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Bible Study the 2 beasts

T

tzalam2

Guest
My bible study today…….in your near future

2 beasts in Revelation 13

Beast 1. “A beast….out of the sea†13:1-10

Beast 2. “Another beast…out of the earth†13:11-18

Beast one’s characteristics: rises up out of the sea, 7 heads, 10 horns,ten crowns,

Upon his heads the name of blasphemy

Beast is like a leopard

Feet as of a bear

Mouth as of a lion

Dragon gives him his power, and his seat, (in the U.N.?)

One head has a healed deadly wound

Beast one, with 7 heads and 10 horns, and a seat, and great authority, blasphemes God, his name, his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven

Beast one makes war with the saints, and overcomes them

If your name is NOT written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world,

you shall worship him, this beast

Beast two’s characteristics: comes up out of the earth

Has 2 horns like a lamb

Speaks as a DRAGON, though

(remember, anytime the dragon is mentioned, it is reference to Satan)

Beast 2 exercises all the power of the 1st beast

Makes the dwellers on the earth to worship the first beast, emphasis on the healed deadly wound

Does great wonders

Makes fire come down from heaven on the earth, in the sight of men

Deceives people by doing miracles in the sight of the beast

He has power to give life to the IMAGE of the beast

Makes the IMAGE of the beast speak

Has the ability to cause death to anyone NOT worshipping the IMAGE of the beast

Beast number 2 is the one who makes everyone receive a mark in their right hand,

or forehead, if they want to buy or sell

The 2nd beast of Chapter 13 in Revelation is called the devil, the beast, and the FALSE PROPHET,

In Revelation 20:10

May God open your eyes, and your mind to His Holy truth and wisdom, and may you let the word of the Lord dwell richly in your heart. Forever. Amen.
 
See, I really don't believe the Beast to be a man. I still cannot comprehend the Beast but I do not know that he is not some ultra-slick dude who is going to sit in a temple and proclaim himself the supreme being of the universe and all people will follow. Come on!

No, I believe in a more spiritual significance to the Book of Revelation. I'm not Preterist or Dispensationist, and I'm not a Presentist(not sure if that is a word.) So what am I? Here is what I believe.

Rev 1:3 Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein:, for the time is at hand.

Does anybody grasp this Scripture? Who ever hears the words of this prophecy and keeps it's things, then the time is at hand. The time was at hand when John wrote this 2000 years ago. It is at hand when I am reading it now. But then again who believes the Scriptures.
 
Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2005 3:32 am Post subject:

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See, I really don't believe the Beast to be a man. I still cannot comprehend the Beast but I do not know that he is not some ultra-slick dude who is going to sit in a temple and proclaim himself the supreme being of the universe and all people will follow. Come on!
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God doesn't deal in anything unnatural. The 1st beast Rev 13:1 has seven heads, meaning its a political system. The book of Revelation is like a big picture book to draw a picture in your mind. There is alot of symbolism.

Rev 13:1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

There is a monster who rises up out of the sea. And he has seven heads! Do you know of any real animal or beast who has seven heads?

This is the structure of the New World Order, the one world system, what we call the United Nations today.

Who is the dragon? Rev 12:9 The dragon is Satan which had the same power structure in the 1st earth age. Rev12:3

What is the sea?

Rev 17:15 And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues .

What are the ten horns?

Dan 7:24 And the ten horns out of this kingdom [are] ten kings [that] shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.

Rev 17:12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.

These are ten king will be present during the reign of Antichrist, during that great hour of temptation. Are these ten kings ten leaders of countries today? Probably not. They were present in the 1st eath ape, they will most likely accompany Satan a part of the angels who are ast out with him. They will reign over, the whole world, all seven continents.

Rev 13:2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as [the feet] of a bear, What is this analogy "and his feet were as the feet of a bear"?
The "feet of a bear" speaks of that which is 'obstructing by ferocity'.

leopards have spots, Deut 32:5 not the spot of Gods children, but this system is run by the tares.

