Bible Study The Body of Christ

[Betty]

One of the passages that I hear referenced often today from non-believers , (and sometimes believers) comes from from John Ch. 17.

In the passage, Jesus is saying a prayer for all who believe and all who would ever believe because of His word.

Jesus includes this in the prayer:

John 17:21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

One thing that I’ve learned in my own studies of the scriptures is that, many times when a statement is made such as in the verse above, we can’t jump to conclusions about what it means. However, the bible examined in context reveals exactly what it means.

Jesus is the King of Kings and Lord of Lords, and He is seated on the throne in heaven.

In the book of revelations John wrote this regarding Jesus.

Revelation 4:8 And the four beasts had each of them six wings about him; and they were full of eyes within: and they rest not day and night, saying, Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty, which was, and is, and is to come.

The saints are spoken of in Revelations but they are not seated on the throne only those who "overcome,," are seated with Christ. "With Christ," are the key words there.

Paul speaks of the saints being seated with Christ, but looked at closely, it says exactly this:

Ephesians 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
Ephesians 2:6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

It does not say that we are seated on the throne but that, "He raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus." This is all about abiding in HIM and seeking all things in Him.

The only mention of any members of the body being seated on the throne is in Revelations and it is about overcoming.

Revelation 3:21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

The above verse is directly from a word to one of the seven Revelation Churches. It's speaking about the end, and overcoming the world in Christ.

Colossians 3:1 If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.

I love to study everything out prayerfully, so I have a tendency to write everything that comes to mind. So here is my attempt to keep this a bit short/er. I wanted to share examples of how God uses the body (the church,) through the gifts that he gives us, and to show how Jesus is the fullness of the Godhead.

There’s a consistent them throughout the word of God, where gifts were given through the Holy Spirit to accomplish God’s will.

The first example of this would be the original temple in the wilderness. God gifted different people with knowledge and understanding so that the work being done would be done in wisdom and in understanding, and in all knowledge of workmanship.

Exodus 31:3 And I have filled him with the spirit of God, in wisdom, and in understanding, and in knowledge, and in all manner of workmanship,
Exodus 31:4 To devise cunning works, to work in gold, and in silver, and in brass,
Exodus 31:5 And in cutting of stones, to set them, and in carving of timber, to work in all manner of workmanship.

In the NT, Paul speaks of this as well.

1 Corinthians 12:27 Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular.
1 Corinthians 12:28 And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues.
1 Corinthians 12:29 Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles?
1 Corinthians 12:30 Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret?

Just as different people were given different gifts to work together in building the wilderness temple, God gave gifts to different people within the body of Christ to work together in building the church.

The Spirit being given to men to carry out God’s will through Christ, who is the only way, the only truth and the only life.

As with Corinthians 12, where Paul listed all of the different gifts given to the members of the body, the bible tells us this about Jesus.

John 3:34 For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.
John 3:35 The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.

Colossians 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

Jesus is the head of the church He has the Spirit without measure, where the members are used by gifts given by measure this is what makes up the body.

Paul describes faith in the same way.

Romans 12:3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

Jesus is the head of the body,

So back to John 17.

John 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

Jesus didn’t just show up, He was with God before the world was.

John 17:6 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.
John 17:7 Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee.

John 17:8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.

The prayer itself sets the focus on exactly who Christ is, on His word, and on those who believe.

John 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

One body, Christ being the head and each member of the body given a measure of faith and gifts within the body in building up the the church, through Christ who, in HIM is the “fullness of the Godhead.” Not any man, but Christ alone.This is why we are told to abide in Him. This is what the prayer in John 17 was all about.

Jesus Himself tells us that when we are in heaven we will be as the angels in heaven, and He is seated on the throne.

Matthew 22:30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

 

[Jim Parker]

Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

In the passage, Jesus is saying a prayer for all who believe and all who would ever believe because of His word.

