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Re: autism (continuing from another thread)

evenifigoalone

Fare thee well, Felicia
2024 Supporter

We can continue here if you like, eddif
I didn't want to derail the new members's thread too much.

Something I should mention is that most autistics view our condition as just being different & don't want to be "cured".
Though I will say that the autistic community has an issue with not listening to the voices of the "lower functioning" ones (level 3 & some level 2). I follow a few of them on other sites, including some who cannot verbally speak but will use other means to do so (such as a tablet designed for communication, or sign language sometimes). I've never asked them if they want a cure, but I can tell you they are capable of being happy as they are if needs are met.

I do certainly view autism as a disability, that said I also agree that it's just a different, natural way of being.
It's primarily a social disability, some of us can have casual conversations without being clocked as autistic, especially if we've learn to hide our autistic traits on the surface. Others are almost totally unresponsive to social communication in typical ways, but still seem happy so long as they are allowed to be themselves.

Other symptoms include sensory differences (being overly reactive to outside stimuli, or being under reactive to it), needing strict routine & getting upset if this routine is not followed, having intense interests, and repetitive fidgeting behavior.

People tend to pity us, but we are very capable of being happy so long as our support needs are met and our differences respected.

If an autistic person is having meltdowns on a regular basis, it's usually because their needs are being ignored or because parents or care takers are forcing them to try to appear "normal" instead of respecting their differences.
(Also, meltdowns can come from sensory overload, our nerves being fed up with too much stimuli, which is one of the less pleasant things about being autistic imo.)

(That said, autism can also come with more intense emotions & those can lead to meltdowns as well.)

Some of us, particularly level 1's like me, can pretend to be normal for a period of time. We call it "masking". But in the long run masking is exhausting and contributes to burnout for us.

That's my perspective anyways
 
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We can continue here if you like, eddif
I didn't want to derail the new members's thread too much.

Something I should mention is that most autistics view our condition as just being different & don't want to be "cured".
Though I will say that the autistic community has an issue with not listening to the voices of the "lower functioning" ones (level 3 & some level 2). I follow a few of them on other sites, including some who cannot verbally speak but will use other means to do so (such as a tablet designed for communication, or sign language sometimes). I've never asked them if they want a cure, but I can tell you they are capable of being happy as they are if needs are met.

I do certainly view autism as a disability, that said I also agree that it's just a different, natural way of being.
It's primarily a social disability, some of us can have casual conversations without being clocked as autistic, especially if we've learn to hide our autistic traits on the surface. Others are almost totally unresponsive to social communication in typical ways, but still seem happy so long as they are allowed to be themselves.

Other symptoms include sensory differences (being overly reactive to outside stimuli, or being under reactive to it), needing strict routine & getting upset if this routine is not followed, having intense interests, and repetitive fidgeting behavior.

People tend to pity us, but we are very capable of being happy so long as our support needs are met and our differences respected.

If an autistic person is having meltdowns on a regular basis, it's usually because their needs are being ignored or because parents or care takers are forcing them to try to appear "normal" instead of respecting their differences.
(Also, meltdowns can come from sensory overload, our nerves being fed up with too much stimuli, which is one of the less pleasant things about being autistic imo.)

(That said, autism can also come with more intense emotions & those can lead to meltdowns as well.)

Some of us, particularly level 1's like me, can pretend to be normal for a period of time. We call it "masking". But in the long run masking is exhausting and contributes to burnout for us.

That's my perspective anyways
The lounge may work.

I can tell you look at your #1 area and are fairly happy. Comfort zones are sought.

Paul was in the wretched man area with his flesh and worked in the mind area. The mind area did not promote comfort, but promoted Jesus Christ, and him crucified.

We deliver folks from problems.

You said you did not believe in a magic diet. I linked a magic pill diet. Till you watch the video completely, and discuss the video, I suppose we are done with our conversation.


Mississippi redneck
eddif
 
I did find an official study on it:

I don't get it, but then there is a lot i do not know.
Don’t worry. I know just enough to be considered dangerous.

Your study seems to not be double blind
(No Masking?)

The results were to be decided by Questions.

To be accepted by some the research is doomed from the beginning.

My feeble understanding is:
Double blind research can cost millions
Questions rely on people’s memory and their perceptions.

Ask the two of us to evaluate something and
What answers do we accept.

eddif
 
Autism is diagnosed in the first place largely by "asking questions".

Question: do you work with autistic people, and what is your level of expertise on this? Do you have official recognition for your knowledge?
 
Autism is diagnosed in the first place largely by "asking questions".

Question: do you work with autistic people, and what is your level of expertise on this? Do you have official recognition for your knowledge?
To not wind up in trouble I will repeat. I will only discuss some things in free zone. People tell too much. I am on strike against free zone on most subjects. Am I avoiding answering your question? Absolutely.

Autism is defined by behavior studies. Communication is an area.

