Vasectomy & Tubectomy - God's Judgment

[Jethro Bodine]

Do you not know that your bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; 1 Corinthians 6:19 NIV This is the "spirit of the world".

Uh, are you aware that this verse is regarding a warning against fornication? Or did you intend to take it completely out of context in order to apply it to the situation at hand?

The natural man sees things and understand things through their flesh, while the supernatural man receives things with understanding that are revealed through the spirit.

And this applies to the subject of this thread how? You lost me.

I get his point.

"...whatever you do, do all to the glory of God." (1 Corinthians 10:31)

There is a spiritual element to every decision we make, and we should be careful to always be aware of that.

In hindsight, for me, the spiritual consideration that I did not consider was how a life of 'sex on demand' free of the natural restraint of the possibility of making another human being (Wow! Making another human being...I'm blown away by that) would affect me spiritually.

 

[Deborah13]

Does this mean the task given to Adam & Eve has been achieved & the rest is up to us ? Or are we to continue to breed until we can't breed anymore & cause deliberate hardship on others by over crowding & public dependents ? If we're entitled to draw the line, where do we draw it ?

I'm not sure what you thought I was saying. At the time I wrote that post for some reason I thought urk already had kids ( mistake on my part). and what I was saying is that if he was worried about the multiply in Gen. he probably shouldn't.
Seek God for personal answers that are not clear to you is what I was saying.
I do not judge people or tell them what they should do.

 

[Guest]

I'm 32 years old, single and with no kids, and I'm choosing to stay that way for the rest of my life. I've been around the block a few times, and I've seen some things; enough to know that this is what I want. In 2005, God came into my life HARD and REAL. I will never forget that night he saved me. His love is so real, that I will spend my life chasing that love and staying close to him.

If he decides to bring a born again christian woman into my life, I will know it. I will decide and ask God what I should do if that circumstance ever comes up. Women are just not the first thing on my mind right now. Some people are just meant to serve God in different ways with different blessings and spiritual fruits and gifts. I will however wait on the vasectomy for now.

1 Corinthians 7:32-40 <sup class="versenum">32 </sup>But I would have you without carefulness. He that is unmarried careth for the things that belong to the Lord, how he may please the Lord:<sup class="versenum">33 </sup>But he that is married careth for the things that are of the world, how he may please his wife.<sup class="versenum">34 </sup>There is difference also between a wife and a virgin. The unmarried woman careth for the things of the Lord, that she may be holy both in body and in spirit: but she that is married careth for the things of the world, how she may please her husband.<sup class="versenum">35 </sup>And this I speak for your own profit; not that I may cast a snare upon you, but for that which is comely, and that ye may attend upon the Lord without distraction.

<sup class="versenum">36 </sup>But if any man think that he behaveth himself uncomely toward his virgin, if she pass the flower of her age, and need so require, let him do what he will, he sinneth not: let them marry.<sup class="versenum">37 </sup>Nevertheless he that standeth stedfast in his heart, having no necessity, but hath power over his own will, and hath so decreed in his heart that he will keep his virgin, doeth well^.<sup class="versenum">38 </sup>So then he that giveth her in marriage doeth well; but he that giveth her not in marriage doeth better.<sup class="versenum">39 </sup>The wife is bound by the law as long as her husband liveth; but if her husband be dead, she is at liberty to be married to whom she will; only in the Lord^.<sup class="versenum">40 </sup>But she is happier if she so abide, after my judgment: and I think also that I have the Spirit of God.

So it sounds like, according to you guys, that the apostle Paul was out of God's will and missed His blessings because he didn't have kids. At least I assume he didn't have kids since he clearly said he wasn't married and never mentioned having any family of his own any other way. And this WAS his choice.

Don't get me wrong, I know kids are a blessing to those who want and choose to have them. But I can't agree that those who choose not to for whatever their reasons may be are somehow out of God's will and will not be blessed by God because of this.

Good point, blessings.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

The other argument sometimes used is one of convenience, not enough time, not enough freedom to pursue other desires or goals, things of that nature, which I think is selfish in nature and not putting God and his will first.

I think men can go against the will of God to not have kids by various means...

God blesses the family.
No family, you miss the blessings.

So it sounds like, according to you guys, that the apostle Paul was out of God's will and missed His blessings because he didn't have kids. At least I assume he didn't have kids since he clearly said he wasn't married and never mentioned having any family of his own any other way. And this WAS his choice.

