-Who Will Be Saved In The Ending Of It All-

[littlelight]

Hi, perhaps Psalms 19:13 will give some light on this? (and do not miss the 'also' word)

I'm sorry that the book reference got cutoff in my last post. It was Num 15: 29-30 and I should have kept to the KJV. So in the KJV it states that presumptuous sins cannot be forgiven under the law of Moses. Acts 13: 38-39 but they are forgiven by faith in Jesus. So Ps 19: 13 does not change what I said. Presumptuous sins are not the sin unto death.

Hi there, what is stated is that it is the presumptuous sin that is leading upward towards death. Eternal death! Perhaps I did not make that clear? When one does any sin knowingly, it takes makes the conscience that much weaker after a period of time. Such as the false teaching of sun. for the Lords day. After a while it is just a passing 'command' of just not to do it. Like lieing, after a while it just is a matter that means nothing much but... is just another cheap law broken!

That is the point of David there. After the praising of the law (sweeter than honey) he comes on back with... 'keep thy servant from presumptive sins; LET THEM not have dominion OVER ME; [THEN] shall I be upright, and I shall be [INNOCENT from the GREAT TRANGRESSION.]

Got that? Perhaps I did not explain it? It goes right along with James 1:15 (NT) A starting point & the finished conceived ending point of eternal death.

But thanks for making this clear!

--Elijah

James 1: 15 states that sin in a believer does lead to death. 1Jn 5:16 states that if we pray for a brother who commit a sin that does not lead to death that God will give him life. If our brothers sin does not lead to death why would God give him life if we intercede? Because in a Christian there is sin which will lead to temporal death and there is a sin that leads to eternal death. In 1 Cor Paul talks about a sin that does not lead to eternal death.




1 Cor 11: 20- 33 The people involved did not repent of disrespecting Jesus. They were sinning against the blood and body of Jesus (v27). Against His blood because they were using what was meant to bring glory to Jesus by indulging their carnal desires. Against His body by disregarding the needs of their brothers.




You stated that if we continue sinning that the conscience gets weaker over time which eventually results in eternal death. 1Cor 11: 30-32 tells us that they were being disciplined by God so that they would not be condemned with the world. In other words God is trying to prevent that from happening. I agree with you that while going through God's discipline we can commit the sin that leads to death. But in verse 30 Paul states that they have “fallen asleep†which means they died and went to heaven. If they had committed the sin unto eternal death Paul would never had said fallen asleep.




Jn 6: 37 Jesus makes an unconditional statement that He will never drive away anyone who comes to Him away. 2 Cor 1:22 we have Jesus' Spirit as His seal of ownership.Jn 15: 4 He remains in us as long as we remain in Him. 2Tim 2:13 He cannot disown us even if we are faithless. The Son never drives us away and the Father disciplines us to death so we will not face judgment with the world.

Not keeping the Sabbath is not the sin that leads to eternal death. So as long as non Sabbath keepers do not commit the sin to eternal death they make it to heaven. I do not believe that we have to keep the sabbath.

 

[John 8:32]

Hi, perhaps Psalms 19:13 will give some light on this? (and do not miss the 'also' word)

Yes or one could believe the truth of the gospel?
Ro 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

so if we are not under the Law, what is right and wrong? Is that up to us to determine?

 

[George Muller]

Hi, perhaps Psalms 19:13 will give some light on this? (and do not miss the 'also' word)

Yes or one could believe the truth of the gospel?
Ro 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

so if we are not under the Law, what is right and wrong? Is that up to us to determine?

The law stills stands as a witness against the sin of man, but it has no power to deliver man from sin. In fact it holds a believer in bondage to sin.

Ro 7:5 For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.
6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.
7 ¶ What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.
9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.

Some of you may not understand this? But the truth is as plain as day. Become a fool and God will make you wise. Become weak and God will make you strong.

 

[George Muller]

So this is why Rev. 12:17 has this ending.

[16] And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.
[17] And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which (NO.1 The Commandments of God!) keep the commandments of God, (No. 2 from cover t cover) and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

--Elijah

Sure those who are walking in the Spirit, are fulfilling the righteousness of the law, just as the scriptures says.
I ask again?
Does the scripture say that the law is spiritual? Do not these scriptures say that the law is being fulfilled in those who walk after the spirit? Now remember not to lie.

