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Tower of Babel

  • Thread starter Thread starter tuwerofbabel
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tuwerofbabel

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Hello i'm doing an assignment for school and i need to ask some in depth questions about a scripture from the bible, "The Tower of Babel." I need to ask somebody who is of religous belief and actively attends church. Would be most appreciated if anyone is willing to discuss this with me.
 
Hi. Welcome to the forum!

What do you know already and what would you like to know?
 
tuwerofbabel said:
Hello i'm doing an assignment for school and i need to ask some in depth questions about a scripture from the bible, "The Tower of Babel." I need to ask somebody who is of religous belief and actively attends church. Would be most appreciated if anyone is willing to discuss this with me.

shoot..........
 
Well, I may be able to answer your questions even though I'm not a Christian.


Finis,
Eric
 
Ok thanks very much, just a heads up that i will be recording this though. If that's ok.

Ok so just some questions about the tower of babel.

Question 1: What are your beliefs about the significance of this story?

Question 2: What are your beliefs about the story itself?

Question 3: To you what do you think this story means, or what do you think it means to the modern day christian?

Question 4: Do you think that the morals and values of the story are relevant to modern day life?

Question 5: What do you believe that the core message or belief of the scripture is?

Thanks very much for any answers, if there is anything else you would like to add, feel free.
 
tuwerofbabel said:
Question 1: What are your beliefs about the significance of this story?

Question 2: What are your beliefs about the story itself?

Question 3: To you what do you think this story means, or what do you think it means to the modern day christian?

Question 4: Do you think that the morals and values of the story are relevant to modern day life?

Question 5: What do you believe that the core message or belief of the scripture is?

The story is old. Some date its origins to a famous ziggurat (temple-tower) of first dynasty of Babylon in the first half of the second millennium B.C., but it may go back further. It was originally a Mesopotamian story, but in the bible it's an etiology for the diversity of languages and nations of the world. There is a Sumerian mythological text describing the god Ellil confounding human language just like in the bible (Albright [1968] Yahweh and the Gods of Canaan, New York: Eisenbrauns, addendum 't', p. 272)

The story in the bible plays on the Hebrew word for Babylon, which is babel and connects it to a verb meaning 'to confuse'. (balal) Of course, this is merely the author's inventiveness. The name 'Babel' really means 'Gate of God', and has nothing to do with confusion. This etiological story cannot be taken to be literally true.

I can't answer the 3rd question. As to the 4th, no, since the story serves no 'moral' purpose. It's an etiology. Can't answer 5.

Finis,
Eric
 
tuwerofbabel said:
Question 1: What are your beliefs about the significance of this story?

Question 2: What are your beliefs about the story itself?

Question 3: To you what do you think this story means, or what do you think it means to the modern day christian?

Question 4: Do you think that the morals and values of the story are relevant to modern day life?

Question 5: What do you believe that the core message or belief of the scripture is?

Question 2: What are your beliefs about the story itself?

I'm your dyed-in-the-wool bible believing Christian so I believe that the story is divinely inspired, no matter what forms it might take in other cultures. In other words, I believe that God wants this story in the Bible for a purpose.

Question 5: What do you believe that the core message or belief of the scripture is?Question 1: What are your beliefs about the significance of this story? Question 3: To you what do you think this story means, or what do you think it means to the modern day christian?

Lumping some of your questions together here. I believe the core message is found in Genesis 11:6, "And the Lord said, "Behold, they are one people, and they all have the same language. And this is what they began to do, and now noting which they purpose will be impossible for them."

Rather than just an explanatory tale of how different languages came about, I think the story is more of a tale of just what an amazing, powerful, yet dangerous animal man is. God's reservations about man's ability to use his intelligence and capabilities for good are more than justified by our own modern era in which language and cultural differences are less and less of an hindrance to working together. My goodness, we've set a man on the moon. We've also created enough nuclear weapons to destroy this earth many times over.

Question 4: Do you think that the morals and values of the story are relevant to modern day life?
The relevancy I take out of it is that we need to be somewhat wary of man's accomplishments. Yes, nothing is impossible for man. We can break down the very atoms that make up the most fundamental essence of life, and then by doing so cause incredible destruction and death. It also shows that God will exercise His will over man, and limit man until such a time as God sees fit.
 
