Quick question.

[Milk-Drops]

Lets say a person looses their job and because of this looses their house. If they would apply for welfare and receive it, would this person be a leech?

If so, why?

If not, what would be considered adequate amount of help the person deserves?

Si the person liberal or conservative based just on this information?

 

[P31Woman]

Lets say a person looses their job and because of this looses their house. If they would apply for welfare and receive it, would this person be a leech?

If a person has no other resources I have no problem with them relying on welfare to help them survive.

If not, what would be considered adequate amount of help the person
deserves?

Deserve is not what I think about. Rather can they do something that would allow them not to rely on welfare. If they can they need to do it and stop relying on others. If there is nothing they can do they need I have no problem with them relying on it.

Si the person liberal or conservative based just on this information?[

Not sure what you mean.

 

[evenifigoalone]

My family, which is pretty conservative, had to be on government welfare for a long time. We had no choice.

 

[WIP]

Lets say a person looses their job and because of this looses their house. If they would apply for welfare and receive it, would this person be a leech?

The way I see it, the welfare programs are in place to provide some level of help for those in dire situations. When it becomes necessary to use the programs I don't see it as being a leech. My opinion may be somewhat biased however because I did find myself in that situation once.

In January, 1982, I had a good paying job. In today's dollars it would be about $58,000.00 per year. In February of that year I got married. In April of that year I signed my name on a new home mortgage. In mid-May of that year, just a few weeks after buying our house, I was informed that I would be laid off on May 31. So, in the course of four months I was married, bought a house, and got laid off. On top of we were expecting our son in July and the iron range economy in northern MN was at an all-time low. Unemployment was high and there were few jobs available. By late summer I was forced to sell down everything I could afford to get rid of, refinance loans, negotiate payments of other debt, and pay down debt as much as I could to reduce our monthly obligations which included a college student loan, car loan, and medical bills from our son's birth. We managed to survive on unemployment benefits for about a year as the government continued to extend our benefits similar to what was done in recent years due to the economic down-turn. By the spring of 1983 the well was running dry and employment was not in site. We eventually had to turn to the state for assistance. We received food stamps, medical insurance, housing support, and monthly financial support for about three months until I finally managed to find a minimum wage job. We went for about three years without paying any income tax due to low income. I can tell you that I was never so happy to pay taxes as I was the year that I finally earned enough income to have a tax liability.

If not, what would be considered adequate amount of help the person deserves?

I don't believe anyone "deserves" help. When I begin to think that the world owes me a living, it will be time for a reality check on my pride. What I believe is fair is help me put food on the table, clothes on my back, and a roof over my head so I can have a chance to pull myself up by my bootstraps and get back on my feet. I do not expect my neighbors to guarantee me my current standard of living. I do expect the state to guarantee that I won't lose my home or any other possessions that I have.

Am I liberal or conservative? You be the judge. I don't particularly care for labels.

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

Welfare is a temporary fix to a temporary situation. The "leeches" are the second-and third-generation families that have no work ethic because they have chosen to let the rest of us support them. The leeches are the ones who have come from another country, immediately acquired welfare services and then, years later, failed to report a very comfortable income, who are the ones you see using an EBT card to purchase lobster and $15/lb. Kansas City strip steaks, using their "real money" from a lucrative small business that they hide from the government to buy their "real" food.

Your question is loaded, and reflects "trolling."

 

[Knotical]

Over the past few years I have had to rely on unemployment and welfare to allow my family to survive. I don't necessarily feel I was entitled to it, but something that was available that I qualified for. Prior to this period, and somewhat after it, I have paid taxes, which a portion of it went back into this system, so I consider it as using something I, more or less, "invested" in.

Now, having said that I see the welfare program as one way to keep people from living on the street and becoming criminals just to get by, by stealing what they need/want. Also, the welfare system as it is functioning now is structured very poorly. For example, we qualified for food stamps for a few years, because of our income. The way this part of the system works is as you start earning more money on your own they pull back on what you are allotted each month. Makes sense, right? On the surface, yes, but the problem comes when individuals who have been on this do find themselves earning a steadily increasing wage, the amount of food stamps starts being pulled back at a faster rate than what your income is increasing, thus causing a problem.