Mississippi redneck
eddif
 
To not wind up in trouble I will repeat. I will only discuss some things in free zone. People tell too much. I am on strike against free zone on most subjects. Am I avoiding answering your question? Absolutely.

Autism is defined by behavior studies. Communication is an area.

Mississippi redneck
eddif
How familiar are you with the diagnostic process?
For adults seeking a diagnosis, the process starts with questionnaires such as the RAADs. They also interview your parents or people who knew you well growing up. There are also sessions where they evaluate behaviors in real time (there is a name for the scale they use, I forget), but a lot of the process is by questions. Most mental disorders are diagnosed by asking questions.
 
Earlier you mentioned autistic people being "treated" enough that they can be a school teacher.


As a late recognized adult (I was not diagnosed as a child, though I did have signs for sure as a child), while I don't think I have what it takes to be a school teacher, I have been able to work with children. I most often work with young children, used to be very uncomfortable doing so because I simply had no idea what to do.

After years of being supervised and watching other adults handle children, I have learned to work with toddlers and negotiate conflicts between them, etc. I have also led a small VBS group of elementary age children, three of which were diagnosed with ADHD & I often had to be firm w/ them and present solutions to their symptoms in real time. (Since I also have ADHD I was able to understand them better than most I feel.)
I had another adult with me of course, but only had to ask for help a couple times.
 
How familiar are you with the diagnostic process?
For adults seeking a diagnosis, the process starts with questionnaires such as the RAADs. They also interview your parents or people who knew you well growing up. There are also sessions where they evaluate behaviors in real time (there is a name for the scale they use, I forget), but a lot of the process is by questions. Most mental disorders are diagnosed by asking questions.
Watch the video. See if the children fit your diagnostic criteria. See if the supposed treatment works/seems to work.. My thoughts are probably not worth a hill of beans.

eddif
 
Watch the video. See if the children fit your diagnostic criteria. See if the supposed treatment works/seems to work.. My thoughts are probably not worth a hill of beans.

eddif
How are you defining "treatment"? Autism isn't curable and probably never will be. (And again, the majority of us don't even want to be cured.) Imo good treatment involves mostly respecting our boundaries and needs, accommodating us. When our needs are met we have far fewer issues.

ABA, etc, is child abuse, it's literally conversion therapy repackaged. They try to force autistic children to not act autistic, when there is nothing wrong with acting autistic. The extreme stuff (meltdowns) are almost entirely simply what happens when we are forced to conform or when we aren't accommodated.
 
Earlier you mentioned autistic people being "treated" enough that they can be a school teacher.


As a late recognized adult (I was not diagnosed as a child, though I did have signs for sure as a child), while I don't think I have what it takes to be a school teacher, I have been able to work with children. I most often work with young children, used to be very uncomfortable doing so because I simply had no idea what to do.

After years of being supervised and watching other adults handle children, I have learned to work with toddlers and negotiate conflicts between them, etc. I have also led a small VBS group of elementary age children, three of which were diagnosed with ADHD & I often had to be firm w/ them and present solutions to their symptoms in real time. (Since I also have ADHD I was able to understand them better than most I feel.)
I had another adult with me of course, but only had to ask for help a couple times.
I mentioned a particular probable autistic child that became a school teacher. Good video for after the first video is sort of explored.

I will be as firm toward you as you seem to think that works.

eddif
 
I mentioned a particular probable autistic child that became a school teacher. Good video for after the first video is sort of explored.

I will be as firm toward you as you seem to think that works.

eddif
Ok, that doesn't require making us less autistic to do so. I've never had "treatment" for autism of any kind and I work with children on a regular basis. I have a friend who is autistic who works as a para-professional, they also have never been treated for their autism as it wasn't recognized until adulthood.

Autistic doesn't necessarily equal intellectually impaired, either, though. And even "low functioning" autistics may not be intellectually impaired, they may be considered "low functioning" based on other criteria, it just means they need a lot of support.
The symptoms of autism vary wildly, if you have met 1 autistic person, you have met 1 autistic person.

If you haven't worked with autistic children, or at minimum been in autistic communities to hear our views and opinions, I would maybe cut back on how much of an authority you deem yourself. Studies, etc, have to be repeated many times over with the same or similar results and by different people in different environments before they can be considered conclusive. There are many, many studies out there that are essentially useless because they are not backed up or have yet to be backed up.
 
I will be as firm toward you as you seem to think that works.
I am not a misbehaving child.

P.S. I recommend wrongplanet.net if you want to see what autistic adults may think and talk about. It's a forum like this one.
 
I'm going to go ahead and try to slow this conversation before it gets very far, as I have work tomorrow and can't have active discussions during work days due to the distraction it causes. Thank you for understanding.

I don't know what your credentials or lack therefore are, eddif , and I'll make as few assumptions as possible. But I would ask that you get out there a bit and try to listen to the voices of autistic adults. Even many professionals in the field honestly need to do this.

We by and large don't want cured. We want our boundaries and differences respected. Respected by society, respected by our care givers, and respected by professionals.