Jesus includes this in the prayer:

John 17:21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

The rest of the passage :

Jhn 17:20-23 I do not pray for these only, but also for those who believe in me through their word, that they may all be one; even as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be in us, so that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. The glory which thou hast given me I have given to them, that they may be one even as we are one, I in them and thou in me, that they may become perfectly one, so that the world may know that thou hast sent me and hast loved them even as thou hast loved me.

So, when the world sees that we are not "one"; inf act, that we are very far from being "one" but, rather we are Catholic, and Baptist, and Pentecostal, and Methodist, and Orthodox, and a multitude of denominations, sects, and schisms which cannot have fellowship with one another, the world might reasonably conclude that God did not send Jesus and that God does not love them.

We would rather be theologically right than submit to Jesus' will.


iakov the fool
(beaucoup dien cai dau)


DISCLAIMER: By reading the words posted above, you have made a free will choice to expose yourself to the rantings of iakov the fool. The poster assumes no responsibility for any temporary, permanent or otherwise annoying manifestations of cognitive dysfunction that, in any manner, may allegedly be related to the reader’s deliberate act by which he/she has knowingly allowed the above rantings to enter into his/her consciousness. No warrantee is expressed or implied. Individual mileage may vary. And, no, I don't want to hear about it. No sniveling! Enjoy the rest of your life here and the eternal one to come.

 

[Betty]

Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

The rest of the passage :

Jhn 17:20-23 I do not pray for these only, but also for those who believe in me through their word, that they may all be one; even as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be in us, so that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. The glory which thou hast given me I have given to them, that they may be one even as we are one, I in them and thou in me, that they may become perfectly one, so that the world may know that thou hast sent me and hast loved them even as thou hast loved me.

So, when the world sees that we are not "one"; inf act, that we are very far from being "one" but, rather we are Catholic, and Baptist, and Pentecostal, and Methodist, and Orthodox, and a multitude of denominations, sects, and schisms which cannot have fellowship with one another, the world might reasonably conclude that God did not send Jesus and that God does not love them.

We would rather be theologically right than submit to Jesus' will.


iakov the fool
(beaucoup dien cai dau)


DISCLAIMER: By reading the words posted above, you have made a free will choice to expose yourself to the rantings of iakov the fool. The poster assumes no responsibility for any temporary, permanent or otherwise annoying manifestations of cognitive dysfunction that, in any manner, may allegedly be related to the reader’s deliberate act by which he/she has knowingly allowed the above rantings to enter into his/her consciousness. No warrantee is expressed or implied. Individual mileage may vary. And, no, I don't want to hear about it. No sniveling! Enjoy the rest of your life here and the eternal one to come.

How does one know what the will of Jesus is if he or she hasn't studied to show themselves approved and sought out the real meaning in Christ?

In my post I tried to explain that Jesus is the only way, the only truth and the only life. There is no person alive on this earth today who that can be said of. Only Jesus. That doesn't negate being in Him. But the the clear differences in scriptures show the entire body working together in Him. At least, here on earth.

That's actually the reason I did this study, I spoke to a few different people within a few weeks who, one claimed to be "god," since the bible says that we are created in His image, and another claimed to be the same as Jesus and a "Christ," based on John ch. 17.
Jesus is the only savoir, and as Christians, He is head over each of us. He is the captain of our souls.

Romans 10:12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
Romans 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
Romans 10:14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

God has always used people to preach in the bible and with the exception of a few denominations, they all have the same bible.

In God's word, there aren't theological differences. Paul taught the same things to all of the churches.
Paul didn't tell the Galatians, "You are a sect of Christians, let's call you Catholic," or the Corinths, "we'll call you Baptists or Pentecostals."

Theological differences is another subject all together.

Ephesians 4:2 With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love;
Ephesians 4:3 Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.
Ephesians 4:4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
Ephesians 4:5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
Ephesians 4:6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

1 Corinthians 1:10 Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

All who believe in Jesus are called to mature and grow in Him, and His word is our instruction.

