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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
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Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
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Depending upon the Holy Spirit for all you do?
Read through the following study by Tenchi for more on this topic
https://christianforums.net/threads/without-the-holy-spirit-we-can-do-nothing.109419/
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How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
Join Sola Scriptura for a discussion on the subject
https://christianforums.net/threads/anointed-preaching-teaching.109331/#post-1912042
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Tribes
- Thread starter JM
- Start date
tim-from-pa
Member
Last tribes of who or what? Whose the first then?
G
Georges
Guest
I've seen material related to the subject......the greater part of the tribes were still in existance during Christianity's early days....in Iraq/Iran.
:
tim-from-pa
Member
It's amazing the way Scripture is being fulfilled. First the fishers (that Jesus sent out), then the hunters of the tribes (Jeremiah 16:16). Probably the biggest misconceptions about lost tribes is that they will behave "like the Jew" practicing their religion in some remote area somewhere. How about looking for a massive number of Gentile people in the isles (and coastlands), that colonized, that are a light to the nations (c.f. Isaiah 49) and finally who do not know where they came from, say, since the 600-700BC timeframe? That's a far more accurate description of them in the Bible.
No, let's turn deaf ears to what the Bible says. Instead, lets look for them on every mountain, every hill, and out of the holes of the rocks. At least God had a sense of humor (like me)
:
No, let's turn deaf ears to what the Bible says. Instead, lets look for them on every mountain, every hill, and out of the holes of the rocks. At least God had a sense of humor (like me)
:
G
Georges
Guest
I wanted to add to the mix.....To those who say there are no more 10 tribes...
Consider this....It has been proven by DNA analysis that at least 2 tribes have been verified....Judah (Obviously) and Levi. The Levitical line has been verified by DNA studies. Jewish last names such as Cohen and even Levit are linked the Levi.
If it is possible for man to discover through DNA analysis that the Priestly line of Levi still exists....Don't you think GOD the creator of DNA can tell who are descended form the rest of the tribes. They are out there, Bible prophecy says they are.
Surely these people can even be sought out today...it's just a matter of a bones and blood DNA check.
BTW, it was found that the Levi DNA had a particular characteristic that is only particular to the Levi line and no one else. I believe the same will be true for the others.
Consider this....It has been proven by DNA analysis that at least 2 tribes have been verified....Judah (Obviously) and Levi. The Levitical line has been verified by DNA studies. Jewish last names such as Cohen and even Levit are linked the Levi.
If it is possible for man to discover through DNA analysis that the Priestly line of Levi still exists....Don't you think GOD the creator of DNA can tell who are descended form the rest of the tribes. They are out there, Bible prophecy says they are.
Surely these people can even be sought out today...it's just a matter of a bones and blood DNA check.
BTW, it was found that the Levi DNA had a particular characteristic that is only particular to the Levi line and no one else. I believe the same will be true for the others.
tim-from-pa
Member
I am just curious as to whom will be the standard for DNA?
G
Georges
Guest
Don't know, but history does know where the 12 tribes were located in the land.....gotta be some bones somewhere. The point in my post being...if the Levitical line has been verified as presently existing (separate of the Jewish (Judah) line, then surely God has the other tribes identified.
tim-from-pa
Member
Well, at least old bones (provided they are not contaminated) sounds better than what many say that propose DNA testing. They want to compare the tribe in question "to the Jew". Since the Jews were tribally mostly from Judah, I always say that one cannot do that--- but that goes over the heads of many because they do not distinguish the Jews from Israelites (the house of Judah v.s. the house of Israel).
R
Raphe
Guest
Jesus said that He came back for the "lost sheep of the house of Israel" which are those lost ten tribes of the house f Israel. The house of Judah is the other of the two houses that split from each other after the death of Solomon.
Matthew 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
The new covenant is even directly promised to these two houses, but few truly understand who they are and why so many of the prophecies n the Old Testament and New are specific to which house is being spoken to.
Hebrews 8:6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises. 7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second. 8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
The house of Judah returned from captivity to rebuild the temple before Jesus was born, but the house of Israel was sifted into the Gentile nations, being called "lo ammi", as though they were not God's people. God promised that in spite of their terrible sins of idolatry that He would make them "Sons of the Living God".(Amos 9:9; Hosea 1:9-11)
Hosea 8:8 Israel is swallowed up; Now they are among the Gentiles Like a vessel in which is no pleasure.