What are the names of blasphemy? Satan appearing as the Messiah, 2 Ths 2. And his angels will be with him appearing as "minister of Christ" 2 Cor 11:13-15. Now that is very blasphemous!

feet of a bear? What is this analogy "and his feet were as the feet of a bear"?
The "feet of a bear" speaks of that which is 'obstructing by ferocity'.

"his mouth as the mouth of a lion"?
And, it's 'roar' is ferocious sounding.
Some people look upon the roar of a lion as a sign of 'courage and strength', but we can also look at it as being bold in it's manner of speech.

"and the dragon (Satan)gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority"
The backbone of this beastly governmental entity comes from that which it had been in the 1st and 2nd Heaven ages. He used it before in the 1 earth age Rev 12:3, he will use it again.


Rev 1:3 Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein:, for the time is at hand.
Does anybody grasp this Scripture? Who ever hears the words of this prophecy and keeps it's things, then the time is at hand. The time was at hand when John wrote this 2000 years ago. It is at hand when I am reading it now. But then again who believes the Scriptures.
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Do you have ears of hear?

http://www.docrob.100megsfree5.com/appe ... end142.htm
and Keep the things which are written therein.

You have to remember John was taken in the spirit to the Lords day and shown things that would happen just before the lords day to after the lords day. John was in the spirit, not some church. This is a very important vs to understand.

Rev 1:10 I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,
 
As I said I don't know much about this subject but do believe that the Book of Revelation is at hand now and was at hand 2000 years ago.

There is alot of symbolism.
Click to expand...

The entire book is signified[symbolized].

2 Thessalonians 2:3 (King James Version) Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition[destruction];

2 Thessalonians 2:4 (King James Version)Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God[you are the temple of God], shewing himself that he is God.

Revelation 13:5 (King James Version) And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.

I don't claim to be an awesome scholar (so I cannot argue this futher less I disgrace God) or to know the depths of God but I am learning.
 
As I said I don't know much about this subject but do believe that the Book of Revelation is at hand now and was at hand 2000 years ago.

There is alot of symbolism.
Click to expand...

The entire book is signified[symbolized].

2 Thessalonians 2:3 (King James Version) Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition[destruction];

2 Thessalonians 2:4 (King James Version)Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God[you are the temple of God], shewing himself that he is God.

Revelation 13:5 (King James Version) And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.

I don't claim to be an awesome scholar (so I cannot argue this further less I disgrace God) or to know the depths of God but I am learning.
 
Bear, lion

The bear makes reference to the ancient Medo-Persian empire, and the lion, the Babylonian empire. What this is showing is that the empire of the beast of revelation will rise to power on the wings (so to speak) of the peoples and nations that now dwell in the lands of these ancient empires. Actually, there are seven ancient empires that usurped control over and did damage to, Israel in the past: Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, MedoPersia, Rome, and Germany. Many people think the seventh should be the Ottoman Empire, but I choose Germany, because it is written that this seventh will be only for a short while, and I believe all seven of these were empires that did great damage to Israel: i.e., carry them off captive, have wars with, etc. The Ottoman empire pretty much left them alone, and they were around for many, many, years.

What is the wound? It is written that the seven heads are seven nations and seven kings. The wound was one of the heads, or one of the seven nations/kings. Which of theses ancient empires has recently been destroyed by the sword? Iraq! Iraq is on the geographic area of ancient Babylon, and her "king," has been dethroned. It is very interesting to me that he was not killed; just removed from power. I am not dogmatic about Iraq being the deadly wound, but it fits perfectly.

Coop
 
Re: Bear, lion

lecoop said:
What is the wound? It is written that the seven heads are seven nations and seven kings. The wound was one of the heads, or one of the seven nations/kings. Which of theses ancient empires has recently been destroyed by the sword? Iraq! Iraq is on the geographic area of ancient Babylon, and her "king," has been dethroned. It is very interesting to me that he was not killed; just removed from power. I am not dogmatic about Iraq being the deadly wound, but it fits perfectly.
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Iraq was a very good type for a wound to a head/nation. But did Iraq support the United Nations? No

Rev 17:9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth.

mountains/heads are nations that support the UN.
The word "mountains" is an analogy used to represent 'governments', 'kingdoms', and / or 'nations'.
This analogy comes from the fact that a 'mountain' is lifted up higher and above the surrounding land or plain, in the same manner that 'governments/kingdoms/nations' rise above the people, to rule the people.

