Bible Study What is-"Abiding in Christ Jesus?"

[Johann!@#]

"ABIDING" IN JOHN'S WRITINGS

John's Gospel describes a special relationship between God the Father and Jesus the Son. It is a mutual intimacy based on Jesus' subjection and equality. Throughout the Gospel Jesus speaks what He hears the Father saying, does what He sees the Father doing. Jesus does not act on His own, but on the will of the Father (i.e., John 5:19,30; 8:28; 12:49; 14:10,24).

This intimate fellowship and servanthood sets the pattern for the relationship between Jesus and His followers. This intimate association was not the absorption of the individual (as in eastern mysticism), but an ethical, moral lifestyle of emulation (cf. John 13:15; 1 Pet. 2:21). Fellowship was

1. cognitive (the worldview of the gospel as the Word of God)

2. relational (Jesus was God's promised Messiah to be trusted in and leaned on)

3. ethical (His character reproduced in godly believers)



Jesus is the ideal man, the true Israelite, the standard of humanity. He reveals what Adam should have, and could have been (humanly speaking). Jesus is the ultimate "image of God." He restores the fallen divine image in mankind (cf. Gen. 1:26-27) by

1. full, unique, and ultimate revelation of God (cf. John 1:18; 14:7-10; Col. 1:15; Heb. 1:1-2)

2. dying on our behalf (substitutionary atonement, cf. Mark 10:45; 2 Cor. 5:21)

3. providing humans an example to follow (cf. John 13:15; 1 Pet. 2:21; 1 John 1:7)

The term "abiding" (menō) reflects the goal of Christlikeness (cf. Rom. 8:28-30; 2 Cor. 3:18; Gal. 4:19; Eph. 1:4; 4:13; 1 Thess. 3:13; 4:3; 5:23; 2 Thess. 2:13; Titus 2:4; 1 Pet. 1:15), the restoration of the Fall (cf. Genesis 3). This reunion of God and His ultimate creation, mankind, for the purpose of fellowship is the Apostle Paul's "in Christ" and the Apostle John's "abide in Me" (i.e., the main text is John 15).

Notice John's usage:

1. Abiding between the Father and Son

a. the Father in the Son (John 10:38; 14:10,11; 17:21,23)

b. the Son in the Father (John10:38; 14:10,11; 17:21)



2. Abiding between Deity and the believer

a. the Father in the believer (John 14:20,23; 1 John 3:24; 4:12-13,15)

b. the believer in the Father (John 14:20,23; 17:21; 1 John 2:24,27; 4:13,16)

c. the Son in the believer (John 6:56; 14:20,23; 15:4,5; 17:23)

d. the believer in the Son (John 6:56; 14:20,23; 15:4,5,7; 1 John 2:6,24,27,28)



3. Other abiding elements (positive)

a. the word of God

1) negatively (John 5:38; 8:37; 1 John 1:10; 2 John 9)

2) positively (John 8:31; 15:2; 1 John 2:14,24; 2 John 9)

b. the love of God (John 15:9-10; 17:26; 1 John 3:17; 4:16)

c. the Spirit of God

1) on the Son (John 1:32)

2) in the believer (John 14:17)

d. obedience is abiding (John 14:15-21,23-24; 15:10; Luke 6:46; 1 John 3:24)

e. love is abiding in light (1 John 2:10)

f. doing the will of God is abiding (1 John 2:17)

g. anointing abides (1 John 2:27)

h. truth abides (2 John 2)

i. the Son abides (John 8:35; 12:34)



4. Other abiding elements (negative)

a. the wrath of God abides (John 3:36)

b. abide in darkness (John 12:46)

c. thrown away. . .burned (not abiding, John 15:6)

d. sinning (not abiding, 1 John 3:6)

e. not loving (not abiding, 1 John 3:14)

f. not a murderer (not eternal life abiding, 1 John 3:15)

g. he who does not live abides in death (1 John 3:14)

 

[Tenchi]

This intimate fellowship and servanthood sets the pattern for the relationship between Jesus and His followers. This intimate association was not the absorption of the individual (as in eastern mysticism), but an ethical, moral lifestyle of emulation (cf. John 13:15; 1 Pet. 2:21). Fellowship was

1. cognitive (the worldview of the gospel as the Word of God)

2. relational (Jesus was God's promised Messiah to be trusted in and leaned on)

3. ethical (His character reproduced in godly believers)

You've offered an interesting OP. Some thoughts:

