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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
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Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
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Depending upon the Holy Spirit for all you do?
Read through the following study by Tenchi for more on this topic
https://christianforums.net/threads/without-the-holy-spirit-we-can-do-nothing.109419/
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How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
Join Sola Scriptura for a discussion on the subject
https://christianforums.net/threads/anointed-preaching-teaching.109331/#post-1912042
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Bible Study The Israel of God
- Thread starter JohnD
- Start date
No less than the scholarly Paul the Apostle draws down the distinction between the physical Jew and the spiritual Jew:
Romans 9:1-6 (KJV)
1 I say the truth in Christ, I lie not, my conscience also bearing me witness in the Holy Ghost,
2 That I have great heaviness and continual sorrow in my heart.
3 For I could wish that myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my kinsmen according to the flesh:
4 Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises;
5 Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.
6 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:
and:
Romans 2:28-29 (KJV)
28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.
"praise" in verse 29 is the literal definition of "Jew" from Judah (Genesis 29:35). whose jewishness is not of men but of God.
The circumcision of the heart (which includes females btw) is at least as old as:
Deuteronomy 10:16 (KJV)
16 Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked.
So the distinction between the physical and the spiritual goes at least as far back as this (and IMHO, all the way back to Eden).
Recall also that in Christ...
Galatians 3:24-28 (KJV)
24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
Galatians 6:13-16 (KJV)
13 For neither they themselves who are circumcised keep the law; but desire to have you circumcised, that they may glory in your flesh.
14 But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.
15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.
16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.
13 For neither they themselves who are circumcised keep the law; but desire to have you circumcised, that they may glory in your flesh.
14 But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.
15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.
16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.
Unpopular only because of Jewish pride and Gentile antisemitism are what fuel opposition to this biblical truth.
As a believer in the Jewish Messiah we are become children of God Spiritual Jews Spirit Israel...
Not physical or heirs to the land grants in the Holy land (for the physical Jews are the chosen / elect people of earth). And the spiritual Jews (all believers in Jesus) are the chosen / elect of heaven:
Galatians 4:21-31 (KJV)
21 Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law?
22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.
23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.
24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.
25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.
26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.
27 For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband.
28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.
29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.
30 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.
31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.
Our citizenship is in heaven and the New Jerusalem is our capital city.
There is no replacement here. And this is as God intended all along first for the Jew then the Gentile.
As a believer in the Jewish Messiah we are become children of God Spiritual Jews Spirit Israel...
Not physical or heirs to the land grants in the Holy land (for the physical Jews are the chosen / elect people of earth). And the spiritual Jews (all believers in Jesus) are the chosen / elect of heaven:
Galatians 4:21-31 (KJV)
21 Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law?
22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.
23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.
24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.
25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.
26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.
27 For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband.
28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.
29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.
30 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.
31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.
Our citizenship is in heaven and the New Jerusalem is our capital city.
There is no replacement here. And this is as God intended all along first for the Jew then the Gentile.
Malachi
Member
I am in 100% agreement that this is exactly God's plan for the Church (Jew and Gentile in one Body).
At the same time, there is a whole body of covenants and prophecies pertaining to Israel as a nation on earth, occupying all the territory between the Nile and the Euphrates.
Unless you balance the two entities, you have actually omitted half of God's plan. And that is a glaring omission. God's grace and righteousness will be established on earth for eternity. Christians must take note of this also. And it is now up to you to bring forth that teaching also.
At the same time, there is a whole body of covenants and prophecies pertaining to Israel as a nation on earth, occupying all the territory between the Nile and the Euphrates.
Unless you balance the two entities, you have actually omitted half of God's plan. And that is a glaring omission. God's grace and righteousness will be established on earth for eternity. Christians must take note of this also. And it is now up to you to bring forth that teaching also.
Chopper
Member
JohnD, thank you for your explanation of the true Jewish believer. I am so grieved at what I hear of peoples opinions of Israel. I have been in love with Israel for decades. The Apple of God's Eye is going thru some tough times. I know for sure that YHWH will never turn His back on His special people. I have supported the "Friends of Israel Defense Forces" with prayer for quite awhile. God bless Israel!
