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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
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Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
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Depending upon the Holy Spirit for all you do?
Read through the following study by Tenchi for more on this topic
https://christianforums.net/threads/without-the-holy-spirit-we-can-do-nothing.109419/
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How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
Join Sola Scriptura for a discussion on the subject
https://christianforums.net/threads/anointed-preaching-teaching.109331/#post-1912042
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Was God surprised with the fall of man?
- Thread starter JM
- Start date
JM said:
No. Romans 11:32, "For God has bound all men over to disobedience so that he can have mercy on them all." No sin, no mercy. No sin, no understanding of Christ's forgivess. No sin, then we are all gods. Yes, indeed, this was the only plan that could make us understand the glories of God's love & forgiveness.
G
Gendou Ikari
Guest
Revelation 13:8 (King James Version) And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
T
TruthMiner
Guest
Gendou Ikari said:
Well, He sure was surprised when this happened:
I thought, `After she has done all these things she will return to Me'; but she did not return. (Jeremiah 3:7).
Gendou Ikari said:
Just for clarification, the "him" in that verse is the beast, not God. God allows sin so that we will understand forgiveness. Those who want forgiveness can have it and those who don't want it, won't have it. But if God didn't allow the devil to have his way, then we would not understand mercy or forgiveness. We would simply believe we are perfect and entitled to heaven. Therefore, God's plan is the only way we will have the humility to come to him.
R
reznwerks
Guest
knowing
If God was surprised then he is not all knowing?TruthMiner said:
R
reznwerks
Guest
intentions
What are Gods real intentions anyway? I mean the bible claims he went to all this trouble to make the universe and all thats in it then spends all his time worrying about whether and how we will worship him. He seems to have a real problem with his ego. I don't know if I want to worship a God that wants to play with me like a cat plays with a mouse.Why should man have to worry about Satan when God can get rid of him at any time? Either God can and won't or wants to and can't .Heidi said:Gendou Ikari said:
Just for clarification, the "him" in that verse is the beast, not God. God allows sin so that we will understand forgiveness. Those who want forgiveness can have it and those who don't want it, won't have it. But if God didn't allow the devil to have his way, then we would not understand mercy or forgiveness. We would simply believe we are perfect and entitled to heaven. Therefore, God's plan is the only way we will have the humility to come to him.
T
TruthMiner
Guest
Re: knowing
What is there to know about something that does not exist? Does tomorrow exist?
reznwerks said:
What is there to know about something that does not exist? Does tomorrow exist?
N
Novum
Guest
Re: knowing
For an omniscient being, everything.
This is no barrier for a truly onmiscient being.
TruthMiner said:
For an omniscient being, everything.
This is no barrier for a truly onmiscient being.
Drew
Member
Re: knowing
This is an entirely valid and interesting question. Although we speak casually about "the future" as if it enjoyed a real existence, it is by no means clear that it does. Does God know the age of the pink polka dotted unicorn in my closet? Of course not, there is no such creature in my closet. "The future" is a practical term that we have become so accustomed to that we fail to even question whether there indeed exists a particular future (I am inclinded to believe that the future is indeed somewhat "open").TruthMiner said:
T
TruthMiner
Guest
Re: knowing
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T
TruthMiner
Guest
Re: knowing
To be omniscient means knowing about everything that IS. Nothing is non-existence. There is nothing to know about nothing.
Since when is there a barrier between nothing?
I don't think you realize how absurd your answers are. Nothing is nothing. There is nothing to know about nothing because it is nothing.
If all you know was everything about nothing that would mean you knew nothing.
Novum said:
To be omniscient means knowing about everything that IS. Nothing is non-existence. There is nothing to know about nothing.
Since when is there a barrier between nothing?
I don't think you realize how absurd your answers are. Nothing is nothing. There is nothing to know about nothing because it is nothing.
If all you know was everything about nothing that would mean you knew nothing.
N
Novum
Guest
Re: knowing
Are you arguing that, since tomorrow does not technically "exist", your god has no knowledge of the future? I believe - though correct me if I'm wrong - that the majority of Christians would disagree with you.
TruthMiner said:
Are you arguing that, since tomorrow does not technically "exist", your god has no knowledge of the future? I believe - though correct me if I'm wrong - that the majority of Christians would disagree with you.
Drew
Member
If I may stick my proboscis (spelling?) in here, I want to raise a text that has inspired much passionate debate. It is 2 Kings 20:1-7:
1 .In those days Hezekiah became ill and was at the point of death. The prophet Isaiah son of Amoz went to him and said, "This is what the LORD says: Put your house in order, because you are going to die; you will not recover."
2 Hezekiah turned his face to the wall and prayed to the LORD, 3 "Remember, O LORD, how I have walked before you faithfully and with wholehearted devotion and have done what is good in your eyes." And Hezekiah wept bitterly.
