Know Gods character, and his word, so we can judge righteously. :yes

 

[cyberjosh]

I agree. I post these videos to challege anyone who holds to these beliefs. I agree they are un-utterable as Romans 8:26 says. However, many of those who utter the groanings use that verse to support their expierences, even though the verse teaches the entire opposite. Why does it happen?

I would say that it happens when people want to base their beliefs primarily upon their experiences rather than on proper doctrine, and as a consequence inevitably human experience can be mislead and wrong conclusions are reached. Often once one's mind is set on a particular interpretation the Scriptures will be selected and crafted to suit the understanding of the person. The truly honest person would open their Bible not to read into it but rather to allow it to open you, with an effectiveness greater than a double-edged sword, and teach you the truth through the working of the Spirit as you pray over it. Honest seeking, like the Bereans, is the first step to correctly dividing the word of God.

God Bless,

~Josh

Then do you believe all those folks are just "putting on a show?" I shake my head when I see it and yet I think...how can so many be so :crazy . Is it that I'm not getting it? Is it just that it is "different strokes for different folks?" It truly puzzles me.

I think it is worse than that. I don't think most people are cognizant of what they are getting into, and they are not pretending. It's clearly a spiritual and/or emotional manifestation in most cases because of how they behave (many times incapacitated - mentally or physically - or out of control).

No, I think it is a case of ignorance in worship, like Jesus illustrated here: "You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews [in Christ]" (John 4:22). Worshiping what you do not know is dangerous, and I think we all know whose playground that is.

P.S. I do not want to cast a negative light on all spiritual encounters because truely God's Spirit can manifest in amazing ways in the believer. But taking this conversation in the context of the videos that Dave frequently puts up in multiple threads, most of those do not appear to be anything other than this ignorance in worship (as well intentioned as it may be).

God Bless,

~Josh

 

[cyberjosh]

No one is blaspheming the Holy Spirit, but trying to recognize what spirit we are dealing with.

We are to judge between good,and evil, and do so in recognition, not condemnation.
We are also to try the spirits whether they are of God, or not......The most sure way to do that, is
Know Gods character, and his word, so we can judge righteously. :yes

You said it!

 

[whirlwind]

I would say that it happens when people want to base their beliefs primarily upon their experiences rather than on proper doctrine, and as a consequence inevitably human experience can be mislead and wrong conclusions are reached. Often once one's mind is set on a particular interpretation the Scriptures will be selected and crafted to suit the understanding of the person. The truly honest person would open their Bible not to read into it but rather to allow it to open you, with an effectiveness greater than a double-edged sword, and teach you the truth through the working of the Spirit as you pray over it. Honest seeking, like the Bereans, is the first step to correctly dividing the word of God.

God Bless,

~Josh

Then do you believe all those folks are just "putting on a show?" I shake my head when I see it and yet I think...how can so many be so :crazy . Is it that I'm not getting it? Is it just that it is "different strokes for different folks?" It truly puzzles me.

I think it is worse than that. I don't think most people are cognizant of what they are getting into, and they are not pretending. It's clearly a spiritual and/or emotional manifestation in most cases because of how they behave (many times incapacitated - mentally or physically - or out of control).

No, I think it is a case of ignorance in worship, like Jesus illustrated here: "You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews [in Christ]" (John 4:22). Worshiping what you do not know is dangerous, and I think we all know whose playground that is.

P.S. I do not want to cast a negative light on all spiritual encounters because truely God's Spirit can manifest in amazing ways in the believer. But taking this conversation in the context of the videos that Dave frequently puts up in multiple threads, most of those do not appear to be anything other than this ignorance in worship (as well intentioned as it may be).

God Bless,

~Josh

Thank you Josh. You are sort of skirting around the "spirit" thing and that is what I wondered about without trying to offend anyone. Is it of God or....? So, I'll take your lead and keep it within the confines of the videos. I do agree in that it doesn't appear to me that they are pretending....at least not all of them.

You handled that like a true son of the south. I'm from "Sweet Home Alabama" too....way down south in Mobile.

 

[Sparkey]

I just jumped to the last post and read a friendly response (thanks ww) and thought I'd jump in from here. This is not my habit at all - preferring to work my way through the entire thread and try to master the concepts so pardon please if it has been said before.

