The Pagan Origins of Christmas

[T. E. Smith]

(The point of this thread is not to be irreverent or to discourage Christmas celebration; it is rather intended to teach the true history of the holiday and to explain why some Christians have historically rejected its celebration.)

It is often asserted that Christmas is, in origin, a Christian holiday. In fact, this is not the case. It originates from at least three pagan holidays, which Christians combined and upon which placed a Christian spin.

1: Saturnalia
First, Christmas originates in the holiday of Saturnalia. This was an ancient Roman festival celebrated in honor of the god Saturn, celebrated between the 17th and 23rd of December. They held a sacrifice at the Temple of Saturn in Rome, with a public banquet. Catullus, a Roman poet, called it "the best of days." Unlike other Roman holidays, it could be held in one's own home, anywhere in the Empire. Some crucial similarities exist:

1. A tree - At Saturnalia, residents would decorate a tree with candles and ornamentation.
2. Gift-giving - At Saturnalia, Romans would purchase and give gifts to one another.
3. Partying - At Saturnalia, the celebrants would party frequently, have banquets, and engage in general merrymaking.

The tree decoration is perhaps the most striking similarity. Some Christians have attempted to argue that the gift-giving comes from the three magi, but that is not the case; it originated in Saturnalia.

2: Yule
More conservative-leaning Christians will denigrate Halloween for its pagan origins in Germanic tribes, all the while happily ignoring the pagan Germanic origins of their favorite holiday. The festival of Yule was celebrated in winter prior to 1000 A.D., held between mid-December and early January. It is connected to the wild hunt. Northern Europe was the last area to be Christianized, and it appears that Yule had a major influence on Christmas. Some similarities:

1. The yule log - the tradition of the yule log comes directly from the pagan holiday of Yule.
2. Carolling - Yule was celebrated with crowds coming together for a winter ritual of singing, known as Koliada. This appears to be the origin of Christmas carolling.

3: "Birthday of the Unconquered Sun"
This was a late Roman holiday honoring Sol Invictus ("unconquered sun"), a god, on - strikingly - the 25th of December. No Christian historian thinks Jesus was born in winter (there are two contested dates, none in Winter), so the day appears to have come from Sol Invictus.

Malachi 4:2 speaks of "the sun of righteousness" (Sol Iustitiae), a reference to Jesus. It makes sense that Christians would have tied the birthday of Sol Invictus to the birthday of Jesus, Sol Iustitiae. In Mausoleum M, under St. Peter's Basilica, we see an inscription calling Jesus "Christo Sole", Christ the sun.

In conclusion, then, Christmas originated in Saturnalia and Sol Invictus, and Christians combined the birth of Jesus with it. Later, Yule was incorporated. The Puritans forbade Christmas celebrations because they recognized this fact.

 

[hawkman]

Derek Gilbert talks about this , maybe you will find it interesting .

Quote from Derek Gilbert , link .

"If God judges us on accidental paganism, we’re all doomed. The wedding ring is a tradition that started in ancient Egypt. The English names of the days of the week come from the names of pagan gods.

The apostle Paul put it best:

One person esteems one day as better than another, while another esteems all days alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, observes it in honor of the Lord. The one who eats, eats in honor of the Lord, since he gives thanks to God, while the one who abstains, abstains in honor of the Lord and gives thanks to God.

Romans 14:5-6 (ESV) "

 

[Mungo]

Here is a link that debunks this "pagan origin" theory.
Calculating Christmas
One particularly interesting point is that the date of 25th December was chosen by Emperor Aurelian in 274 for the new celebration of Sol Invictus because Christians were already celebrating that date.
It's worth reading the whole article.

 

[T. E. Smith]

Here is a link that debunks this "pagan origin" theory.
Calculating Christmas
One particularly interesting point is that the date of 25th December was chosen by Emperor Aurelian in 274 for the new celebration of Sol Invictus because Christians were already celebrating that date.
It's worth reading the whole article.

Hardly clear that Christians came up with the date first. The biblical reference that I cited makes it likely that Christians came up with it from a pagan holiday. Also this is just one of the three origins; Saturnalia is most important, though Yule is important if only because some Christians like to criticize Halloween for pagan Germanic origins.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

(The point of this thread is not to be irreverent or to discourage Christmas celebration; it is rather intended to teach the true history of the holiday and to explain why some Christians have historically rejected its celebration.)

It is often asserted that Christmas is, in origin, a Christian holiday. In fact, this is not the case. It originates from at least three pagan holidays, which Christians combined and upon which placed a Christian spin.

