Bible Study Why Do Christians, IGNORE....Christ's Words ?

[Jay T]

Matthew 4:4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

Is this the reason so many people who believed that they were Christians, are LOST (Matthew 7:21-23) ?

 

[irishrain]

Matthew 4:4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

Is this the reason so many people who believed that they were Christians, are LOST (Matthew 7:21-23) ?

The Subject is false prophets if you back up a little.

Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
They have the appearance of being Christian ministers and preachers, but their agenda is to devour the flock for profet or self glorification.
Matt 24:4-5, Ezekiel 22:26-28.

Mat 7:16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
Can you discern the fruit from which tree?

Mat 7:17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
One of the first lessons in the Word of God is that there are two different trees which one can eat. Gen 2:9,Gen 2:17.

Mat 7:18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
Jesus Christ, the Word of God, is that good tree, the Tree of Life. Satan, the other Jesus who is preached is the corrupt tree and no good fruit can come from him.

Mat 7:19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
The Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil (Satan) which deceives the whole world Rev 20:10 is cast into the lake of fire.

Mat 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
So very simple, since Christ said that there world be Many false propphets in this final generation who come in His name saying that He is Christ, that Jesus is Lord, Praise the Lord, Hallelujah, then MANY of the Christian ministers and preachers you see and hear today are a fake and are feeding our people Bad FRUIT.

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

They come in His name and do everything but HIs will. They use HIS name christian to teach, but they do not teach HIS WORD chapter by chapter and verse by verse, but rather teach the TRADITIONS of MEN. They claim to cast out devils and those who follow ought to be teachers themselves Heb 5:12 are still as Biblically illiterate.

Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
"In that day" is the day of Christ's return. Woe to the foolish prophets Ezekiel 13:3

Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Iniquity is anomia in gk 458, which means transgression of the law, the Word of God. They lead people astray by substituting church instead of teaching the Word of God chapter by chapter and verse by verse. Christ never knew these Christians because they never knew HIM. Christ called them foolish.

Mat 7:24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
James 1:22
JESUS CHRIST, the WORD of God, is the Rock(Deut 32:18) upon which the wise stand and that Rock unmovable PSA 62:6

Mat 7:25 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.
This is the great tribulation of antichrist in the final generation of the fig tree when the flood Rev 12:15 of Satan's lies come forth.

Mat 7:26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:

Mat 7:27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.
floods Rev 12:15,
winds G417 as in 4 winds
great was the fall of it( 2 Ths 2:3) the apostasy
2 Ths 2:10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish, because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

Mat 7:28 And it came to pass, when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at his doctrine:
John 6:48, John 10:9, John 11:25, John 14:6, John 8:12, John 4:14, John 15:1,5, PSA 18:2

Mat 7:29 For he taught them as one having authority, and not as the scribes.

Hosea 14:8 Ephraim shall say, What have I to do any more with idols? I have heard him, and observed him: I am like a green fir tree. From me is thy fruit found.
Ephraim the largest of the 10 tribes of the House of Israel and is put forth here in a figure of speech to represent the whole. Idols are just iniquitous teaching and after the traditions of men.
Evergreen tree is symbolic of everlastin life. From which tree do you pick your fruit from?

 

[Jay T]

Matthew 4:4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

Is this the reason so many people who believed that they were Christians, are LOST (Matthew 7:21-23) ?

The Subject is false prophets if you back up a little.

I happen to be the author of this post, and I didn't mention anything about prophets at all.
But since you're here and wish to get into the subject. I'm happy to give any comments regarding that subject.

[quote:7ea26]They come in His name and do everything but HIs will. They use HIS name christian to teach, but they do not teach HIS WORD chapter by chapter and verse by verse, but rather teach the TRADITIONS of MEN.

[/quote:7ea26]You mean like Sunday worship services ?

 

[wavy]

Firsly, irishrain, your personal analysis of Matthew 7 has little to do with the point of Matthew 4...

Mat 7:17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.

One of the first lessons in the Word of God is that there are two different trees which one can eat. Gen 2:9,Gen 2:17.

This is superimposition, and I do not see how this ties into Matthew 7. Sounds nice, but is abstract. Not be be rude, but I don't.

Mat 7:18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

Jesus Christ, the Word of God, is that good tree, the Tree of Life. Satan, the other Jesus who is preached is the corrupt tree and no good fruit can come from him.

Again, see above.

Mat 7:19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

The Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil (Satan) which deceives the whole world Rev 20:10 is cast into the lake of fire.

Again, see above.

Mat 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

So very simple, since Christ said that there world be Many false propphets in this final generation who come in His name saying that He is Christ, that Jesus is Lord, Praise the Lord, Hallelujah, then MANY of the Christian ministers and preachers you see and hear today are a fake and are feeding our people Bad FRUIT.

