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The Poverty Gospel

And I agree with you, Jethro, but we must call out false teachers and condemn their preaching! God expects a full account of your life. This means that we must not only preach the gospel, but preach against false gospels, like the "prosperity gospel", which (for the unknowing) preaches that wealth should be spent on material things and that when you buy for yourself you are giving to God because it makes the body of Christ look well off. In matters of inter-Christian discussion you speak some truth, but in matters of false teachers, false gospels, false faiths, we must speak out because those are your potential brothers and sisters being fed a series of lies that will lead to their own destruction!
I just don't get that excited about how it might mislead people anymore. I started out as a new Christian in a hard core 'prosperity gospel' church (I mean that in every sense that you and many others understand what that means). I could tell even as a babe in Christ that it was at the least misguided. and was being used by many to cater to the desires of the flesh. But that really doesn't make the teaching in and of itself completely and categorically wrong. It means the person who does that with it is wrong.

I'm okay with talking about false doctrine for the benefit of others but the truth is those who truly belong to God have the compass of his anointing inside that alerts them to false doctrine. We really don't need to get our undies in a bunch about it. We just share the truth and move on. That's what Jesus did. He reserved his few emotional outbursts for the actual authors of false doctrine, not the sheep who stumbled along behind.

Honestly, I think Kidron's biggest error is his insensitivity in sharing what he believes about God's prosperity. I learned a long time ago that you can't shame very many people into accepting what you believe. Most of us are by nature much too proud to do that, lol. Shaming hardens way more people than it softens. Shaming is how cults thrive, not legitimate Christianity.

The actual content of what he says is just like everything everybody shares here, me included. No one takes what is said hook line and sinker with little or no thought or pause (how I wish that were true in regard to the truth). No, we cautiously take it in and ponder it and perhaps add some piece of it to the development of our doctrinal beliefs.
 
And that's where I have to differ with you, respectively. I think that sharing the gospel and condemning the false are one and the same. But I do agree that we must share in love. And I believe Kidron's intent was one of love, just as mine was too. And I do in fact agree with Kidron in most of his posting here. Where I differ, and I believe it is simply him not knowing of what I speak, is that he seems to think the "prosperity gospel" is made up mumbo-jumbo. And though I do not take any offense at his attempt to shame me I must add that the hypocrisy that he speaks of is something that I wish to further remove myself from, in that I do desire a minimalistic life. And I am aware that it is silly for me to say that while I go to college, but I do so because I believe it is God's desire that I become a pastor of His flock.
 
And I agree with you, Jethro, but we must call out false teachers and condemn their preaching! God expects a full account of your life. This means that we must not only preach the gospel, but preach against false gospels, like the "prosperity gospel", which (for the unknowing) preaches that wealth should be spent on material things and that when you buy for yourself you are giving to God because it makes the body of Christ look well off. In matters of inter-Christian discussion you speak some truth, but in matters of false teachers, false gospels, false faiths, we must speak out because those are your potential brothers and sisters being fed a series of lies that will lead to their own destruction!

We must be very careful with how we deal with those who teach falsely (not because of them) for many genuine believers become deceived because what is offered sounds great. Jesus uses the parable of the tares and the wheat to explain how we should deal with them. As the fruit of their mouths come to maturity there false doctrines will expose themselves and we can quickly cut them out without damaging the deceived but most certainly still children of God.

Love conquers all for nothing can defend against it such is its power.

John O
 
We speak about the "Prosperity Gospel" because it is such a prevalent and, well for lack of a better term, depraved new-age theology that has swept our television channels and our bookstores. It's a very unbiblical theology that entangles the lost in this whole "God wants you to have what your heart desires" teaching and claims that the inverse of prosperity, and truly even the lack of great wealth, is but God's punishing for your displeasing (not necessarily even evil, but simply displeasing) ways. The idea that, and someone on here brought this to my attention a few weeks ago, you can be saved but have God punishing you with poverty or even lower-middle-class-ness.

Well, the opposite of this "prosperity gospel" is logically the "poverty gospel". And though I have not yet seen or heard someone actually take it to this point yet, I can see the workings of it.

Now don't get me wrong I think Francis Chan is doing some awesome stuff and I have two of his books and I agree with him wholeheartedly, I think that, and maybe even fear that, his words and the words of others of this new movement towards humility and glory to God alone (as opposed to the backsliding from this way that once was but is now often not in the church) and above all other things may be turned into some sort of "poverty gospel". That is, salvation comes through simplicity and poverty, or better put, simplicity and poverty are the fruits of salvation.

This, unlike the prosperity gospel, is one that could be very easily concluded through the four gospels, as well as the remainder of the New Testament. At a first glance the entire New Testament seems to be an opposition to wealth and riches, but is it? I'd say not. Even Paul, maybe one of the most poverty stricken apostles in the New Testament, says that you should give to lift up others, but you should not give to the point that you yourself fall to where they were! Help your brothers up, but don't trade your place for theirs, lest you yourself end up in the need of another.

The truth of the matter is that riches breeds sin, both greed, idolatry, coveting, and blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. Speaking from experience, when I was a kid I'd get (what I thought anyways) was vast amounts of wealth each birthday and Christmas. I'd get crisp $100 bills, glorious $50 bills, an awesome $20 bills. I was rich! I was so happy, because of the M-O-N-E-Y! I had the world by the beard and look out because I was unstoppable!

This is what Jesus meant when he warned about wealth. It breeds a sense of power. He warned against it because truly the rich man would see himself as equal to God and as in no need of His help. This is sin, and this is what Christ meant by the words, not that the way to Heaven had a maximum income level, like roller-coasters and their "You Must be This Tall" signs.

Just something to keep your thoughts on, your prayers on, and your eye on, lest someone decides to grab that pendulum as it hits the apex of the "prosperity gospel" and decides to swing it ALLLLLLLLL the way to the other side. Of course this would be something that believers would have to worry about because there is really no way that such a "poverty gospel" would grab many from the world, although maybe a few hippies and some hobos would jump on that train. The true fear is that it will bring Christian brother against Christian brother.

And some may very well say I am just crazy, but it's not something new, this idea of poverty being the fruit of salvation isn't new at all, it's just as old as prosperity being the fruit of salvation!


When the rich young man came to Jesus, he wanted to know how he could be saved. Christ told him to go and sell all that he had. I do not think that Christ wanted the man to be a pauper. The man was more concerned with his material goods that with following Jesus.

Many have come to the conclusion that to be poor is more Christian like than being rich. Christ said that it is hard for a rich man to enter heaven not impossible. Abraham was a friend of God and was rich. I believe the problem is when we focus too much on our material things to the exclusion of our focus on God. On the other hand, many poor people can have a kind of self righteous pride when it comes to being poor. Poverty can lead to all kinds of evil. The key is that God must come first. Matthew 6.33

It is no sin to be rich. Poverty can come from lots of things including laziness which God abhors.
 
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