Muslim Forum Site Insulting Christianity

[Roel]

I was shocked to find a Muslim site (http://www.yanabi.com) where Muslims in their 'interfaith' forum do nothing else than insulting Christians, the Bible, Jesus, and everything that has to do with our religion. I was thinking, maybe we should join them and debate with them.

 

[Arj]

Show them love and respect no matter how they treat you.

 

[Devekut]

I'm not that shocked.

Have you seen how most posters talk about Islam here?

 

[waitinontheLamb]

It should not surprise us when darkness hates the Light and reviles against it. Islam is a violent and dangerous religion and it's real god would love nothing more then to destroy all Christians as we represent his enemy and the One who will judge him one day.

Pray for them

 

[Rick W]

I'm not that shocked.

Have you seen how most posters talk about Islam here?

I was thinking the same thing.
Ever since Isaac and Ishmael there's been contention.

 

[turnorburn]

I strongly suggest that you think not twice but thrice about this, if you don't mind stamping

on every other post then I say go ahead, but stop and consider this deep seated hatred as mentioned before you do :

In His Service,
turnorburn

 

[RadicalReformer]

I was shocked to find a Muslim site (http://www.yanabi.com) where Muslims in their 'interfaith' forum do nothing else than insulting Christians, the Bible, Jesus, and everything that has to do with our religion. I was thinking, maybe we should join them and debate with them.

First, we need to be careful when things are deemed "interfaith". Typically they are used to attract nonimal believers of any "religion" in an effort to convert them.

Secondly - Christ is the Way, the Truth, and the Life. There is no other foundation that can be laid (1 Cor 3:11) - interfaith is not God building unity, rather it is satan attempting to sow seeds of discontent and division.

 

[Arj]

Islam could kill everyone of us,but it can never extinguish the Light

 

[turnorburn]

Islam could kill everyone of us,but it can never extinguish the Light

:-D That's a big 10/4

 

[Arj]

Hallelujah brothers and sisters,hallelujah.

 

[nomoreillusions]

Consider that most Muslims are just normal people, husbands, wives, fathers, daughters, etc.. they aren't out to hurt anyone, they are just following their beliefs even as we follow ours. They can be very warm, welcoming people just like we can, and they can also be very hateful, nasty people just like we can. They believe they are right, just as we believe we are.

It's wrong to condemn an entire segment of humanity just because the most notable in the news are bad. Whatever else they do, ultimately it is between them and G-d as to their eternal status. On earth, we should still treat them as our brothers, fellow sinners, even as Yeshua dedicated his life to helping not the 'well' but the 'sick'. There's plenty of bad press concerning Christians too, and I know I'm never eager to be asked "why do Christians do that sort of thing" and try to explain they shouldn't, even if some do.

 

[Arj]

Mohammad called for the killing of christians and jews in his time iff they didnt convert(or any other non believer).Unfortunatly a lot of modern muslims think that gives them a free ticket to murder.

 

[luckyfox]

I think it's only to be expected. While some Christians certainly display tolerance for Muslims and a willingness to accept their choice to practise the religion of thir choosing, many are downright hostile regarding Islam, and extend that intolerance beyond the wider faith to the actual individuals themselves. There seems to be a tremendous amount of ignorance about Islam in the Western world, and many Christians are condemning it without any first-hand knowledge or a wilingness to befriend Muslims. I guess it makes sense that Muslims would develop a similar attitude about Christians, although it certainly is unpleasant.

Maybe it's time to turn the other cheek??

 

[Elisha Kai]

It is simply to easy to judge Christianity here.

Also one needs to define insult, if insult suggests that all Muslims are animals, then sure that is wrong, if insult criticises the religion of Islam, its faith and book, then such is not insult but normal criticism which is applied towards everything. Unfortunately, criticism that is utilized in history e.g. against the Christian faith is labelled as insult, islamophobia or racism if applied upon Islam which is ridicolous.

Anyway we need to consider some history here. If you go back say, 15 years, Christians were not engaged with such debate against Islam, instead Muslims brutally attacked the Christian faith by all possible means possible; I remember it, and I remember how these Muslims, their debators and literature insulted and despised in the most hiddeous way what I found precious.

In the 1980s one Christian scholars, Anish Shorrosh and Palestinian Christian, began to reply back and ask similar questions, these same Muslim debators could not take this pressure and tried to kill him twice and he was badly persecuted for daring to even respond in a effective manner, their attempt to kill him is even one video and can be ordered (let me know if you are interested to see it).