Rev 17:10 And there are seven kings five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.
five are fallen, fallen kingdoms/types of beast systems
'kingdoms' which have ruled over Jerusalem:

Five fallen: (the words "are fallen" refers to 'the loss of power to reign')
types/examples of beast systems.

1. Babylon, represents lion
2. Medio-Persia, bear, and Persia by the leopard
3. Greece,dreadful and terrible beast
4. Rome, political beast
5. Mohammedans,religious beast

One is:
6. The good and bad figs (True Judah and spurious Judah (tares)

Rev 17:11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.

Satan's "beast" government is the 7th government/kingdom which shall have rule over Jerusalem, and from Jerusalem, the world.

Rev 17:12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.
These same "ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings" were spoken of in Daniel 7. These are the ten supernatural entities which come disguised as 'kings/prophets' of old times. 2 Crn 11:13-15. Which are the same 'ten toes' on which Satan political/religious beastly image/government
stands upon.
It is these 'toes' which give balance to the feet of this top heavy 'image' spoken of in Daniel 2:42, allowing it to stand.

Rev 17:13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.
These ten supernatural, spurious kings/prophets are all of the same way of thinking. That is, they all think upon Satan as their 'King/God'; and their will is to do Satan's will. They give all their power and strength to Satan's government/kingdom .

Rev 17:14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

Matt 20:16, for many be called, but few chosen, many called to salvation, few chosen elect.

Rev 17: 15 And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues.

16 And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.
Jerusalem literally means 'the teaching of peace. These fallen angels shall hate the 'teaching of Peace, the teaching of truth.
These also "shall hate the whore", this city because this is GOD's most favorite place, where HE shall dwell in the Eternity.

17 For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.
the word "whore" refers to 'idolatry'.
Therefore this "woman" has become an 'idolatrous woman'.
And, since verse 18 speaks of what this woman represents,

18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.

This "great city" speaks of Jerusalem.
 
18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.

This "great city" speaks of Jerusalem.
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Anyone with this kind of thinking is obviously a Preterist. Whenever did Jerusalem ever "reign over the kings of the earth"? I don't think anyone on this forum has "Stupid" stamped on their foreheads. Jerusalem doesn't even "sit on seven hills" so, this is all false Preterist doctrine.

The woman in Revelation 17 is a city (Rome) which sits on seven hills (Rome) that reigns over the kings of the earth.

Here is no mystical or allegorical language but an unambiguous statement in plain words: "The woman ... is that great city." There is no justification for seeking some other hidden meaning. Yet books have been written and sermons preached insisting that "Mystery Babylon" is the United States. That is clearly not the case, for the United States is a country, not a city. One might justifiably refer to the United States as Sodom, considering the honor now given to homosexuals, but it is definitely not the Babylon that John sees in this vision. The woman is a city.

Furthermore, she is a city built on seven hills. That specification eliminates ancient Babylon. Only one city has for more than 2000 years been known as the city on seven hills. That city is Rome. The Catholic Encyclopedia states: "It is within the city of Rome, called the city of seven hills, that the entire area of Vatican State proper is now confined."

Popes crowned and deposed kings and emperors, exacting obedience by threatening them with excommunication. At the time of the First Vatican Council in 1869, J.H. Ignaz von Dollinger, Professor of Church History in Munich, warned that Pope Pius IX would force the Council to make an infallible dogma out of "that pet theory of the Popes  that they could force kings and magistrates, by excommunication and its consequences, to carry out their sentences of confiscation, imprisonment, and death...." He reminded his fellow Roman Catholics of some of the evil consequences of papal political authority:

When, for instance, [Pope] Martin IV placed King Pedro of Aragon under excommunication and interdict...then promised indulgences for all their sins to these who fought with him and [tyrant] Charles [I of Naples) against Pedro, and finally declared his kingdom forfeit...which cost the two kings of France and Aragon their life, and the French the loss of an army...

