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Life on other planets...

V

Vanguard

Guest
I don't have permission to post in the science forum yet, so I have to do it here for now.

Do you believe in life on other planets? Why or why not?

As for me, I most certainly do. Our galaxy, the Milky Way, contains billions of stars/planets. It is but one galaxy in the vastness of the universe, which contains billions of galaxies. When you consider those numbers, the odds are just far too great. Some stars are so far away that it takes billions of light years for the light from that star to travel across the universe and be visible on earth. That distance is unfathomable for humans as this time. We have not even scratched the surface of what is out there.
 
For the reasons you state I would be amazed if there were not. Unfortunately we will never know about 99.99999999999999999999999999999999999% (roughly) of the universe.

Life on earth has been found in some incredibly hot, cold, airless, sun-less, food-less places where it is difficult to imagine anything living. Given those extremes, the conditions for life do not seem to be particularly limited by 'Goldilocks' conditions.

I would not be the slightest bit surprised if signs of life are found on Mars in the next few years. There should then be a few people eating their hats :lol
 
I would not be the slightest bit surprised if signs of life are found on Mars in the next few years. There should then be a few people eating their hats :lol

That would be cool! But the abortion debate would still be on! (I'm sure you've seen the comparison).

I can't even begin to think how cool that would be. All the possibilities. It would just be very exciting.
 
Do you believe in life on other planets?

If only all belief questions were so easy to answer....

The Drake equation states that:

where:
N = the number of civilizations in our galaxy with which communication might be possible (i.e. which are on our current past light cone);
and
R* = the average rate of star formation per year in our galaxy
fp = the fraction of those stars that have planets
ne = the average number of planets that can potentially support life per star that has planets
fℓ = the fraction of the above that actually go on to develop life at some point
fi = the fraction of the above that actually go on to develop intelligent life
fc = the fraction of civilizations that develop a technology that releases detectable signs of their existence into space
L = the length of time for which such civilizations release detectable signals into space[5]


Source.

If your question is only about life in general and ignores intelligence, civilisation and communication you can drop fi and fc and would have to redefine L to something like "the length of time for which life on such a planet survives".

I know we don't have usefull data for some of those factors, but I love when a matter of belief can be mathematised.
 
I don't see why God would not create more sentient races in the universe, maybe to test us even more. Intentions aside, even if it is possible that life exist on other planets I don't how they could reach us, though of course my own lack of comprehension doesn't mean that it's impossible.

To go a little off topic, I do love science fiction, especially Frank herberts Dune and all the side novels. I think humanity will colonize the stars and maybe encounter new alien life sin some forms, but I really doubt we will ever encounter intelligent life. Though having a Star Wars/Star Trek future would be cool. If we ever do encounter I think Warhammer 40,000 is more realistic, I don't see any possibility for peacefull encounters, and 40,000 years into the future seem more realistic than most science fiction predictions.
 
Is there life of other planets? I think there probably is, and it would be interesting to know for sure, but it doesn't affect my Christian faith either way.
 
.....maybe encounter new alien life sin some forms....
Freudian slip? :o

.... 40,000 years into the future seem more realistic than most science fiction predictions.

Now there's a thought. If mankind can solve the food, fuel, population, pollution and intolerance problems - AND survive another 40,000 years, their future will be beyond out imagining. Even today we lead a 'science fiction' lifestyle compared with my youth. We already have equipment more advanced than some of the 'Star-Trek' props. :infinity

H G Wells may be disappointed that we don't have a time-machine but we have just about everything else he imagined - in less than 100 years.
 
If only all belief questions were so easy to answer....
I know we don't have usefull data for some of those factors, but I love when a matter of belief can be mathematised.

In your wiki link, you will read that He only came up with it as a starting point for discussion.
The Drake equation is not science, nor is it mathematics.

The fact is, he pulled most of the terms out of the air. NONE of the following terms can be defined, only guessed at.
<dl><dd>n<sub>e</sub> = the average number of planets that can potentially support life per star that has planets</dd><dd>f<sub>ℓ</sub> = the fraction of the above that actually go on to develop life at some point</dd><dd>f<sub>i</sub> = the fraction of the above that actually go on to develop intelligent life</dd><dd>f<sub>c</sub> = the fraction of civilizations that develop a technology that releases detectable signs of their existence into space</dd><dd>L = the length of time for which such civilizations release detectable signals into space<sup id="cite_ref-5" class="reference">[5]</sup></dd></dl>All of these terms are guesses, and not even very scientific guesses. Guessing is not mathematics.
Go back and read the last four - we have NO DATA, NOTHING to base any number on for these terms. NOTHING.
How is that mathematics in your mind?

(Notice that I left out R and Fp because THOSE terms we have pretty good numbers for.)

Belief is, in this case, still just that, belief.
 