Question 3: To you what do you think this story means, or what do you think it means to the modern day christian?

From the Hebrew writer's perspective,I believe this story is full of innuendos. Keep in mind that these stories were told and written from an Exodus perspective. For example, the Hebrews were slaves in Egypt where they were oppressed, beaten and abused by the empire and their daily toils to the government included making bricks day in and day out as they increased the wealth of Egypt and built the Egyptian skyline.

From a Exodus perspective, Egypt is known as the Anti Kingdom of God as it represents how an empire is built on the backs of the oppressed. In modern day language, we call this systemic sin. When we look at the story of how Bable was built, we see that it was made of bricks, and from one who was recently freed from oppression, this would have resonated.

In modern day, this can easily translate this story into how nations as a whole exploit the weak for their own gain as systemic sin is still prevalent in today' world. Take for example the working conditions of third world countries that exploit children and adults alike to manufacture goods that are sold to hungry consumers right here in the USA.

I realize that my thoughts on this matter are vague and certainly not complete from the many perspectives this story represents, but I hope that it gives you a footing on which to proceed.
 
tuwerofbabel said:
Ok thanks very much, just a heads up that i will be recording this though. If that's ok.

Ok so just some questions about the tower of babel.

Question 1: What are your beliefs about the significance of this story?

Question 2: What are your beliefs about the story itself?

Question 3: To you what do you think this story means, or what do you think it means to the modern day christian?

Question 4: Do you think that the morals and values of the story are relevant to modern day life?

Question 5: What do you believe that the core message or belief of the scripture is?

Thanks very much for any answers, if there is anything else you would like to add, feel free.

I think that most people will have common answer to your questions.......But im kinda wondering what the author of these questions believes?????? Is it you????

Genesis 11:3 "And they said one to another, "Go to, let us make brick, and burn them thoroughly." And they had brick for stone, and slime had they for mortar."

[2564 chemar (khay-mawr'); from 2560; bitumen (as rising to the surface): -slime (-pit).]

The slime is basically asphalt,,,,Nebuchadnezzar (over 1300 years ago) built garden constucted of this ashpalt....

Gen. 11:4 And they said, Go to, let us build us a city and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven; and let us make us a name, lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth.

If you look at the Hebrew you will see that "let us make us a great name" actually should read
"let us provide our own salvation".

"whose top may reach unto heaven" should read "and its top with the heavens".............

These people building this tower,,,remembered the flood and how it swept things away....So they decided to build a tower that would provide there own salvation if another flood came....
 
If you look at the Hebrew you will see that "let us make us a great name" actually should read
"let us provide our own salvation".

I've never seen this interpretation of the Hebrew before. How does the Hebrew translate into "let us provide our own salvation"?
 
handy said:
If you look at the Hebrew you will see that "let us make us a great name" actually should read
"let us provide our own salvation".

I've never seen this interpretation of the Hebrew before. How does the Hebrew translate into "let us provide our own salvation"?

It doesn't. This is completely made up.


Finis,
Eric
 
handy said:
If you look at the Hebrew you will see that "let us make us a great name" actually should read
"let us provide our own salvation".

I've never seen this interpretation of the Hebrew before. How does the Hebrew translate into "let us provide our own salvation"?

Waz up,,,,Handy

I hope you not looking for a word for word carryover,,,,,but form reading the Hebrew it would seem that more then just a tower was being built....with all the referances to the heavens....


Insert ---- These Mesopotamian temple platforms are called ziggurats, a word derived from the Assyrian ziqquratu, meaning "high." They were symbols in themselves; the ziggurat at Ur was planted with trees to make it represent a mountain. There the god visited Earth, and the priests climbed to its top to worship.

The ziggurat continued as the essential temple form of Mesopotamia during the later Assyrian and Babylonian eras. In these later times it became taller and more towerlike, perhaps with a spiral path leading up to the temple at the top. The Greek historian Herodotus wrote that the main temple of Babylon, the famous Tower of Babel, was such a tower divided into seven diminishing stages, each a different color: white, black, purple, blue, orange, silver, and gold.

