The Invisible God

[netchaplain]

Surely, it would suffice us to see the Father, but that would not be faith, and if one cannot be satisfied without seeing Him yet, one will never be satisfied; because it would not be faith that sees Him, but our flesh! We should be most encouraged just to know that the Father is ours and we are His, and there is no greater exhortation, no greater faith than knowing the Father—until we see Him!​

Of course seeing Him now would be also encouraging, but it would not be worth losing that greatest part of our faith, but it would be the proof of Him without faith. Faith first (this life)—then the proof, which increases our satisfaction in seeing Him after the time of faith (faith will be no more). Phillip told Jesus that if He would show them the Father it would satisfy them (Jhn 14:8); but he was coming from a heart that needed proof. Not for faith in Christ, but more evidence for faith in Christ, for “Jews require a sign” (1Co 1:22), but the Lord Jesus had given enough evidence for faith in Him, and desires that our faith in Him will be rewarded when we do finally see the Father and the blessed Lord Jesus (Jhn 20:29) at the “translation” (Heb 11:5 - rapture).

He wants us to see the Father through Himself (Jhn 14:9) for increased faith (believing there is a Father without having to see Him, as they would have liked). Seeing the Father will be the last thing on faith’s menu. The Father is the reason for all things and therefore must be the last proof to see, but not before the time. As we can see it is mostly about faith, and seeing God through seeing the Lord Jesus is the greatest of faith. We are God’s, and He gives us to His Son; but we are still the Father’s—by sonship in Christ—still God’s children, i.e. child-ship.

God said “no man can see” Him “and live” (Exo 33:20; Jhn 1:18; 1 Timothy 6:14–16; 1 John 4:12). But seeing Jesus is as seeing the Father, for they are the same in everything, but are in different authorities. This answers to Jesus being “the fullness of the Godhead (Father) bodily,” and “the express image of His (Father) person” (Col 2:9; Heb 1:3).

Faith is all we have to go on, and thus it is the second most important virtue after “love” (1Co 13:13); and is why it is that “faith which worketh by love” (Gal 5:6). It is sensible to see why God desires that we wait last to see Him (He did not show Himself to anyone)—saving the most important for last. It was God who sent the Son, and it is God Who manifested the greatest love. He could have come in His Son’s place, but that would not have been the most sacrificial!

NC​

 

[2nd Timothy Group]

Surely, it would suffice us to see the Father, but that would not be faith, and if one cannot be satisfied without seeing Him yet, one will never be satisfied; because it would not be faith that sees Him, but our flesh!

I've never heard anyone say anything like your quote above, and I find it extremely intuitive.

Though I haven't actually "seen" the Father, I have experienced something even greater, for the Lord shared His Power with me. Not that I am Powerful, but that He simply allowed me to be in His Holy Presence to the degree that His Presence nearly killed me. It would have been the most wonderful death anyone could have ever imagined.

But after this remarkable experience, I found it to be impossible that I not respond. For, I realized that this Power could take my life at any moment. I knew, with full assurance, that God is absolutely real. I learned that Day that God knows exactly where I am at all moments, and as you can imagine, it was most alarming. Even though it has been many years now (without any repeat moments), I think daily about my encounter with the Lord, for those memories will never escape me. Having felt what I have felt, it is virtually impossible that I would ever deny Him unless the Lord Himself hardened my heart as He did with Peter.

And so, I have often said that the way in which I believe almost transcends Trust itself. I don't simply Trust in the Lord, but more, I have been known by the Lord. Being Known by the Lord is an entirely new plane.

Numbers 11:27-29 NLT - "A young man ran and reported to Moses, "Eldad and Medad are prophesying in the camp!" 28 Joshua son of Nun, who had been Moses' assistant since his youth, protested, "Moses, my master, make them stop!" 29 But Moses replied, "Are you jealous for my sake? I wish that all the LORD's people were prophets and that the LORD would put his Spirit upon them all!"

 

[netchaplain]

Though I haven't actually "seen" the Father, I have experienced something even greater, for the Lord shared His Power with me. Not that I am Powerful, but that He simply allowed me to be in His Holy Presence to the degree that His Presence nearly killed me.

