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Why Does God Permit Evil and Suffering?

Sergei

Member
“Why does God permit evil and suffering?†is a childish and naive question, but one which I hear quite often. And the strange thing is that I hear this question not from children but from adults who consider themselves to be Christians: “Why do the innocent suffer? Why are children born blind. Why does a promising life crumble in its prime? Why is there social injustice?â€

Arriving in the United States for the first time, I could not understand why my friends deliberately exposed their healthy baby to a neighbor’s child, who was suffering with chicken pox. After a while I understood. After two to three days of being infected, a child recovers from chicken pox and has no trace of the disease. My friends did this to the disease, so it would not overtake their child in older age. Chicken pox is a much more serious disease in adults, often lingering for more than one month and sometimes causing death. Deliberately exposing a child to chicken pox is the same as giving him common vaccinations, which we do to our children at birth.

In a good, pious family a mother died, leaving her husband and three children. The father was lost in his grief. Arriving at the cemetery, his mind dimmed, he almost ran into the open pit in which the coffin was to be lowered. When the funeral was finally over, and having recovered somewhat, he started to drive the children home. Within five minutes, he turned the car around and drove back to the cemetery. His children, trying to comfort him, tried to persuade him to turn around, but he turned to them and quietly said, “Do not worry. I forgot something. I’ll be all right.†Back in the cemetery, he went alone to the grave. A few minutes later he returned to the glances of inquiring children, and said, “I forgot to thank God for taking your mother before me. Can you imagine what she would need to bear if I died before her?†In other words, he would not want to subject his wife to the testing and grief he suffered himself.

In the United States, many small towns do not have hospitals and doctors. One young man who graduated from medical school decided to go to a small town in Nebraska, where he founded a private practice. He knew full well that he would earn much less money than he would if he opened a practice in a big city. At the same time, he knew that the city needed a doctor. Arriving in town, he opened a small clinic. He and his wife, a nurse, began helping people. For his work, he charged very little, and for those who were short on money he did not take anything.

The doctor quickly became very popular in this small town. The people loved and highly respected him. When election time came, he was asked to run for mayor of the city. He did not refuse and of course was chosen. On the same day he was supposed to go to the city administration to take the oath, he suddenly became blind. It was a terrible misfortune for the entire city and a terrible grief for his wife. The doctor was transported to the hospital, located 60 miles away, but they were unable to identify a cause for his blindness. The young doctor did not lose heart and consoled his crying wife with the words “So must the Lord.â€

Several weeks passed and the young doctor sat at home, while his wife went to work to assist the sick. When she needed more knowledge, she called home to her husband. In one of those days he was in the kitchen when the phone rang. He knew it was his wife calling, and he hurried to the phone. He was still not settled into the house and got his foot caught on a table leg. He fell, hit his head on the table, and lost consciousness. His wife, alarmed that he did not answer the phone, rushed home and found her beloved husband on the floor in a puddle of blood. At that time the helicopter was summoned from the nearest hospital, and the young man received all the necessary examinations and was taken into the operating room. His wife waited, and the hours seemed to last an eternity; she walked down the hallway near the operating room, fearfully awaiting the outcome. Finally the door opened, the surgeon came out and went to her. "By doing the operation, we found a tumor in his brain, which was pressing on a nerve that controls vision. We removed the tumor,†he said. “The wound was minor, and, most importantly, your husband's vision is restored. He softly added that if her husband had not gone blind and had the accident, the tumor would have gone unnoticed and he would have died within a month.â€

In The Mysterious Stranger, Mark Twain tells the story of how, during the Middle Ages, an angel came to a small village in Austria. He quickly made friends with a group of local children, as they were his peers. The guys just loved him and accepted him into their circle. They played together and went into the woods to the river, which flows near the village. One clear sunny day, they went swimming. Among this group of boys was very nice, beautiful, and loving little ten-year-old girl whom everyone loved. She also went swimming this day and drowned. Running, the grieving parents and the whole village gathered at the scene. The villagers began to interrogate the angel. "How could you allow this? You're an angel! You could prevent the death of our friend ". The angel replied as follows: "I went through it a millions lives of her choice and the best was one in which she grew up, went to the city, where she became a “walkâ€, contracted a terrible disease and tormented by the pain and shame, lain 20 years in a filthy hovel and died. It was the best version of her life.â€
Now imagine that you did not know the ending of these stories. What would you say? Why does God allow pain and suffering? Consider the following two points: First, suppose that a man wants to harm you, your children, relatives, and friends, and you do not know what to do. Turn to the Lord, that He may avenge you. You can pray until the end of the century, knock you’re yours head against a wall or floor, but all your attempts will be doomed to failure. The Lord will hear you and cry with you, but he simply cannot help you with your request. The Lord cannot give what is not in his nature. In the Lord, in His own nature, there is no evil, violence, revenge, deceit, lies, or, any vices. He cannot give you what He does not have.