Pope Clement IV, in 1265, after selling millions of South Italians to Charles of Anjou for a yearly tribute of eight hundred ounces of gold, declared that he would be excommunicated if the first payment was deferred beyond the appointed term, and that for the second neglect the whole nation would incur interdict....

Only of the Vatican could it be said that a city reigns over the kings of the earth. The phrase "the worldwide influence of Washington" means the influence not of that city but of the United States, which has its capital there. When one speaks, however, of the influence of the Vatican around the world, that is exactly what is meant  the city and the worldwide power of Roman Catholicism and its leader the pope. Vatican City is absolutely unique.

Moreover, for more than a thousand years the Roman Catholic Church exercised both religious and civil control over the entire city of Rome and its surroundings. Pope Innocent III (1198-1216) abolished the secular Roman Senate and placed the administration of Rome directly under his command. The Roman Senate that had governed the city under the Caesars had been known as the Curia Romana (Roman Curia). That name, according to the Pocket Catholic Dictionary, is now the designation of "the whole ensemble of administrative and judicial offices through which the Pope directs the operations of the Catholic Church.

Partial or full Preteristism is nothing short of heresy in an attempt to say all prophecy was ended with the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD and takes away the blame of who the real whore of Revelation 17 really is and directs it toward Jerusalem.
 
Anyone with this kind of thinking is obviously a Preterist. Whenever did Jerusalem ever "reign over the kings of the earth"? I don't think anyone on this forum has "Stupid" stamped on their foreheads. Jerusalem doesn't even "sit on seven hills" so, this is all false Preterist doctrine.
pret•er•ist
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Jerusalem is GODs favorite spot not Rome. He took her to WIFE Spiritually Eze 16.
Rev 11:8 She is like Sodom( spiritually perversion and Egypt,= captivity).

She WILL be polluted with Satan standing there 2 ths2:4 , Zep 3:1
Has this happened yet? No

As Satan runs the New Word Order Political beast Rev 13:1, Rev 18:10
But Jerusalem will be the headquarters of the Universe for all enternity Rev 21:2

Luk 13:34 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, which killest the prophets, and stonest them that are sent unto thee; how often would I have gathered thy children together, as a hen doth gather her brood under her wings, and ye would not!

Jer 25:15 For thus saith the LORD God of Israel unto me; Take the wine cup of this fury at my hand, and cause all the nations, to whom I send thee, to drink it.

Jer 25:16 And they shall drink, and be moved, and be mad, because of the sword that I will send among them.

Jer 25:17 Then took I the cup at the LORD's hand, and made all the nations to drink, unto whom the LORD had sent me:
the cup Rev 16

Jer 25:18 To wit, Jerusalem, and the cities of Judah, and the kings thereof, and the princes thereof, to make them a desolation, an astonishment, an hissing, and a curse; as it is this day;

Jer 25:29 For, lo, I begin to bring evil on the city (WHAT CITY IS THAT? ) which is called by my name, and should ye be utterly unpunished? Ye shall not be unpunished: for I will call for a sword upon all the inhabitants of the earth, saith the LORD of hosts.

Rev 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

Rev 18:5For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.

Rev 18:6 Reward her even as she rewarded you, and double unto her double according to her works: in the cup which she hath filled fill to her double.

Rev 18:7How much she hath glorified herself, and lived deliciously, so much torment and sorrow give her: for she saith in her heart, I sit a queen, and am no widow, and shall see no sorrow.

Rev 18:10 Standing afar off for the fear of her torment, saying, Alas, alas, that great city Babylon, that mighty city! (AND HERE SHE IS CALLED A CITY) for in one hour is thy judgment come.