There are examples of divisions in the scriptures. There was on point where Paul said this.

1 Corinthians 3:3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
1 Corinthians 3:4 For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?
1 Corinthians 3:5 Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man?
1 Corinthians 3:6 I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase.
1 Corinthians 3:7 So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.

 

[Nathan]

How does on know what the will of Jesus is if he or she hasn't studied to show themselves approved and sought out the real meaning in Christ?

In my post I tried to explain that Jesus is the only way, the only truth and the only life. There is no person alive on this earth today who that can be said of. Only Jesus. That doesn't negate being in Him. But the the clear differences in scriptures show the entire body working together in Him. At least, here on earth.

That's actually the reason I did this study, I spoke to a few different people within a few weeks who, one claimed to be "god," since the bible says that we are created in His image, and another claimed to be the same as Jesus and a "Christ," based on John ch. 17.
Jesus is the only savoir, and as Christians, He is head over each of us. He is the captain of our souls.

Romans 10:12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
Romans 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
Romans 10:14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

God has always used people to preach in the bible and with the exception of a few denominations, they all have the same bible.

In God's word, there aren't theological differences. Paul taught the same things to all of the churches.
Paul didn't tell the Galatians, "You are a sect of Christians, let's call you Catholic," or the Corinths, "we'll call you Baptists or Pentecostals."

Theological differences is another subject all together.

Ephesians 4:2 With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love;
Ephesians 4:3 Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.
Ephesians 4:4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
Ephesians 4:5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
Ephesians 4:6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

1 Corinthians 1:10 Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

All who believe in Jesus are called to mature and grow in Him, and His word is our instruction.

There are examples of divisions in the scriptures. There was on point where Paul said this.

1 Corinthians 3:3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
1 Corinthians 3:4 For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?
1 Corinthians 3:5 Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man?
1 Corinthians 3:6 I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase.
1 Corinthians 3:7 So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.

So is it possible for believers to unite in one mind? I hear it so often said that it's impossible. People shrug it off as unneeded.

Personally I think it's possible. I don't think that Jesus would have prayed for it if it was not.

 

[Betty]

So is it possible for believers to unite in one mind? I hear it so often said that it's impossible. People shrug it off as unneeded.

Personally I think it's possible. I don't think that Jesus would have prayed for it if it was not.

I believe so Nathan, if God's word and truth is upheld above our own ideas. There are areas even among denominational differences where all agree. Jesus is Lord and Savior, is one area.

I was actually thinking about this and "divisions," last night and there is a passage where Jesus said this:

Matthew 10:34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
Matthew 10:35 For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.
Matthew 10:36 And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.

I don't know the reason for the divisions in the above passage, but God does.

And also, there are a lot of divisions for different reasons within the scriptures. Many of the divisions were based on the question of who Jesus is in the scriptures.

For example:
John 7:41 Others said, This is the Christ. But some said, Shall Christ come out of Galilee?
John 7:42 Hath not the scripture said, That Christ cometh of the seed of David, and out of the town of Bethlehem, where David was?
John 7:43 So there was a division among the people because of him.

The division in that passage was based on a half truth. We know that Jesus was born in Bethlehem. He was in Galilee as well.

Another example is:

John 9:16 Therefore said some of the Pharisees, This man is not of God, because he keepeth not the sabbath day. Others said, How can a man that is a sinner do such miracles? And there was a division among them.

1 Corinthians 14:33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.

Another division:

Matthew 25:32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
Matthew 25:33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.

There's a lot of passages that go into unity and division. Prayerful study of each one is a good idea, and something that I'm going to do today along with prayer for understanding.

One thing I have no doubt of is it's our job to be inline with God and His truth. Not the other way around. His truth stands.

 

[Jim Parker]

Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

How does one know what the will of Jesus is if he or she hasn't studied to show themselves approved and sought out the real meaning in Christ?

Jesus clearly stated his will. Anyone can read it.

In my post I tried to explain that Jesus is the only way, the only truth and the only life.