Interesting subject and discussion.
My personal feeling and beliefs have followed down the same paths I see portrayed here. Understanding that the number of planets that might contain life are not a certainty but guesses, we can probably agree that the number in all probability very high and that a logical human mind would guess that there probably other life forms. But after a lot of reading and contemplation I arrived at this: I would not at all be surprized to find out in this life or in heaven that there are other children of God besides us humans on earth. But I believe that the other alternative, that we are it, is even more revealing of the majesty and awesomness of God. Contemplate if you will or can that God is so omnipotent that making the entire universe just for us is child's play. He cold make another one in one nanosecond if he wanted to. He could make another one that we could not see or comprehend with any of the senses he gave us. I contend to those that would call me small minded for believing that we could be the "only ones"e are the small minded ones for not being able to comprehend the power and might of our God.

Isaiah 55:9 For [as] the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.
Live by faith. lean not on your own understanding. Don't start believing that something is true just because you think it is, should be, or you want it to be. To do anything else is to miss the grandure of our God.

B2I
 
Pizzaguy and Caludya BOTH missed the first sentences of the Wiki article
The Drake equation is a mathematical equation used to estimate the number of detectable extraterrestrial civilizations in the Milky Way galaxy. It is used in the field of the Search for ExtraTerrestrial Intelligence (SETI). The equation was devised in 1961 by Frank Drake while at the National Astronomy and Ionosphere Center.

Note the limitations:

Only the Milky Way Galaxy
Only life forms that are detectible at present
Only the life forms that construct a civilization

And of course, it is an estimate.
It is an estimate based upon seven INDEPENDENT and IMMEASURABLE variables. Therefore it is nonsense.

In the theological sense, I believe that it is an absurdity as well as an impossibility.
That is because to create a civilization that is sufficiently sophisticated requires beings that have will, intellect and emotion, In other words a person but not necessarily a human body. (having a human body is an impossibility, as you will discover shortly) Because Each member of the Triinity have will, intellect and emotion, Each are described as Persons who have a spiritual Nature, excepting Jesus who has both a spiritual and human nature.

As Christians, we believe that Jesus Christ added to himself (See Philippians 2:6 ff) a human nature. Why was that done? It is because as the Second Adam, He took upon Himself the nature of a human and be in all ways like us, but without sin. In this way, Jesus was able to provide a full and substitutionary (vicarious) Atonement that satisfied the requirement for the penalty for all sins of every human, stated in Genesis 3: death. "The soul that sinneth shall die" says Isaiah.

The observant Christian says, "True, but what does that have to do with ETs? Scripture tells us that humans are created in "the image of God". So when Jesus "took upon Himself the form of a servant" he did not take upon Himself the form and nature of Fido the dog, or Fluffy the cat. He took upon Himself the form and nature of the ONLY creation of God to bear his image. In one respect, it was not really a gigantic "step down". Due to the Fall of Adam, the first human, the Atonement required a second, but sinless Human to take the penalty for the sin of Adam that is passed down upon all humans. Good's wrath and judgment against sin was satisfied in the death of Jesus. It is the Resurrection that proved the forgiveness of sins was final. Thus when Christians place their faith in the nature and extent of the Atonement of Jesus, they are saved, forever.For that, we all rejoice.

Hebrews 13:13 says Jesus Christ is "the same, yesterday, today and forever." EACH of the Trinity are immutable, meaning never-changing, ever. For God to permit intelligent beings on other planets, it would require that they are physical beings with bodies, according to the rules of the Drake "Equation". They could not be spiritual bodies such as angels posess because they would have to organize, and create and build technology capable of communicating with other beings with the same attributes. (For the sake of argument and convenience, I will call them ETs) So exactly would those ETs be like?

It is my opinion that they could not be other humans existing anywhere in the Universe. The reason for that has to do with the Atonement on Calvary. It was a once-in -eternity event. Since Satan was defeated at Calvary, and the extent of that defeat extends to the heavenlies, it is illogical and impossible for the Crucifixion to be repeated. What was done on Earth c 33 AD was a sufficient event to affect EVERYTHING that God created.

It is my opinion that God did not create anything resembling a Ferengi, a Romulan, a Kilngon or a Wookue. While all of those fictional characters possess personhood, if they did exist, then it must be that they have a sinless nature, or else there is salvation available outside of the Atonement of Jesus Christ. In other words, Jesus would have to be as a Vulcan, or a Cardassian or a Yoda or whatever in order to provide salvation for them, also. (The use of the implausible helps to make a point in a humurous way.) Equally improbible is the idea that the ETs would have knowledge of what happened on earth during the Crucifixion and Resurrection.

All that is to demonstrate that in order to have any alien civilization that is capable of doing as SETI presupposes is to do great damage to Scripture, and to the plan of salvation. In fact the belief of ETs existing trashes God and everything He created. Thus I believe that it is only a gullible or naive Christian can believe in any sort of ET.

On this I reserve the right to be wrong.
Live well and prosper!
 
Whether life or no life in other planets all I know is my FC Barcelona Squad will surely compete with any form of life there and defeat them
 
??? :lol I'm afraid to ask:lol

Brother, you're just going to have to get with the times and sign up for a facebook account lol!

irony_life-mars_vs_life-earth.jpg
 
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