16 And saying, Alas, alas, that great city, that was clothed in fine linen, and purple, and scarlet, and decked with gold, and precious stones, and pearls!

17 For in one hour so great riches is come to nought. And every shipmaster, and all the company in ships, and sailors, and as many as trade by sea, stood afar off,

18 And cried when they saw the smoke of her burning, saying, What city is like unto this great city!

19 And they cast dust on their heads, and cried, weeping and wailing, saying, Alas, alas, that great city, wherein were made rich all that had ships in the sea by reason of her costliness! for in one hour is she made desolate.
one hour, hour of temptation

20 Rejoice over her, thou heaven, and ye holy apostles and prophets; for God hath avenged you on her.

21 And a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea, saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all.

millstone is Christ Dan 2:34

Jerusalem doesn't even "sit on seven hills"
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From Jerusalem, Anti-Christ will rule the seven continents (the whole world) .
 
Revelation 11:8
And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which dspiritually is called Sodom and Egypt,where also our Lord was crucified.

That is, openly at Rome: where at that time was a most great crowd of people, the year of Jubile being then first ordained by Boniface to the same end, in the year 1300. So by one act he committed two wrongs against Christ, both abolishing his truth by restoring the type of the Jubile, and triumphing over his members by wicked superstition. Now that we should understand the things of Rome, John himself is the author, both after in the seventeenth chapter almost throughout, and also in the restriction now next following, when he says, it is that great city (as he calls it) Revelation 17:18 and is spiritually termed Sodom and Egypt: and that spiritually (for that must here again be repeated from before) Christ was there crucified. For the two first names signify spiritual wickednesses: the latter signifies the show and pretence of good, that is, of Christian and sound religion. Sodom signifies most licentious impiety and in the most confident glorying of that city, as it were in true religion, being yet full of falsehood and ungodliness. Now who is ignorant that these things do rather, and better fit Rome, than any other city? The commendations of the city of Rome for many years past, are publicly notorious, which are not for me to gather together. This only I will say, that he long since did very well see what Rome is, who upon leaving, used these verses: "Roma vale, vidi, Satis est vidisse: revertar, Quumleno, meretrix, scurra, cinadus ero." "Now farewell Rome, I have seen thee, it was enough to see: I will return when as I mean, bawd, harlot knave to be".


Jerusalem is GODs favorite spot not Rome.
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Agreed...that goes without saying or being implied. That's why the plagues he mentions will not befall Jerusalem but Rome, for all her adultery, false religious system,, blasphemy and shedding more blood that any people at any time-either pagan Rome or so called, Christian Rome. She has the blood of the Martyrs of Jesus dripping from her fingers. and will utterly be destroyed.

In relating Jeremiah with Revelation you're talking about two entirely different aspects of God's wrath. He did indeed destroy Jerusalem and over and over chasten his people in a variety of ways. However, this has nothing to do with the book of Revelation and his judgement on the Great whore of the 17th Chapter. No other city or people fit the description the angel gave John but Rome itself and their apostate religious system. Albeit, they will not be the only ones who are subject to God's wrath in that day. All false religious systems will drink of the wine of the wrath of God. All her offspring will befall the wrath and judment of God since they have made themselves an idolatrous people

Babylon has always been just anotner word for Rome. Even Catholic apologist will agree on this. Revelation is not talking about Jerusalems demise in speaking of the different beast in chapter 13 or 17. As I said, only a Preterist has this mindset which is Jesuit-Romanism in nature. Had the Reformers been preterist in their approach to the book of Revelation and believed that the Antichrist was Nero (which teaching Gentry, De Mar and other Jesuit preterists uphold, although Calvin called this is an old wife’s tale), there would have been no Protestant Reformation at all. Why? Because the Reformers main teaching called for separation from the Great Whore of Babylon, the mystical Antichrist at Rome, so that they would not commit spiritual fornication with the great prostitute church, which they all taught was still going on in the 16th century - long after the death of Nero!

