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[_ Old Earth _] Peer reviewed biology journal has bad news for evolutionists

  • Thread starter Thread starter kendemyer
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kendemyer

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Bioscience is peer reviewed science journal that is well respected in the scientific community. The January 30th, 1980 issue of Bioscience had this statement, “Why do creationists seem to be the consistent winners in public debates with evolutionists?â€Â

Here is one websites commentary:

Who wins the Debates?

If creation is only a religious view then why do creationists win the overwhelming majority of debates with evolutionists on Creation Vs Evolution? These debates have been held since 1970. The June 15th, 1979 Wall Street Journal reported that, “The creationists tend to win.†The January 30th, 1980 issue of Bioscience* asked, “Why do creationists seem to be the consistent winners in public debates with evolutionists?†Henry Morris reported in an ICR letter dated August 1979 that, “By now, practically every leading evolutionary scientist in this country has declined one or more invitations to a scientific debate on creation/evolution.†Dr. Morris reported that Duane Gish, who has had over 300 formal debates, “at least in our judgment and that of most in the audiences, he always wins.â€Â

It is absolutely critical to note that during these debates that have taken place all over the United States in the last 20 years, creationists have carefully avoided references to religious concepts and literature and focused their platforms on strict scientific evidence such as the laws of thermodynamics, the fossil record, etc. The understanding that even the evolutionists admit that the creationists have won most of the debates is an interesting and important fact by itself.

taken from: http://members.shaw.ca/mark.64/hcib/whowins.html

* I made a correction on the date

(I read the Wall Street Journal article quoted in the first link. It was a science professor from the Univerisity of MN and evolutionist who was quoted as saying the creationists "tend to win the debates").

I think the reason is clear. Despite their best efforts biologist have never witnessed macroevolution. The fruit fly experiments have been going on for about a hundred years and here is the result: Fruit flies remain fruit flies. I think writer Norman Macbeth summed up things nicely regarding the fruit fly experiments: "Richard Goldschmidt fell into despair. The changes, he lamented, were so hopelessly micro that if a thousand mutations were combined in one specimen, there would still be no new species." (Norman Macbeth, Darwin Retried (1971), p. 33. ).

So the biology supports the idea that the different kinds of animals are completely resistent to changing to into different kinds of animals. Fruit flies remained fruit flies. Of course, this confirms creationism.

Here is an excellent article on this subject:

Once a fruit fly, always a fruit fly
http://www.pathlights.com/ce_encyclopedia/10mut10.htm

Also, the fossil record has not been kind to macroevolutionist especially in the case of the "missing link". Here is what the senior science writer of Britain's most respected science journal wrote: "Fossil evidence of human evolutionary history is fragmentary and open to various interpretations. Fossil evidence of chimpanzee evolution is absent altogether". Henry Gee (evolutionist), “Return to the Planet of the Apes,†Nature, Vol. 412, 12 July 2001, p. 131. Britain's emininent paleoanthropologist Sir Solly Zuckerman concurrs. Sir Solly Zuckerman, the famous paleoanthropologist of Birmingham University in England wrote: "…We then move right off the register of objective truth into those fields of presumed biological science, like extrasensory perception or the interpretation of man's fossil history, where to the faithful anything is possible - and where the ardent believer is sometimes able to believe several contradictory things at the same time." (Solly Zuckerman, Beyond the Ivory Tower, New York: Taplinger Publishing Company, 1971, p. 64 ). Clearly, this is not compelling science.

Paleoanthropology is not the only achilles heel for the macroevolutionary hypothesis. Here is what a prominent evolutionist admitted regarding the fossil record: "In any case, no real evolutionist, whether gradualist or punctuationist, uses the fossil record as evidence in favour of the theory of evolution as opposed to special creation." (Mark Ridley, 'Who doubts evolution?', New Scientist, vol. 90, 25 June 1981, p. 831 ).

So the fossil record shows different kinds of animals with big gaps between them. Of course, this confirms creationism.

Since debates commonly require evidence for your position plus the ability to deflect criticisms of your position it is no surprise that the macroevolutionary position consistently loses the university debates.

Now the macroevolutionist might argue well the creationists pepper evolutionists with questions and the macroevolutionist do not have the time to respond to questions. I think this is a poor excuse. Clearly, the macroevolutionists can ask questions of the creationists. The macroevolutionist can claim it is just because the creationists are more eloquent. Do not macroevolutionists write books, give lectures, etc? The macroevolutionist certainly has no shortages of spokespersons who are eloquent. In short, excuses are not replacements for evidence nor are they a substitute for a position that has the ability to withstand objections.
 
Way to bring up 25 year old articles. :roll:
 
The reason that creationists win many arguments with evolutionists is because the evolutionary theory is incredibly complicated. An evolutionist, in order to win a debate, must have an immense amount of knowlege - both biological and paleontological. A creationist, however, can slam the evolutionary theory easily, with little or no scientific knowlege, and can present strawmen that sound very good to the inexperienced ear. In this way, evolutionists are at a disadvantage.

And, by the way, macroevolution has been observed.

Heather
 
It would be impossible for a Football coach to win an arguement about football with someone off the street who thought football was played in a tennis court.
 
I believe many Darwinist are now afraid to debate. It seems as if they missed the Kansas public hearings for example.
 
The debate in Kansas was not about the evolutionary theory. ToE does NOT have anything to do with the origins of life, and that's how the Kansas anti-Darwinists were trying to make it seem. It was a complete straw man, and therefore many evolutionists boycotted the debate. It was completely ridiculous. They also tried to make science (evolution) stand for Atheism, and the debate was really a battle against Atheism.

It's silly, really. You shouldn't try to fight what you don't understand.

Heather
 
Why do you suppose creationists always loose on the net? The reason they do well in staged debates, is the limited time lets them shotgun as many fake objections as they can, for which the scientist cannot hope to refute them all.

Any he misses, results in a win for them.

On the net, the same technique won't work, because we can dissect the fakes at lesiure.

This is why you will rarely see one of the professional creationists on the net.

Those who try it, like Sarfati, get their heads handed to them.
 
I see that I'm going to have to use ultimate force in this debate, behold the power of...
FUNNY PICTURES!
dnftt.jpg

nutri_facts.jpg
 
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