I'm glad your ok. Yes, the Lord can use things we may not even think of. When God does anything with us it's the Spirit using the Life of Christ in us, thus it is always all Three working in us. Of course the only one literally with us is Their Holy Spirit, and the Father and Son in us through the Spirit, for the Father and Son are in heaven.

Some may say since God is omnipresent He is in us too. But to me, it's more of Him seeing all things all the time that explains His omnipresence, i.e. we are always in the presence of His sight.

 

[hawkman]

And so, I have often said that the way in which I believe almost transcends Trust itself. I don't simply Trust in the Lord, but more, I have been known by the Lord. Being Known by the Lord is an entirely new plane.

I am trying to understand the "new plane " you are on . I am not belittling your experience, but Doesn't God know all of us ?

Psalms 139:1 O lord, thou hast searched me, and known me.

New International Version
You know when I sit and when I rise; you perceive my thoughts from afar.

Read all of Psalm 139 !

Luke 12:6 Are not five sparrows sold for two farthings, and not one of them is forgotten before God?

Luke 12:7 But even the very hairs of your head are all numbered. Fear not therefore: ye are of more value than many sparrows.

Does God know our future ? Yes he does !

 

[netchaplain]

I am trying to understand the "new plane " you are on . I am not belittling your experience, but Doesn't God know all of us ?

Psalms 139:1 O lord, thou hast searched me, and known me.

New International Version
You know when I sit and when I rise; you perceive my thoughts from afar.

Read all of Psalm 139 !

Luke 12:6 Are not five sparrows sold for two farthings, and not one of them is forgotten before God?

Luke 12:7 But even the very hairs of your head are all numbered. Fear not therefore: ye are of more value than many sparrows.

Does God know our future ? Yes he does !

He knows all, and knows all things, which is what omniscience is.

 

[2nd Timothy Group]

I am trying to understand the "new plane " you are on . I am not belittling your experience, but Doesn't God know all of us ?

Nope. Not all are Known by Christ.

Matthew 7:22-23 NLT - "On judgment day many will say to me, 'Lord! Lord! We prophesied in your name and cast out demons in your name and performed many miracles in your name.' But I will reply, 'I never knew you. Get away from me, you who break God's laws."

This is what is so difficult for most to see, which is that they have not been given eyes to see, ears to hear, and legs to Spiritually walk. The Pharisees, Saducees, and teachers of the law certainly fall into the category. John chapter 9, the entire chapter, is one of the Keystone passages of the entire Bible. It deals with physical healing, but to provide the context of those physical healings, we find that they actually reflect the initial Spiritual healing.

John 9:39-41 NLT - "Then Jesus told him, "I entered this world to render judgment--to give sight to the blind and to show those who think they see that they are blind." Some Pharisees who were standing nearby heard him and asked, "Are you saying we're blind?" "If you were blind, you wouldn't be guilty," Jesus replied. "But you remain guilty because you claim you can see."

Jesus had not Circumcised the hearts of the Pharisees in verse 40, nor did He Circumcise the hearts of those referenced in Matta 7:23. To be Known by Christ is to receive the Spiritual Circumcision of Christ.

Does God know our future ? Yes he does !

Yes, because He follows the Scroll of the Lord, prewritten in Heaven. It isn't that He is looking ahead, but the situation is that He creates as time moves forward, hence the Eternal Plan which revolves around Christ and His Redemptive Power.

Isaiah 34:15-17 NIV - "The owl will nest there and lay eggs, she will hatch them, and care for her young under the shadow of her wings; there also the falcons will gather, each with its mate. Look in the scroll of the LORD and read: None of these will be missing, not one will lack her mate. For it is his mouth that has given the order, and his Spirit will gather them together. He allots their portions; his hand distributes them by measure. They will possess it forever and dwell there from generation to generation."

If I were you, I'd be upset with your pastors and teachers for not teaching you these incredible verses. I was after I first discovered them. These "pastors" and teachers" have flat-out denied to teach us these passages, and I think that you should ask "them" why.

Cheers!

 

[hawkman]

Nope. Not all are Known by Christ.

Matthew 7:22-23 NLT - "On judgment day many will say to me, 'Lord! Lord! We prophesied in your name and cast out demons in your name and performed many miracles in your name.' But I will reply, 'I never knew you. Get away from me, you who break God's laws."

When Jesus speaks of "I never knew you " he is speaking of "knew" in a relationship sense, that is Jesus did not know them as being a believer.
Of course Jesus knew them because we are told in this very verse Jesus knew they were breaking God's laws .