1: Saturnalia
First, Christmas originates in the holiday of Saturnalia. This was an ancient Roman festival celebrated in honor of the god Saturn, celebrated between the 17th and 23rd of December. They held a sacrifice at the Temple of Saturn in Rome, with a public banquet. Catullus, a Roman poet, called it "the best of days." Unlike other Roman holidays, it could be held in one's own home, anywhere in the Empire. Some crucial similarities exist:

1. A tree - At Saturnalia, residents would decorate a tree with candles and ornamentation.
2. Gift-giving - At Saturnalia, Romans would purchase and give gifts to one another.
3. Partying - At Saturnalia, the celebrants would party frequently, have banquets, and engage in general merrymaking.

The tree decoration is perhaps the most striking similarity. Some Christians have attempted to argue that the gift-giving comes from the three magi, but that is not the case; it originated in Saturnalia.

2: Yule
More conservative-leaning Christians will denigrate Halloween for its pagan origins in Germanic tribes, all the while happily ignoring the pagan Germanic origins of their favorite holiday. The festival of Yule was celebrated in winter prior to 1000 A.D., held between mid-December and early January. It is connected to the wild hunt. Northern Europe was the last area to be Christianized, and it appears that Yule had a major influence on Christmas. Some similarities:

1. The yule log - the tradition of the yule log comes directly from the pagan holiday of Yule.
2. Carolling - Yule was celebrated with crowds coming together for a winter ritual of singing, known as Koliada. This appears to be the origin of Christmas carolling.

3: "Birthday of the Unconquered Sun"
This was a late Roman holiday honoring Sol Invictus ("unconquered sun"), a god, on - strikingly - the 25th of December. No Christian historian thinks Jesus was born in winter (there are two contested dates, none in Winter), so the day appears to have come from Sol Invictus.

Malachi 4:2 speaks of "the sun of righteousness" (Sol Iustitiae), a reference to Jesus. It makes sense that Christians would have tied the birthday of Sol Invictus to the birthday of Jesus, Sol Iustitiae. In Mausoleum M, under St. Peter's Basilica, we see an inscription calling Jesus "Christo Sole", Christ the sun.

In conclusion, then, Christmas originated in Saturnalia and Sol Invictus, and Christians combined the birth of Jesus with it. Later, Yule was incorporated. The Puritans forbade Christmas celebrations because they recognized this fact.

Why do you think this is the “true” meaning of Christ-mass? It isn’t. The word “Christ” refers to Jesus. That Romans celebrated their festivals on Dec 25th or that during the long winters northern people had a celebration to “warm” up those long dark days is irrelevant.

 

[T. E. Smith]

Why do you think this is the “true” meaning of Christ-mass? It isn’t. The word “Christ” refers to Jesus. That Romans celebrated their festivals on Dec 25th or that during the long winters northern people had a celebration to “warm” up those long dark days is irrelevant.

It need not be the "true" meaning of Christmas (what do you mean by true?), but it is the origins of why we have a celebration then, and it explains the details of the celebration (the date, tree, presents, log).

 

[Northman]

Since ALL days belong to God, it's best to ignore the enemy when he tries to claim one after the fact.

 

[T. E. Smith]

Since ALL days belong to God, it's best to ignore the enemy when he tries to claim one after the fact.

If you'll remember, Paul describes the "strong" Christian as one who regards all days alike.

 

[Northman]

If you'll remember, Paul describes the "strong" Christian as one who regards all days alike.

Days/food issues
All under the same category. Only the immature in faith are even remotely concerned about them. I mean that in the context of the body. Of course judaizers will always be concerned and talking about this sort of thing.

 

[D-D-W]

We Messianics as a whole have no practice for celebrating Christmas - for a few different reasons.

First - Ancient Judaism (on which we are based) did not celebrate the anniversary of birth, but did (still does) mark the anniversary of one's death. It is called yartzheit. So it is doubtful that our Master ever had a birthday party.

2nd - there is no real consensus on His birth day. There are 2 possibilities, calculating from Zechariah (husband of Mary's cousin Elizabeth) being in the temple during his family order Abijah's period (2 weeks 6 months apart). One puts it during the Feast of Tabernacles (majority opinion) and the other during Passover week. The Didache (from ~ 100 ad) indicated that HE was born on the first day of Tabernacles. Since the Roman and Greek worlds did celebrate birth days, apparently that is when they chose to observe it.

3rd - the overtly paganized commercialism associated with Christmas is clearly not biblical.

4th - Chanukkah! Falls around the same time. And it (unlike Christmas) was observed by our Master. In fact, it was at the Temple during Chanukkah (translated Feast of Dedication) that He chose to make the first public announcement of His Messiahship.