Amos 9:9 "For surely I will command, And will sift the house of Israel among all nations, As grain is sifted in a sieve; Yet not the smallest grain shall fall to the ground.
Hosea 5:3 I know Ephraim, and Israel is not hid from me: for now, O Ephraim, thou committest whoredom, and Israel is defiled.
Hosea 1:9 Then God said: "Call his name Lo-Ammi, For you are not My people, And I will not be your God.
10 "Yet the number of the children of Israel Shall be as the sand of the sea, Which cannot be measured or numbered. And it shall come to pass In the place where it was said to them, ‘You are not My people,’ There it shall be said to them, ‘You are sons of the living God.’
11 Then shall the children of Judah and the children of Israel be gathered together, and appoint themselves one head, and they shall come up out of the land: for great shall be the day of Jezreel.
Romans 9:25 ¶ As He says also in Hosea: "I will call them My people, who were not My people, And her beloved, who was not beloved." 26 "And it shall come to pass in the place where it was said to them, ‘You are not My people,’ There they shall be called sons of the living God."
Ephraim was the son of Joseph who saved his brothers in Egypt, and was the one Abraham passed the covenant promise to as "firstborn", and he was the head of the house of Israel which was 10 tribes. Jeremiah prophecies of Ephraim as God's "firstborn". There is a connection that Jesus has with the firstborn of God, Him being also the "firstborn among many brethren", and who is it today that are called the born again?(Rom.8:29) There is also a connection with the "Church of the firstborn" (Heb. 11:23).
Jeremiah 31:9 They shall come with weeping, and with supplications will I lead them: I will cause them to walk by the rivers of waters in a straight way, wherein they shall not stumble: for I am a father to Israel, and Ephraim is my firstborn.
Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
Hebrews 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
Hosea said that the house of Israel would dwell in a "pleasant place" and take his children to the murderer.
The promises given to those who inherited the covenant from Abraham, through his seed would possess the gate of their enemies. Actually, there is a large amount of description in scripture that should help us identify who these people would be today, and I believe they are the Church. The house of Israel are the born again, firstborn brothers of Christ, and the house of Judah is the other of the two witnesses before the God of Abraham Isaac, and Jacob on this earth.
Before entering into the Promised Land, twelve men, one to represent each of the twelve tribes, were sent spy out the Promised Land. Only two returned with a good report: Caleb, from the tribe of Judah, and Joshua, frorn the tribe of Ephraim (Numbers 13:2,6,8).
In the Bible, the first example of two who witnessed to truth of the claims of the Holy One of Israel are of Judah Ephraim. Two witnesses gave a good report about the promises of our God: A Judahite and an Ephraimite.
At the end of our Holy Book, Yeshua says of His two witnesses: "I will grant the power of prophecy to My two witnesses" (Revelation 11:3.)
Two witnesses were anointed to speak for the Holy One of Israel. And Yeshua describes them as, "The two olive trees that stand before the Lord of the earth" (Revelation 11:4).
Also, after seeing two olive trees, Zechariah asked the Holy One, "What are these two olive trees"? And He answered "These are the two who are anointed to serve the Lord of all the earth" (Zechariah 4:11,14, NM)
In the Book of Revelation, the two witnesses are "two lampstands." And, "Lampstands are ... churches" (Revelation 11:3,4; 1:20). And, (true) churches ( ekklesias) are assemblies /congregations of called out ones.
Thus do we see the two witnesses as two congregations of peoples. And, in the last days, Yahveh calls forth two congregations of peoples: They are the "two sticks,. " or olive trees," that He will soon make "one" in His hand (Ezekial 37:15-28). Judah and Ephraim.
Ezekial 37:16 Moreover, thou son of man, take thee one stick, and write upon it, For Judah, and for the children of Israel his companions: then take another stick, and write upon it, For Joseph, the stick of Ephraim, and for all the house of Israel his companions 17 And join them one to another into one stick; and they shall become one in thine hand.