We know that the whole earth groans!
The "groaning" is oftentimes linked in the word with an image of a woman in travail (at the time of birthing). I've felt myself personally moved while in prayer in the past and understood that the prayer that I was praying with my own lips wasn't for me but thought maybe for a stranger?

For the earnest expectation of the creation eagerly awaits the revelation of the sons of God.
For we know that all the creation groans together and travails together until now.

We can hear His Spirit through creation -- and I have heard of a time when mountains will "clap their hands".

And not only so, but also we ourselves having the firstfruit of the Spirit, also we ourselves groan within ourselves, eagerly expecting adoption, the redemption of our body;
for we were saved by hope, but hope being seen is not hope; for what anyone sees, why does he also hope?
But if we hope for what we do not see, through patience we wait eagerly.
And likewise the Spirit also joins in to help our weaknesses. For we do not know what we should pray as we ought, but the Spirit Himself intercedes on our behalf with groanings that cannot be uttered.

I don't get stumbled by these scriptures but I do get sidetracked easily. My mind goes to another scripture in 1Tim that says that the husbandman (Farmer?) must eat of the firstfruits - we are supposed to be gentle and have the fruits of the spirit and I get convicted then and there. My thoughts continue along these lines often. But I still think that it (the groaning in creation and in the saints) is a good thing and a working of the Holy Spirit however we wrestle the writings of Paul.

~Sparrow

(going back to joyfully? dutifully? wade through the thread now)

 

[Sparkey]

"Okay! I'm back," chirps the sparrow as she removes her wading boots.

Me again - Hmmmm.... Dave? I can't talk about that video much because I wasn't there and have no divine revelation from God about it. What I can speak about is from my personal experiences of which I am happy to share; When I was very young the Lord was calling me out of the catholic church. Not that there aren't many lovely and saved within that church. I consider the main reason that I was sprinkled when I was a baby was because my mom was catholic and that's why but maybe this too was directed by God?

Back then (in the late 60's / early 70's and thereabouts) there was a term commonly used: "holy rollers". One of the assemblies that I was brought to was a very tiny church called "Bethel Chapel". There, I met a woman, who was 30 years my senior and very sweet, and I knew she was filled with the Spirit of God. I could tell by the love I saw in her and in her house and in her relationships. It was kinda all over her. She loved reading from the book of John and especially loved reading from Isaiah. Today, and looking back, it is my thought that this simple loving church didn't have enough biblical teaching. < which by no coincidence happens to be the same thought I have about that first church I attended as a baby > Back to topic: What I read from the epistle that Paul wrote to the assembly in Corinth still applies today. < Paul was writing to them and not to a church that was over-zealous for traditions of men - they were ignorant of the Spiritual things and their Apostle was putting them straight as the Holy Spirit directed Him! >

Yes, Paul was speaking to what could be termed over-zealousness in Spiritual things. But I also read this: "For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it." Paul came pretty close to saying that people who saw the people worshiping in his day could call them crazy. I wonder what we'd see if there was a YouTube of Corinth from then?

1Co 14:23 If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those that are unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad?

Again, I'm not talking about the YouTube video here or commenting on it. Only talking about what was and is being taught by the Holy Spirit. He spoke of many things in that letter.

Paul had just finished speaking to them about no longer being children in understanding. The he quoted Isaiah 28:11& 12 when he said, "1Co 14:21 In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord." We can clearly understand that Paul was not commending them but instead asking them to have a proper understanding. He also implied that God was talking to them when he quoted Isaiah. It sounds to me like Paul said in an almost scolding tone, "The Lord is indeed speaking --- but you are not hearing Him, as was prophesied. We don't want divisions and God is not an author of confusion." -but that's just my ear "talking" here.

Let me stress this again, I am not being sent to the YouTube video in any way, shape or form. It can't speak at all.

My thought about Bethel Chapel (where I learned at the feet of a very sweet Christian and I CAN testify about her faith and love and trust) is that they had not come into the fullness of the glory of Christ. There were somethings they couldn't yet hear when they read from Paul, "1Co 14:40 Let all things be done decently and in order."

~Sparrow

PS. To nobody in particular: I'm male -- but my persona (the sparrowhawk) is a female bird. "She" defends the nest. I say this because I don't want any PM's from guys (or gals for that matter) hitting on me --- look at the picture, please? I'm old and not young. These things simply ought not to be.