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Who Are The Elect? (Kinda Long But Important)

wavy said:
bbas 64 said:
Good day, Wavy

Hello.

As to you take on Matt 22:

All are invited to attend the wedding feast of King Yahshua and join his people as one of them, but not all live up to that call. Those who come in the right garments (true obedience to Torah with Messiah's atonement, I believe) will be chosen

In order to hold this view one would have to simply disreguard the historical context with in the Parable. The King supplied the wedding garments, they were given to some of the invited "all", and handed out in accordance with the will of the King as to hounor the Son and his Bride.

I don't particularly understand your use of “historical contextâ€Â.

Join his people as one of them???

Mat 22:3 And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come.

Mat 22:4 Again, he sent forth other servants, saying, Tell them which are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriage.
Mat 22:5 But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise:
Mat 22:6 And the remnant took his servants, and entreated them spitefully, and slew them.

Mat 22:7 But when the king heard thereof, he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city.
Mat 22:8 Then saith he to his servants, The wedding is ready, but they which were bidden were not worthy.
Mat 22:9 Go ye therefore into the highways, and as many as ye shall find, bid to the marriage.

The bidden would not come, the King killed them for their actions.

Oh, so your assumption is that those bidden are Israel, and they didn’t come thus he had to call some type of new people? Defies all scripture above. Anyway, on context, I believe this refers to unrepentant, unsaved parts of Jewish Israel (not the house of Judah as a whole). If we read the preceding chapter (Matthew 21:45), we’ll find that Yahshua is sayings these things to the leaders of Jewish Israel. Unredeemed Judah is the man who tried to come in the wrong garments (enter the kingdom without the blood atonement of Messiah). The context of Matthew 21, Matthew 22, and Matthew 23 are the Pharisees and the scribes and the priests, a.k.a. the leaders of Jewish Israel. Nothing in this context indicates the nation as a whole.

He was not talking about the whole nation of Israel (both houses) in context. You picked this grain of scripture, but you have yet to explain the numerous passages above that identify Israel as Yahweh’s one and only eternal, chosen/elect people (no offense).

Good Day, Wavy

The historical context of the wedding thown by a King for his Son.

The King supplies the wedding garments, the people do not bring them.

That is where your whole assertion falls apart, it neglects the historical back drop.

Who are the Bidden??

Peace to u,

Bill
 
bbas 64 said:
Good Day, Wavy

The historical context of the wedding thown by a King for his Son.

The King supplies the wedding garments, the people do not bring them.

That is where your whole assertion falls apart, it neglects the historical back drop.

Who are the Bidden??

Peace to u,

Bill

Then this brings the point home. Like I said, unbelieving Judah trying to sneak into the kingdom without the righteousness and atonement given by Messiah.

The bidden are Judah.
 
“Jehovah hath made everything for its own end; Yea, even the wicked for the day of evil,†Prov. 16:4.

“A stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence; for they stumble at the word, being disobedient; whereunto also they were appointed,†I Peter 2:8.

“For there are certain men crept in privily, even they who were of old written of beforehand to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying our only Master and Lord, Jesus Christ,†Jude 4.

“But these, as creatures without reason, born mere animals to be taken and destroyed, railing in matters whereof they are ignorant, shall in their destroying surely be destroyed,†II Peter 2:12.

“For God did put in their heart to do His mind, and to come to one mind, and to give their kingdom unto the beast, until the word of God should be accomplished,†Rev. 17:17.

We also see “vessels of wrath†which by the Lord were “fitted unto destruction,†were “endured with much long suffering†in order that He might “show His wrath, and make His power knownâ€Â; and with these are contrasted the “vessels of mercy, which He afore prepared unto glory†in order “that He might make known the riches of His glory†upon them (Rom. 9:22, 23).

“God gave them up unto a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not fitting,†Rom. 1:28; and the wicked, “after his hardness and impenitent heart treasures up for himself wrath in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God,†Rom. 2:5.

“God sendeth them a working of error, that they should believe a lie,†II Thess. 2:11.

“Behold, ye despisers, and wonder, and perish; For I work a work in your days, A work which ye shall in no wise believe, if one declare it unto you,†Acts 13:41.

“For this cause they could not believe, for that Isaiah said again, He hath blinded their eyes, and He hardened their heart; Lest they should see with their eyes, and perceive with their heart, And should turn, And I should heal them,†John 12:39, 40.

“Depart from me, ye cursed, into the eternal fire which is prepared for the Devil and his angels,†Matt. 25:41

“For judgment came I into this world, that they that see not may see; and that they that see may become blind,†John 9:39.

“I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou didst hide these things from the wise and understanding, and didst reveal them unto babes,†Matt. 11:25.

“Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast your pearls before swine,†Matt. 7:6.

The Holy Spirit has been pleased to repeat six times over in the New Testament this passage from Isaiah (Matt. 13:14, 15; Mark 4:12; Luke 8:10; John 12:40; Acts 28:27: Rom. 11:9, 10).

“But Sihon king of Heshbon would not let you pass by him; for Jehovah thy God hardened his spirit, and made his heart obstinate, that He might deliver him into thy hand, as at this day,†Deut. 2:30.

“For it was of Jehovah to harden their hearts, to come against Israel in battle, that He might utterly destroy them, as Jehovah commanded Moses.†Joshua 11:20.

“For the Scripture saith unto Pharaoh, For this very purpose did I raise thee up, that I might show in thee my power, and that my name might be published abroad in all the earth,†Rom. 9:17 (see also Ex. 9:16)

We can be sure at least one was elected never to come to Christ, the son of perdition in John 17, he was lost for fulfill Scripture.

Non-Calvinists still have a problem to deal when they deny election. If election is based on the foreknowledge of God knowing that you would accept the Gospel, then God still created a mass of people that would only be sent to hell for not believing the Gospel. Another point, if Jesus died for everyone the God would give everyone a chance to accept the Gospel, but He doesn't. We all agree no salvation exists outside of Jesus Christ, so the many pagan nations and peoples who never heard the Gospel are left without the means by which to be saved....this is election.

"... And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher? And how shall they preach unless they are sent? ..."

"Now when they had gone through Phrygia and the region of Galatia, they were forbidden by the Holy Spirit to preach the word in Asia" (Acts 16:6)

Just look at the way Paul was converted, he was knocked off a horse and told to go! The idea of election (as listed above in the quotations I used) is clear. We clearly see those who were not elected, hence, you have a group of elect sinners.

Did Jesus die for all (not just the elect) and then not supply a way for all to least deny the Gospel?

If you have read the Book of Romans or human works such as the Five Pionts of Calvinism by Steele or the Reformed Doctrine of Predestination by Boettner and still don't believe in election, I can do nothing.

A little more to think about, I see election in many ways, individual, national and vocational. Most people will allow for national and vocational but not individual...but what is national election but the election of a group of individuals? What is vocational election but God giving to one man what he won't give another? God does not give to all men equally, God with holds the Gospel from some nations and some people.

We still don't have a reason for Abraham's seed being blessed, why wasn't it another tribe's seed? It was God's good pleause to test Abraham and bless his seed, that's the only reason that fits with what the Bible tells us.

From the moment I gave my life to Christ, I was sure of election. Like a pig in mud, I was happy in sin and would never have chosen Jesus Christ if it wasn't for His saving Grace calling me out. To sum it all up, I believe in the ELECT: Exhaustive Depravity, Lord-centered Election, Effectual Atonement, Conquering Grace and Triumphant Saints.

I wasn't taught to believe in the election, I read the Bible and it drips of God's purpose and plan.

JM
 
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