The Law

[Oats]

Do you believe the Law was to harsh? I.e can't be followed?


When Jesus died did he die for those before his death?

:smt056:nag:eyelid


Can someone follow the Law and be saved?

 

[glorydaz]

Do you believe the Law was to harsh? I.e can't be followed?


When Jesus died did he die for those before his death?

:smt056:nag:eyelid


Can someone follow the Law and be saved?

The law was meant to be too harsh, a schoolmaster to bring us to Christ.
It was given so man would see his sin and realize he needed a Saviour.
It can be followed (sort of), but if you disobey in one point, you've broken the entire law.

Yes, Jesus died for the sins of the whole world...from Adam to the day He returns in Glory.

No one can follow the law and be saved..Romans 3:20 "Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin."

Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.

 

[Alabaster]

Do you believe the Law was to harsh? I.e can't be followed?


When Jesus died did he die for those before his death?

:smt056:nag:eyelid


Can someone follow the Law and be saved?

The Law was given to show us that we cannot do anything BUT sin--it cannot be adhered to.

Galatians 3:24-25 NLT
Let me put it another way. The law was our guardian until Christ came; it protected us until we could be made right with God through faith. And now that the way of faith has come, we no longer need the law as our guardian.


As for Jesus' atonement...it was for all of mankind for all time.

 

[Theofilus]

Do you believe the Law was to harsh? I.e can't be followed?


When Jesus died did he die for those before his death?

:smt056:nag:eyelid


Can someone follow the Law and be saved?

1. No, the Law was not (and is not) too harsh.

Then the LORD your God will make you most prosperous in all the work of your hands and in the fruit of your womb, the young of your livestock and the crops of your land. The LORD will again delight in you and make you prosperous, just as he delighted in your fathers, if you obey the LORD your God and keep his commands and decrees that are written in this Book of the Law and turn to the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul.
Now what I am commanding you today is not too difficult for you or beyond your reach. It is not up in heaven, so that you have to ask, “Who will ascend into heaven to get it and proclaim it to us so we may obey it?†Nor is it beyond the sea, so that you have to ask, “Who will cross the sea to get it and proclaim it to us so we may obey it?†No, the word is very near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart so you may obey it. (Deu. 30:9-14)​

God says it's not too difficult for us. I, for one, am not prepared to call Him a liar. The New Testament confirms that God's commandments are not too harsh.

This is love for God: to obey his commands. And his commands are not burdensome. (I John 5:3)​

2. I'll let others answer this one.

3. Contrary to what many (perhaps even most) churches teach, the Law was never intended to save anyone. People in Old Testament times were saved by grace through faith, just like we are today (see Heb. 11). God gave us the law for a number of reasons, but not to save us.

 

[WIP]

I think we get too hung up on the law. Too often we look at God's law as we do civil law; that it was provided as a blueprint for salvation. It was not. Law was given to us as an eye opener to show us how we lack the perfection God demands from us and how much we desperately needed a savior. We are already condemned. It is only through Jesus Christ that we can be saved from ourselves.

 

[elijah23]

Do you believe the Law was to harsh? I.e can't be followed?


When Jesus died did he die for those before his death?

:smt056:nag:eyelid


Can someone follow the Law and be saved?

The purpose of the law is to keep us out of trouble. I don’t consider that harsh.

Yes, Jesus died for those that had already died and all that would die afterwards.

Like I said, the law is meant to keep us out of trouble. If we follow the law, we will stay out of trouble.

 

[Alabaster]

The purpose of the law is to keep us out of trouble. I don’t consider that harsh.

Yes, Jesus died for those that had already died and all that would die afterwards.

Like I said, the law is meant to keep us out of trouble. If we follow the law, we will stay out of trouble.

False. The law is there to show us we are sinners and we have no hope of stopping without a Saviour.

Romans 3:19-20 NLT
Obviously, the law applies to those to whom it was given, for its purpose is to keep people from having excuses, and to show that the entire world is guilty before God. For no one can ever be made right with God by doing what the law commands. The law simply shows us how sinful we are.

 

[glorydaz]

1. No, the Law was not (and is not) too harsh.

Then the LORD your God will make you most prosperous in all the work of your hands and in the fruit of your womb, the young of your livestock and the crops of your land. The LORD will again delight in you and make you prosperous, just as he delighted in your fathers, if you obey the LORD your God and keep his commands and decrees that are written in this Book of the Law and turn to the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul.
Now what I am commanding you today is not too difficult for you or beyond your reach. It is not up in heaven, so that you have to ask, “Who will ascend into heaven to get it and proclaim it to us so we may obey it?†Nor is it beyond the sea, so that you have to ask, “Who will cross the sea to get it and proclaim it to us so we may obey it?†No, the word is very near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart so you may obey it. (Deu. 30:9-14)​

God says it's not too difficult for us. I, for one, am not prepared to call Him a liar. The New Testament confirms that God's commandments are not too harsh.