So what was actually being created here is a 1 world system,,,,,a one world system under Nimrod would provide a false salvation based on a fake religious order....

Insert---"whose top may reach unto heaven" should read "and its top with the heavens". The literal translation in Green's Interlinear says, "with its top, the heavens".

So again we see referance to "heaven" aka salvation by entering this tower....I also used the companion bible (E.W.) in researching this.....

Also the word ????? (a name) does not mean a name as used in the english...

8034 shem shame a primitive word (perhaps rather from 7760 through the idea of definite and conspicuous position; Compare 8064); an appellation, as a mark or memorial of individuality; by implication honor, authority, character:--+ base, (in-)fame(-ous), named(-d), renown, report.

7760 suwm soom or siym {seem}; a primitive root; to put (used in a great variety of applications, literal, figurative, inferentially, and elliptically):--X any wise, appoint, bring, call (a name), care, cast in, change, charge, commit, consider, convey, determine, + disguise, dispose, do, get, give, heap up, hold, impute, lay (down, up), leave, look, make (out), mark, + name, X on, ordain, order, + paint, place, preserve, purpose, put (on), + regard, rehearse, reward, (cause to) set (on, up), shew, + stedfastly, take, X tell, + tread down, ((over-))turn, X wholly, work.

8064 shamayim shaw-mah'-yim dual of an unused singular shameh {shaw-meh'}; from an unused root meaning to be lofty; the sky (as aloft; the dual perhaps alluding to the visible arch in which the clouds move, as well as to the higher ether where the celestial bodies revolve):--air, X astrologer, heaven(-s).
 
wavy said:
handy said:
If you look at the Hebrew you will see that "let us make us a great name" actually should read
"let us provide our own salvation".

I've never seen this interpretation of the Hebrew before. How does the Hebrew translate into "let us provide our own salvation"?

It doesn't. This is completely made up.


Finis,
Eric

DO you think I give a hoot about a non-christian giving input on christian matters.....Thats just like non-christian giving bible interpretations...

and let us make us a name, lest we be scattered

How is making a name going to keep you from being scattered????? Will changing my name to Bill or maybe Tom stop a flood that will scatter people.......Will creating a great name for a group of people stop a flood.......NO and NO,,,,,but building a tower that will reach the heavens was the plan,,,and that would allow man to escape another flood....

footnote --- God had already said he would not flood the earth again,,,just goes to show the people trusted in Nimrod more than the Lord.....
 
I would love to waste my time and wade through your rambling, pointing out all the absurdities in your post, only to have you, as I would predict, miss the entire point anyway as what I say flies right over your head.

But frankly, I don't have time. Suffice to say that I think it is obvious that you have zero understanding of Hebrew and fail to distinguish between interpreting what the text means and the correct translation of the Hebrew.

And oh yes, your plagiarism is noted.

Finis,
Eric

(THE) said:
DO you think I give a hoot about a non-christian giving input on christian matters.....Thats just like non-christian giving bible interpretations...

and let us make us a name, lest we be scattered

How is making a name going to keep you from being scattered????? Will changing my name to Bill or maybe Tom stop a flood that will scatter people.......Will creating a great name for a group of people stop a flood.......NO and NO,,,,,but building a tower that will reach the heavens was the plan,,,and that would allow man to escape another flood....

footnote --- God had already said he would not flood the earth again,,,just goes to show the people trusted in Nimrod more than the Lord.....
 
I find it somewhat interesting that the tower of Babel incident took place after the flood in the Bible, suggesting that from the rather long period from the creation to the flood the world spoke one language. Or, it could just mean that the language of Noah was the only one that survived the flood. Anyone have further thoughts on that?

P.S. Sup, Eric? I bide my time piddling here and there on these forums. Whenever I get some real time to sit down for a while I will try to read more of Redford and get back to you on his book.

~Josh
 
wavy said:
I would love to waste my time and wade through your rambling, pointing out all the absurdities in your post, only to have you, as I would predict, miss the entire point anyway as what I say flies right over your head.