Indeed. Bad fruits like "Torah is done away with", for example.

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

They come in His name and do everything but HIs will. They use HIS name christian to teach, but they do not teach HIS WORD chapter by chapter and verse by verse, but rather teach the TRADITIONS of MEN. They claim to cast out devils and those who follow ought to be teachers themselves Heb 5:12 are still as Biblically illiterate.

They "use his name christian"??? Is this a typo?

Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

"In that day" is the day of Christ's return. Woe to the foolish prophets Ezekiel 13:3

"That day" seems to be, more logically, the judgment. I could be wrong, though.

Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Iniquity is anomia in gk 458, which means transgression of the law, the Word of God. They lead people astray by substituting church instead of teaching the Word of God chapter by chapter and verse by verse. Christ never knew these Christians because they never knew HIM. Christ called them foolish.

Indeed. The Word of יהוה. All of it. Not the last 1/3 of it, which is Jay's point...

Mat 7:24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

James 1:22
JESUS CHRIST, the WORD of God, is the Rock(Deut 32:18) upon which the wise stand and that Rock unmovable PSA 62:6

I don't think Messiah is the specific rock here. The "rock" is his Torah sayings. So in addition to calling him "Lord/Master", you must do as he says. So the foundation is built upon him and his sayings. Not just "belief" (not saying you were saying this, however).

As far as James 1:22, a comparison between that and Romans 2:13 will give us the answer as to which "word" he is talking about:

James 1:22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.

Romans 2:13 For not the hearers of Torah are just before יהוה, but the doers of Torah shall be justified.

No NT at this time, btw.

Mat 7:26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:

Mat 7:27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.

floods Rev 12:15,
winds G417 as in 4 winds
great was the fall of it( 2 Ths 2:3) the apostasy
2 Ths 2:10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish, because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

Yes, also mentioned as "mystery of iniquity (anomia)" in this passage (2:7), or "violation of the law", as you point out above.

Mat 7:28 And it came to pass, when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at his doctrine:

John 6:48, John 10:9, John 11:25, John 14:6, John 8:12, John 4:14, John 15:1,5, PSA 18:2

All true.

Hosea 14:8 Ephraim shall say, What have I to do any more with idols? I have heard him, and observed him: I am like a green fir tree. From me is thy fruit found.

Ephraim the largest of the 10 tribes of the House of Israel and is put forth here in a figure of speech to represent the whole. Idols are just iniquitous teaching and after the traditions of men.

Ephraim is the ten tribes, collectively. Ephraim was also divorced for "lack of knowledge (Torah)" according to Hosea 4:6, one of the most misapplied and taken out of context scriptures ever:

Hosea 4:6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten Torah of thy God, I will also forget thy children

 

[Geo]

"EVERY word" is one reason, but there seem to be a few more reasons,
I read a book yesterday where the author also tries to find the point where
people get lost:

"The churches of Apostate Christendom are now packed with
reprobates. They have tasted and been made partakers of Holy
Things. They have been enlightened as to their condition by the
good Word of God. They continue to insist that they are "already"
SAVED. Eventually, these Holy things lose ALL their effect on one
who will not TAKE ACCOUNT of whether or not the "truth" he is
receiving is making any REAL DIFFERENCE in his life, and who is not
concerned whether or not the "truth" he is receiving FAITHFULLY and
HONESTLY reflects the teachings of Our Lord Jesus Christ.

Everyone today knows that the word "gospel" means "GOOD NEWS":
but it is precisely what is now commonly called "the good news"
that IS this doctrine of apostasy. The "good news", they say, is
that EVERYTHING IS ALREADY DONE AND ACCOMPLISHED; and therefore:

YOU DON'T HAVE TO DO ANYTHING!!!! The "good news", they say, is
that ABSOLUTELY NOTHING WILL EVER BE REQUIRED OF YOU,
because salvation is a "free gift". Furthermore, they warn that if anyone
thinks that any particular change, sacrifice, or act of obedience,
is necessary for THEIR OWN salvation; they are trying to be saved
by "works"; and they are therefore doubly condemned. This idea:
that God has totally forgiven, accepted, and affirmed everyone who
will only SAY that Jesus Christ was the Son of God, and that He
died for our sins, is an ABSOLUTE CONTRADICTION to what Jesus
Himself had to say about these things.

Jesus said:

Mark 9:43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: for it is
better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having
two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall
be quenched.