Ro 7:14 ¶ For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
Ro 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

I did not get an answer from the one who claimed to condemn liars?
He who is without sin, cast the first stone "law"

 

[Elijah674]

If one loves His maker, then why will they not serve Him??? Acts 5:32

--Elijah

 

[George Muller]

If one loves His maker, then why will they not serve Him??? Acts 5:32

--Elijah

The gospel does not change;
Ro 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

 

[John 8:32]

So this is why Rev. 12:17 has this ending.

[16] And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.
[17] And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which (NO.1 The Commandments of God!) keep the commandments of God, (No. 2 from cover t cover) and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

--Elijah

Sure those who are walking in the Spirit, are fulfilling the righteousness of the law, just as the scriptures says.
I ask again?
Does the scripture say that the law is spiritual? Do not these scriptures say that the law is being fulfilled in those who walk after the spirit? Now remember not to lie.

Ro 7:14 ¶ For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
Ro 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

Would you really try to say that one can fulfill the law walking in the spirit all the while breaking the law in the letter? Sorta like telling your brother you love him as you squeeze the trigger?

 

[Elijah674]

PS: And yes, they ALL will be 7th Day Sabbath keepers!

Rom 10:9-11

9 That if you confess with your mouth,"Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved. 11 As the Scripture says, "Anyone who trusts in him will never be put to shame."

NIV

I have done the above so I have confidence in that I qualify for the below.

2 Cor 5:1

5 Now we know that if the earthly tent we live in is destroyed, we have a building from God, an eternal house in heaven, not built by human hands.

NIV

Your belief is that only the Sabbath keepers will get into heaven.

I believe that anyone who adds one work of their own, which says Jesus work was not enough, as their right to claim entry into heaven is on dangerous ground.

In other words in Matt 7: 22 I believe there may be some that say “have we not kept the Sabbath†as work that will keep them out of heaven because they don't trust in Jesus. They are trusting in their work of keeping the Sabbath.

LOVINGLY! Get off of the milk of Heb. 5!

--Elijah

 

[John 8:32]

Hi, perhaps Psalms 19:13 will give some light on this? (and do not miss the 'also' word)

I'm sorry that the book reference got cutoff in my last post. It was Num 15: 29-30 and I should have kept to the KJV. So in the KJV it states that presumptuous sins cannot be forgiven under the law of Moses. Acts 13: 38-39 but they are forgiven by faith in Jesus. So Ps 19: 13 does not change what I said. Presumptuous sins are not the sin unto death.

Hi there, what is stated is that it is the presumptuous sin that is leading upward towards death. Eternal death! Perhaps I did not make that clear? When one does any sin knowingly, it takes makes the conscience that much weaker after a period of time. Such as the false teaching of sun. for the Lords day. After a while it is just a passing 'command' of just not to do it. Like lieing, after a while it just is a matter that means nothing much but... is just another cheap law broken!

That is the point of David there. After the praising of the law (sweeter than honey) he comes on back with... 'keep thy servant from presumptive sins; LET THEM not have dominion OVER ME; [THEN] shall I be upright, and I shall be [INNOCENT from the GREAT TRANGRESSION.]

Got that? Perhaps I did not explain it? It goes right along with James 1:15 (NT) A starting point & the finished conceived ending point of eternal death.

But thanks for making this clear!

--Elijah

James 1: 15 states that sin in a believer does lead to death. 1Jn 5:16 states that if we pray for a brother who commit a sin that does not lead to death that God will give him life. If our brothers sin does not lead to death why would God give him life if we intercede? Because in a Christian there is sin which will lead to temporal death and there is a sin that leads to eternal death. In 1 Cor Paul talks about a sin that does not lead to eternal death.




1 Cor 11: 20- 33 The people involved did not repent of disrespecting Jesus. They were sinning against the blood and body of Jesus (v27). Against His blood because they were using what was meant to bring glory to Jesus by indulging their carnal desires. Against His body by disregarding the needs of their brothers.




