True name of Elohim

[fadinglight]

Many bibles today refer to our creator, our Elohim to be known as "God" or "Lord". God and Lord are titles, not names. There are many religions today in which believe in many different Gods. So if God is used in most religions how can it be the name of the one and only true Elohim? The answer is it's not his name, to many Christians today believe that "God" is the name to the Elohim of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, but this can not be true for God is a title used by many other religions. So how do you find the true name of our Elohim? You search for the original texts of the bible which are in hebrew. Exo 3:15 And Elohim said to Moses again, You shall say this to the sons of Israel, YAHWEH, the Elohim of your fathers, the Elohim of Abraham, the Elohim of Isaac, and the Elohim of Jacob, has sent me to you. This is my name forever, and this is my memorial from generation to generation.

Rev 22:19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, Yahweh shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

Deu 4:2 Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish aught from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the Yahweh your Elohim which I command you.


coyhwh.com For more coverage and information on this topic and others. (Papers) tab.

 

[Blazin Bones]

Are you advocating that we stop calling the only true God, God? Elohim, El-Shaddai, Jehovah, Jesus, I am; these are Names of the ONLY God. Those who believe in other gods cannot claim beleif in the God. Just because other faiths claim that their created dieties are God's does not make it true. Since Jehovah is the only true God I would contend it is no less Christian to Esteem Jehovah for who he is, the only true God. I am not discredting that Elohim is his name, but just suggesting that to tell Christian that we cannot call the only true God, God is a bit out there for me.

 

[stovebolts]

This is from another topic that you might find interesting.

viewtopic.php?f=32&t=39535&start=0

It might be of note also that God has many names as mentioned in Genesis. These names include, but not limited to Elohim, YHVH and El. It is also worthy of note that Elohim and El are also referred to within the various Near Eastern pantheon's with no connection to YHVH.

The setting these texts were written in was a setting where the entire Near Eastern region was inundated with other gods which we will refer to as the pantheon. For further information on the pantheon, please refer to this thread. viewtopic.php?f=56&t=34818 For biblical reference in regard to YHVH and the pantheon, please read Psalm 82:1, 95:3, 96:4, 135:5 and 136:2. Thus, god (Elohim) is always representative of the pantheon, while God (Elohim) is always reference to YHVH within the biblical texts.

In my studies, I have found that within the pagan pantheon, both Elohim and El are normatively representative of the god head to which the lesser gods are subject. Within Near Eastern texts, this godhead is called Elohim in reference to his absolute power and authority while the name El is more often used in reference as a type of father figure in connection to fertility and his offspring.

Although I do not wish to delve deeply into the name El and how it was used within the Hebrew texts, it is clear that the Hebrew writers identified El as the father of the Patriarchs (El) Genesis 49:25 much in the way the Canaanites viewed El as the father of their pantheon. Also, El was not revealed to the patriarchs as YHVH, but as El Shaddai (God Almighty, Exodus 6:3).

 

[fadinglight]

"Are you advocating that we stop calling the only true God, God? Elohim, El-Shaddai, Jehovah, Jesus, I am; these are Names of the ONLY God. Those who believe in other gods cannot claim beleif in the God. Just because other faiths claim that their created dieties are God's does not make it true. Since Jehovah is the only true God I would contend it is no less Christian to Esteem Jehovah for who he is, the only true God. I am not discredting that Elohim is his name, but just suggesting that to tell Christian that we cannot call the only true God, God is a bit out there for me."

First let me address that I did not say his true name was Elohim. Read Exo 3:15 one more time, hopefully more thoroughly than last.

I'm advocating that it is your duty as a christian to find your God's true name. The bible was originally written in hebrew than translated from w/e other language one of them being Greek. It would only make sense that the name used in the hebrew text would be the correct name, YHWH and Yahshua. If the countries, that translated the bible, from w/e language into English the correct translation from Yahshua to English would most likely be Joshua not Jesus. I'm not telling you, you cant call him God only sharing with you the understanding that God is truly a title not a name and the importance of his name.

 

[fadinglight]

Also would like to add, that the reason for this post was only to inform and aware christians that his name is important and that when given the information about his name you should have the intent to listen or further research. It wasn't to discredit any mirachle that happened in the name of Jesus Christ, only to share factual information about the true name of Jesus and the Elohim of our fathers, Yashua the son and Yahweh the father.