4 Before Isaiah had left the middle court, the word of the LORD came to him: 5 "Go back and tell Hezekiah, the leader of my people, 'This is what the LORD, the God of your father David, says: I have heard your prayer and seen your tears;I will heal you. On the third day from now you will go up to the temple of the LORD. 6 I will add fifteen years to your life. And I will deliver you and this city from the hand of the king of Assyria. I will defend this city for my sake and for the sake of my servant David.' "
7 Then Isaiah said, "Prepare a poultice of figs." They did so and applied it to the boil, and he recovered.
In verse 1, God says Hez will not recover, in verse 7, we are told that Hez indeed recovers.
Did God know the future about Hezekiah?
The only reasonable argument that I have heard supporting the notion that God indeed knew that He was going to heal Hez involved the assertion that there is an unstated qualifying assumption to be tacked onto the "you will not recover" statement in verse 1. According to this argument, what God really was saying was "If you do not repent and pray to me, you will not recover" I am not all that crazy about this proposed solution since it manifestly changes the meaning, but at least it is not outright silly like some of the explanations that I have read in this forum (there have been some lulus, I assure you).
1 .In those days Hezekiah became ill and was at the point of death. The prophet Isaiah son of Amoz went to him and said, "This is what the LORD says: Put your house in order, because you are going to die; you will not recover."
2 Hezekiah turned his face to the wall and prayed to the LORD, 3 "Remember, O LORD, how I have walked before you faithfully and with wholehearted devotion and have done what is good in your eyes." And Hezekiah wept bitterly.
4 Before Isaiah had left the middle court, the word of the LORD came to him: 5 "Go back and tell Hezekiah, the leader of my people, 'This is what the LORD, the God of your father David, says: I have heard your prayer and seen your tears;I will heal you. On the third day from now you will go up to the temple of the LORD. 6 I will add fifteen years to your life. And I will deliver you and this city from the hand of the king of Assyria. I will defend this city for my sake and for the sake of my servant David.' "
7 Then Isaiah said, "Prepare a poultice of figs." They did so and applied it to the boil, and he recovered.
In verse 1, God says Hez will not recover, in verse 7, we are told that Hez indeed recovers.
Did God know the future about Hezekiah?
The only reasonable argument that I have heard supporting the notion that God indeed knew that He was going to heal Hez involved the assertion that there is an unstated qualifying assumption to be tacked onto the "you will not recover" statement in verse 1. According to this argument, what God really was saying was "If you do not repent and pray to me, you will not recover" I am not all that crazy about this proposed solution since it manifestly changes the meaning, but at least it is not outright silly like some of the explanations that I have read in this forum (there have been some lulus, I assure you).
J
John the Baptist
Guest
The Everlasting Gospel means what? All and everything 'creation' does is known of God in eternity! All prayers are also pre/known & answered as the Godhead see's fit! (See Romans 4:17's last part of the verse) The Eternal Covenant REQUIREMENT is for Their creation to become PERFECTLY MATURE & to be safe to save for ETERNITY! Nahum 1:9
And as was the case of Judas, God knew what his free choice was to be beforehand. (Or else it would have been another way and been recorded as such)
Our salvation depends on our MATURE FREE CHOICE, and yes, this final tally too, was all known in eternity! See Ecclesiastes 12:13-14.
---John
And as was the case of Judas, God knew what his free choice was to be beforehand. (Or else it would have been another way and been recorded as such)
Our salvation depends on our MATURE FREE CHOICE, and yes, this final tally too, was all known in eternity! See Ecclesiastes 12:13-14.
---John
T
TruthMiner
Guest
Re: knowing
The majority of Christians do not even consider the question and your reply begs the question.
Because the future is called "the future" the term sounds to them like an existent thing that is out there to look into. It isn't. Just because a non-reality has a label, does not mean it exists. The future is a way of describing the reality that does not now exist. Hence, there is nothing to know about tomorrow at the present time because at the present time there is no such thing as tomorrow.
The reason this must be addressed is because people often talk about God looking into the future in a forward looking manner as if the future is a reality out there to look into and this entire concept is based on this presumption. But is the presumption correct? I think not.
Novum said:
The majority of Christians do not even consider the question and your reply begs the question.
Because the future is called "the future" the term sounds to them like an existent thing that is out there to look into. It isn't. Just because a non-reality has a label, does not mean it exists. The future is a way of describing the reality that does not now exist. Hence, there is nothing to know about tomorrow at the present time because at the present time there is no such thing as tomorrow.
The reason this must be addressed is because people often talk about God looking into the future in a forward looking manner as if the future is a reality out there to look into and this entire concept is based on this presumption. But is the presumption correct? I think not.