You stated that if we continue sinning that the conscience gets weaker over time which eventually results in eternal death. 1Cor 11: 30-32 tells us that they were being disciplined by God so that they would not be condemned with the world. In other words God is trying to prevent that from happening. I agree with you that while going through God's discipline we can commit the sin that leads to death. But in verse 30 Paul states that they have “fallen asleep” which means they died and went to heaven. If they had committed the sin unto eternal death Paul would never had said fallen asleep.




Jn 6: 37 Jesus makes an unconditional statement that He will never drive away anyone who comes to Him away. 2 Cor 1:22 we have Jesus' Spirit as His seal of ownership.Jn 15: 4 He remains in us as long as we remain in Him. 2Tim 2:13 He cannot disown us even if we are faithless. The Son never drives us away and the Father disciplines us to death so we will not face judgment with the world.

Not keeping the Sabbath is not the sin that leads to eternal death. So as long as non Sabbath keepers do not commit the sin to eternal death they make it to heaven. I do not believe that we have to keep the sabbath.

ANY sin that is not repented of leads to eternal death...

Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
Heb 10:28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
Heb 10:29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?

Doesn't matter which sin, ANY sin can be fatal if not repented of.

 

[littlelight]

PS: And yes, they ALL will be 7th Day Sabbath keepers!

Rom 10:9-11

9 That if you confess with your mouth,"Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved. 11 As the Scripture says, "Anyone who trusts in him will never be put to shame."

NIV

I have done the above so I have confidence in that I qualify for the below.

2 Cor 5:1

5 Now we know that if the earthly tent we live in is destroyed, we have a building from God, an eternal house in heaven, not built by human hands.

NIV

Your belief is that only the Sabbath keepers will get into heaven.

I believe that anyone who adds one work of their own, which says Jesus work was not enough, as their right to claim entry into heaven is on dangerous ground.

In other words in Matt 7: 22 I believe there may be some that say “have we not kept the Sabbath†as work that will keep them out of heaven because they don't trust in Jesus. They are trusting in their work of keeping the Sabbath.

LOVINGLY! Get off of the milk of Heb. 5!

--Elijah

You are using weapons of this world.You pull a comment that I made on “Christian, why do you believe you'll go to Heavenâ€(made 05-11-2013,0659am) and post it Here. You also posted in the middle of it a commit that I did not see till now. Which makes it look like I made that commit on this topic.



Matt 7:16-17




What you have done does not resemble a grape or fig.




On top of it you tell me to get off the milk.




I will tell you, in brotherly love, to quit using deceptive tactics. If your doctrine cannot be proved without using the weapons of this world then it is a false doctrine.

 

[littlelight]

PS: And yes, they ALL will be 7th Day Sabbath keepers!

Rom 10:9-11

9 That if you confess with your mouth,"Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved. 11 As the Scripture says, "Anyone who trusts in him will never be put to shame."

NIV

I have done the above so I have confidence in that I qualify for the below.

2 Cor 5:1

5 Now we know that if the earthly tent we live in is destroyed, we have a building from God, an eternal house in heaven, not built by human hands.

NIV

Your belief is that only the Sabbath keepers will get into heaven.

I believe that anyone who adds one work of their own, which says Jesus work was not enough, as their right to claim entry into heaven is on dangerous ground.

In other words in Matt 7: 22 I believe there may be some that say “have we not kept the Sabbath†as work that will keep them out of heaven because they don't trust in Jesus. They are trusting in their work of keeping the Sabbath.

LOVINGLY! Get off of the milk of Heb. 5!

--Elijah

You are using weapons of this world.You pull a comment that I made on “Christian, why do you believe you'll go to Heavenâ€(made 05-11-2013,0659am) and post it Here. You also posted in the middle of it a commit that I did not see till now. Which makes it look like I made that commit on this topic.



Matt 7:16-17




What you have done does not resemble a grape or fig.




On top of it you tell me to get off the milk.




I will tell you, in brotherly love, to quit using deceptive tactics. If your doctrine cannot be proved without using the weapons of this world then it is a false doctrine.

Elijah764

I apologize for the above. I forgot that I used that on 2 posts. I am wrong in what I posted above as to my comments about you. My fruit don't look too good.