AMEN!!

That's actually the reason I did this study, I spoke to a few different people within a few weeks who, one claimed to be "god," since the bible says that we are created in His image, and another claimed to be the same as Jesus and a "Christ," based on John ch. 17.

Yeah. Unfortunately, people tend to make up stuff and pretend they can avoid the judgment by reason of their fantasies.

God has always used people to preach in the bible and with the exception of a few denominations, they all have the same bible.

I think a more accurate statement is that God uses people to preach the Gospel.

All who believe in Jesus are called to mature and grow in Him, and His word is our instruction.

Yep! Ephesians 4:11-16
And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ: That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ: From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.

Unfortunately, like the Corinthian church, (1Co 1:10) we divide ourselves into sects and factions in direct opposition to Jesus prayer that we be one just as Jesus and the Father are one.

Jhn 17:20-21 I do not pray for these only, but also for those who believe in me through their word, that they may all be one; even as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be in us, so that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

Unfortunately, that isn't happening and that was my point.

iakov the fool
(beaucoup dien cai dau)


DISCLAIMER: By reading the words posted above, you have made a free will choice to expose yourself to the rantings of iakov the fool. The poster assumes no responsibility for any temporary, permanent or otherwise annoying manifestations of cognitive dysfunction that, in any manner, may allegedly be related to the reader’s deliberate act by which he/she has knowingly allowed the above rantings to enter into his/her consciousness. No warrantee is expressed or implied. Individual mileage may vary. And, no, I don't want to hear about it. No sniveling! Enjoy the rest of your life here and the eternal one to come.

 

[Kidron]

Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.



So, when the world sees that we are not "one"; inf act, that we are very far from being "one" but, rather we are Catholic, and Baptist, and Pentecostal, and Methodist, and Orthodox, and a multitude of denominations, sects, and schisms which cannot have fellowship with one another, the world might reasonably conclude that God did not send Jesus and that God does not love them.

We would rather be theologically right than submit to Jesus' will.

-
You see yourself as a denomination (based on your explanation)
God ( if you are actually saved) sees you as a "Son".
So, in God's perspective the "born again" are "family" and so "one of the family"...or "one, In Christ".

You on the other hand have defined the believers based on their Local Church membership.
That is your theology.
Its not God's.

 

[misbehaved11]

One of the passages that I hear referenced often today from non-believers , (and sometimes believers) comes from from John Ch. 17.

In the passage, Jesus is saying a prayer for all who believe and all who would ever believe because of His word.

Jesus includes this in the prayer:

John 17:21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

One thing that I’ve learned in my own studies of the scriptures is that, many times when a statement is made such as in the verse above, we can’t jump to conclusions about what it means. However, the bible examined in context reveals exactly what it means.

Jesus is the King of Kings and Lord of Lords, and He is seated on the throne in heaven.

In the book of revelations John wrote this regarding Jesus.

Revelation 4:8 And the four beasts had each of them six wings about him; and they were full of eyes within: and they rest not day and night, saying, Holy, holy, holy, Lord God Almighty, which was, and is, and is to come.

The saints are spoken of in Revelations but they are not seated on the throne only those who "overcome,," are seated with Christ. "With Christ," are the key words there.

Paul speaks of the saints being seated with Christ, but looked at closely, it says exactly this:

Ephesians 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
Ephesians 2:6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

It does not say that we are seated on the throne but that, "He raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus." This is all about abiding in HIM and seeking all things in Him.

The only mention of any members of the body being seated on the throne is in Revelations and it is about overcoming.

Revelation 3:21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

The above verse is directly from a word to one of the seven Revelation Churches. It's speaking about the end, and overcoming the world in Christ.

Colossians 3:1 If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.

I love to study everything out prayerfully, so I have a tendency to write everything that comes to mind. So here is my attempt to keep this a bit short/er. I wanted to share examples of how God uses the body (the church,) through the gifts that he gives us, and to show how Jesus is the fullness of the Godhead.