This is a rather...dry and academic conception of fellowship with God. You mention "intimate association" but I would suggest to you that "association" isn't the best word to use. Rather, "communion" would better suit what Scripture means by fellowship with God. Intimate communion is certainly what was evident in Christ's relationship with the Father while Christ was on earth. He and the Father were one, Jesus said (John 10:30; John 17:11); in Christ "dwelt all the fullness of the Godhead bodily" (Colossians 2:9). Many times, Jesus went off alone to commune with the Father in prayer. Jesus was filled with the Holy Spirit and repeatedly declared by the Father to be "my Son in whom I am well pleased" (Matthew 3:17; Matthew 12:18; Matthew 17:5) There was a union, a oneness, between Christ and God the Father, a deep relational intimacy described in the Gospel accounts of Christ's relationship with the Father.

"Association," in contrast, is a sort of clinical, mechanical term, indicating affiliation rather than deep oneness of mind, heart and purpose. You wouldn't refer to a husband and wife as merely associated with one another, right? Soldiers in battle, willing to give their lives for one another, wouldn't best be described as "associates." The loving connection between mother and child isn't well-captured by saying the two are "in association" with one another. So, too, the relationship between Christ and his Heavenly Father goes far beyond what "association" conveys. And Scripture never uses the word "association" to describe what it is God is inviting us into with Himself relationally.

Also, I wonder about defining intimate fellowship as "an ethical, moral lifestyle of emulation." This sounds like being a disciple rather than a co-equal with God, as Jesus was. It also seems to mistake the effect of fellowship (moral living) for the means to it. But moral, ethical living of the sort God desires from us is the product of fellowship with God, not the way to obtain fellowship with Him. Christ shared in the divine essence, utterly unified in mind, heart and purpose with God the Father and so he lived a perfect life. He didn't live a perfect life and thereby was unified with God.

Christ's example of relating with the Father, it seems to me, then, goes well beyond emulation. While there can be fellowship - intimate communion - in discipleship, it is not necessary for the emulation central to discipleship to entail such communion. Christ's disciples, for example, emulated their Master, but they had with him nothing like the fellowship Christ shared with the Father. In fact, for most of the time they were with Jesus, his disciples seemed not to fully understand who he really was, one of them finally betraying him, another, at his crucifixion, denying any connection to him, and the rest hiving off in fearful, confused isolation. In this, it seems to me, one can see that discipleship doesn't necessarily equate to fellowship. Is it a good idea, then, to conflate them and make them synonymous? I don't think so.

Jesus is the ideal man, the true Israelite, the standard of humanity. He reveals what Adam should have, and could have been (humanly speaking). Jesus is the ultimate "image of God." He restores the fallen divine image in mankind (cf. Gen. 1:26-27) by

1. full, unique, and ultimate revelation of God (cf. John 1:18; 14:7-10; Col. 1:15; Heb. 1:1-2)

2. dying on our behalf (substitutionary atonement, cf. Mark 10:45; 2 Cor. 5:21)

3. providing humans an example to follow (cf. John 13:15; 1 Pet. 2:21; 1 John 1:7)

I'm not clear on how any of this "restores the fallen divine image in mankind." The Fall separated Man from God spiritually, breaking the direct fellowship with Him that was natural to the existence of Adam (and Eve). But we all bear the "imago dei" regardless, the stamp of our divine Creator evident in our moral conscience, our reasoning ability, our appreciation of beauty, our capacity to be filled with wonder, our desire to love and be loved, and so on. Christ reconciles us to God, mediating between holy God and unholy Man, serving as the "Door" to the "green pasture" of communion with God, but this doesn't restore the divine image of God in us, as far as I can see, only our relationship/fellowship with Him as His own.

The term "abiding" (menō) reflects the goal of Christlikeness (cf. Rom. 8:28-30; 2 Cor. 3:18; Gal. 4:19; Eph. 1:4; 4:13; 1 Thess. 3:13; 4:3; 5:23; 2 Thess. 2:13; Titus 2:4; 1 Pet. 1:15), the restoration of the Fall (cf. Genesis 3). This reunion of God and His ultimate creation, mankind, for the purpose of fellowship is the Apostle Paul's "in Christ" and the Apostle John's "abide in Me" (i.e., the main text is John 15).

Yes. To "abide in Christ" is, basically, to be born-again, to be saved. One cannot abide in Christ and not be saved.

d. obedience is abiding (John 14:15-21,23-24; 15:10; Luke 6:46; 1 John 3:24)

No, obedience is the effect, the "fruit," of abiding in Christ.

