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Pastor decries "politics" in Church

T

thessalonian

Guest
Paster Greg Boyd of Woodland Hills Baptist Chruch (here in Minneapolis) was interviewed about his book, The Myth of a Christian Nation, regarding involvement of Christians and Churches in politics. He doesn't allow groups who are against abortion or homosexuality to pass out information in his Church. He says he's conservative on these issues however. It's created a bit of a stir nationwde.

http://www.whchurch.org/whchurch/pdfs/2 ... YTimes.pdf

Discuss
 
Quite honestly I find his positions to be a mixed bag of truth and error. The Church must be about the issues of the day. He is quite wrong that Jesus did not take moral stands. The moral stands of the day were with regard to taking care of the widow and the orphan. Also against the money changers in the temple who were exploting the poor. Jesus also did not come for the purpose of being involved in government as he did not come to set up a governemnt. Yet he did not tell those whom he met along that way that were affiliated with the government to stay out of politics.

He does have some valid points in that I think it is problematic for a Christian Church to align completely with a particular party. There are issues on both sides of the republican/democrat isle. Christians, however must be involved in the political process and there is no reason that Churches cannot organize against issues that affect them.

Pastors in Churches need to take strong stands against abortion and homosexuality and I hear pastor boyd from time to time on the radio and hear about him. I do not hear him making these kinds of stands. Seems like he is straddling the line to keep members. Yet he comes out with this book and this article that drives the conservatives away from his Church.
 
I think its great if the church stays out of politics

and then politics stay out of church.

don't force christians to do things that are unchristian, but don't force non christians, to follow christianity and its rules.


Doesn't that sound really fair?!
 
I knew you would show up peace. Hmmmm, a non-christian telling Christians what is Christian? :o

How they love to try to silence Christianity.

One of our "rules" is thou shalt not kill. Perhaps we should wave that one for a while.
 
I am all for religious organizations staying out of politics. It is far better to keep debates open and unfettered by religious opinion.
 
I am all for religious organizations staying out of politics. It is far better to keep debates open and unfettered by religious opinion.

Politics must be about what is best for the citizenry, not the best for Christians, Jews, Muslims, etc.
 
thessalonian said:
I knew you would show up peace. Hmmmm, a non-christian telling Christians what is Christian? :o

How they love to try to silence Christianity.

One of our "rules" is thou shalt not kill. Perhaps we should wave that one for a while.
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thess, that is notjust a christian rule, but that is a rule of hamurabi, and many others, before the Christians adopted it.

But, it does seem you christians are usually bent on killing criminals, and killing the innocent (and non inocent) in iraq and afghanistan and elsewhere.
 
thessalonian said:
Quite honestly I find his positions to be a mixed bag of truth and error. The Church must be about the issues of the day. He is quite wrong that Jesus did not take moral stands. The moral stands of the day were with regard to taking care of the widow and the orphan. Also against the money changers in the temple who were exploting the poor. Jesus also did not come for the purpose of being involved in government as he did not come to set up a governemnt. Yet he did not tell those whom he met along that way that were affiliated with the government to stay out of politics.

He does have some valid points in that I think it is problematic for a Christian Church to align completely with a particular party. There are issues on both sides of the republican/democrat isle. Christians, however must be involved in the political process and there is no reason that Churches cannot organize against issues that affect them.

Pastors in Churches need to take strong stands against abortion and homosexuality and I hear pastor boyd from time to time on the radio and hear about him. I do not hear him making these kinds of stands. Seems like he is straddling the line to keep members. Yet he comes out with this book and this article that drives the conservatives away from his Church.
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Thess
Well said. I could not agree with you more.
Adrian Rogers (who has went home to be with the Lord )said the following

I believe in the separation of church and state, but not in separation of God and government. Christians are salt and light in society.
 
I said it before and I'll say it again; when a civilization abandons it's morals, so goes the very moral fabric of that civilization. Unfortunalely, this has infiltrated the church and as a result, the moral fabric of the church shall suffer too. :-?

A Pastor who forbids speaking out against sin does his congregation a grave injustice.
 
Because then the church is preaching politics from the pulpit and not scripture. Of course you can be religious and involved in politics. Over 90% of the country is religious and a good portion of them are involved in one way or another. In fact you can use your religion to guide your decisions regarding policies, legislation, and voting. However, you can not use your understanding of religion to impose political beliefs on your congregation (well, unless you have the hubris to claim that you know God's will and understand how best to enforce it) let alone constituents given our pluralistic society.

Also:
Barry Goldwater said:
Religious factions will go on imposing their will on others unless the decent people connected to them recognize that religion has no place in public policy. They must learn to make their views known without trying to make their views the only alternatives.
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Most certainly there is a line of prudence for a pastor to walk. However when politics and moral issues intersect I think there is some liberty there. Within the Church these issues can and should be promoted without taking the sides of certain political parties. There is also much danger of seeker sentiviness here in which a pastor will not boldly preach the truth for fear of loosing those who do not agree with him. This is a serious mistake. People must hear the truth staight up.
 
God has always been involved with politics. Daniel 2:21 says that God sets up kings and He removes kings. And in New Testament times the Herodians were the politicians of the day as well as certain Jewish sects. God is the one who set up government. And Christians should be involved with politics, when it comes to our people. We are to commit the act of interposition, where we step up for people who cannot step up for themselves. And as for that pastor in question in the above post, there is something wrong with him.
 
Lewis W said:
God has always been involved with politics. Daniel 2:21 says that God sets up kings and He removes kings. And in New Testament times the Herodians were the politicians of the day as well as certain Jewish sects. God is the one who set up government. And Christians should be involved with politics, when it comes to our people. We are to commit the act of interposition, where we step up for people who cannot step up for themselves. And as for that pastor in question in the above post, there is something wrong with him.
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so Why did God set up hitler? and then wait so long to remove him? Same with saddam, Osama, Bush, Pol-Pot, Kim il jong?
 
peace4all said:
Lewis W said:
God has always been involved with politics. Daniel 2:21 says that God sets up kings and He removes kings. And in New Testament times the Herodians were the politicians of the day as well as certain Jewish sects. God is the one who set up government. And Christians should be involved with politics, when it comes to our people. We are to commit the act of interposition, where we step up for people who cannot step up for themselves. And as for that pastor in question in the above post, there is something wrong with him.
Click to expand...

so Why did God set up hitler? and then wait so long to remove him? Same with saddam, Osama, Bush, Pol-Pot, Kim il jong?
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He did not set those kind of people up man, what is wrong with you ?
 
Peace4all,

Did you ever think your human wisdom might be in error? No, probably not. Your too "wise" for that.
 
When did freedom of religion become freedom from religion?

thess wrote:
Most certainly there is a line of prudence for a pastor to walk. However when politics and moral issues intersect I think there is some liberty there. Within the Church these issues can and should be promoted without taking the sides of certain political parties. There is also much danger of seeker sentiviness here in which a pastor will not boldly preach the truth for fear of loosing those who do not agree with him. This is a serious mistake. People must hear the truth staight up.
Click to expand...

I couldn't agree more. When you say seeker sensitive, did you mean luke warm? :wink:
 
Lewis, What am I supposed to do? Deny the parts of the bible that make the bible seem evil?

If God didnt set up the rulers, then god doesn't have a play in politics that way, right>?!

Rom 13:1 ¶ Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.

and of course
proverbs 8:15,16
15 By me kings reign
and rulers make laws that are just;

16 by me princes govern,
and all nobles who rule on earth.

Lewis, What is wrong with you? Haven't read the bible much, Or do you just pick and choose parts of the bible you like?
 
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