Is it when you say "Known by Christ" that you are speaking of Known in a relationship sense ?
If so all Christians are Known by Christ, correct ?

 

[Consecrated Life]

Surely, it would suffice us to see the Father, but that would not be faith, and if one cannot be satisfied without seeing Him yet, one will never be satisfied; because it would not be faith that sees Him, but our flesh! We should be most encouraged just to know that the Father is ours and we are His, and there is no greater exhortation, no greater faith than knowing the Father—until we see Him!​

Thus the appropriate and true Word the Lord left us with in regard to the inferior quality from God's perspective of having to see with our eyes in order to believe.


Jhn 20:29
Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.

 

[2nd Timothy Group]

When Jesus speaks of "I never knew you " he is speaking of "knew" in a relationship sense, that is Jesus did not know them as being a believer.
Of course Jesus knew them because we are told Jesus knew they were breaking God's laws .

Okie doke, but I am 100% convinced that "I never knew you" has to do with Colossians 2:11 & 13. They say:

Colossians 2:11, 13 NLT - "When you came to Christ, you were "circumcised," but not by a physical procedure. Christ performed a spiritual circumcision--the cutting away of your sinful nature. ... 13 You were dead because of your sins and because your sinful nature was not yet cut away. Then God made you alive with Christ, for he forgave all our sins."

Jesus says "get away from me" because they are still considered "dead." And they are "dead" because Christ had not Circumcised their hearts.

Hawkman . . . this is what the Gospel is all about, and Colossians 2:9-15 needs to be shared when you share the True Gospel. Do you teach others about Colossians 2:9-15?

 

[netchaplain]

Nope. Not all are Known by Christ.

Matthew 7:22-23 NLT - "On judgment day many will say to me, 'Lord! Lord! We prophesied in your name and cast out demons in your name and performed many miracles in your name.' But I will reply, 'I never knew you. Get away from me, you who break God's laws."

It's as Hawkman mentioned, Jesus knows everything and everybody. But most He only knew them as unbelievers.

 

[2nd Timothy Group]

It's as Hawkman mentioned

Ahhhh . . . as you wish.

 

[netchaplain]

Thus the appropriate and true Word the Lord left us with in regard to the inferior quality from God's perspective of having to see with our eyes in order to believe.

Not sure I understand this.

 

[2nd Timothy Group]

Not sure I understand this.

This person is probably referring to the concept found in John 9:29-31.

John 9:39-41 NLT - "Then Jesus told him, "I entered this world to render judgment--to give sight to the blind and to show those who think they see that they are blind." 40 Some Pharisees who were standing nearby heard him and asked, "Are you saying we're blind?" 41 "If you were blind, you wouldn't be guilty," Jesus replied. "But you remain guilty because you claim you can see."

This is the Purpose of Christ, and the manner in which Jesus grants this Spiritual Eyesight, this is His Work. The fact that a person is then capable of Spiritual Sight; this is the Holy Effect of Christ.

The above is the core of the Gospel, and it's something that the "church" needs to start teaching pronto instead of flat-out ignoring it. It disgusts me that few "preachers" will even touch John 9:29-31.

 

[hawkman]

Hawkman . . . this is what the Gospel is all about, and Colossians 2:9-15 needs to be shared when you share the True Gospel.

Sharing the Gospel with a non-Christian, in my own thinking, I would not share Col2:9-15 unless the Holy Spirit lead me to . Why ? Paul wrote this letter to the believers in Colossae and the lost will have trouble getting the meaning out of what is spoken of in Colossians, it is more meat than milk of the Word .

Do you teach others about Colossians 2:9-15?

If I were to teach Colossians 2:9-15 I would prefer to teach the whole book of Colossians, after all it is a letter that should be read as a whole stream of thought from Paul . How many hours would it take ?

What do you think netchaplain, you have a history in teaching ?

 

[Consecrated Life]

Not sure I understand this.

Jhn 20:29
Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.

 

[2nd Timothy Group]

I would not share Col2:9-15 unless the Holy Spirit lead me to .

Incredible. Colossians 2:9-15 is the "Heart" of the Gospel. These SEVEN verses are what the Bible revolves around. These Seven verses are essential if a person is to understand the True Gospel.