Imam justifies rape of unveiled women

[jgredline]

Australia's top Muslim cleric rationalized a series of gang rapes by Arab men, blaming women who "sway suggestively," wear make-up and don't cover themselves in the tradition of Islam.


Sheik Ibrahim Mogra with Sheik Taj el-Dene Elhilaly. (Courtesy Sydney Daily Telegraph)

Sheik Taj el-Dene Elhilaly's comments in a Ramadan sermon in a Sydney mosque have stirred a furor in the country with even Prime Minister John Howard weighing in with condemnation.

The cleric also said the judge in the case, who sentenced the rapists, had "no mercy."

"But the problem, but the problem all began with who?" he said, referring to the women victims – whom he said were "weapons used by Satan."

The victims of the vicious gang rapes are leading the national outcry – with some calling for deportation of the sheik. In a Sydney Daily Telegraph online poll, 84 percent of people said the Egyptian-born sheik should be deported.


http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/artic ... E_ID=52630

 

[ChristineES]

That is the problem with most men, they put all the blame on the woman even when it is not her fault. Islam makes it even easier. The Qu'ran says that even if you suspect your wife is being unfaithful, to beat her.

 

[Quath]

I remember back in college, a traveling Christian preacher was on the student stairs with a crowd around him. He was thumping a Bible and speaking of harlots and Jezebels that show leg and drive men to commict acts of lust.

A girl in a mini-skirt was going up the stairs and had not realized what she had wandered into. Some of the guys played around and shouted "Jezebal" and "Harlot." She looked confused and one guy shouted "You are tempting me with your legs." She spied the preacher and figured out what was happening. She gave a half smile and flashed him her panties and kept going. Everyone started to cheer for her and they all dispersed. The preacher seemed too stunned to speak.

 

[Jon-Marc]

It is NEVER the victim's fault for being raped or molested. There is NEVER any excuse for attacking and raping someone. It doesn't matter how she is dressed or not dressed. Rape is not about sexual desire or how the victim is dressed. It is about having control over the victim. It is also, in my opinion, a way to make one's self feel strong. Only a coward attacks the weak. Do they ever go after someone stronger than they are? I don't like fighting, but I certainly would never pick a fight with someone I can't whip. The victims are usually women and children who can't fight back. The attacker wants to feel strong and in control. The ONLY person to blame for ANY attack on another is the attacker. Society and the police need to stop blaming the victims and put the blame where it belongs--on the ATTACKER!

 

[SputnikBoy]

It is NEVER the victim's fault for being raped or molested. There is NEVER any excuse for attacking and raping someone. It doesn't matter how she is dressed or not dressed. Rape is not about sexual desire or how the victim is dressed. It is about having control over the victim. It is also, in my opinion, a way to make one's self feel strong. Only a coward attacks the weak. Do they ever go after someone stronger than they are? I don't like fighting, but I certainly would never pick a fight with someone I can't whip. The victims are usually women and children who can't fight back. The attacker wants to feel strong and in control. The ONLY person to blame for ANY attack on another is the attacker. Society and the police need to stop blaming the victims and put the blame where it belongs--on the ATTACKER!

Of course. This goes without saying.
There ARE, however, many females today who DO flaunt their sexuality and overstep the bounds of modesty and decency. Even the Bible makes reference to 'immodest' dress in females. I guess it does so because it KNOWS that immodesty in females might well be responsible for inciting the lustful thoughts of males.

 

[moniker]

Of course. This goes without saying.
There ARE, however, many females today who DO flaunt their sexuality and overstep the bounds of modesty and decency. Even the Bible makes reference to 'immodest' dress in females. I guess it does so because it KNOWS that immodesty in females might well be responsible for inciting the lustful thoughts of males.

Of course, we should never blame the victim of rape. Duh. But, seriously, I'm totally going to go ahead and blame the victim of rape.
:roll:

 

[SputnikBoy]

Of course, we should never blame the victim of rape. Duh. But, seriously, I'm totally going to go ahead and blame the victim of rape.
:roll:

Did I say something wrong ...?

 

[Solo]

That is the problem with most men, they put all the blame on the woman even when it is not her fault.