This is love for God: to obey his commands. And his commands are not burdensome. (I John 5:3)​

This chapter in Deut. is speaking prophetically when He will "circumcise" our heart. His commands are not burdensome once our hearts have been circumcised.

And the LORD thy God will circumcise thine heart, and the heart of thy seed, to love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, that thou mayest live.

 

[Ashua]

The law of the LORD [is] perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD [is] sure, making wise the simple. -Psalm 19:7

Thy word [is] true [from] the beginning: and every one of thy righteous judgments [endureth] for ever. -119:160

For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin. -Romans 7:14

10If thou shalt hearken unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to keep his commandments and his statutes which are written in this book of the law, and if thou turn unto the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul.

11For this commandment which I command thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off.

12It is not in heaven, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it?

13Neither is it beyond the sea, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go over the sea for us, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it?

14But the word is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it.

15See, I have set before thee this day life and good, and death and evil;

16In that I command thee this day to love the LORD thy God, to walk in his ways, and to keep his commandments and his statutes and his judgments, that thou mayest live and multiply: and the LORD thy God shall bless thee in the land whither thou goest to possess it.

17But if thine heart turn away, so that thou wilt not hear, but shalt be drawn away, and worship other gods, and serve them;

18I denounce unto you this day, that ye shall surely perish, and that ye shall not prolong your days upon the land, whither thou passest over Jordan to go to possess it.

19I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:

20That thou mayest love the LORD thy God, and that thou mayest obey his voice, and that thou mayest cleave unto him: for he is thy life, and the length of thy days: that thou mayest dwell in the land which the LORD sware unto thy fathers, to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob, to give them. -Deuteronomy 30:10-20

There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God [is] faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear [it]. -1 Corinthians 10:13

Christ never abolished the Law. He only silenced the curse for breaking it for those who believe on Him. He is the blood redemption that payed the righteous demand of the Law. We were debtors and guilty before the Law. He satisfied that debt. Now the Law and we are "squared" because of Him.

31Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:

33But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

35Thus saith the LORD, which giveth the sun for a light by day, and the ordinances of the moon and of the stars for a light by night, which divideth the sea when the waves thereof roar; The LORD of hosts is his name:

36If those ordinances depart from before me, saith the LORD, then the seed of Israel also shall cease from being a nation before me for ever.

37Thus saith the LORD; If heaven above can be measured, and the foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, saith the LORD.

38Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that the city shall be built to the LORD from the tower of Hananeel unto the gate of the corner.

39And the measuring line shall yet go forth over against it upon the hill Gareb, and shall compass about to Goath.

40And the whole valley of the dead bodies, and of the ashes, and all the fields unto the brook of Kidron, unto the corner of the horse gate toward the east, shall be holy unto the LORD; it shall not be plucked up, nor thrown down any more for ever.

Shall the Scriptures be broken? Not at all. The Law endures. It's curse is impotent. Praise be to YHVH Elohienu and His son Yeshua.

 

[jasoncran]

This chapter in Deut. is speaking prophetically when He will "circumcise" our heart. His commands are not burdensome once our hearts have been circumcised.

slightly off moses told the isrealites that they must circumcise the forseskin of thier hearts

they operated on faith as we do. they had the ot sacrifices but God did show them mercy otherwise why would moses talk about the Goodness of God if didnt have that relationship or also of david.

the problem was the law didnt redeem and that the lord was more selective on giving grace.

few came to him as they CHOOSE not to. and also the lord planned for christ to redeem since genesis.
but even then if one choose to serve god and desired the righteousness it was possible.

ie daniel, the prophets and others, he called people then.

 

[Pard]

The Law is something anyone can follow. The problem is that we are corrupt and broken. Adam and Eve were human, and for a time they followed the Law. When we are in Heaven we shall all follow the Law. The Law is not beyond the ability of a human to follow, but we are not really human. We are messed up shadows of our true selves.

So in a way, yes the Law was designed so that we would fail in keeping it. It is meant to be that hard because we cannot live that Law without devoting ourselves to God 100%, which is something I do not think anyone has ever done (aside from Jesus!).

 

[Ashua]

Of the 613 Laws attributed to the Torah... If we had 613 members on this board who pledges to keep ONE of them perfectly for life, and did so (although break the others as is common to sinful man), then it is possible to keep any given law, so the answer is, it is possible.

Also, if you can keep every law perfectly for 10 minutes then why not 11 minutes? why not 12?

It is possible to tie your hands behind your back and do a backflip. catch it in mid air, land squarely on a unicycle, and then ride it across a tight rope, but it just is not going to happen in empirical reality. We are failures. That is why we need Christ.

 

[Hitch]

Dont forget ,it was the strict appliction of the letter of the Law that saved the woman caught in adultery.