Thankfully, in our situation I was able to find a second source of income that was enough where we did not have too much of a burden being "weaned" off of food stamps. Also, this occurred at the end of the year, and I was able to quickly file our taxes and received a nice return that helped us "get over the hump." Our challenge now is making sure we stretch our resources enough where we do not find ourselves with a monthly deficit (our government should take some lessons ;))

That is just one aspect of it. And I consider it to be both a blessing and a curse. I do not envy anyone who finds them having to use it, but I also do not buy into the mentality that these are "entitlement" programs either.

 

[Sparkey]

I like the question. It is my prayer that my own finances would be blessed sufficiently so that I might have the ministry of "giving" restored to me.

Give, and it will be given to you. A good measure, pressed down...
"Give, and it will be given to you. A good measure, pressed down...
shaken together and running over, will be poured into your lap.

[so that you in turn may do likewise]​

For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you."

I've heard of open handed giving. Both hands, both of them... would that not be a gift of service? To be able to be abundant in meeting the needs of others. To be used in "Godly Giving"? Some may dream, and so do I...

 

[farouk]

My own instinct is to avoid taking welfare if one can possibly help it.

What I find distasteful, though, is when angry people claim that 'it's all the fault of immigrants' or 'all the fault of people from this or that race'.

Whereas the reality is that so often economic needs affect people of various races and irrespective of how long they may have been in the US, or Canada, or elsewhere.

What I find distasteful, also, is when during election time some politicians say nasty things about vulnerable people, in order to get themselves elected on a wave of fear and prejudice. But then once elected they'll take the view: 'Well, now, we don't need to apply the rules too strictly, do we?' Same with political cycles: what the same people might say can differ markedly depending on whether it's before or after the Iowa caucus, or when it's into the lame duck phase of a second term. I'm reminded also of a former Canadian Prime Minister's buddies sticking chewing gum in the payphones during their party rivals' campaign meetings.

The rhetorical aspects of econonic conditions, and the actual conditions themselves may differ markedly.

 

[WIP]

Over the past few years I have had to rely on unemployment and welfare to allow my family to survive. I don't necessarily feel I was entitled to it,

Actually, unemployment insurance is an entitlement, the first 26 weeks anyway. We (our employers on our behalf) pay unemployment insurance premiums just as we pay auto insurance premiums, homeowners insurance premiums, health insurance premiums, etc. It's when the government passes extensions that it becomes less of an entitlement and more of a welfare program.

 

[Milk-Drops]

If a person has no other resources I have no problem with them relying on welfare to help them survive.


Deserve is not what I think about. Rather can they do something that would allow them not to rely on welfare. If they can they need to do it and stop relying on others. If there is nothing they can do they need I have no problem with them relying on it.


Not sure what you mean.

I mainly asked these questions to spark a conversation over how welfare should be or is seen by us. I had a lengthier post in mind originally but I chose to keep it simple. Mainly what I am getting at is that as of the last few years there seems to be a growing disdain for the poor in this nation and assumptions of what the poor do.

Personally I'm libertarian and grew up in a small town. I believe fully in self motivation and doing the best with the resources available to help improve your lot in life. This includes doing your best to stand on your own feet with the least amount of assistance. Now I've met people that have taken advantage of the system and have done my best to avoid these people in general or talk to them about how they aren't really helping themselves in the long run. At the same time I've met people that need the programs just to get by and they are doing their best to try and get out of a bad situation. It can't be helped sometimes.

The whole point of asking whether or not the person is conservative or liberal is to get people to consider something that seems to be an assumed stance on anyone who accepts welfare. There have been many posts where I've seen posters make the comment of " they vote for dems to keep their handouts". Its a blanket statement hoisted on people who both need and don't need welfare to get by and it seems that there isn't a distinction of the person.

its not aimed at anyone, just something that I thought needed some light discussion.

 

[Milk-Drops]

My family, which is pretty conservative, had to be on government welfare for a long time. We had no choice.

I understand and am not judging you based on this. Times are rough rite now and I've seen families that were fine a few years ago completely fall apart financially in this economy. Times are tough and I hope to help people where I can and to extend understanding to those who need it. Sorry to hear of your situation. Is everything working out better now?