Really? I am surprised that you have such a feminist attitude blaming "most men" as blaming women concerning rape. I have never blamed a woman for this terrible crime, nor do I know any men that do. Perhaps you run around the wrong crowds?! :o

 

[Jon-Marc]

I realize that how a woman dresses can arouse desire in a man, but that certainly doesn't give any man the right to attack them. Where I worked (and retired from) there was a light-skinned black lady who looked good. When she dressed in black (as she often did) she looked oh so fine! Black made her look sexy for lack of a better word. However, I certainly never thought of forcing myself on her, or even of wanting to have sex with her. I just loved the way she looked.

 

[moniker]

Did I say something wrong ...?

There ARE, however, many females today who DO flaunt their sexuality and overstep the bounds of modesty and decency. Even the Bible makes reference to 'immodest' dress in females. I guess it does so because it KNOWS that immodesty in females might well be responsible for inciting the lustful thoughts of males.

The woman, in choosing her dress, is responsible for inciting the lustful thoughts in males which leads to her being raped. You are blaming the victim in the very same post that you agree with the premise of never blaming the victim. You essentially paraphrased what the Imam we're all lambasting said.

 

[Drew]

There ARE, however, many females today who DO flaunt their sexuality and overstep the bounds of modesty and decency. Even the Bible makes reference to 'immodest' dress in females. I guess it does so because it KNOWS that immodesty in females might well be responsible for inciting the lustful thoughts of males.

The woman, in choosing her dress, is responsible for inciting the lustful thoughts in males which leads to her being raped. You are blaming the victim in the very same post that you agree with the premise of never blaming the victim. You essentially paraphrased what the Imam we're all lambasting said.

Sputnik has in no way blamed the victim for being raped.

You are presuming that he holds the view that no moral choice exists between the state of arousal through "lustful thoughts" and the execution of a rape. If Sputnik were to hold the view that "lustful thoughts" lead to rape without a further moral choice being made, you would have a point. But Sput has not said this.

He does, admittedly, appear to allocates some "blame" in respect to inciting lustful thoughts, but this is as far as he has gone. Even this is questionable - note how he uses the phrase "might well be responsible.."

Sputnik - I hope you do not mind my expressing an opinion re what can be justifiably concluded from what you have written.

 

[Jay T]

The trend in modern Christainity is......"God Says, But I Think".

People generally want to get into heaven, on their own terms......

Matthew 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide [is] the gate, and broad [is] the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
7:14 Because strait [is] the gate, and narrow [is] the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.


7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity (SIN).

 

[SputnikBoy]

Sputnik has in no way blamed the victim for being raped.

You are presuming that he holds the view that no moral choice exists between the state of arousal through "lustful thoughts" and the execution of a rape. If Sputnik were to hold the view that "lustful thoughts" lead to rape without a further moral choice being made, you would have a point. But Sput has not said this.

He does, admittedly, appear to allocates some "blame" in respect to inciting lustful thoughts, but this is as far as he has gone. Even this is questionable - note how he uses the phrase "might well be responsible.."

Sputnik - I hope you do not mind my expressing an opinion re what can be justifiably concluded from what you have written.

Not at all, Drew. You said it well. Thanks.

 

[SputnikBoy]

Actually, I taped (VCR) a program from the SBS TV Channel last week (Insight, Australia) that dealt with this very issue in a forum-type setting. The audience was made up of Muslims and non-Muslims, politicians, and clerics of various persuasions. It was a most interesting discussion. I wish there was a way to convert my tape to a format that allowed me to present the program on the Internet. IS there a way ...?

 

[SputnikBoy]

Further to my above post ...the Insight program that I mentioned entitled "Asking For It" that deals with the issue under discussion is available at:

http://www20.sbs.com.au/video/?channel=Insight

The audio was fine but the video had a tough time playing 'catch-up'. Anyway, for anyone who might be interested it IS there.

 

[Jay T]

The TRUE church of God.....has members which keep all 10 commandments, thru their faith in Jesus Christ (Revelation 14:12).

Rape, being a violation of the commandment: "THOU SHALT NOT COMMIT ADULTRY" ...is the mark of a religion, which shows they know not God !

 

[GodsAngel]

That is the most awful thing I have heard.. I agree that a woman should not dress sugestivley but I still dont think its her fault if another man has sex with her.. It shouldnt be callled rape anyways...