Chanukkah - never appears in the Jewish bible (OT) but is universally celebrated by Jews. Does appear in the Christian bible (John 10.22) but totally ignored by Christians.

 

[T. E. Smith]

We Messianics as a whole have no practice for celebrating Christmas - for a few different reasons.

First - Ancient Judaism (on which we are based) did not celebrate the anniversary of birth, but did (still does) mark the anniversary of one's death. It is called yartzheit. So it is doubtful that our Master ever had a birthday party.

2nd - there is no real consensus on His birth day. There are 2 possibilities, calculating from Zechariah (husband of Mary's cousin Elizabeth) being in the temple during his family order Abijah's period (2 weeks 6 months apart). One puts it during the Feast of Tabernacles (majority opinion) and the other during Passover week. The Didache (from ~ 100 ad) indicated that HE was born on the first day of Tabernacles. Since the Roman and Greek worlds did celebrate birth days, apparently that is when they chose to observe it.

3rd - the overtly paganized commercialism associated with Christmas is clearly not biblical.

4th - Chanukkah! Falls around the same time. And it (unlike Christmas) was observed by our Master. In fact, it was at the Temple during Chanukkah (translated Feast of Dedication) that He chose to make the first public announcement of His Messiahship.

Chanukkah - never appears in the Jewish bible (OT) but is universally celebrated by Jews. Does appear in the Christian bible (John 10.22) but totally ignored by Christians.

On Chanukkah, that does appear in the book of Esther right? And I am delighted to see you point out how it is in John. I've never met a Christian before who was aware of this. But it's not hard to figure out. Just look up the Jewish calendar and figure out the timeline from other holidays mentioned in John...

 

[D-D-W]

On Chanukkah, that does appear in the book of Esther right? And I am delighted to see you point out how it is in John. I've never met a Christian before who was aware of this. But it's not hard to figure out. Just look up the Jewish calendar and figure out the timeline from other holidays mentioned in John...

Not in Esther or any other OT book. The events of Chanukkah were recorded in the apocryphal books of Maccabees (never considered part of the Jewish bible) and occurred in the 160s bce time frame, well after all the OT was written.

BTW, when the Temple was rededicated after the pagans offered pigs to Zeus, every stone that the swine blood touched was removed and stored in Solomon's porch, awaiting Messiah to come and say what to do with them. They were holy to God but irreparably polluted by idol worship. That porch was our Master's favorite place in the Temple. (at least it seems that way from reading the gospels)

 

[T. E. Smith]

Not in Esther or any other OT book. The events of Chanukkah were recorded in the apocryphal books of Maccabees (never considered part of the Jewish bible) and occurred in the 160s bce time frame, well after all the OT was written.

Oh shoot, I was thinking of Purim. My bad, I remember that story now.

 

[hawkman]

4th - Chanukkah! Falls around the same time. And it (unlike Christmas) was observed by our Master. In fact, it was at the Temple during Chanukkah (translated Feast of Dedication) that He chose to make the first public announcement of His Messiahship.

Once called the Feast of the Maccabees .

 

[Davos]

I think the Birth was in the feast of tabernacles. Or the day of atonement.

Here on our local radio some years ago, an American woman was being interviewed on Thanksgiving. And she was asked why they had two festivals close together, Thanksgiving and Christmas? She said many Americans, particularly in New England didn't celebrate Christmas, considering it a papal trivia. It changed in the late 19 century with mass immigration of Italians and Irish.

There are only two birthdays mentioned in scripture and they both resulted in someone losing their head.

I believe that if we were to celebrate the birthday, we would have been told and given the date in scripture.

 

[meerkat05]

2nd - there is no real consensus on His birth day. There are 2 possibilities, calculating from Zechariah (husband of Mary's cousin Elizabeth) being in the temple during his family order Abijah's period (2 weeks 6 months apart). One puts it during the Feast of Tabernacles (majority opinion) and the other during Passover week. The Didache (from ~ 100 ad) indicated that HE was born on the first day of Tabernacles. Since the Roman and Greek worlds did celebrate birth days, apparently that is when they chose to observe it.

If I remember right Jesus was born at the same time the lambs were born. In Israel its only a couple times a year..around passover in April and around September.

 

[reddogs]

I think the Birth was in the feast of tabernacles. Or the day of atonement.

Here on our local radio some years ago, an American woman was being interviewed on Thanksgiving. And she was asked why they had two festivals close together, Thanksgiving and Christmas? She said many Americans, particularly in New England didn't celebrate Christmas, considering it a papal trivia. It changed in the late 19 century with mass immigration of Italians and Irish.