At time I would never debate anyone, as such was unknown to me. I remember in 1995 while at Bible college that I twice suggested polemical approaches in which fellow Christians reacted with anger against me for such thinking; I cannot therefore say that Christians have been anything but polite, patient and tolerant.

Prior to 1995 Christians in the West typically did not attack Islam or criticise it, if anything Christians shared their message with Muslims, however, initially Christians got fed up with the criticism and decided that the Muslims needed to taste their own medicine. This decision launched a range of Christian apologists into war with Islam, so to speak, through which the website answering-Islam.org originated.

What am I saying then, I am saying that the Christian criticism of Islam is simply a response to decades of Islamic criticism and insult of the Bible and Christianity.

Furthermore, that this criticism is necessarily insulting is not an issue, we criticise everything in this world, politic, culture, drama, lifestyle and Christianity, we do not necessarily call this insult, but criticims of Islam has been phrased as insult rather than criticism, and many seem to follow this trend, as if Islam has the only monopoly upon being secured from criticism.

Furthermore, go to any Islamic country and consider the freedom of speech, in Pakistan for example Christians are being daily criticised and insulted through media, papers, television etc, and they have not even the permission to reply back or defend themselves; the Muslims have attempted the same in the West but here we respond.

Let me also add that most of these Christian apologists were born and brought up in Muslim countries, were they experienced Islam first hand, they faced such insult for years, and even persecution.

Call it insult anyone, but then lets end all insult, or criticism toward anything, even Christianity, and that will not be accepted. Its amazing that now when Christians start replying we need to consider tolerance, peace, behavior, and of course we need to apply these and criticise in a godly and mannered way, but why was this not urged before 1995. This would have avoided the present situation.

Or lets keep the debate going.

 

[turnorburn]

One of our biggest mistakes is allowing our flesh to dictate to our feelings, what about Gods
feelings, they are after all his creation. Let us examine what his word says, God said Jacob I loved, Esau I have hated. Examine his track record. The man that lost his inheritance, a Hunter, impulsive, dominated by appetite. Made a bad bargain, lacks appreciation for higher things, married heathen wives, lost his blessing, and sought to repent when it was too late. Make sure
your calling, if God has called you to minister to the Muslims then do so by all means and do it with all of your might, otherwise don't go there..

In His Service,
turnorburn

Consider that most Muslims are just normal people, husbands, wives, fathers, daughters, etc.. they aren't out to hurt anyone, they are just following their beliefs even as we follow ours. They can be very warm, welcoming people just like we can, and they can also be very hateful, nasty people just like we can. They believe they are right, just as we believe we are.

It's wrong to condemn an entire segment of humanity just because the most notable in the news are bad. Whatever else they do, ultimately it is between them and G-d as to their eternal status. On earth, we should still treat them as our brothers, fellow sinners, even as Yeshua dedicated his life to helping not the 'well' but the 'sick'. There's plenty of bad press concerning Christians too, and I know I'm never eager to be asked "why do Christians do that sort of thing" and try to explain they shouldn't, even if some do.

 

[stovebolts]

Elisha Kai,
That was a great post. Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

if God has called you to minister to the Muslims then do so by all means and do it with all of your might, otherwise don't go there..

Amen :smt038

I've been a member of the Christian Muslim Forum site for some time now and really have learned a lot about how Christians and Muslims are attempting to live in peace with each other. It is possible!

http://www.christianmuslimforum.org/

 

[Elisha Kai]

Well my call is dealing with the objections against the Christian faith, at the time being mainly those objections raised by Muslim apologists; I am not sure exactly how that corresponds to the narrative account of Esau or Jacob, which are historical accounts within their own context (if that is what Turnorburn referred to, otherwise my apology if I misunderstood the point given).

As to Muslim-Christian dialogue, I am still trying to grasp the logic of it. I am not sure how many here have lived in Muslim countries and have family in Muslim countries, but in that context Muslim-Christian dialogue only gets as far as it can. I cannot say that Muslim-Christian dialogue is wrong or correct, I believe that the Bible is sufficent to teach us Christians to love Muslims and to live in peace with Muslims.

Unfortunately I am aquainted with three Muslim dialogues in my location, all three are being used as a tool to enforce Islamic ideas upon the Christian community, in other words when the dialouge is over, the real questions are being asked. And that is what I mean when I question the effectiveness of such gatherings. It will only take a specific amount of time until you will need to deal with the real issues.

We also need to remember that in the Islamic ideology non-Muslims are second class citizens and if sharia law is imposed a Muslim can by law even kill a Christian or Jew without being punished, merely because the blood of a Muslim has more value than that of a non-Muslim. If the minority victim is an atheist or hindu, they are actually to be killed.