Second, every time you experience evil or sorrow, rejoice. "But I tell you: Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for those who persecute you." That is why we should not be surprised of our share of hard times. When it comes to trouble--illness, financial hardship, disappointment, we immediately ask Why? And because God puts us in such circumstances, we require more strength of will, courage , and patience. Whenever we fall, He again puts us on our feet. Whenever we fall ill (remember the first story about vaccinations), we become stronger. God makes us go forward, to climb to a higher level. The Lord knows the price of our own efforts. We will never be come close to perfection. The Lord wants to transform us into such creatures that would stand up to any test. He will turn the weakest, the most unworthy of us, into a god or a goddess, a dazzling, radiant creature with such energy that it is difficult to imagine. This will be a long and sometimes painful process, but it is our destiny, our choice.

“It may be difficult for an egg to turn into a bird, but it is much more difficult to learn to fly while remaining an egg. We are now like an egg, but we cannot indefinitely remain just an egg, an ordinary, decent egg. Either we hatch out of it, or it will deteriorateâ.

Sergei Chernyaev.
 
To make us WARRIORS.

Judges 3

<sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV-6570">1</sup> These are the nations the LORD left to test all those Israelites who had not experienced any of the wars in Canaan <sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV-6571">2</sup> (he did this only to teach warfare to the descendants of the Israelites who had not had previous battle experience): <sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV-6572">3</sup> the five rulers of the Philistines, all the Canaanites, the Sidonians, and the Hivites living in the Lebanon mountains from Mount Baal Hermon to Lebo Hamath. <sup class="versenum" id="en-NIV-6573">4</sup> They were left to test the Israelites to see whether they would obey the LORD’s commands, which he had given their ancestors through Moses.
 
To make us WARRIORS.

Judges 3

<sup id="en-NIV-6570" class="versenum">1</sup> These are the nations the LORD left to test all those Israelites who had not experienced any of the wars in Canaan <sup id="en-NIV-6571" class="versenum">2</sup> (he did this only to teach warfare to the descendants of the Israelites who had not had previous battle experience): <sup id="en-NIV-6572" class="versenum">3</sup> the five rulers of the Philistines, all the Canaanites, the Sidonians, and the Hivites living in the Lebanon mountains from Mount Baal Hermon to Lebo Hamath. <sup id="en-NIV-6573" class="versenum">4</sup> They were left to test the Israelites to see whether they would obey the LORD’s commands, which he had given their ancestors through Moses.

Do you want to see how warrior fight?


These versus chronicle a time where these inexperienced warriors had to finally face the nations that God left to teach them how to fight. How do you think they went into battle. Do you think they suited up in armor and weapons? Do you think they did it with the power of their will?

Read 2 Chronicles 20

They fought the same way we fight our enemy. They faced physical enemies, but we live in the New Testament age...the age of the Spirit, so our enemies are principalities and powers. Against rulers of the darkness of THIS age. However, we fight the same way.

*They praised the beauty of holiness instead of shouting out a battle cry and all the way down to the enemies camp they sang to the Lord on High...

Praise isn't because God needs our praise, we praise God because it bolsters our faith. We need to praise Him.

*A line from a song by Don Fransisco, Jehoshaphat.
 
Here are the lyrics from that awesome song by Don Francisco.