The grace of God that saves us, does NOT allow us to enter
into life whether we have cut off the offending hand or not: but
IS that revelation of truth that makes us WILLING and ABLE to cut
off WHATEVER appears to stand between us and salvation. Take note
of what Jesus says here: one may enter into life, MAIMED. That is,
one may be converted, and enter into ETERNAL life (be saved) while
being crippled or maimed. This cannot be a reference to going to
heaven in the end: for there are no maimed people in heaven, and,
no one who is included in the resurrection of the just (Luke 14:14)
will be resurrected into a maimed body. Jesus is contrasting being
SAVED at the cost of losing a hand during this life, with having
two hands to go into hell. These words of Jesus, and many more
like them, CONTRADICT the notion that one may enter into life by
merely making concessions to "creeds" and "doctrines".

 

[Gendou Ikari]

Why do people ignore the Word of God? Why do you ask? Here is the truth! MOST CHRISTIANS WOULDN'T TOUCH THE TRUTH WITH A MILE LONG POLE!

1 Timothy 4:10 (King James Version) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

Philippians 2:9-11 (King James Version) Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

1 Corinthians 12:3 (King James Version) Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

John 12:32 (King James Version) And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

1 Timothy 2:4 (King James Version) Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

2 Peter 3:9 (King James Version) The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Isaiah 46:10 (King James Version) Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:


Hey, I'm not done yet.
:-D

1 Corinthians 15:22-28 (King James Version) For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet. The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death. For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him. And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

Colossians 1:15-20 (King James Version) Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And he is before all things, and by him all things consist. And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence. For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell; And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

Now I am done. If you have a problem with these verses take it up with God and not me[a man.]

 

[Jay T]

Why do people ignore the Word of God? Why do you ask? Here is the truth! MOST CHRISTIANS WOULDN'T TOUCH THE TRUTH WITH A MILE LONG POLE!

And that bears repeating !!!

That is why the Bible tells us, that so many people who believed that they were Christians, are LOST !

Jesus Christ said it Himself...... Matthew 4:4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

 

[Bick]

Why do Christians ignore Christ's words?

Jay T, you wrote:

"Matthew 4:4 But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

Is this the reason so many people who believed that they were Christians, are LOST (Matthew 7:21-23) ?"

Regarding Matt. 4:4: Are you saying, if man fails to live by the whole Bible, that is, every word, even trying to keep the Law to be saved, they are lost?

Do you not see that all scripture is profitable, but all scripture is not addressed to the Church/Body of Christ, or to all mankind today?

Christ Jesus did not come to minister to the nations, but to His own people, and specifically to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. See John 1:11, Matt.10:5,6.

Jesus and his disciples preached the gospel of the kingdom of the heavens, the hope of Israel.

IMO Matt.7:21-23 speaks of those who prophecied, and performed miracles in Jesus name, yet "in that day' (at His second coming to establish the kingdom on earth), Jesus knowing their evil heart, drives them away to not enter the kingdom. While the principals of doing things falsely by so-called
"Annointed Ministers" may apply today, only God knows their hearts.

I think the Lord wants us to concentrate more on preaching the good news of Christ dying on our behalf, and by believing this we are saved.

Bick

 

[Bick]

Ignoring Christ's words?

Gendou, I agree with you completely. The verses you quote set forth God's ultimate goal.

Bick

 

[Jay T]

Re: Why do Christians ignore Christ's words?

Regarding Matt. 4:4: Are you saying, if man fails to live by the whole Bible, that is, every word, even trying to keep the Law to be saved, they are lost?

Christians do not...keep the Law, to be saved.
They keep the Law 'because' they are saved (Romans 3:31).

Do you not see that all scripture is profitable, but all scripture is not addressed to the Church/Body of Christ, or to all mankind today?

The NT says that the OT is for our learning.
That is one of the reasons God placed a warning on Paul's writings.....
2 Peter 3:15 "And account [that] the longsuffering of our Lord [is] salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;
3:16 As also in all [his] epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as [they do] also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction".
The Bible always interprets itself.....IF...one has studied everything.

Christ Jesus did not come to minister to the nations, but to His own people, and specifically to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. See John 1:11, Matt.10:5,6.

Useing that own logic......the New Covenant is only addressed to Israel (Hebrews 8:8-10)....meaning that only Israel is God's people and only they 'have' a God.
How do you expect to get into heaven without a God, yourself ?

I think the Lord wants us to concentrate more on preacing the good news of Christ dying on our behalf, and by believing this we are saved.

Christ's Death, Burial, and Resurrection is only half....of the Gospel message.
Satan and all his millions of angels believe this much !

It is the other half of the Gospel, that is the part that is just as important, that satan has convinced the Christian world, not to pay attention to !

 

[Bick]

Ignoring Christ's words?

Jay T: When you say "the other half of the gospel" are you implying that man is going to get some credit for his works, in order to "get to heaven"?

That we are not justified by faith alone?

