arunangelo said:
Many people misinterpret the exception in Matthew's Gospel (5:31-32). This exception in the Greek text is porneia (which means incest or fornication). The exemption is against unlawful marriages between close relatives, which were considered unlawful (Leviticus 18:6-18), because they were considered incestuous (porneia); and against common-law marriages (which are also unlawful marriages), in which couples fornicate by living together. Some people try to equate porneia with adultery. However, in the second half of the 32nd verse in the above referenced Matthew’s gospel the Greek word for adultery is moiceia.
Sorry but you are wrong, as per usual..
Forncation is ANY and ALL sexual immorality committed by ANYONE, married or not as proven by the usage of the word in the scriptures.
Porneia...aka ‘’fornication’’
By WmTipton
Assertions/Conclusions of this Article
To show that the greek word 'porneia' is all inclusive of sexual immorality
Supporting Evidence
Some claim that fornication in Matthew is PRE marital sex alone and that divorce and remarriage for any other reason is not permissible.
But we see that conflicts with the use of the word throughout the NT.
Porneia is whoredom, harlotry, illicit sex of any kind.
This included every sexual sin of every nature.
Sex with men, women, animals or any other perversion in existence or any new ones that a person can come up with.
This can be commited by anyone. A husband or wife or a single person.
When porneia (any sexual sin) is carried out by the married, the crime of adultery is committed.
Even the current English definition of ‘’fornication’’ is against these false doctrine as it says NOTHING about Unmarried people, but only that the two engaging in ‘’fornication’’ are not married to each other.
Here is the current definition...
Main Entry: for·ni·ca·tion
Pronunciation: "for-n&-'kA-sh&n
Function: noun
: consensual sexual intercourse between two persons not married to each other
Source: Merriam-Webster's Medical Dictionary, © 2002 Merriam-Webster, Inc.
Notice not a single word about either person being ‘’unmarried’.
One or both could be married to someone else, they just aren't married to EACH OTHER.
Or both could be single.
Fornication means just what porneia presents,...having sex with someone who ISN'T your lawful spouse, whether you're married or not.
Porneia is a word in the Greek language that much of the NT was written in originally.
It is not specifically a religious word, nor was it created to write about any specific sexual in in scripture and it does not center around religious intent/meaning, but simply is showing general sexual immorality regardless of its nature.
The word is as ambigious/subjective as the words 'sexual immorality' are. It is not limited to any specific sexually immoral act, but is used to blanketly speak about this type of 'immorality'.
Here is the greek word rendered as ''fornication'' in your KJV bibles.
G4202
porneia
por-ni'-ah
From G4203; harlotry (including adultery and incest); figuratively idolatry: - fornication.
Also....
In Acts 15 and 21, four items are given for gentiles to abstain from as presented in the following verses.
Act 15:20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.
Act 15:29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.
Act 21:25 As touching the Gentiles which believe, we have written and concluded that they observe no such thing, save only that they keep themselves from things offered to idols, and from blood, and from strangled, and from fornication (G4202, same as the exception clause in Matthew).
1. Things offered to idols
2. blood
3. Things strangled
4. fornication (G4202 same as the exception clause).
I ask those who say fornication (porneia G4202) is premarital or betrothal sex only and not “adulteryâ€, why is it that the writer ONLY used ''porneia'' in Acts 15 and 21 and didnt seem to think it necessary to mention ''adultery'' as something to abstain from as well?
Hes already on the topic of sexual sin here, why not mention the big one *IF* adultery is a separate sin?
The reason is "porneia'' covers ANY sexual sin. Paul knew that as did whoever rendered Jesus words in Matthew into greek.
When it was used it in Acts 15, he was laying out a blanket coverage for ANY sexual sin, that we abstain from ALL sexual sin. Just as Jesus meant all sexual sin in Matthew 19.
''Porneia'' (whoredom, harlotry), by default, would be ''adultery'' within a marriage, there was no need to mention adultery, it was covered. And neither was there any need for Jesus to use the word adultery, which would have left a hole or two in His teaching (see ''why didnt Jesus say ''except for adultery)
We see in the following passage that only the fornicator is mentioned..
I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:
Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world.
But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat. For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within? But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.
(1Co 5:9-13 KJV)
Now, *IF* adultery isnt included in 'porneia' or 'fornication', why on earth didnt Paul mention not keeping company with the adulterer ?
Was Paul stating to not keep company with the fornicator ... but hey, its ok to hang out with adulterers ?
Hardly.
Paul used a word that covers all sexual sin.
He mentions a ''brother'' and isnt it odd that the word he chose rendered as 'fornicator' here is the masculine form of porneia ?
G4205
pornos
Thayer Definition:
1) a man who prostitutes his body to another’s lust for hire
2) a male prostitute
3) a man who indulges in unlawful sexual intercourse, a fornicator
Paul was clearly stating to not keep company with any man called a brother who is out having illicit sex.....married or not.