Now Jehoshaphat was King in Jerusalem a long long time ago
When the children of Judah all worshiped the Lord from the high on down to the low
And Judah was a wealthy kingdom Everybody's children were fed
Because Jehoshaphat studied the Word of the Lord and did everything He said

But out the east came an army one day after Jehoshaphat's gold
They were marching right straight to Jerusalem and Jehoshaphat soon was told
So he called all the people together and everyone fasted and prayed
The Lord God answered the people and He said there's no need for you to be afraid

Because the battle is mine tomorrow, it's not yours and it's not the kings
And all you got to do is just stand and watch to see the salvation I bring
Just believe that what I told you is exactly what I'm going to do
And go out tomorrow against them because the Lord's gonna fight for you

The army rose early next morning marched on out with the king
Jehoshaphat chose some singers, he told them singers to sing
And they praised the beauty of holiness instead of shouting out a battle cry
And all the way down to the enemies camp they sang to the Lord on high

They were singing Praise ye the Lord for His mercy endures forever and ever
Praise ye the Lord for His mercy endures forever and ever
Praise ye the Lord for His mercy endures forever and ever
Praise ye the Lord our God His mercy will never end

The Lord God set up an ambush He got the enemy all turned around
And they started killing each other you know till they all laid dead on the ground
And the riches and the jewels that they left behind it took them three whole days to haul

The children of Judah all praised the Lord because He saved them one and all

If the parallel not real obvious now I'll spell it right out for you
When you see trouble comin' to rip you off here's all that you need to do
Pray to your heavenly father and believe that His Word is true
And then step out and shout the salvation of God because He'll win that battle for you
 
When 'bad' events happen to people, many cry out: "Why me, Lord?"

Instead of that cry, the shout should be "Why NOT me, Lord? Thank you!"

Adversity, calumnity...sickness... you name it, it can potential cross paths with you. These are to toughen us up, shape us into the warriors for God we are meant to be.

When one is going through a rough patch, if that person continues forward on his/her walk, others observe the actions/reactions of the person experiencing the turmoil. This has created curiousity for the observers....many of whom make the decision they want the joy/peace that the 'sufferer' knows.

It is amazing, humbling and positivitely exciting to know that someone has made the ultimate choice to follow the Lord, merely because your walk has influenced someone else.

:wave
 
(Isa 50:1) ... Or which of My creditors [is it] to whom I have sold you? For your iniquities you have sold yourselves, ...
 
This has and will remain the hardest question of all times, great minds have debated it since conception.

We lost a great person some years ago, he became a Doctor, instead of making bucks he was going in the mission field to be a christian doctor, but thugs broke in his home, killed him and brutally beat and raped his wife and daughter....hard to understand why. It's been years, his family still hasn't emotionally recovered.

I was stricken with a severe nerve disease years ago that has no cure, much as I prayed, tried to be the best christian I could it got worse. I obviously questioned why, but after years I now say "why not me, why should I be exempt from the
fate of suffering" I have found no reason for it, it cost me a job, lost my home and forced to live a much different lifestyle, but many suffer so much more.

Sadly, many teach suffering comes and goes, we learn, etc.., for many it's non ending, in countries with no social or welfare care it becomes disturbing to see millions suffer and die from lack of basic needs, many christians.

We pray for God's kingdom to come so we can have peace on earth like in heaven, until that kingdom comes we will all battle evil and suffering.
 
This has and will remain the hardest question of all times, great minds have debated it since conception.

We lost a great person some years ago, he became a Doctor, instead of making bucks he was going in the mission field to be a christian doctor, but thugs broke in his home, killed him and brutally beat and raped his wife and daughter....hard to understand why. It's been years, his family still hasn't emotionally recovered.

I was stricken with a severe nerve disease years ago that has no cure, much as I prayed, tried to be the best christian I could it got worse. I obviously questioned why, but after years I now say "why not me, why should I be exempt from the
fate of suffering" I have found no reason for it, it cost me a job, lost my home and forced to live a much different lifestyle, but many suffer so much more.

Sadly, many teach suffering comes and goes, we learn, etc.., for many it's non ending, in countries with no social or welfare care it becomes disturbing to see millions suffer and die from lack of basic needs, many christians.

We pray for God's kingdom to come so we can have peace on earth like in heaven, until that kingdom comes we will all battle evil and suffering.

There are only two reasons.
1. For His glory
2. Sins and Curses.

=> For God's glory, you should wait for His reward as well.
=> For Sins, you must ask forgiveness and forgiveness does not remove curses.

You can find a link called 'generational curses' in my signature where I explained why generational curses does not go away.
 