 

[Caroline H]

Point understood fadinglight, welcome to the site BTW

 

[seve]

correct me if I am wrong.... It's my understanding, based on the Book of Revelation, that no man knows the name of the invisible God, the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, at this time -- until one overcometh in the end.

look and read...

Revelation 3:11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown. v12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.

Revelation 19:12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself. v13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

JMHO based on the Scriptures.

 

[RND]

I'm advocating that it is your duty as a christian to find your God's true name.

My understanding of man's duty to God is slightly different than yours.

Ecc 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this [is] the whole [duty] of man.

Where does the Bible ever state that it is man's duty to know God's true name? What good would it be to know God's true name and yet be unable to reflect His character?

 

[fadinglight]

Thank you Seve and RND for your replies. You both have brought up very good questions and points. I'll be searching in scripture to answer your questions, and as soon as possible. Please check back daily

If you would like to search some information yourself, please visit coyhwh.com there are many answers there and could explain questions you have a lot more thoroughly than I could.

But I do know this the name of the Elohim of our fathers Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob is very important. Why? because there is only one name given for salvation and eternal life, and thats Yahweh the father and Yahshua the son.

 

[RND]

Thank you Seve and RND for your replies. You both have brought up very good questions and points. I'll be searching in scripture to answer your questions, and as soon as possible. Please check back daily

If you would like to search some information yourself, please visit coyhwh.com there are many answers there and could explain questions you have a lot more thoroughly than I could.

But I do know this the name of the Elohim of our fathers Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob is very important. Why? because there is only one name given for salvation and eternal life, and thats Yahweh the father and Yahshua the son.

Thank you for the invitation to visit your church's site. From that cite I read: "We believe Yahweh to be a family name consisting of Yah, Yahweh the Father, and Yahshua Yahweh his Son. We believe them to be two separate beings, but are one in thought, mind, and love by the Holy Spirit. Gen 1:26, and Gen 19:24, shows this duality of beings. Deut 6:4, also states "Yahweh Elohim, Yahweh Echad" (united, supreme). This word echad in the Hebrew shows a duality of Yahweh. We believe that Yahweh the Father is greater than Yahshua the Son, (Jn 5:30, Matt 19:7) in both power and Authority, but commands us to honor Yahshua as we honor him (Jn 5:23)."

How do you answer the inquiry that the name pronounced Yahweh is simply the vocalization of the tetragrammaton YVWH?

 

[seve]

Dear fadinglight,

It is my biblical opinion that Yahweh (OT) is the Son of God himself (not the Father) who was sent into this world (NT) to save us from our sins who also became known as Jesus Christ or "Yashsua". As I have posted before, Scriptures document us that no man knows the name of the invisible God (Father) at this time - until one overcometh in the end (Rev. 3:12).

Isaiah 43:10 Ye are my witnesses (physically seen), saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God FORMED, neither shall there be after me.

No man hath seen God at anytime (John 1:18), therefore, the God of the OT who was the only God FORMED according to Isaiah 43:10 could not have been the invisible God Father (who is a Spirit that never change) -- but the Son himself.

What makes you think that the God of the Old Testment (the Son himself) is different God of the New Testament? Thanks

God Bless

 

[RND]

Dear fadinglight,

It is my biblical opinion that Yahweh (OT) is the Son of God himself (not the Father) who was sent into this world (NT) to save us from our sins who also became known as Jesus Christ or "Yashsua". As I have posted before, Scriptures document us that no man knows the name of the invisible God (Father) at this time - until one overcometh in the end (Rev. 3:12).

Isaiah 43:10 Ye are my witnesses (physically seen), saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God FORMED, neither shall there be after me.

No man hath seen the God at anytime (John 1:18), therefore, the God of the OT who was the only God FORMED according to Isaiah 43:10 could not have been the invisible God Father but the Son himself.

What makes you think that the God of the Old Testment (the Son himself) is different God of the New Testament?

God Bless

Excellent point. My sentiments exactly. Jesus is the God of the Old Testament.