Bick

 

[wavy]

"Faith" does not just imply "belief". It automatically implies action. If you truly trust Yahweh, you'll act (you have no reason not to act, or otherwise you are lacking faith).

So yes, by faith alone. Not by "dead works". These are works that you do that you think merits you something. Faithfully obedient works are just that: being obedient.

Revelation 14:13 And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in יהוה from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them.

Revelation 22:14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

Revelation 22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

 

[John the Baptist]

Bick wrote:
Regarding Matt. 4:4: Are you saying, if man fails to live by the whole Bible, that is, every word, even trying to keep the Law to be saved, they are lost?

*****
John here: Bick. Here is where most all people make their mistake. The question that you ask is a question to the one who wrote the verse. It was Christ who said that Salvation was Conditional, it is He who wrote Matthew 4:4! The ones who do not Love Christ will not do as He says: "[IF] ye LOVE ME KEEP MY COMMANDMENTS". Why do we keep His Commandments Brick?? Surely Matthew 4:4 is a required New Testament Commandment!
Perhaps you might understand what the First requirement of Salvation requires? (CONDITION=REQUIREMENT) Christ said that ye MUST BE BORN AGAIN!! John 3:3

This is what is once again misunderstood. Before Adam sinned, he LOVED HIS MASTER. 1 John 3:4 tells us what Adam did. He broke the Eternal Covenant of the Godhead. But before this 'sin' he was perfect, He did not need to be Born Again, HE WAS BORN RIGHT TO BEGIN WITH!! He was not under the law until he sinned. Yet the law condemned him when he sinned. After he sinned and broke the Covenant of God, he had to be re/born, BORN AGAIN! This is what is required of all of Adams descendants, say's Christ. This is mankinds REQUIRED 'starting point'. The Eternal Covenant of Hebrews 13:20 must again be recreated in mans fallen heart! This is the New Covenant! New in the understanding that mankind MUST BE BORN AGAIN WITH THE ETERNAL COVENANT AGAIN RECREATED IN THE PERFECT HEART!! GOD IS LOVE! HIS COVENANT IS LOVE!! (see Matthew 22:35-40) See Hebrews 10:15-16.

NOW, AND ONLY NOW DOES ONE REALLY LOVE THEIR MASTER. And He says??? Again, "IF YE LOVE ME KEEP MY COMMANDMENTS." So why then do I keep His 7th Day Sabbath Commandment? Remember now, Adam had no problem with the CONDITION to stay saved until he SINNED! (broke the Covenant)

Now read the rest of this poster's post?
*******

Christians do not...keep the Law, to be saved.
They keep the Law 'because' they are saved (Romans 3:31).
Quote:

Do you not see that all scripture is profitable, but all scripture is not addressed to the Church/Body of Christ, or to all mankind today?
The NT says that the OT is for our learning.
That is one of the reasons God placed a warning on Paul's writings.....
2 Peter 3:15 "And account [that] the longsuffering of our Lord [is] salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;
3:16 As also in all [his] epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as [they do] also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction".
The Bible always interprets itself.....IF...one has studied everything.

 

[Jay T]

Re: Ignoring Christ's words?

Jay T: When you say "the other half of the gospel" are you implying that man is going to get some credit for his works, in order to "get to heaven"?

That we are not justified by faith alone?

Bick

Righteousness by faith is the goal every Christian should attain to.
Which means... "Without faith it is impossible to please Him: for he that cometh to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of them that diligently seek Him" (Hebrews 11:6).

There are many in the Christian world who claim that all that is necessary to salvation is to have faith; works are nothing, faith is the only essential. But God's Word tells us that faith without works is dead, being alone.

Many refuse to obey God's commandments, yet they make a great deal of faith. But faith must have a foundation.

God's promises are all made upon conditions. If we do His will, if we walk in truth, then we may ask what we will, and it shall be done unto us. While we earnestly endeavor to be obedient, God will hear our petitions; but He will not bless us in disobedience.

If we choose to disobey His commandments, we may cry, "Faith, faith, only have faith," and the response will come back from the sure Word of God, "Faith without works is dead" (James 2:20).

Such faith will only be as sounding brass and as a tinkling cymbal. In order to have the benefits of God's grace we must do our part; we must faithfully work and bring forth fruits meet for repentance.

We are workers together with God. You are not to sit in indolence, waiting for some great occasion, in order to do a great work for the Master. You are not to neglect the duty that lies directly in your pathway, but you are to improve the little opportunities that open around you. . . .


To Wrestle, Labor, and Strive

We are to do all that we can do on our part to fight the good fight of faith. We are to wrestle, to labor, to strive, to agonize to enter in at the strait gate. We are to set the Lord ever before us. With clean hands, with pure hearts, we are to seek to honor God in all our ways.