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Growth Is The Trinity Biblical? (Yes!)

Nintentacle

Nintentacle

Member
"Deuteronomy 6:4 - The Hebrew word for "One" is "Echad" (http://biblehub.com/text/deuteronomy/6-4.htm) which can be "One united" (http://biblehub.com/hebrew/259.htm). The same word is used in Genesis 2:24 (http://biblehub.com/text/genesis/2-24.htm), "Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.". More than one is one. Sound like the trinity?

Someone online said, "Let's put this together in a different form: one person, God the Father, plus one person, God the Son, plus one person, God the Holy Ghost, equals one person, God the What?"

The "3 persons" are one God. Here's an example:
Is my soul a part of me? Yes.
Is my body a part of me? Yes.
Are those more than one parts? Yes.
But am I one person? Yes.
But is my soul my body, and my body my soul? No.

Apply the same thing to the trinity: While the Father (I.e., body) is not the Son (I.e., soul), they are both one God (I.e., one person).

Trinity in the Bible:
Genesis 1:1 - "In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.".
The word for God (Elohim) can be plural. (http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elohim)

Genesis 1:26 - ""And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness"
Genesis 1:27 - ""So God created man in his own image"
First God says "Let us make man in our (Plural) image", and then God creates man in HIS (Singular) image, implying God is both singular and plural.

Deuteronomy 6:4 - See my first part of the entire post.

Psalm 110:1 - "The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand,
until I make thine enemies thy footstool.".
This verse implies a plurality of Lords, and Jesus claims to be the Lord mentioned (Mark 14:61-62)

Proverbs 30:4 - "Who hath ascended up into heaven, or descended? who hath gathered the wind in his fists? who hath bound the waters in a garment? who hath established all the ends of the earth? what is his name, and what is his son"s name, if thou canst tell?"
This is saying God has a Son.

Isaiah 7:14 - "Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel."
Immanuel means "God with us." (Matthew 1:26), making the child literally God, with us (Mankind at that time).

Zechariah 9:9 - "Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion; shout, O daughter of Jerusalem: behold, thy King cometh unto thee: he is just, and having salvation; lowly, and riding upon an ass, and upon a colt the foal of an ass.".
God is the King of Zion and the redeemer of Zion (Isaiah 44:6), so this verse is speaking of God. Jesus came to Jerusalem on a donkey and on a colt the foal of a donkey (Matthew 21:1-9), making Jesus God.

Zechariah 11:12-13 - "And I said unto them, If ye think good, give me my price; and if not, forbear. So they weighed for my price thirty pieces of silver. And the Lord said unto me, Cast it unto the potter: a goodly price that I was prised at of them."
The Lord was betrayed for 30 pieces of silver. Jesus was betrayed for 30 pieces of silver (Matthew 26:14-16), making Jesus the Lord."

Matthew 28:18 - "And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth."
Only God has all power over Heaven and Earth. Jesus is clearly claiming divinity.

Mark 14:61-62 - "But he held his peace, and answered nothing. Again the high priest asked him, and said unto him, Art thou the Christ, the Son of the Blessed? 62"And Jesus said, I am: and ye shall see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven."
Jesus claimed to be the Son of Man (Daniel 7:13) and David's Lord (Psalm 110:1)

John 1:1 - "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."
John 1:14 - "And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth."
Jesus is God according to this.

John 8:24 - "I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am, ye shall die in your sins." (Note: I did not include "He" in because the word "He" was added by the translators for clarity. "He" is not in the original.) (http://biblehub.com/text/john/8-24.htm)
Jesus claimed to be "I am", (Exodus 3:14)

Acts 5:3 - "But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land?"
Acts 5:5 - ""Whiles it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God."
Peter equates the Holy Spirit with God.
 
Yes it is
3decb523bc016f2bb2d8d545817941e3.jpg
3 persons one God.
 