 

[littlelight]

my apology to Elijah 647

I made some false statements about Elijah647 on "who will be saved at the end of it all".


I was wrong. What I said about him was false. He did not do as I stated. I want to make sure that anyone who might read them knows that the statements I made were false.

 

[Elijah674]

LOVINGLY! Get off of the milk of Heb. 5!

--Elijah

You are using weapons of this world.You pull a comment that I made on “Christian, why do you believe you'll go to Heaven”(made 05-11-2013,0659am) and post it Here. You also posted in the middle of it a commit that I did not see till now. Which makes it look like I made that commit on this topic.



Matt 7:16-17




What you have done does not resemble a grape or fig.




On top of it you tell me to get off the milk.




I will tell you, in brotherly love, to quit using deceptive tactics. If your doctrine cannot be proved without using the weapons of this world then it is a false doctrine.

Elijah764

I apologize for the above. I forgot that I used that on 2 posts. I am wrong in what I posted above as to my comments about you. My fruit don't look too good.

Hey guy! This guy NAMED Elijah764 is not ME!! Elijah674, and the 'brass' needs to change his handle to stop this CONFUSON!
--Elijah

 

[reba]

Seems a typo ... lets get back to topic.... moderator

 

[Elijah674]

Seems a typo ... lets get back to topic.... moderator

Lets see, what was the subject?;)
Was it about the 'scape goat'.

--Elijah

 

[reba]

Re: my apology to Elijah 647

I made some false statements about Elijah647 on "who will be saved at the end of it all".


I was wrong. What I said about him was false. He did not do as I stated. I want to make sure that anyone who might read them knows that the statements I made were false.

I have moved your apology to here, Thank you Littlelight .... we are back on topic now reba

 

[George Muller]

So this is why Rev. 12:17 has this ending.

[16] And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.
[17] And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which (NO.1 The Commandments of God!) keep the commandments of God, (No. 2 from cover t cover) and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

--Elijah

Sure those who are walking in the Spirit, are fulfilling the righteousness of the law, just as the scriptures says.
I ask again?
Does the scripture say that the law is spiritual? Do not these scriptures say that the law is being fulfilled in those who walk after the spirit? Now remember not to lie.

Ro 7:14 ¶ For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
Ro 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

Would you really try to say that one can fulfill the law walking in the spirit all the while breaking the law in the letter? Sorta like telling your brother you love him as you squeeze the trigger?

There must be something about the "letter" that you do not understand? Or about the flesh of man?

Ro 7:5 For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.
6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.
7 ¶ What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.

 

[Elijah674]

First the apology is accepted.

Next? The only ones with the 3 Angels Messages are these of Rev. 12:17 keeping both the Commandments of Jehovah God (ALL TEN!) & that have the TESTIMONY of Jesus.

Rev. 12:17 DOCUMENTS...
[17] And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

This message is the last message for the world!

And it consists of...
Rev. 18:4
[4] And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.
[5] For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.

These [all] are 'yoked' together as seen in Rev. 17:1-5 with her daughters. And this is the LAST MESSAGE that you will have.
Christ verifies that with Matt. 6:24...
[24] No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

And in 1 John 2:7 we find that the ETERNAL COVENANT has nothing New seen except its fulfilling of it. (but who can read that???)
[7] Brethren, I write no new commandment unto you, but an old commandment which ye had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which ye have heard from the beginning.

--Elijah

 

[George Muller]

And in 1 John 2:7 we find that the ETERNAL COVENANT has nothing New seen except its fulfilling of it. (but who can read that???)
[7] Brethren, I write no new commandment unto you, but an old commandment which ye had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which ye have heard from the beginning.

1Jo 3:23 ¶ And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.

The bible is a wonderful book but those who handle the Word of God should take heed they do not use it to deceive others.

 

[Elijah674]

Re: my apology to Elijah 647

I made some false statements about Elijah647 on "who will be saved at the end of it all".


I was wrong. What I said about him was false. He did not do as I stated. I want to make sure that anyone who might read them knows that the statements I made were false.

I have moved your apology to here, Thank you Littlelight .... we are back on topic now reba

I accept your apology, my remarks to you were sincere. (I wondered if my other post was seen?)

--Elijah