What passes for Protestant Reformed teaching today, as we see, may be Jesuit-Romanist, so let us all do our homework indeed. Do not take my word for it. Christians should do their own historical homework. Do not believe that all those who go under the banner of Reformed teaching have necessarily done their homework because some who think they have, obviously have not and any Christian should fully and unequivocally reject any style of Preteristism as it is a last ditch effort by Rome to take the heat off of them, being truly the Great Whore of Revelation 17 and trying in a vain attempt to thwart the biblical implication of her ruin and complete destruction onto God's beloved city-Jerusalem.

Do you believe the following...

1.) All prophecy from Revelation 1:1 to 20:1 is fulfilled and past, having occurred before the end of 70AD.
2.) All of Matthew 24 was fulfilled by close of 70AD.
3.) All text using the terms "last day, or last days" refer to the time between 30AD and 70AD and are all fulfilled.
4.) The marriage of the Lamb in Rev 19:7-9 took place with the saints living after 70AD in that generation.
5.) The Gospel of the Kingdom to be preached to all the world (age) (Matt 24:14) was fulfilled and ended in 70AD.
6.)That the whore of Revelation 17 is Jerusalem.

If so, then you are a Preterist and I totally reject that belief.

That "great city" in Revelation is none other than Rome which is the Mother of Harlots and Abominations of the earth...drunk with the blood of the saints and of the martyrs of Jesus. Revelation 17:5-6
 
Let's not forget that revelations is actually "the Revealation of Jesus the Messiah".

Too much analysis leads to paralysis. :)
 
D46 wrote
Do you believe the following...

1.) All prophecy from Revelation 1:1 to 20:1 is fulfilled and past, having occurred before the end of 70AD.
Click to expand...
Nope John was taken in the spirit to the LORDS Day Rev1:10

2.) All of Matthew 24 was fulfilled by close of 70AD.
Click to expand...
Nope Matt 24,luke 21,mark 13 are Prophesy which is coming to pass before our very eyes.

3.) All text using the terms "last day, or last days" refer to the time between 30AD and 70AD and are all fulfilled.
Click to expand...
H 0319 after part, end
a) end, issue, event
b) latter time (prophetic for future time)
c) posterity
d) last, hindermost
nope they aren't fullfilled yet

4.) The marriage of the Lamb in Rev 19:7-9 to
ok place with the saints living after 70AD in that generation.
Click to expand...
The bride of Christ happens in Rev 19., parable of the wedding Matt 22 Some are all ready GOD's wife from the 1st earth age. Don't get the bride and wife mixed up.

5.) The Gospel of the Kingdom to be preached to all the world (age) (Matt 24:14) was fulfilled and ended in 70AD.
Click to expand...
no it was not
Mat 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
Ad 70 wasn't it.

6.)That the whore of Revelation 17 is Jerusalem.
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You have to think spiritually on this one. She's like a city Babylon . Where does Satan stand? 2 Ths 2,Rev 14:8

You seem stuck on AD 70 when Jerusalem was taken. Well the western wall still stands. Mark 13:1-2. Hopefully you don't think that is when the seals took place?

If so, then you are a Preterist and I totally reject that belief.
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I am not sure what doctrine a Preterist is, or what they teach, never heard the word preterist before. I just read and study the word not what some man teaches. Hopefully you did read my answer to your questions.
 
irishrain said:
Asaph wrote
Do you believe the following...

1.) All prophecy from Revelation 1:1 to 20:1 is fulfilled and past, having occurred before the end of 70AD.
Click to expand...
Nope John was taken in the spirit to the LORDS Day Rev1:10

[quote:00e54]2.) All of Matthew 24 was fulfilled by close of 70AD.
Click to expand...
Nope Matt 24,luke 21,mark 13 are Prophesy which is coming to pass before our very eyes.