Metaphorically, the two witnesses are two anointed Olive trees that speak for the God of Israel. And history proves that, though distorted, for two millennia, two peoples, Jews (house of Judah) and Christians (house of Israel), have essentially been proclaiming Yahveh's twin truths of Law and Grace. And soon, Yahveh will make His divided house, His twin branched olive tree, "one stick" in His hand. For Israel will have lived through a time of division. They will have come full circle. Once more, two witnesses will be fully united in their testimony about the promises made by the Holy One of Israel.
And once more, they will be able to take the Land...but only when they are united. Where are they united - they are united and returned to the land, as they are over a hundred prophesies speaking of the reunification of the two houses or witnesses and their return to the promised land that was never taken - from the Nile to the Euphrates rivers.
Jer 3:18 In those days the house of Judah will walk with the house of Israel, and they will come together from the land of the north to the land that I gave your fathers as an inheritance.
Eze 37:12 Therefore prophesy and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord
GOD; Behold, O my people, I will open your graves, and cause you to come up out of your graves, and bring you into the land of Israel. 13 And ye shall know that I am the LORD, when I have opened your graves, O my people, and brought you up out of your graves, 14 And shall put my spirit in you, and ye shall live, and I shall place you in your own land: then shall ye know that I the LORD have spoken it, and performed it, saith the LORD.
Judaism and Christianity are the only two religons on the face of the earth that give testimony about the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob."
Those of Islamic faith claim to follow the God of Abraham. However, Abraham's God calls Himself,"The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob" (Exodus 3:16; Acts 3:13). Islam denies that Isaac and Jacob are Abraham's heirs. Instead, they claim that Ishmael is Abraham's true heir. Therefore, the Allah (god) of Islam and the God of Abraham cannot be one and the same.
If There Are Two Individuals...If beyond the two companies of peoples of Ephraim and Judah there are two individual witnesses - Scriptural precedent intimates that one will be an Ephraimite and the other a Judahite. If there are two individual witnesses who will yet rise, then they will lead the two houses of Israel in a war against the Beast. For, it is their war.
The Amplified Bible says of this battle, "But with united forces, Ephraim and Judah will swoop down upon the shoulder of the Philistines land sloping toward the west; together they will strip the people on the east [the Arabs]. They will lay their hand upon Edom and Moab, and the Ammonites shall obey them" (Isaiah 11: 14,).
Matthew 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
The new covenant is even directly promised to these two houses, but few truly understand who they are and why so many of the prophecies n the Old Testament and New are specific to which house is being spoken to.
Hebrews 8:6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises. 7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second. 8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
The house of Judah returned from captivity to rebuild the temple before Jesus was born, but the house of Israel was sifted into the Gentile nations, being called "lo ammi", as though they were not God's people. God promised that in spite of their terrible sins of idolatry that He would make them "Sons of the Living God".(Amos 9:9; Hosea 1:9-11)
Hosea 8:8 Israel is swallowed up; Now they are among the Gentiles Like a vessel in which is no pleasure.
Amos 9:9 "For surely I will command, And will sift the house of Israel among all nations, As grain is sifted in a sieve; Yet not the smallest grain shall fall to the ground.
Hosea 5:3 I know Ephraim, and Israel is not hid from me: for now, O Ephraim, thou committest whoredom, and Israel is defiled.
Hosea 1:9 Then God said: "Call his name Lo-Ammi, For you are not My people, And I will not be your God.
10 "Yet the number of the children of Israel Shall be as the sand of the sea, Which cannot be measured or numbered. And it shall come to pass In the place where it was said to them, ‘You are not My people,’ There it shall be said to them, ‘You are sons of the living God.’
11 Then shall the children of Judah and the children of Israel be gathered together, and appoint themselves one head, and they shall come up out of the land: for great shall be the day of Jezreel.
Romans 9:25 ¶ As He says also in Hosea: "I will call them My people, who were not My people, And her beloved, who was not beloved." 26 "And it shall come to pass in the place where it was said to them, ‘You are not My people,’ There they shall be called sons of the living God."
Ephraim was the son of Joseph who saved his brothers in Egypt, and was the one Abraham passed the covenant promise to as "firstborn", and he was the head of the house of Israel which was 10 tribes. Jeremiah prophecies of Ephraim as God's "firstborn". There is a connection that Jesus has with the firstborn of God, Him being also the "firstborn among many brethren", and who is it today that are called the born again?(Rom.8:29) There is also a connection with the "Church of the firstborn" (Heb. 11:23).