There’s a consistent them throughout the word of God, where gifts were given through the Holy Spirit to accomplish God’s will.

The first example of this would be the original temple in the wilderness. God gifted different people with knowledge and understanding so that the work being done would be done in wisdom and in understanding, and in all knowledge of workmanship.

Exodus 31:3 And I have filled him with the spirit of God, in wisdom, and in understanding, and in knowledge, and in all manner of workmanship,
Exodus 31:4 To devise cunning works, to work in gold, and in silver, and in brass,
Exodus 31:5 And in cutting of stones, to set them, and in carving of timber, to work in all manner of workmanship.

In the NT, Paul speaks of this as well.

1 Corinthians 12:27 Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular.
1 Corinthians 12:28 And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues.
1 Corinthians 12:29 Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles?
1 Corinthians 12:30 Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret?

Just as different people were given different gifts to work together in building the wilderness temple, God gave gifts to different people within the body of Christ to work together in building the church.

The Spirit being given to men to carry out God’s will through Christ, who is the only way, the only truth and the only life.

As with Corinthians 12, where Paul listed all of the different gifts given to the members of the body, the bible tells us this about Jesus.

John 3:34 For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.
John 3:35 The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand.

Colossians 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

Jesus is the head of the church He has the Spirit without measure, where the members are used by gifts given by measure this is what makes up the body.

Paul describes faith in the same way.

Romans 12:3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

Jesus is the head of the body,

So back to John 17.

John 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

Jesus didn’t just show up, He was with God before the world was.

John 17:6 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.
John 17:7 Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee.

John 17:8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.

The prayer itself sets the focus on exactly who Christ is, on His word, and on those who believe.

John 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

One body, Christ being the head and each member of the body given a measure of faith and gifts within the body in building up the the church, through Christ who, in HIM is the “fullness of the Godhead.” Not any man, but Christ alone.This is why we are told to abide in Him. This is what the prayer in John 17 was all about.

Jesus Himself tells us that when we are in heaven we will be as the angels in heaven, and He is seated on the throne.

Matthew 22:30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

Colossians 3:2
"Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth." Is this what you are referring to also? Setting our thoughts, affections, desires, on things above, where Christ Jesus is seated?

 

[Betty]

Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

Jesus clearly stated his will. Anyone can read it.

Then we agree here, not just "can read it," but that every believer should read it.


[/QUOTE]Yeah. Unfortunately, people tend to make up stuff and pretend they can avoid the judgment by reason of their fantasies.[/QUOTE]

I kinda feel like that was a personal statement, and I back everything that I say up with the scriptures. If you have specific point where you can show something was "made up." Please share it and if you are correct, I will be corrected."

[/QUOTE]I think a more accurate statement is that God uses people to preach the Gospel.[/QUOTE]

Actually God used people throughout the scriptures to speak HIS word. So my statement was very accurate. That in no way goes against the gospel. I'm not sure why anyone would think it does?

[/QUOTE]Yep! Ephesians 4:11-16
And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ: That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ: From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.

Unfortunately, like the Corinthian church, (1Co 1:10) we divide ourselves into sects and factions in direct opposition to Jesus prayer that we be one just as Jesus and the Father are one.[/QUOTE]

Jesus said that a house divided cannot stand. I don't think that most Christians set out to bring division, and I do believe that the scriptures themselves clear up every division, when His word is considered and upheld even higher than our own.

[/QUOTE]Jhn 17:20-21 I do not pray for these only, but also for those who believe in me through their word, that they may all be one; even as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be in us, so that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.[/QUOTE]

Unfortunately, that isn't happening and that was my point.

