Seeking....

[Veritas]

[quote:124ef]Veritas wrote:
If you are truely seeking Jesus and call out to Him I guarantee He will answer you. ...and that's not really my guarantee but His.

CuriousAgnostic wrote:
I'm truly seeking the truth man. [/quote:124ef]

Well, cool. If you're seeking truth.. then you know it exists right?

If i'm truly seeking Jesus and him alone, then I already unconditionally believe.

I have to smile. You percieve truths quite well. Maybe AVBunyan should talk about this with you a bit.

Can't do that without proving it to me, i'm a skeptic, I was born that way, and thats who I am.

What kind of proof would you like?

CuriousAgnostic replied:
Think about it.... everyone has that little voice in the back of their head. If you truly believe in christianity, it's jesus, the holy spirit, whatever you want to call it. If your muslim it's allah. If you're an ancient egyptian, it's ra. If you're a skeptic, all that little voice is, is you, your subconcious telling you things.

And one of those voices are telling the truth.

[quote:124ef]Veritas wrote:
Curious, are you really interested?

CuriousAgnostic replied:
I am interested. Just because I don't perscribe to any organized religion doesn't mean I enjoy reading these boards... I do much more reading than posting. Occassionally something tickles my fancy and i'll write.

Sometimes, like the above post, i'm looking for reactions. This helps me understand the point of view of others, and I hope you don't take these more "abrasive" posts as insults, they are not meant to be.[/quote:124ef]

Thats fine. I won't take them as insults. I don't anyways, but I wonder about others motives sometimes.

[quote:124ef]Veritas wrote:
You say "bring on hell". It sounds good in the movies, but do you really mean that?

CuriousAgnostic replied:
Onto hell. Well, as described by the fanciest of imaginations, i'm not too particularly keen on it. Do I think it exists? As much as I think heaven does. Seems way too simplistic to me, and if there is an afterlife i'm hoping it'll be much grander than eternal bliss or eternal torment. I'm betting that just like on this planet, any afterlife is what you make of it. And if there is nothing? Heck, who cares, I won't have any conciousness to care![/quote:124ef]

Well, you just hit on a few things there. Afterlife is what you make of it. God will ultimately let you make what you want of it; if you don't want to be around Him, he will grant that.

And, what do you have to lose? Accepting Christ is quite simple. You just accept that you can't do it on your own. That you've messed up, and need a Savior. There's a chasm between us and God (and your ultimate joy). Christ spans that chasm for us. It not about earning your way to "heaven" as every other religion would have you believe. It's simply faith in Christ.

Too simplistic for ya?

 

[Guest]

Well, cool. If you're seeking truth.. then you know it exists right?

Perhaps. There is some sort of truth out there. I do know there is a difference between percieved truth and absolute truth, and I believe that an absolute truth hasn't yet even been hit on by the likes of man.

What kind of proof would you like?

My buddy who has the website I cannot mention except in that other part of the forum has an interesting article called "Christians, convert me". I kind of like it, it makes sense in a way. It'll at least let you know how to prove it to an atheist, if you even care, and if you want to check out the article, i'll link directly to it, if thats ok. It's an interesting read and i'm sure you'll have a few comments on it. Check it out [urlhttp://www.divinediscussions.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=34&Itemid=37]here[/url]

And one of those voices are telling the truth.

There is only one voice, i'm talking about how you percieve it.

Thats fine. I won't take them as insults. I don't anyways, but I wonder about others motives sometimes.

Understood. There are people who take perverse pleasure in bashing people only for their culture and beliefs; thats not my purpose. I've been on the recieving end for not being one thing or another. Simply, I want verbal discourse with intelligent people such as yourself, from different cultures and backgrounds and beliefs.

And, what do you have to lose? Accepting Christ is quite simple.

Pasquals wager. Might as well accept christ, cuz if you do, and christ is the way, then you win. And if you blink into nothingness, nothing was wasted, EXCEPT FOR:
1) Accepting christ because of pasquals wager is pointless if you're only saying so. Don't you think an omnipotent god can see through that charade?
2)You assume that there are only two choices, the christian way and no way at all. Wouldn't you have egg on your face if you got up to heaven and saw that it was a bunch of arabs climbing all over muhammad and allah? Or egyptians and ra? Or greeks and prometheus? OOOOOO or even pastafarians and the flying sphagetti monster!!

Too simplistic for ya?