Don't get me wrong, I know kids are a blessing to those who want and choose to have them. But I can't agree that those who choose not to for whatever their reasons may be are somehow out of God's will and will not be blessed by God because of this.

If you have the will of the apostle Paul then go with it. You'll get blessings in that area.
But to choose to have sex and avoid having children is missing out in blessings that God has in store for you.

 

[Obadiah]

But to choose to have sex and avoid having children is missing out in blessings that God has in store for you.

I know the point you are making, but I just think that has a lot more to do with personal preferences for wanting to raise kids than it does with scripture. We have many choices in life these days and there is nothing wrong with making those choices that are not condemned as sin nor will result in condemnation.

I like kids and have nothing against them nor against all who enjoy raising them even though I was in a situation where raising my own wasn't wise or practical for me. I suppose that puts me in a place where from my point of view I think we need to recognize our own personal preferences or even the specific will of God just for us, and not impose that on others by trying to make them feel guilty or saying they are out of the will of God just because they don't have the same calling or preferences we do. I mean, I COULD take Pauls comments on staying single out of context and use them to say everyone who gets married is out of Gods will and missing out on His blessings, but I don't. I realize that is not what Paul was saying when I read his comments in the context they were written.

I just really haven't seen anything in scripture saying it is Gods will or command that every person has to raise children or they will miss out on something good for them (something that can't be replaced with some other blessing instead). Of course things like vasectomies or birth control pills weren't mentioned because they didn't exist when scripture was written, but there were other ways of avoiding pregnancy (not just abstinence) that were practiced even back in Jesus time and I don't see any condemnation in scripture that is read and understood within the context it was written.

Sure, kids are a blessing for those who want to raise them and are in a position to do so (married, etc.) But there are many things that are blessings from God that not everyone takes advantage of or that may not be a blessing to every person. Lacking any scripture for us today, especially in light of Paul's comments on marriage and family life, I don't believe there is any command to have kids nor do I see any threat or warning about a person who chooses not to have kids missing out on a blessed life. I also just don't see any condemnation on enjoying sex while avoiding pregnancy. That seems like a personal preference to me. God has many ways to bless us in many different circumstances and lifestyles.

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

But to choose to have sex and avoid having children is missing out in blessings that God has in store for you.

I know the point you are making, but I just think that has a lot more to do with personal preferences for wanting to raise kids than it does with scripture. We have many choices in life these days and there is nothing wrong with making those choices that are not condemned as sin nor will result in condemnation.

I like kids and have nothing against them nor against all who enjoy raising them even though I was in a situation where raising my own wasn't wise or practical for me. I suppose that puts me in a place where from my point of view I think we need to recognize our own personal preferences or even the specific will of God just for us, and not impose that on others by trying to make them feel guilty or saying they are out of the will of God just because they don't have the same calling or preferences we do. I mean, I COULD take Pauls comments on staying single out of context and use them to say everyone who gets married is out of Gods will and missing out on His blessings, but I don't. I realize that is not what Paul was saying when I read his comments in the context they were written.

I just really haven't seen anything in scripture saying it is Gods will or command that every person has to raise children or they will miss out on something good for them (something that can't be replaced with some other blessing instead). Of course things like vasectomies or birth control pills weren't mentioned because they didn't exist when scripture was written, but there were other ways of avoiding pregnancy (not just abstinence) that were practiced even back in Jesus time and I don't see any condemnation in scripture that is read and understood within the context it was written.

Sure, kids are a blessing for those who want to raise them and are in a position to do so (married, etc.) But there are many things that are blessings from God that not everyone takes advantage of or that may not be a blessing to every person. Lacking any scripture for us today, especially in light of Paul's comments on marriage and family life, I don't believe there is any command to have kids nor do I see any threat or warning about a person who chooses not to have kids missing out on a blessed life. I also just don't see any condemnation on enjoying sex while avoiding pregnancy. That seems like a personal preference to me. God has many ways to bless us in many different circumstances and lifestyles.

Hey OB, I hope you are not getting me wrong.
I never mentioned condemnation or guilt in any of my posts.
I was simply addressing a young person that I think should look deeper before making life altering decisions.
What's it like being in your 30's without children?
Or your 40's or your 50's?
I think there are blessings that come from God by having children.
Without the children, you don't get those blessings.
How you feel in your 20's may not be how you'll feel later in life.
A young person really needs to think about and understand the implications as much as possible.
I discussed this with people at my church without much agreement.
It's definitely a personal thing.