I hope this discussion has been fruitful and you haven't felt attacked at any point. Was never my intention.
 
I'm going to go ahead and try to slow this conversation before it gets very far, as I have work tomorrow and can't have active discussions during work days due to the distraction it causes. Thank you for understanding.

I don't know what your credentials or lack therefore are, eddif , and I'll make as few assumptions as possible. But I would ask that you get out there a bit and try to listen to the voices of autistic adults. Even many professionals in the field honestly need to do this.

We by and large don't want cured. We want our boundaries and differences respected. Respected by society, respected by our care givers, and respected by professionals.

I hope this discussion has been fruitful and you haven't felt attacked at any point. Was never my intention.
Epidemiology

Not that I am smart enough to understand totally what it even totally means. I am interested lately in the way people perceive truth to be perceived. Questions asked and discussed as a source of truth? Is it really a way to get to truth or just a flawed process that is supposed science (science so called).

Does religion use the same perception to arriving at truth? Physical health or spiritual wellness are not the same exactly, but there can be parallels. Prosper and be in health even as soul prospers, comes to mind.

Truth comes from God. God hid truth in what he did in creation. Th creation of beach areas to slow storm waves is one of my favorites. Job experienced the protection from the onslaught of Satan.

Autism is an attack on life. Just how to define it is probably not up to us. The demoniac Jesus healed, could he be an example? He got his right mind back.

The mind of Christ in us reveals truth. I don’t think my wisdom will ever solve problems. A letter from a university, employer, religious organization is accepted by some as authority, in defining status.

Being able to see does not exactly come from a randomized double blind study either. Man does need to realize he has vision problems (understanding problems). We go into a study seeking information from God. Elihu went into his deceleration thinking he had an innate wisdom leading him. I relate to the problem Elihu had. I continually have to remind myself to watch what I think or say.
I am not always totally correct (through a glass darkly).

Do not look at the posting of eddif during work hours (if possible).

Mississippi redneck
eddif
 
Ok, that doesn't require making us less autistic to do so. I've never had "treatment" for autism of any kind and I work with children on a regular basis. I have a friend who is autistic who works as a para-professional, they also have never been treated for their autism as it wasn't recognized until adulthood.

Autistic doesn't necessarily equal intellectually impaired, either, though. And even "low functioning" autistics may not be intellectually impaired, they may be considered "low functioning" based on other criteria, it just means they need a lot of support.
The symptoms of autism vary wildly, if you have met 1 autistic person, you have met 1 autistic person.

If you haven't worked with autistic children, or at minimum been in autistic communities to hear our views and opinions, I would maybe cut back on how much of an authority you deem yourself. Studies, etc, have to be repeated many times over with the same or similar results and by different people in different environments before they can be considered conclusive. There are many, many studies out there that are essentially useless because they are not backed up or have yet to be backed up.
The above is so true.
There aren't, I don't think, two autistic persons that have exactly the same symptoms/problems.

Not only are there different levels, but each level will differ in problems or symptoms from person to person.
Some are ALSO intellectually impaired.
Some have high level functioning in some areas.
IOW, my granddaughter can remember anything and bring it to mind at any time.
It's amazing.
But she can't add or do any real math.

She has social anxiety, but loves people and likes to talk to them one on one.
She has a very limited attention span, but could listen to persons tell stories of their lives for hours.

It's all very mysterious.
Probably just some small little thing in the brain that went wrong.
I foresee that it'll be fixed in the future -

Thank God for medication that helps.
 
Despite being autistic I actually hold a leadership position at my job, which I have held onto for 4 years. It's a customer service job, which isn't at all ideal for my disability. But I've been able to adapt enough to have some measure of success. I work the register and the customer service desk, and people often express that I'm their favorite cashier. I also work as a supervisor over the other cashiers most days.

Not all autistics can do what I can, it depends on the degree to which we are disabled by the condition and what our most disabling symptoms are.
I do very much need accommodations for the sensory issues that come with autism, I wear noise reduction earplugs. (Noise reduction headphones would be better, but they would look less professional.) The earplugs keep me from going into sensory overload, which can make me extremely irritable.

Still wish to end it here, but thought I'd give more context on my life and what I've achieved. I wasn't recognized as autistic or ADHD until adulthood, and so was not recognized as having a disability as a child. Therefore I never got any kind of formal treatment or intervention.
We (autistic people) are not always as limited in our abilities as people, the public, trend to think we are.
 
I'm very impressed by you and proud of you.
Just wanted to say that.
Thank you :)

For sure I am the odd one out at my job sometimes. I stim (fidget) in odd ways, especially if stressed or excited. Sometimes when talking with customers I don't know when to stop going on about a topic of interest and it may not be until they walk away that I realize I goofed. Or I'll say something kinda not great before my brain catches up. I have learned to better recognize when I am being odd or awkward, but sometimes I only know that I am being awkward, not how to stop being awkward. Lol
 
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