JOHN 8
52Then said the Jews unto him, Now we know that thou hast a devil. Abraham is dead, and the prophets; and thou sayest, If a man keep my saying, he shall never taste of death.
53Art thou greater than our father Abraham, which is dead? and the prophets are dead: whom makest thou thyself?
54Jesus answered, If I honour myself, my honour is nothing: it is my Father that honoureth me; of whom ye say, that he is your God:
55Yet ye have not known him; but I know him: and if I should say, I know him not, I shall be a liar like unto you: but I know him, and keep his saying.
56Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.
57Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham?
58Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, BEFORE ABRAHAM WAS, I AM.
59Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

EXODUS 3:13-16
13And Moses said unto God, Behold, when I come unto the children of Israel, and shall say unto them, The God of your fathers hath sent me unto you; and they shall say to me, What is his name? what shall I say unto them?
14And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM HATH SENT ME UNTO YOU.
15And God said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, The LORD God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, hath sent me unto you: this is my name for ever, and this is my memorial unto all generations.
16Go, and gather the elders of Israel together, and say unto them, The LORD God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, of Isaac, and of Jacob, appeared unto me, saying, I have surely visited you, and seen that which is done to you in Egypt:
 
Rollo Tamasi said:
How can 3 people be 1 God?
Click to expand...
I attempted to explain it in my post. I said:
"The "3 persons" are one God. Here's an example:
Is my soul a part of me? Yes.
Is my body a part of me? Yes.
Are those more than one parts? Yes.
But am I one person? Yes.
But is my soul my body, and my body my soul? No.

Apply the same thing to the trinity: While the Father (I.e., body) is not the Son (I.e., soul), they are both one God (I.e., one person)."
 
Nintentacle said:
I attempted to explain it in my post. I said:
"The "3 persons" are one God. Here's an example:
Is my soul a part of me? Yes.
Is my body a part of me? Yes.
Are those more than one parts? Yes.
But am I one person? Yes.
But is my soul my body, and my body my soul? No.

Apply the same thing to the trinity: While the Father (I.e., body) is not the Son (I.e., soul), they are both one God (I.e., one person)."
Click to expand...
And where does the Holy Spirit come in?
 
Rollo Tamasi said:
How can 3 people be 1 God?
Click to expand...
Hello Rollo Tamasi,

We cannot fully comprehend who God is. For example, I find it fascinating how God reveals Himself to Ezekiel in Ezekiel 1-3, to Isaiah in Isaiah 6, and to the apostle John on the Island of Patmos in Revelation 1.

Personally, the way I proceeded in order to figure out what the Bible teaches about who God is was as follows: I broke the problem into separate pieces. Who is God? Answer: there is One God who presents Himself as the Father in many places throughout the Bible. And there is One God only as can be read in Deuteronomy 6:4.

Then I read through my entire Bible, Old and New Testament, observing carefully any mention of who Jesus was. Key verses being John 1:1, with John 1:14, and John 20:28. These passages show Jesus as being God, as do many other texts of the Old Testament that are then applied to Jesus in the New Testament.

Later, I tackled The Holy Spirit in a similar fashion and found that He is presented as a person who has attributes that only God has such as giving life, as for example in John 3:5. But it was 2 Corinthians 3:17 that really drove it home for me, for it says "Now the Lord is the Spirit" (NIV,2011). Also, the quote from Psalm 95:7-11 found in Hebrews 3:7-11, where what is said of God in Psalm 95 is said of the Spirit in Hebrews 3.

Having broken down the question of the trinity into its three component parts of understanding God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit, Matthew 28:18-20 brings all of these nicely together when Jesus says to baptize in the name of the Father, of the Son and of the Holy Spirit: the three persons of the Godhead.

That is why I like Kathi's diagram:
Kathi said:
Yes it is
3decb523bc016f2bb2d8d545817941e3.jpg
Click to expand...


It helps express in a visual form a Christian teaching that is spread out throughout the entire Bible, and which is not necessarily easy to grasp. We believe it, not because we reason it out, but because we find it in the pages of Scripture.

I prefer the term "tri-unity" to the term "trinity" as a summary term for this teaching, because in my view it insists a little more explicitely on the unity of God than the more usual term "trinity".
 
Last edited:
DanielGarneau said:
Hello Rollo Tamasi,

We cannot fully comprehend who God is. For example, I find it fascinating how God reveals Himself to Ezekiel in Ezekiel 1-3, to Isaiah in Isaiah 6, and to the apostle John on the Island of Patmos in Revelation 1.