The life of Christ, that gives life to the world, is in His Word. It was by His word that Jesus healed disease and cast out demons; by His word He stilled the sea, and raised the dead; and the people bore witness that His word was with power. He spoke the word of God, as He had spoken to all the prophets and teachers of the Old Testament. The whole Bible is a manifestation of Christ. It is our source of power. -- The Signs of the Times , June 25, 1902

In the wilderness, when all means of sustenance failed, God sent His people manna from heaven, and a sufficient and constant supply was given. This provision was to teach them that while they trusted in God, and walked in His ways, He would not forsake them. The Saviour now practised the lesson He had taught to Israel. By the word of God succor had been given the Hebrew host, and by the same word it would be given to Jesus. He awaited God's time to bring relief. He was in the wilderness in obedience to God, and He would not consent to obtain food by following the suggestions of Satan. In the presence of the witnessing universe He testified that it is a less calamity to suffer whatever may befall than to depart in any manner from the will of God. -- The Signs of the Times , December 3, 1902

During the journeyings of the children of Israel through the wilderness, Jesus Christ, enshrouded in a pillar of cloud by day and in a pillar of fire by night, led them on their way, indicating where they should march and where they should pitch their tents. Christ guarded them from all the beasts of the wilderness and from the poisonous serpents. This they had reason to know; for when God removed His restraining power from the serpents, great was the affliction in the camp of the Israelites. Their murmuring was a constant offense to God. He saw that they had thrown off all fear of Him, and He permitted fiery serpents to attack them, that they might realize how in the past His power had guarded them from untold dangers. -- Manuscript Releases Volume Fourteen, page 345

 

[fadinglight]

How do you answer the inquiry that the name pronounced Yahweh is simply the vocalization of the tetragrammaton YVWH? - RND

The hebrew language doesn't have vowels. Remember that these are the original texts in hebrew. But when you pronounce YHWH in hebrew it sounds as Yahweh in English, since English language contains vowels. hopefully that answers your question

 

[RND]

The hebrew language doesn't have vowels.

Yes it does, the Hebrew language doesn't have "written vowels" in distinct letter forms such as A-E-I-O-U. http://www.hebrew4christians.com/Gramma ... ction.html

Remember that these are the original texts in hebrew. But when you pronounce YHWH in hebrew it sounds as Yahweh in English, since English language contains vowels. hopefully that answers your question

Actually, the pronunciation of YHWH is simply the pronunciation of the letters as I mentioned. Rabbinical Jews, as a rule (because of the Talmud), and as a tradition, never pronounced the name of God nor even spelled it - for fear of dishonoring the name. http://www.hebrew4christians.com/Names_ ... iting.html

As a side note however, I must say I do appreciate your denominations teaching regarding the sabbath and the state of the dead.

 

[fadinglight]

Ok, so what your implying is that there is only one divine being known as Yahweh in (OT) and than Yashua in (NT). Hopefully I'm correct on what your saying.

Gen 1:1 In the beginning Elohim created the heavens and the earth.
our Heavenly father used "Elohim" to describe himself, which is the hebrew word meaning deity and is plural. El would be singular and Elohim is plural stating more than one and has a plural connotation such as family.

Gen 1:26 And Elohim said, let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; and let the rule over the fish in the sea, and over the birds of the heavens, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over all the creepers creeping on the earth.
Gen 1:27 And Elohim created the man in His own image; in the image of Elohim He created him. He created them male and female.
In Gen 1:26 you can see that he uses the pronoun "us" which clearly states more than one being.

Gen 3:22 And Yahweh Elohim said, Behold! The man has become as one of Us, to know good and evil. And now, lest he put forth his hand and also take from the Tree of Life, and eat, and live forever,

Pro 30:4 Who has gone up to Heaven, and come down? Who has gathered the wind in His fists? Who has bound the waters in His garments? Who has made all the ends of the earth to rise? What is His name, and what is His Sons's name? Surely you know.

Psa 2:2 The kings of the earth set themselves; yea, the rulers have plotted together against Yahweh and His Messiah,
Psa 2:6 Yea, I have set My king on My holy mount on Zion,
Psa 2:7 I will declare concerning the statute of Yahweh: He said to me, you are my son. Today I have begotten you.