In such settings were Islam is being practiced according to the book, dialogue is simply out of the question. I know personally that such dialogue has taken place in Muslim countries where Sharia was not imposed, however, I am not sure about the outcome of such, I know that my Indian pastor friends refuse to engage in such dialogues possibly as it poses a danger in terms of religious compromise.

And the issue of compromise is another issue that worries me, as Christians we do not need to combine our religious activities with Muslims or that of any other religious practice just to understand or befriend them; I don't know whether the website you linked promotes this (unfortunately I did not have time to look through it, I am merely stating my opinion on Muslim-Christian dialogue as a whole, as I am aquainted with it). I am just considering the example of Jesus and the apostles here, Jesus would eat and befriend the religious leaders, yet he would not compromise with them, and the Pharisees were certainly people of great moral and religious standard, highly impressive in their devotion and great examples of godliness and virtue, simiarly to many figures of other religions, this did not lure Jesus into dialogue, understanding or the urge of friendship; Jesus did befriend and love them, in the same way as any present Christian ought to love Muslims, Hindues, Sikhs and atheists, however, the gatherings were not a matter of reaching common terms and agreements but to reveal the truth.
In the same way Paul did not urge his followers to dialogue with the Jews or Pagans to understand them or live in peace with them, but to love them, and otherwise live among them in such a way as to win them by life and by words. By referring to these examples I am not merely referring to any Biblical narrative taken out of context but the actual examples of Jesus and the early Christians who were pretty much in the same situation as we find ourselves today.

I am an evangelical believer, I do not compromise my faith the slightest, but I am concerned why evangelical Christians often seek to dialogue with Muslims while they refrain from engaging in dialogue with for example Roman Catholics and Jehovas Witnesses who are closer to our faith than Muslims. That is not strike against you personally StoveBolts, you may be dialoging with all groups, so I do not judge you for engaging in Muslim Christian dialogue, but I hope certainly that if such dialogue is right, that we also are willing to dialogue with others.

As for me, I attempt to follow the ways of Jesus and the disciples at this point, that may sound naive, but I try, and that is to befriend and love the non-Christian, but through life and word seek to create understanding for the truth, rather than just focusing on what may unite us, in that case the discourses between Jesus and the religious leaders would never have taken place. And Christianity today if it existed would be a mixture of Judaism and paganism.

So to summarize of course we need to live in peace with the Muslims, of course we need to understand them, but only concern is how far we go and if we are willing to compromise, and that tends to happen.

 

[turnorburn]

I talk with Muslims all the time, when we talk about the brothers it opens
the door to an education, they by the grace of God actually see the truths
of his word :wink: I don't go to temple as per my disabilities, but ride in
their Taxi Cabs.

 

[stovebolts]

I talk with Muslims all the time, when we talk about the brothers it opens
the door to an education, they by the grace of God actually see the truths
of his word :wink: I don't go to temple as per my disabilities, but ride in
their Taxi Cabs.

Isn't it amazing how God presents the opportunities to share his truth. Living near Detroit, I got to know the Muslim owners of the corner gas station when we lived in the city pretty well. Also,the boss I had at my old job actually referred me to my current job (Big move up.. Big). If his boss knew, he would have gotten fired. Long story short, my old boss was Muslim and we use to have some really cool, long talks about Islam and Christianity. Where he struggled, was some of his friends that were, how do you say this??/ to the extreem right in Islam? Needless to say, I've heard first hand from him some of the views of those on hard right of Islam. It really is sad.

But all of this gives me hope because we could both talk about our God and we both could see that anyone to the extreem (soft or hard) from any religion was an abberation from truth.

Through the five years that he was my boss, we became pretty good friends and still talk on occation. (I'm hoping to have lunch with him soon). In that five years, never have I had to compromise my view on God or Christianity, but then, I never had to force it on him either. I believe this is in part to living as Christ directed us which brings about trust and integrity. I'll always recall the first time he said, "I like you because what I see, is what I get." I thought that was a pretty good complement and gave all glory and honor to God. That was our first talk about God.

Elisha Kai,
Thank you for your post. I actually did a search on your name and found the other forum that you hang out at. I really enjoyed reading your posts. God is using you in very big ways and may he continue to bless your ministry.

As far as my ministering to Catholics, I do my best as they also minister to me.

God bless, and thank you for being such an inspiration.

 

[Elisha Kai]

Thanks for your encouragment Stovebolts.

God bless

Elisha Kai