 

[Sparkey]

What's it like being in your 30's without children?

I would not know. My first son was born when I was seventeen years of age. Some may have argued that I 'should' have had a vasectomy. But, comes the objection, what about my other two sons? They arrived with I was thirty-one and thirty-three years of age. Today? There is no need for a "procedure" regarding the "out of use" parts.

 

[Guest]

What's it like being in your 30's without children?

Depends on what your needs and wants are at the time. Everyone is different.

 

[Mountain Man]

What's it like being in your 30's without children?

Depends on what your needs and wants are at the time. Everyone is different.

Isn't strange how we are expected to be different in some ways and the same in others..."individual" like many other words has many definitions,most people don't mind you being you....as long as you are like them.

 

[Guest]

What's it like being in your 30's without children?

Depends on what your needs and wants are at the time. Everyone is different.

Isn't strange how we are expected to be different in some ways and the same in others..."individual" like many other words has many definitions,most people don't mind you being you....as long as you are like them.

If everything and everyone was the same, life would be blahh and bloop bloop.

 

[Guest]

If the Lord wants me to have another child, a little thing like a vasectomy is certainly not going to stand in His way.

Is it possible to reverse it, or is permanent.

 

[Atonement]

Greetings to you all in our Lord Jesus Christ

This is a very hard subject for a lot of reasons. There can be medical reasons to have this procedure done, personal reasons or other reasons like your spouse etc.. I'm not aware of any Scripture that inclines us to believe either way. So what one should do, is pray about this commitment one is making and search oneself about the reason one is making this decision. God judges our hearts and our intentions..

God Bless

Edit - line in red

 

[Obadiah]

They say it's possible to reverse it, but I do not think it's 100% guaranteed to work

According to my doctor, Vasectomy reversal is only about 60% effective and can cost as much as $10,000! Of course, that was about 15 years ago I was told this, so no telling how much applies today. But it's probably a good reason to pray hard and think hard about it before getting one.

 

[Guest]

Does anyone know the cost of getting one now. [MENTION=90700]Edward[/MENTION] [MENTION=93344]Obadiah[/MENTION] etc..

 

[Sparkey]

Quick Google search is all I know.

Google: "What is the average cost of a vasectomy?" Looks like (not counting insurance or other 'discounts') US $350 to $1,000 ?

Best Answer from Yahoo Answers "ASK":
At a nonprofit clinic the cost is from $200-$700. If you go to a regular urologist the cost is between $600-$1000. If you have insurance the cost is about $25.

Don't bother with Vasiclip. The failure rate is about 50% where on a traditional vasectomy is about .1%. I am pretty sure vasiclip is no longer in business

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Not to be too harsh, but what's wrong with not having sex if you don't want to have children?

I wonder if subduing the sex drive is more spiritual than removing the consequences of sex(?)

 

[Obadiah]

what's wrong with not having sex if you don't want to have children

Assuming a person has normal bodily functions and drives, unnecessarily denying yourself and your spouse a God given pleasure would be what's wrong with it, at least at first thoughts. I mean, if you're single and if God calls you specifically to make this sacrifice for some reason that's between you and He, so be it. This seems to have been the case with Paul, but that doesn't seem to be what God calls most people to do.

 

[Sparkey]

normal bodily functions

but that doesn't seem to be what God calls most people to do.

Your thinking that majority defines "normal" ? Sheesh, I sure hope not! But I see that what you say is true. Sadly true.

 

[Obadiah]

Your thinking that majority defines "normal" ? Sheesh, I sure hope not!

LOL! Yeah, I see your point and should have been more clear that I didn't mean "majority"! I meant "normal" in the way God intended normal people's bodys to function. Like not having a physical handicap or some other condition that prevents sexual function.

 

[Destructus86]

I for sure plan to have one after our first. We only want one. To me it's being a responsible person. We know we couldn't handle more than 1 kid, so we want to be responsible and make sure we just have the one.

It's called biology. It's like saying "Ok God, I am going to let go of this steering wheel and let you drive me to work." What happens next? You CRASH. Why? Because YOU were responsible for your actions in driving the car because God created gravity.

Same with children...if you have a ton of kids it's not because God willed it. (though sometimes that's true) It's because that's how He created biology to function