Agreed it isn't happening, but I don't think it's impossible. As I said, if God's full counsel is upheld above all of us, there would be no division.

iakov the fool
(beaucoup dien cai dau)


DISCLAIMER: By reading the words posted above, you have made a free will choice to expose yourself to the rantings of iakov the fool. The poster assumes no responsibility for any temporary, permanent or otherwise annoying manifestations of cognitive dysfunction that, in any manner, may allegedly be related to the reader’s deliberate act by which he/she has knowingly allowed the above rantings to enter into his/her consciousness. No warrantee is expressed or implied. Individual mileage may vary. And, no, I don't want to hear about it. No sniveling! Enjoy the rest of your life here and the eternal one to come. [/QUOTE]

I haven't figured out how to quote each statement to reply to each one, I hope that just the "quote," words being there help....I underlined my responses, to differentiate. Apologies to anyone reading for my lack of forum skills. For some reason, the first one quoted but the rest didn't.

I'll get this down eventually...lol

 

[Nathan]

I'll get this down eventually...lol

There is a slight learning curve. Your not alone.

 

[Betty]

Colossians 3:2
"Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth." Is this what you are referring to also? Setting our thoughts, affections, desires, on things above, where Christ Jesus is seated?

I absolutely believe that we should set our affection on things above not on things of this earth." Yes. He is the head over us.

Proverbs 3:5 Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.
Proverbs 3:6 In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.

He is the one who directs us, Jesus said, "take My yoke upon you and learn of Me." He's got the reigns. He directs us, even when we're plowing.

 

[Betty]

There is a slight learning curve. Your not alone.

Thank you Nathan, that's encouraging.

 

[Jim Parker]

Yeah. Unfortunately, people tend to make up stuff and pretend they can avoid the judgment by reason of their fantasies.[/QUOTE]

I kinda feel like that was a personal statement, and I back everything that I say up with the scriptures. If you have specific point where you can show something was "made up." Please share it and if you are correct, I will be corrected." [/QUOTE]
I was responding to your comment of the experience of "a few different people within a few weeks who, one claimed to be "god," since the bible says that we are created in His image, and another claimed to be the same as Jesus and a "Christ," based on John ch. 17."

Actually God used people throughout the scriptures to speak HIS word. So my statement was very accurate. That in no way goes against the gospel. I'm not sure why anyone would think it does?

AH!
I misread your original statement.

iakov the fool

 

[Betty]

Yeah. Unfortunately, people tend to make up stuff and pretend they can avoid the judgment by reason of their fantasies.

I kinda feel like that was a personal statement, and I back everything that I say up with the scriptures. If you have specific point where you can show something was "made up." Please share it and if you are correct, I will be corrected." [/QUOTE]
I was responding to your comment of the experience of "a few different people within a few weeks who, one claimed to be "god," since the bible says that we are created in His image, and another claimed to be the same as Jesus and a "Christ," based on John ch. 17."

AH!
I misread your original statement.

iakov the fool[/QUOTE]

That's a big concern Jim Baker, that's why I try to make these points. When we lift ourselves up to the level of Christ, there's not only a lack of humility, but a lack of regard that we indeed need Christ in everything. We can do nothing of ourselves.

I actually have a whole study about different people in the scriptures who uplifted themselves to the level of God. I used to chat online with Christians of mixed denominations and a Jehovah's witness woman that I chatted with is part of the reason for the original study. I revisited it based on recent conversations. You would be amazed how many will say things like that. Even where it isn't part of their denominational doctrine. So I wanted to look at each example within the scriptures on that, as well those who believe that they are Him (some actually do.) So I would be able to answer by His word. Not only them, but for anyone listening.

I sometimes miss things in messages too. It's no problem.

 

[ezrider]

I haven't figured out how to quote each statement to reply to each one, I hope that just the "quote," words being there help....I underlined my responses, to differentiate. Apologies to anyone reading for my lack of forum skills. For some reason, the first one quoted but the rest didn't.

Highlight the text that you want to quoted, then select either +quote or reply. If you use the +quote, then you can quote multiple comments individually.

 

[Betty]

Highlight the text that you want to quoted, then select either +quote or reply. If you use the +quote, then you can quote multiple comments individually.

Thank you so much ezrider. That helps a lot!