There are only two birthdays mentioned in scripture and they both resulted in someone losing their head.

I believe that if we were to celebrate the birthday, we would have been told and given the date in scripture.

That's interesting that it was seen as coming from pagan rites that the church of Rome brought in.

 

[WalterandDebbie]

(The point of this thread is not to be irreverent or to discourage Christmas celebration; it is rather intended to teach the true history of the holiday and to explain why some Christians have historically rejected its celebration.)

It is often asserted that Christmas is, in origin, a Christian holiday. In fact, this is not the case. It originates from at least three pagan holidays, which Christians combined and upon which placed a Christian spin.

1: Saturnalia
First, Christmas originates in the holiday of Saturnalia. This was an ancient Roman festival celebrated in honor of the god Saturn, celebrated between the 17th and 23rd of December. They held a sacrifice at the Temple of Saturn in Rome, with a public banquet. Catullus, a Roman poet, called it "the best of days." Unlike other Roman holidays, it could be held in one's own home, anywhere in the Empire. Some crucial similarities exist:

1. A tree - At Saturnalia, residents would decorate a tree with candles and ornamentation.
2. Gift-giving - At Saturnalia, Romans would purchase and give gifts to one another.
3. Partying - At Saturnalia, the celebrants would party frequently, have banquets, and engage in general merrymaking.

The tree decoration is perhaps the most striking similarity. Some Christians have attempted to argue that the gift-giving comes from the three magi, but that is not the case; it originated in Saturnalia.

2: Yule
More conservative-leaning Christians will denigrate Halloween for its pagan origins in Germanic tribes, all the while happily ignoring the pagan Germanic origins of their favorite holiday. The festival of Yule was celebrated in winter prior to 1000 A.D., held between mid-December and early January. It is connected to the wild hunt. Northern Europe was the last area to be Christianized, and it appears that Yule had a major influence on Christmas. Some similarities:

1. The yule log - the tradition of the yule log comes directly from the pagan holiday of Yule.
2. Carolling - Yule was celebrated with crowds coming together for a winter ritual of singing, known as Koliada. This appears to be the origin of Christmas carolling.

3: "Birthday of the Unconquered Sun"
This was a late Roman holiday honoring Sol Invictus ("unconquered sun"), a god, on - strikingly - the 25th of December. No Christian historian thinks Jesus was born in winter (there are two contested dates, none in Winter), so the day appears to have come from Sol Invictus.

Malachi 4:2 speaks of "the sun of righteousness" (Sol Iustitiae), a reference to Jesus. It makes sense that Christians would have tied the birthday of Sol Invictus to the birthday of Jesus, Sol Iustitiae. In Mausoleum M, under St. Peter's Basilica, we see an inscription calling Jesus "Christo Sole", Christ the sun.

In conclusion, then, Christmas originated in Saturnalia and Sol Invictus, and Christians combined the birth of Jesus with it. Later, Yule was incorporated. The Puritans forbade Christmas celebrations because they recognized this fact.

Good morning, Interesting, we find things are not as pagan as people claim as to their belief.

Love, Walter And Debbie

 

[JT4444]

We Messianics as a whole have no practice for celebrating Christmas - for a few different reasons.

First - Ancient Judaism (on which we are based) did not celebrate the anniversary of birth, but did (still does) mark the anniversary of one's death. It is called yartzheit. So it is doubtful that our Master ever had a birthday party.

2nd - there is no real consensus on His birth day. There are 2 possibilities, calculating from Zechariah (husband of Mary's cousin Elizabeth) being in the temple during his family order Abijah's period (2 weeks 6 months apart). One puts it during the Feast of Tabernacles (majority opinion) and the other during Passover week. The Didache (from ~ 100 ad) indicated that HE was born on the first day of Tabernacles. Since the Roman and Greek worlds did celebrate birth days, apparently that is when they chose to observe it.

3rd - the overtly paganized commercialism associated with Christmas is clearly not biblical.

4th - Chanukkah! Falls around the same time. And it (unlike Christmas) was observed by our Master. In fact, it was at the Temple during Chanukkah (translated Feast of Dedication) that He chose to make the first public announcement of His Messiahship.

Chanukkah - never appears in the Jewish bible (OT) but is universally celebrated by Jews. Does appear in the Christian bible (John 10.22) but totally ignored by Christians.

We lost something when Christianity spread through Europe. I appreciate the perspective of Messianic believers who understand the Jewish roots of the faith. I only wish more Jews would see Jesus as the Messiah.

 

[Delete_me]

Christmas has Gentile origins. Not a thing wrong with that.