Personally, the way I proceeded in order to figure out what the Bible teaches about who God is was as follows: I broke the problem into separate pieces. Who is God? Answer: there is One God who presents Himself as the Father in many places throughout the Bible. And there is One God only as can be read in Deuteronomy 6:4.

Then I read through my entire Bible, Old and New Testament, observing carefully any mention of who Jesus was. Key verses being John 1:1, with John 1:14, and John 20:28. These passages show Jesus as being God, as do many other texts of the Old Testament that are then applied to Jesus in the New Testament.

Later, I tackled The Holy Spirit in a similar fashion and found that He is presented as a person who has attributes that only God has such as giving life, as for example in John 3:5. But it was 2 Corinthians 3:17 that really drove it home for me, for it says "Now the Lord is the Spirit" (NIV,2011). Also, the quote from Psalm 95:7-11 found in Hebrews 3:7-11, where what is said of God in Psalm 95 is said of the Spirit in Hebrews 3.

Having broken down the question of the trinity into its three component parts of understanding God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit, Matthew 28:18-20 brings all of these nicely together when Jesus says to baptize in the name of the Father, of the Son and of the Holy Spirit: the three persons of the Godhead.

That is why I like Kathi's diagram:




It helps express in a visual form a Christian teaching that is spread out throughout the entire Bible, and which is not necessarily easy to grasp. We believe it, not because we reason it out, but because we find it in the pages of Scripture.

I prefer the term "tri-unity" to the term "trinity" as a summary term for this teaching, because in my view it insists a little more explicitely on the unity of God than the more usual term "trinity".
Click to expand...
Hi Daniel, what you just explained to me is 3 persons being one God.
You didn't explain how three persons can be one God.
But your explanation as to how each is God is very good.
Thank you.

How does this sound?

"The Trinity is a mystery that cannot be explained or comprehended by human reason but is best expressed by stating that we worship one God in Trinity and Trinity in unity, neither confusing the persons or dividing the substance that we are compelled by the Christian truth to confess that each distinct person is God and Lord and that the deity of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit is one, equal in glory and co-equal in majesty". Lutheran Church
 
Rollo Tamasi said:
Hi Daniel, what you just explained to me is 3 persons being one God.
You didn't explain how three persons can be one God.
But your explanation as to how each is God is very good.
Click to expand...

There are many things I do not fully understand about God. Read the following three passages in their entirety and think them through: Ezekiel 1-3, Isaiah 6, and Revelation 1. In these passages, I cannot fully comprehend how God reveals Himself to Ezekiel , to Isaiah, and to the apostle John. But I do get something of His majesty.
 
Rollo Tamasi said:
Hi Daniel, what you just explained to me is 3 persons being one God.
You didn't explain how three persons can be one God.
But your explanation as to how each is God is very good.
Thank you.

How does this sound?

"The Trinity is a mystery that cannot be explained or comprehended by human reason but is best expressed by stating that we worship one God in Trinity and Trinity in unity, neither confusing the persons or dividing the substance that we are compelled by the Christian truth to confess that each distinct person is God and Lord and that the deity of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit is one, equal in glory and co-equal in majesty". Lutheran Church
Click to expand...

It's a mystery, that is for sure.......... sigh........

DanielGarneau said:
There are many things I do not fully understand about God. Read the following three passages in their entirety and think them through: Ezekiel 1-3, Isaiah 6, and Revelation 1. In these passages, I cannot fully comprehend how God reveals Himself to Ezekiel , to Isaiah, and to the apostle John. But I do get something of His majesty.
Click to expand...

Using scriptures to find a "Trinity" is Not going to happen. It's a made up Cathloic Doctrine, and they used no scriptures. Trying to find something in scripture, that is not there is a work of frustration.

The real Trinity Doctrine that started it all came about in 325ad. The Roman Cathloic church set out to defend the Deity of Jesus. Some guy was going around saying Jesus was a created being, and that did not set well with Rome.

Hence, the real and true Trinity Doctrine was born. A statement of faith that has been adopted even to this day.