Religion and simplicity? No way my friend, those two words NEVER go together ;)

 

[stranger]

CuriousAgnostic wrote:
My buddy who has the website I cannot mention except in that other part of the forum has an interesting article called "Christians, convert me". I kind of like it, it makes sense in a way. It'll at least let you know how to prove it to an atheist, if you even care, and if you want to check out the article, i'll link directly to it, if thats ok. It's an interesting read and i'm sure you'll have a few comments on it. Check it out [urlhttp://www.divinediscussions.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=34&Itemid=37]here[/url]
Religion and simplicity? No way my friend, those two words NEVER go together ;)

Hi CuriousAgnostic,

I had a look at the link and read the article. If it were titled 'Christians, convince me' I might be pursuaded to respond, one point at a time. My take is that it is up to Mike to convert himself (many believers will say he can't do this - it is not a reference to being born again) and this happens by listening to the gospel being preached. This is the simplicity of the Christian faith. So whether the hearer is a four year old or a Professor of Comparative Religion both 'hear' the word in their own capacity as God opens their eye, ear and the heart.

Having said that I am convinced of the reasonableness of the foolishness of the Gospel!

 

[Guest]

If it were titled 'Christians, convince me' I might be pursuaded to respond, one point at a time.

I had him take a look at your respons here.. He thinks that your title suggestion is much more reasonable and he says he's going to change it. He wanted me to thank you too... this is a moving target for him, and he's learning as he goes along.

As far as responding one point at a time, he invites you to do so, if you want to. He actually has a tab on the home page for essay comments, and the comments will be published along side the article. Again, he wants to stress that this is his opinion only, and would most welcome yours and anyone elses.

Having said that I am convinced of the reasonableness of the foolishness of the Gospel!

I'm not quite sure what you meant by that, could you clarify?

 

[Gabbylittleangel]

Religion and simplicity? No way my friend, those two words NEVER go together ;)

Mar 10:15 Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child, he shall not enter therein.

You are right. This is one of the most difficult things to understand.

 

[Gary]

Well, cool. If you're seeking truth.. then you know it exists right?

Perhaps. There is some sort of truth out there. I do know there is a difference between percieved truth and absolute truth, and I believe that an absolute truth hasn't yet even been hit on by the likes of man.

hmm. something rang an alarm bell.

"...I believe that an absolute truth hasn't yet even been hit on by the likes of man."

Do you believe that you have hit on an absolute truth above?


:

 

[eleventyseven]

Religion and simplicity? No way my friend, those two words NEVER go together ;)

Hmmmmm. This is such a loaded comment.

My first reaction is that I want to contradict - but then I remind myself there is a VAST difference between faith and religion.

Personally, I think faith is a lot more simple than people make it out to be.
Sure, there are individual complexities about it, but in the end, you either believe, you don't believe, or you're somewhere in the middle.

Religion? Religion just makes faith complicated.



I like this thread. :3 Please proceed.

 

[stranger]

I'm not quite sure what you meant by that, could you clarify?

Hi,

There is a very famous passage that I had in mind:

1 Corinthians 1:17-31, (NASB)

17For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel, not in cleverness of speech, so that the cross of Christ would not be made void.

The Wisdom of God
18For the word of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.
19For it is written,
"I WILL DESTROY THE WISDOM OF THE WISE,
AND THE CLEVERNESS OF THE CLEVER I WILL SET ASIDE."

20Where is the wise man? Where is the scribe? Where is the debater of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world?

21For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not come to know God, God was well-pleased through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.

22For indeed Jews ask for signs and Greeks search for wisdom;

23but we preach [a]Christ crucified, to Jews a stumbling block and to Gentiles foolishness,

24but to those who are the called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God.

25Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men, and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

26For consider your calling, brethren, that there were not many wise according to the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble;

27but God has chosen the foolish things of the world to shame the wise, and God has chosen the weak things of the world to shame the things which are strong,

28and the base things of the world and the despised God has chosen, the things that are not, so that He may nullify the things that are,

29so that no man may boast before God.

30But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption,

31so that, just as it is written, "LET HIM WHO BOASTS, BOAST IN THE LORD."


Yes I think Christianity is reasonable, very much so. I was converted by reading the book of Leviticus after having read the new testament. I recall that Jesus was called the lamb of God, and that he was very busy - that's what I retained from reading the new testament. In those days I thought once you read a book thats it - its on to the next one. So I was given a copy of the old testament and got as far as the book of Leviticus.

Then I started to get bored with the tedious descriptions of the sacrifical system and saw that sacrifices were offered to God for sin. The trouble was that it had to be repeated so I asked a question:

How can man stop sinning? (to end the tediousness of the sacrificial system.)

The answer came to me - the lamb of God. So I saw that God had a plan - and I believed. That was how it all started. I also met a group of Christians and no doubt they prayed for me.

Anyway, there are Christians from all over the world - mostly US by the look of it. So if you have questions or objections but all means post them.