Jeremiah 31:9 They shall come with weeping, and with supplications will I lead them: I will cause them to walk by the rivers of waters in a straight way, wherein they shall not stumble: for I am a father to Israel, and Ephraim is my firstborn.
Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
Hebrews 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
Hosea said that the house of Israel would dwell in a "pleasant place" and take his children to the murderer.
The promises given to those who inherited the covenant from Abraham, through his seed would possess the gate of their enemies. Actually, there is a large amount of description in scripture that should help us identify who these people would be today, and I believe they are the Church. The house of Israel are the born again, firstborn brothers of Christ, and the house of Judah is the other of the two witnesses before the God of Abraham Isaac, and Jacob on this earth.
Before entering into the Promised Land, twelve men, one to represent each of the twelve tribes, were sent spy out the Promised Land. Only two returned with a good report: Caleb, from the tribe of Judah, and Joshua, frorn the tribe of Ephraim (Numbers 13:2,6,8).
In the Bible, the first example of two who witnessed to truth of the claims of the Holy One of Israel are of Judah Ephraim. Two witnesses gave a good report about the promises of our God: A Judahite and an Ephraimite.
At the end of our Holy Book, Yeshua says of His two witnesses: "I will grant the power of prophecy to My two witnesses" (Revelation 11:3.)
Two witnesses were anointed to speak for the Holy One of Israel. And Yeshua describes them as, "The two olive trees that stand before the Lord of the earth" (Revelation 11:4).
Also, after seeing two olive trees, Zechariah asked the Holy One, "What are these two olive trees"? And He answered "These are the two who are anointed to serve the Lord of all the earth" (Zechariah 4:11,14, NM)
In the Book of Revelation, the two witnesses are "two lampstands." And, "Lampstands are ... churches" (Revelation 11:3,4; 1:20). And, (true) churches ( ekklesias) are assemblies /congregations of called out ones.
Thus do we see the two witnesses as two congregations of peoples. And, in the last days, Yahveh calls forth two congregations of peoples: They are the "two sticks,. " or olive trees," that He will soon make "one" in His hand (Ezekial 37:15-28). Judah and Ephraim.
Ezekial 37:16 Moreover, thou son of man, take thee one stick, and write upon it, For Judah, and for the children of Israel his companions: then take another stick, and write upon it, For Joseph, the stick of Ephraim, and for all the house of Israel his companions 17 And join them one to another into one stick; and they shall become one in thine hand.
Metaphorically, the two witnesses are two anointed Olive trees that speak for the God of Israel. And history proves that, though distorted, for two millennia, two peoples, Jews (house of Judah) and Christians (house of Israel), have essentially been proclaiming Yahveh's twin truths of Law and Grace. And soon, Yahveh will make His divided house, His twin branched olive tree, "one stick" in His hand. For Israel will have lived through a time of division. They will have come full circle. Once more, two witnesses will be fully united in their testimony about the promises made by the Holy One of Israel.
And once more, they will be able to take the Land...but only when they are united. Where are they united - they are united and returned to the land, as they are over a hundred prophesies speaking of the reunification of the two houses or witnesses and their return to the promised land that was never taken - from the Nile to the Euphrates rivers.
Jer 3:18 In those days the house of Judah will walk with the house of Israel, and they will come together from the land of the north to the land that I gave your fathers as an inheritance.
Eze 37:12 Therefore prophesy and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord
GOD; Behold, O my people, I will open your graves, and cause you to come up out of your graves, and bring you into the land of Israel. 13 And ye shall know that I am the LORD, when I have opened your graves, O my people, and brought you up out of your graves, 14 And shall put my spirit in you, and ye shall live, and I shall place you in your own land: then shall ye know that I the LORD have spoken it, and performed it, saith the LORD.
Judaism and Christianity are the only two religons on the face of the earth that give testimony about the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob."
Those of Islamic faith claim to follow the God of Abraham. However, Abraham's God calls Himself,"The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob" (Exodus 3:16; Acts 3:13). Islam denies that Isaac and Jacob are Abraham's heirs. Instead, they claim that Ishmael is Abraham's true heir. Therefore, the Allah (god) of Islam and the God of Abraham cannot be one and the same.