Clearly in these and many others there is a Father and a Son, and a Family name.

 

[RND]

Ok, so what your implying is that there is only one divine being known as Yahweh in (OT) and than Yashua in (NT). Hopefully I'm correct on what your saying.

Somewhat correct. The God of the OT is none other than Jesus Christ and He is the Son of God in the NT. He was part of the Godhead then just as He is now. The book of John tells us nothing was made without Jesus.

Gen 1:1 In the beginning Elohim created the heavens and the earth.
our Heavenly father used "Elohim" to describe himself, which is the hebrew word meaning deity and is plural. El would be singular and Elohim is plural stating more than one and has a plural connotation such as family.

If you look and see the use of Elohim is plural, meaning this verse is referring to more than one entity.

http://www.hebrew4christians.com/Names_ ... lohim.html

Gen 1:26 And Elohim said, let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; and let the rule over the fish in the sea, and over the birds of the heavens, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over all the creepers creeping on the earth.
Gen 1:27 And Elohim created the man in His own image; in the image of Elohim He created him. He created them male and female.
In Gen 1:26 you can see that he uses the pronoun "us" which clearly states more than one being.

Exactly. At creation there was the creation made by God the Father, Gos the Son and Gos the Holy Spirit. All aspects of the divine nature of the Godhead are present in Genesis.

Gen 3:22 And Yahweh Elohim said, Behold! The man has become as one of Us, to know good and evil. And now, lest he put forth his hand and also take from the Tree of Life, and eat, and live forever,

See above.

Pro 30:4 Who has gone up to Heaven, and come down? Who has gathered the wind in His fists? Who has bound the waters in His garments? Who has made all the ends of the earth to rise? What is His name, and what is His Sons's name? Surely you know.

Jesus Christ.

Psa 2:2 The kings of the earth set themselves; yea, the rulers have plotted together against Yahweh and His Messiah,
Psa 2:6 Yea, I have set My king on My holy mount on Zion,
Psa 2:7 I will declare concerning the statute of Yahweh: He said to me, you are my son. Today I have begotten you.

Clearly in these and many others there is a Father and a Son, and a Family name.

Of this there can be no doubt. But the thing I think you are missing here is that I haven't said that there isn't a Godhead depicted in the OT scriptures.

 

[stovebolts]

Is it possible that Elohim is plural in the sense that Elohim is the head of the pantheon, or within the Yawistic sense, over all creation while El is singular due to it's focus on a singular entity, such as El Shaddai (God Almighty)



viewtopic.php?f=32&t=39535&start=0

 

[fadinglight]

So RND please explain more, I'm not fully understanding what your getting at. There is many scriptures in the bible that states there is more than one being, and that there is a Son and a Father. If you believe there isnt just ONE DIVINE DEITY where Yahweh the father is Yashua the son. Than what are you saying? Obviously there are scriptures that clearly state 2 seperate beings Yahweh the father and Yahshua the son. Are you now saying you believe in The father, the son, and the holy spirit as 3 individual beings?

 

[RND]

So RND please explain more, I'm not fully understanding what your getting at. There is many scriptures in the bible that states there is more than one being, and that there is a Son and a Father.

Correct.

If you believe there isnt just ONE DIVINE DEITY where Yahweh the father is Yashua the son. Than what are you saying?

I've never suggested that there isn't one divine deity. It is obvious, in my mind, that the very opening of the Bible in Genesis we are introduced to the Godhead of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Your notion of "Yahweh the father is Yashua the son" is found descriptively in the pages of the NT. Jesus gave up His divinity to become a man, yet He retained a perfect connection to the Father in mind and body.

I believe that the God who spoke to Noah, Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, who led the COI, who spoke to Moshe and who created all things is Jesus Christ - God the Son.

Obviously there are scriptures that clearly state 2 seperate beings Yahweh the father and Yahshua the son.

Sure, you bet!

Are you now saying you believe in The father, the son, and the holy spirit as 3 individual beings?

Of course! That's what the Godhead is isn't it? God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit? Three Gods making up one Godhead and thus one God?

 

[fadinglight]

K now I understand, I'll pull out some more scriptures for you. Just give me some time