3.) All text using the terms "last day, or last days" refer to the time between 30AD and 70AD and are all fulfilled.
Click to expand...
H 0319 after part, end
a) end, issue, event
b) latter time (prophetic for future time)
c) posterity
d) last, hindermost
nope they aren't fullfilled yet

4.) The marriage of the Lamb in Rev 19:7-9 to
ok place with the saints living after 70AD in that generation.
Click to expand...
The bride of Christ happens in Rev 19., parable of the wedding Matt 22 Some are all ready GOD's wife from the 1st earth age. Don't get the bride and wife mixed up.

5.) The Gospel of the Kingdom to be preached to all the world (age) (Matt 24:14) was fulfilled and ended in 70AD.
Click to expand...
no it was not
Mat 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
Ad 70 wasn't it.

6.)That the whore of Revelation 17 is Jerusalem.
Click to expand...
You have to think spiritually on this one. She's like a city Babylon . Where does Satan stand? 2 Ths 2,Rev 14:8

You seem stuck on AD 70 when Jerusalem was taken. Well the western wall still stands. Mark 13:1-2. Hopefully you don't think that is when the seals took place?

If so, then you are a Preterist and I totally reject that belief.
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I am not sure what doctrine a Preterist is, or what they teach, never heard the word preterist before. I just read and study the word not what some man teaches. Hopefully you did read my answer to your questions.[/quote:00e54]

I don't know what happened, but Asaph did not write all that. :lol:
 
D46 said
Furthermore, she is a city built on seven hills.
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God is not talking about seven physical hills! This is speaking of seven nations and the seven leader or kings of these seven nations. The city of Rome is therefore excluded. God is not talking about the Catholic church!

irishrain said
Iraq was a very good type for a wound to a head/nation. But did Iraq support the United Nations? No
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Why do you believe that the United Nations has anything to do with this? God said that the beast would rise or come to power on the seven empires, of which 5 were fallen. They were Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, MedoPersia, Greece, Rome, and Germany, IMHO. I don't think these nations have much to do with the United Nations or the European Common Market Nations.

Coop
 
Why do you believe that the United Nations has anything to do with this? God said that the beast would rise or come to power on the seven empires, of which 5 were fallen. They were Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, MedoPersia, Greece, Rome, and Germany, IMHO. I don't think these nations have much to do with the United Nations or the European Common Market Nations.
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Coop[/quote]

This "sea", or masses of people are looking to this "beast" [political beast] as their peace system. The "seven heads" are seven dominions of the people, or seven continents of this world body; as even the activities and divisions at the North and South Poles are governed through the United Nations Charter. It covers the entire world land masses.

We have the one world political system now in position, and in control. The world is now in the process of being divided into its new horns of power, and the divisions will change present boundaries into new dominions of power.

This system, and governmental order is the same as Satan used in the first earth age, in Revelation 12:3 however there are some major differences Notice that in Revelation 12:3 from the first earth age that the seven heads wore the seven crowns. where by in this earth age, under the political beast of the United Nations there will be 10 crowns. Rev 13:1

They were Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, MedoPersia, Greece, Rome, and Germany
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These were types of Beast systems of past of the" known world then", but not now.
Ask yourself is this world wide? Only the United Nations covers the entire world now.
 
God is not talking about seven physical hills! This is speaking of seven nations and the seven leader or kings of these seven nations. The city of Rome is therefore excluded. God is not talking about the Catholic church!
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Wrong...when it says seven hills, that's what it means. Pretty plain to me. Rome is in the forefront of God's wrath although many others will follow that forsake the truth in Gods' word. That includes not only Rome, but every apostate religion.

Revelation 17:9 (KJV) And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth.

This refers undoubtedly to Rome the seven-hilled city--Septicollis Roma. The seven heads, saith the angel, are seven mountains, that is, signify seven mountains: a clear description of Rome, as to its local situation, being built upon seven hills.

God is talking about the instigator of false religious systems (situated in Rome...Vatican City proper) and all the harlot daughter she has spawned.

And again...

Revelation 17:18 (KJV) And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.

That is, Rome that great city, or only city (as Justinian calls it) the king and head of which was then the emperor, but now the pope, since the condition of the beast was changed.
 
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