If There Are Two Individuals...If beyond the two companies of peoples of Ephraim and Judah there are two individual witnesses - Scriptural precedent intimates that one will be an Ephraimite and the other a Judahite. If there are two individual witnesses who will yet rise, then they will lead the two houses of Israel in a war against the Beast. For, it is their war.
The Amplified Bible says of this battle, "But with united forces, Ephraim and Judah will swoop down upon the shoulder of the Philistines land sloping toward the west; together they will strip the people on the east [the Arabs]. They will lay their hand upon Edom and Moab, and the Ammonites shall obey them" (Isaiah 11: 14,).
Vic C.
Member
Hi Raphe,
http://www.christianforums.net/viewtopi ... vid#223076
________________________________________________________________________
[1] sons of fresh oil
Just thought I'd share this info.
Peace,
Vic
Interesting you would make the connection between this verse and the two witnesses. I see it, though I had attributed this verse to be talking about David and Jesus; the two annointed ones. I submitted a post on this a few weeks ago...
http://www.christianforums.net/viewtopi ... vid#223076
________________________________________________________________________
http://www.enduringword.com/commentaries/3804.htm
[1] sons of fresh oil
Just thought I'd share this info.
Peace,
Vic
I
irishrain
Guest
They are simply two flesh men, because Satan kills them vs.7 , They are also the sons of oil Zac 4.
Rev 11:7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.
Rev 13:11 ,Rev 9:11, Rev 17:8
Zac 4 is a beautiful Analogy of how the Truth flows threw the Holy Spirit to the world threw the seven branched candlestick( 7 churches Rev 1:20), a menorah.
I
irishrain
Guest
10 lost tribes http://members.tnns.net/wordweb/losttribe.htm
Part of the key of David is knowing where they are at today! :x-mas:
Part of the key of David is knowing where they are at today! :x-mas:
tim-from-pa
Member
Irishrain:
Your link is broken. Nothing comes up when I try it. Are you sure you did not have a typo when you typed that URL?
Your link is broken. Nothing comes up when I try it. Are you sure you did not have a typo when you typed that URL?
I
irishrain
Guest
tim_from_pa said:
It still works for me. :-? Try this one http://members.tnns.net/wordweb/home.htm
Here is another link and a really good book on the on
traceing the lost tribes of Israel.
http://www.artisanpublishers.com/
Abrahamic Covenant - Ray Capt
The little book that clearly identifies
Abraham's modern-day descendants.
E. RAYMOND CAPT world renown biblical archeologist and historian.
HS00100
Author: E. Raymond Capt
This outline of the identity of God's people, as revealed in this study of God's Covenant with Abraham, was compiled as a guide for Bible students. Traces Abraham's descendants through the formation of the Tribes of Israel, their captivities and migration to their appointed land in Europe and later on to America (with Ephriam identified with England and Manasseh with America).
Manasseh means "forgetfulness" and if there has ever been a people forgetful of their past it is this Manasseh-Israel people of the United States!
Abrahamic Covenant is "the" little blue book that opened the eyes of thousands of Christians to their Israelite heritage and how that one single discovery has changed the way they now view all Bible doctrine and prophecy!
tim-from-pa
Member
irishrain said:
Now here's a smart cookie in my book. Thanks for the link. I love Capt and I have my own web site on these same things, including the genealogy (based on the bible, Capt's works and Judah's Sceptre/ Joseph's birthright by J.H. Allen) from King David to Elizabeth II today. There, I guess I spilled the beans a little :-D
As I would say in my Irish accent, "Aye, you are a fine lad (or lass)" Very good.
tim-from-pa
Member
JM said:
Well, I hope you find it, but unless you are just curious as to what the show says, I'd look to Irishrain's links instead. If you really want to know about the lost tribes, don't turn deaf ears to sound teaching about them, unless you want to waste your time to "look for them on every mountain, every hill, and out of the holes of the rocks."
To the rest: It look like Raphe, Wavy, Irishrain and myself are on the same page pertaining to this subject, at least from from what I am reading so far. That's a tad encouraging these days.