Porneia and its forms are all inclusive of sexual sin of the married and the Unmarried.
In Ephesians and Colossians both we see references to Fornication, but none about adultery.
But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints; Neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks. For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.
(Eph 5:3-5 KJV)
(whoremonger being the masculine form ...pornos)
and
When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory. Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry: For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:
(Col 3:4-6 KJV)
So if this porneia (fornication) does not include all sexual sin, then we would have to suppose that Paul is only directing these two churches to abstain from SOME sexual sins (incest, premarital sex, etc) , and surely not adultery (if it were the case that porneia is not all inclusive of sexual immorality)
When Jesus' words were rendered as ''porneia'' in Matt 5:32 and 19:9, He was saying the same thing ''Sexual Sin'' or whoredom. Jesus did not mean just PREmarital sex, and neither does the definition of ‘’fornication’’ present that idea either.
He used a word, the same as in Acts 15, that covers ALL sexual sin....whoredom....as ‘’fornication’’ clearly shows as well. ....porneia even covers the possiblity of bestiality if it has occured.
We cannot divorce our spouse and remarry without committing adultery against that union, EXCEPT for any sexual sin...EXCEPT that this person we marry has had sex with someone they arent married to.
That is what is clearly conveyed with ‘’porneia’’ and what is also presented with the REAL definition of ‘’forncation’’ (not the Unmarried tripe that some pass off on us )
In this next verse we see conclusively that porneia DOES cover 'adultery'.
1Co 5:1 It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife.
Very obviously if this woman was some one elses husband then to have her was 'adultery'.
But the text here only mentions fornication (porneia) instead of the word adultery which it SHOULD use if some fallacious doctrines were right and porneia did not cover acts of adultery as well by the married.
2.0
Fornication defined by Mosaic Law
Assertions/Conclusions of this Article
To show that the word 'fornication' is in part defined by the sexual prohibitions in the Mosaic law. (clearly that could never be an exhaustive list)
Supporting Evidence
Acts 15 shows and attempt to have GENTILES in the church follow the Mosaic law.
The council of Jerusalem shows that the gentiles werent to be troubled with it other than 4 things which include abstaining from blood and from fornication (sexual immorality).
It is therefore concluded that 'fornication' is DEFINED by the sexual sins listed IN the Mosaic law....this is evidenced by 1 Cor 5 and the man who was committing FORNICATION who had his fathers wife...a sin that was forbidden in the Mosaic law, but nothing that Ive seen specifically mentioned as being sin in the NT except that one passage.
Did Paul just pull this sin out of his ear ?
No.
Fornication....aka sexual sin...is DEFINED by the law and the acts forbidden therein. The law forbids a man to have his fathers wife and that is exactly what this man was condemned for and cast out of the church over.
(Act 15:5 ) But some of those from the sect of the Pharisees rose up, saying, "It is necessary to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses...........Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God: But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.
(Act 15:19-20 )
Lev 18:8 The nakedness of thy father's wife shalt thou not uncover: it is thy father's nakedness.
(1Co 5:1 EMTV) It is actually heard that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not even named among the Gentiles--that a man has his father's wife!
The EVIDENCE supports that "fornication" in the New testament is DEFINED by sexual prohibitons from the Mosaic law.
3.0
We've established that porneia is used to cover a broad range of sexual immorality.
Now that that IS established, we see that it also quite conclusively covers PREmarital sex as well in 1 cor 7:1-2.
Now concerning the things of which you wrote to me: It is good for a man not to touch a woman. Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let each man have his own wife, and let each woman have her own husband.
(1Co 7:1-2 EMTV)
Coming at this with our previous conclusion that 'porneia' is ALL sexual immorality this passage shows conclusively that PREmarital sex is also wrong and needs to be dealt with by having ones own spouse.
Even without the previous conclusion that the word is ALL sexual immorality, this passage entirely on its own condemns PREmarital sex by showing that a man or woman is to have their OWN spouse.
Lets play this nonsense game that porneia is only prostitution for just a moment and examine the verse.
Now concerning the things of which you wrote to me: It is good for a man not to touch a woman.
Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let each man have his own wife, and let each woman have her own husband.
(1Co 7:1-2 EMTV)
Does it say to avoid this sexual sin let each have their own boyfriend/girlfriend ? Their own lover ?
No, it quite clearly shows that we are to have our own husbands or wives to avoid this sexual sin REGARDLESS of what it might actually be.
It is complete folly to try to assert that Paul MIGHT have also mean
'you can also have sex with someone else you arent married to as long as they arent a temple prostitute"...more like purposefully rejecting the facts.
Whether the immoral and argumentative can accept the facts or not, Paul ONLY gives ONE remedy for avoiding this sexual sin and that is to have OUR OWN SPOUSE.
*IF* you are going to partake of sexual intercourse GET MARRIED !