In John 14:15, and John 14:23 obedience is conditioned upon love of Christ; that is, if it is the case that one loves Christ, then one will obey him. The fruit of loving Christ is obedience; obedience is not love itself. So, too, in the matter of abiding in Christ. Obedience is not the means of abiding in him, but the result of doing so.

1 John 3:24 describes the relationship between abiding in God and obedience, but John doesn't write that obedience is itself abiding in God. Rather, John wrote that a born-again person's obedience merely reveals that they abide in God (that is, they are saved); because a person is abiding in God, they will keep His commandments.

I point this out because very often Christians are thinking that, if they attend church, give a tithe, pray, own a Bible, and sing in the church choir (are there church choirs anymore?), they are members of God's kingdom. Never mind that they have no heart for God, that they desire many other things, worldly and fleshly things, far more than they desire God. So long as they do the right things, they believe, they're in - just like the Pharisees did (Matthew 23, Matthew 15:8). But the First and Great Commandment isn't about external doing but about one's internal condition, the state of one's heart toward God. Keeping God's commandments, then, is only indicative of abiding in God insofar as doing so expresses a love - a deep, over-riding desire - for Him. It is not possible to abide in God, though, by of way of law-keeping (Romans 3:20; Galatians 2:16).

e. love is abiding in light (1 John 2:10)

f. doing the will of God is abiding (1 John 2:17)

These, too, mistake effect for cause, or make effect identical with cause.

 

[Johann!@#]

This is a rather...dry and academic conception of fellowship with God.

Really "sorry" you see it as "dry and academic"- I stand by what I have posted.
J.

 

[Tenchi]

Really "sorry" you see it as "dry and academic"- I stand by what I have posted.
J.

One can only speak of what one knows. There's no need, then, to apologize to me for being where you are in your understanding of life in Christ. Until God brings you on, you can't be anywhere else.

 

[Johann!@#]

One can only speak of what one knows. There's no need, then, to apologize to me for being where you are in your understanding of life in Christ. Until God brings you on, you can't be anywhere else.

I would advise you-strongly-not to become too personal.
You work out your own salvation with fear and trembling, as I do mine.

 

[Tenchi]

I would advise you-strongly-not to become too personal.
You work out your own salvation with fear and trembling, as I do mine.

Personal? I was no more personal in my remarks to you than you are here in your own remarks to me. Essentially, you've said in the quotation above what I did: We each have our own unique journey with God. I can't expect you, then, to be where I am with the Lord, and vice versa. I'm not sure how this is being too personal...

 

[for_his_glory]

Johann!@# and Tenchi

Please take this to a private PM to work out your personal differences as both of you are in violation of the Terms of Service (ToS) 1.1 Anymore of this you will both be timed ban from this thread. No need to reply to this. Take it to TWTS if you have a problem with this warning.

 

[for_his_glory]

To abide in Christ means allowing His word to fill our minds, direct our will and transform our affections as abiding in Christ is to be Christlike in all we say and do as He was always subjected to God in all He spoke and all He did while here on earth.

Romans 3:22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

Galatians 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

Philippians 3:9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

The faith of Christ is understood as we study these scriptures to name a few in the KJV, John 12:44-50; Galatians 2:16; Philippians 3:9). The newer translations has changed where it says faith of Christ to faith in Christ. There is a difference between faith of Christ and faith in Christ as you can read in those scriptures out of the KJV. The faith of Christ is what He believed in the Father as He never said or did anything above that which God gave Him to speak or to do while He was on earth, John 12:49, 50. Our faith in Christ is the same faith of Christ He had in the Father as we can never go above that of what He taught us and the works He left for us to follow in.

The Son of God is that free gift of God's grace given to all who will believe by faith in Christ and confess Him as Lord and Savior so they will see the kingdom of God, Ephesians 2:8-10; John 3:5-7; Romans 10:9, 10. There is no working towards something that is free as all we have to do is accept the gift. Believe is a verb that means something we consider to be true as we have heard the Gospel and not only heard it, but also believe what is written for our well being.

Faith works come after we are Spiritually born again and indwelled with the Holy Spirit that empowers us to go out into the world and continue in the good works of the Lord, Acts 2:37, 38; James 2:14-20. The good works are taking His Gospel message to the world as we too are His disciples and to love and help those in need as what we do we do unto the glory of the Lord Christ Jesus, Matthew 25:31-40