God Bless Israel!
Romans 11:28 (KJV)
28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers’ sakes.
Romans 15:25-27 (KJV)
25 But now I go unto Jerusalem to minister unto the saints.
26 For it hath pleased them of Macedonia and Achaia to make a certain contribution for the poor saints which are at Jerusalem.
27 It hath pleased them verily; and their debtors they are. For if the Gentiles have been made partakers of their spiritual things, their duty is also to minister unto them in carnal things.
28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers’ sakes.
Romans 15:25-27 (KJV)
25 But now I go unto Jerusalem to minister unto the saints.
26 For it hath pleased them of Macedonia and Achaia to make a certain contribution for the poor saints which are at Jerusalem.
27 It hath pleased them verily; and their debtors they are. For if the Gentiles have been made partakers of their spiritual things, their duty is also to minister unto them in carnal things.
Israel (Yisra'el) is a compound of three words:
Yish
Sarar
Elohiym
He Prince God.
In witnessing to a Jewish Rabbi on the Isaiah 53 text, the Holy Spirit bade me grant the Jewish argument that the suffering servant of the text was Israel. A few passages in Isaiah do in fact mention Israel / Jacob is the servant of the Lord. So I did. And the rabbi was elated. Finally a Christian who admits this is no messianic passage... but I said, hold the phone here. I didn't say that. I said the suffering servant is Israel. But there are several Isarels, aren't there?
Israel the patriarch
Israel the ancient Northern Kingdom
Israel the modern day state
Israel the people of Abraham Isaac and Jacob
The rabbi agreed.
And the language of the passage Isaiah 52:13- 53:12 speaks of an individual suffering for the benefit of the masses. Even if you interpreted Israel to be the people of Israel does it fit the theology of keeping the law and suffering for the benefit of Gentiles who do not keep the Law?
So... Israel is Jacob?
No. He was long dead even by Isaiah's day.
Then who?
There is another Israel most have not considered.
The meaning of Israel is He is the Prince of God. Who would that ultimately be but the Messiah?
The good rabbi had to leave... and I never heard from him again.
Revelation 3:12 (KJV)
12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.
New Jerusalem is our city and (Spirit) Israel is our name and his new name.
Yish
Sarar
Elohiym
He Prince God.
In witnessing to a Jewish Rabbi on the Isaiah 53 text, the Holy Spirit bade me grant the Jewish argument that the suffering servant of the text was Israel. A few passages in Isaiah do in fact mention Israel / Jacob is the servant of the Lord. So I did. And the rabbi was elated. Finally a Christian who admits this is no messianic passage... but I said, hold the phone here. I didn't say that. I said the suffering servant is Israel. But there are several Isarels, aren't there?
Israel the patriarch
Israel the ancient Northern Kingdom
Israel the modern day state
Israel the people of Abraham Isaac and Jacob
The rabbi agreed.
And the language of the passage Isaiah 52:13- 53:12 speaks of an individual suffering for the benefit of the masses. Even if you interpreted Israel to be the people of Israel does it fit the theology of keeping the law and suffering for the benefit of Gentiles who do not keep the Law?
So... Israel is Jacob?
No. He was long dead even by Isaiah's day.
Then who?
There is another Israel most have not considered.
The meaning of Israel is He is the Prince of God. Who would that ultimately be but the Messiah?
The good rabbi had to leave... and I never heard from him again.
Revelation 3:12 (KJV)
12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.
New Jerusalem is our city and (Spirit) Israel is our name and his new name.
Malachi
Member
"Our" being the Church. Reiteration is not necessary, and we are all agreed on this aspect of God's grace.
Now it would only be fair and balanced to speak of Israel on earth under Christ during and beyond the Millenium. All Bible Truth must be tied together to avoid misleading those who are searching for the truth.