But frankly, I don't have time. Suffice to say that I think it is obvious that you have zero understanding of Hebrew and fail to distinguish between interpreting what the text means and the correct translation of the Hebrew.

And oh yes, your plagiarism is noted.

Finis,
Eric

(THE) said:
DO you think I give a hoot about a non-christian giving input on christian matters.....Thats just like non-christian giving bible interpretations...

and let us make us a name, lest we be scattered

How is making a name going to keep you from being scattered????? Will changing my name to Bill or maybe Tom stop a flood that will scatter people.......Will creating a great name for a group of people stop a flood.......NO and NO,,,,,but building a tower that will reach the heavens was the plan,,,and that would allow man to escape another flood....

footnote --- God had already said he would not flood the earth again,,,just goes to show the people trusted in Nimrod more than the Lord.....

Plagerism,,,,,I copyed and pasted 2 things and put (insert) right by it so it would be obvious,,,,also I type with major ,,,,,,,,,?????????? so its obvious when you dont see this I have added it.........

I have read your post nothing you have ever said has went over my head.......

I would love to waste my time and wade through your rambling, pointing out all the absurdities in your post, only to have you, as I would predict, miss the entire point anyway as what I say flies right over your head.

What is rambling?????? the text says the word used for "a name" is ????? and is not implying the usage of names relating to titles.....

Absurd??????

I believe from the surrounding text (Hebrew) we can conclude the tower was built to escape Gods wrath,,,,and that would mean to provide there own salvation.....

Why dont reply with scripture/research.......Bashing from behind a computer makes you look like even a smaller man......
 
cybershark5886 said:
I find it somewhat interesting that the tower of Babel incident took place after the flood in the Bible, suggesting that from the rather long period from the creation to the flood the world spoke one language. Or, it could just mean that the language of Noah was the only one that survived the flood. Anyone have further thoughts on that?

P.S. Sup, Eric? I bide my time piddling here and there on these forums. Whenever I get some real time to sit down for a while I will try to read more of Redford and get back to you on his book.

~Josh


I believe the writer is concentrating on the Adamic blood and those closely surrounding......As you probably know the word "erets" is mostly used to describe a area of land not the entire world......
 
Man, there's some attitude on here... :mad

To the OP - From what I gather, before I came to the faith and without me going into scripture for this, the Tower of Babel was being built and added on to by men who wanted to reach the heavens (and be like God)..
God had it destroyed and scattered them, mixed their languages up to slow them down. Maybe if God had not done that then they may have destroyed the earth with their selfish attitudes and progress.
It is interesting to note that only recently we have started to have so many scientific advancements where we can do so called Godly experiments and use technology to do amazing yet dangerous things..
Maybe God had to slow mankind down in Babel for their own sake!
Just a thought... :P



http://getwiththeword.blogspot.com/
 
Steve76 said:
Man, there's some attitude on here... :mad

To the OP - From what I gather, before I came to the faith and without me going into scripture for this, the Tower of Babel was being built and added on to by men who wanted to reach the heavens (and be like God)..
God had it destroyed and scattered them, mixed their languages up to slow them down. Maybe if God had not done that then they may have destroyed the earth with their selfish attitudes and progress.
It is interesting to note that only recently we have started to have so many scientific advancements where we can do so called Godly experiments and use technology to do amazing yet dangerous things..
Maybe God had to slow mankind down in Babel for their own sake!
Just a thought... :P



http://getwiththeword.blogspot.com/

I think its a good chance that they would have evolved into a 1 world system under Nimrod,,a shadow of the 1 world system that is to come under satan/antichrist....

THe message of Christ is salvation,,,,,,SO the message of the antichrist will also be salvation and even here in Genesis we see man trying to create there own salvation,,,,if the dudes would have just acted right they would have not had to worry about floods......
 
Ok thank you very much for all of your answers, i will attempt to incorporate as many as possible. Finally for anyone who is game, i have a modern day version of the tower of babel story."http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ldI2FJQ_oE" I don't think that there are any profanity's or anything too coarse, but if you could take the time to watch it and then answer. Do you think that this interpretation of the story is disrespectful, or do you think there is good religious relevance, and does it help us get closer to god?
 
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