The true Doctrine stated Jesus is God of God, From the Father Begotten, not made before the foundation of the World..... (That is wrong, Jesus has no creation date, Begotten though Mary as Human) and is of the "SAME" substance as his Father.

Not 1 God.......... 2 Gods, of the same substance or essence.

The Holy Spirit was never mentioned in the real Doctrine. He was included in 381ad in a revision of the Original.

The Original Doctrine is pretty spot on to what scriptures say, execpt the end part of the doctrine that says you have to be part of the Roman Cathloic church.

Years later......... and I mean 100's.............. men came in and corrupted the doctrine by saying there are 3, that somehow and magically become 1. A mystery of the Christain faith.

This once again came from Rome, and Rome stated the doctrine is not found in scriptures (1912)

Since then, many other denominations have just made up their own versions and counterfits.

Don't take my word for it, look up the History of it.

Scripturally there is ONLY ONE LORD GOD............ Just one. There are not like him or any before or after him. He is the creator, Saviour, and Father, the God of Isreal.

There is only One Lord Jesus Christ. God the Son, not his Father, whom the Father called servant in a few places................ His Servant.

The Holy Spirit does not even speak on his own, Can't be one with the Father else the Father can't speak on his own. Never called God, but the Spirit that belongs to God.
That is scripture.

Jude really breaks it down for us in an amazing scripture. Now if only the KJV would have translated LORD Correctly it would be clearly seen.

Jud 1:4 kjva For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord (despotēs) God, and our Lord (kurios) Jesus Christ.

When comparing the two together, the Holy Spirit used despotēs Father, husband, absolute ruler for God the Father.

kurios means to rule over anothers things.

Jude helps us by the Holy Spirit to let us know............ There is ONLY ONE LORD GOD, none like him, no other gods like him. This is in line with all the rest of the scriptures.
 
Free said:
Although there are many errors in your post, this is the most serious. This is polytheism, which has nothing to do with Christianity. It is heresy.
Click to expand...

Go google it Free....... There are zero errors in my post. There is no scripture saying we are Not suppose to believe in Polythiesm. If there is a God the Father and there is a Lord Jesus Christ, that makes TWO.............. TWO Gods............ Now which one of them don't you believe in?

Jude said there is ONE LORD GOD.......... and the LORD JESUS CHRIST.........

What your saying Free is one of them is not real and does not exist. There has to be two Free.

How you count just one is the real mystery.

Go read the Orignial and real trinity Doctrine........ Tell me what it says.
 
Brother Mike said:
Go google it Free....... There are zero errors in my post. There is no scripture saying we are Not suppose to believe in Polythiesm. If there is a God the Father and there is a Lord Jesus Christ, that makes TWO.............. TWO Gods............ Now which one of them don't you believe in?
Click to expand...
There are numerous Scriptures which state unequivocally that there always has been, is, and ever will be only one God. This is foundational to Judaism and Christianity. One cannot be a Christian and believe in two Gods (which actually makes them two gods). Period.
 
Free said:
There are numerous Scriptures which state unequivocally that there always has been, is, and ever will be only one God. This is foundational to Judaism and Christianity. One cannot be a Christian and believe in two Gods (which actually makes them two gods). Period.
Click to expand...

Free, we have been having this discussion for a few years now. There is ONE LORD GOD........... That does not erease the ONe LOrd JESUS CHRIST.

The Father called his son GOD.

There is no foundation in scripture saying there is only ONE, not one scripture.

Now if the FAther called his Son God.......... then that is two.

50 Scriptures mention them both together............ TWO

Now how you come up with one, is a mystery to me, but there is a Father and there is a Son, both God, sitting on their perspective thrones.

50 some scriptures say there are two................ Believe scripture, not some Cathloic doctrine from the 1500's when they suddenly become 3 that are one.

You can't fault me for counting two. It's in many scriptures, and I am not willing to say there is just one, and no Son.

Remember, Trinity believers there are 3 and all 3 are seperate and give their own account. Those 3 are 1 and that part is called a mystery.

A Mystery free. I don't buy into the Mystery. You can't fault me for believing scriptures. If you want to believe in the mystery, then I am fine with that.

At least your not Oneness............ I am thankful for that.
 
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