Sergei said:
“Why does God permit evil and suffering?†is a childish and naive question
It is not a childish and naïve question if you don’t understand and accept any ‘answer’ ever given to you in the last 70 years. It seems to me that you are simply avoiding the perfectly valid question.
WIP said:
Who among us is innocent?
Babies, young children, millions, if not billions of downtrodden, suffering, 'meek' people. You know, the ones who will inherit the earth.
Asua said:
1. The invention of the free will
2. A fallen world cursed through Adam
ronniechoate34 said:
For punishment.
Kellig said:
To make us WARRIORS.
AirDancer said:
… to toughen us up, shape us into the warriors for God we are meant to be.
felix said:
1. For His glory
2. Sins and Curses.

I have heard these trite answers all my life and frankly I’m still shocked that anyone would think such awful things of a loving God. How on earth do any of these tie in with the loving Jesus shown to us in the Sermon on the Mount? How can you think that an all loving God wants us to fight, despite his own words, and wants little children to be born suffering, live suffering and die suffering?

The Sermon on the Mount shows us a loving God. We say the words, ‘God is love’; don't you believe those words? How can anyone think that He actually wants birth defects, crippling diseases, starvation, savagery, mutilation, wars, EVIL? Jesus and Christianity are all about love and peace, not about war and suffering. Does anyone really think that a loving God is going to torture an innocent baby just to punish the parents? Of course not! Who would honestly and truthfully praise a God who behaved like that?

Whatever the REAL answer to this question is, I cannot accept that any of you have got anywhere near the truth. It would be far better for you to say, 'I don't know' than come up with these 'answers' which paint a picture hate, spite and indifference.
 
It is not a childish and naïve question if you don’t understand and accept any ‘answer’ ever given to you in the last 70 years. It seems to me that you are simply avoiding the perfectly valid question.
Babies, young children, millions, if not billions of downtrodden, suffering, 'meek' people. You know, the ones who will inherit the earth.

I have heard these trite answers all my life and frankly I’m still shocked that anyone would think such awful things of a loving God. How on earth do any of these tie in with the loving Jesus shown to us in the Sermon on the Mount? How can you think that an all loving God wants us to fight, despite his own words, and wants little children to be born suffering, live suffering and die suffering?

The Sermon on the Mount shows us a loving God. We say the words, ‘God is love’; don't you believe those words? How can anyone think that He actually wants birth defects, crippling diseases, starvation, savagery, mutilation, wars, EVIL? Jesus and Christianity are all about love and peace, not about war and suffering. Does anyone really think that a loving God is going to torture an innocent baby just to punish the parents? Of course not! Who would honestly and truthfully praise a God who behaved like that?

Whatever the REAL answer to this question is, I cannot accept that any of you have got anywhere near the truth. It would be far better for you to say, 'I don't know' than come up with these 'answers' which paint a picture hate, spite and indifference.
The problem is that the issue is much more complex than most realize and it is ultimately a mystery as to why God continues to allow evil.

What we can say is that God's plan for the eradication of evil, for justice and putting things right, has begun. His Kingdom was inaugurated through the resurrection of Jesus, who's death was itself an act of immense evil. Followers of Jesus are to be about the kingdom business which very much includes bringing about justice and dealing with evil. The problem is that humans are often not to be trusted because we are very much a part of the problem.

This to me is very the problem with the problem of evil: we are to be the ones through whom the solution is to be carried out, yet we are very much a part of the problem.

Throw natural evil into the mix and it complicates things further.

Note that these are not my own thoughts. The best book I have read on this topic thus far, from where these ideas come, at least insofar as I have remembered them correctly, is http://www.amazon.ca/Evil-Justice-G...3986/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1330629476&sr=8-1
 
IMO, we suffer for many reasons, I look at it as if God is giving us an opportunity. Bad things happen for a reason. We just need to figure out what our place in the situation is and realize how we can change from it.
 
"...the creation was subjected to frustration, not by its own choice, but by the will of the one who subjected it, in hope that the creation itself will be liberated from its bondage to decay and brought into the glorious freedom of the children of God." (Romans 8:20-21 NIV1984)

The evil and frustration we are subjected to in this world is by God's design and intended to persuade us to end our love affair with this world and flee to the hope he has provided us in Jesus Christ and the kingdom to come. My hope in things to come, and my hatred for this world grows stronger every day with every reminder of how frustrating and evil a world without God really is.


20 He who testifies to these things says, “Yes, I am coming soon.”

Amen. Come, Lord Jesus. (Rev. 22:20 NIV1984)
 
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