 

[Milk-Drops]

The way I see it, the welfare programs are in place to provide some level of help for those in dire situations. When it becomes necessary to use the programs I don't see it as being a leech. My opinion may be somewhat biased however because I did find myself in that situation once.

In January, 1982, I had a good paying job. In today's dollars it would be about $58,000.00 per year. In February of that year I got married. In April of that year I signed my name on a new home mortgage. In mid-May of that year, just a few weeks after buying our house, I was informed that I would be laid off on May 31. So, in the course of four months I was married, bought a house, and got laid off. On top of we were expecting our son in July and the iron range economy in northern MN was at an all-time low. Unemployment was high and there were few jobs available. By late summer I was forced to sell down everything I could afford to get rid of, refinance loans, negotiate payments of other debt, and pay down debt as much as I could to reduce our monthly obligations which included a college student loan, car loan, and medical bills from our son's birth. We managed to survive on unemployment benefits for about a year as the government continued to extend our benefits similar to what was done in recent years due to the economic down-turn. By the spring of 1983 the well was running dry and employment was not in site. We eventually had to turn to the state for assistance. We received food stamps, medical insurance, housing support, and monthly financial support for about three months until I finally managed to find a minimum wage job. We went for about three years without paying any income tax due to low income. I can tell you that I was never so happy to pay taxes as I was the year that I finally earned enough income to have a tax liability.


I don't believe anyone "deserves" help. When I begin to think that the world owes me a living, it will be time for a reality check on my pride. What I believe is fair is help me put food on the table, clothes on my back, and a roof over my head so I can have a chance to pull myself up by my bootstraps and get back on my feet. I do not expect my neighbors to guarantee me my current standard of living. I do expect the state to guarantee that I won't lose my home or any other possessions that I have.

Am I liberal or conservative? You be the judge. I don't particularly care for labels.

Thank you for sharing WIP. I'm glad to hear that things are going better for you. I also don't care for those labels in genral because I don't feel they really mean anything anymore. I agree that we shouldn't expect our neighbors to support our lifestyles, and I do have my personal opinions on welfare and its use, but I do see the situation you were in and am sorry you had to go through it. Thank you for sharing.

 

[Milk-Drops]

Your question is loaded, and reflects "trolling."

Sorry you feel that way.

 

[Jake]

The circumstances the US is under are different than the past few decades, it is a financial mess, an economical upheaval. In the years past, when unemployment rates were at good numbers, if a person was able bodied, they should have been working and not receiving subsidies from the government.

However, because our government has chosen to create a market which detours and sabotages small business growth, unemployment rate is at an extremely high rate, so some people do not have a choice. The jobs available are either ones needing a higher education - engineering, scientists - OR they are service jobs, even though it IS money, it is not enough to support a family. If a person is on welfare, let's hope they are trying to figure out how to get off of it asap. There are many grants and loan availability for higher education, all one needs to do is discover which careers are growing and go for it! In this way, they will eventually be off of welfare and able to support their families.

 

[evenifigoalone]

I understand and am not judging you based on this. Times are rough rite now and I've seen families that were fine a few years ago completely fall apart financially in this economy. Times are tough and I hope to help people where I can and to extend understanding to those who need it. Sorry to hear of your situation. Is everything working out better now?

Yeah, our situation improved pretty drastically a few months back. We were able to pay off a lot of debts, too. We still get one government assistance program for now, but we're off the others, like food stamps, and happy about that.

 

[WIP]

Thank you for sharing WIP. I'm glad to hear that things are going better for you. I also don't care for those labels in genral because I don't feel they really mean anything anymore. I agree that we shouldn't expect our neighbors to support our lifestyles, and I do have my personal opinions on welfare and its use, but I do see the situation you were in and am sorry you had to go through it. Thank you for sharing.

Looking back now, I don't really feel sorry I went through it. It was a humbling and learning experience that taught me a lot about myself. I learned that I can survive without things and even today I don't place a lot of faith in things. Oh, I enjoy life and I have things but I don't live for them anymore. I'm more content.