Bible Study The Strong Delusion

[Nathan]

The wages; a fixed regular payment, typically paid on a daily or weekly basis, made by an employer to an employee, especially to a manual or unskilled worker, of sin, is death...

God is asking all to not die but live... That is all...

John 8:24
"I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins."

To believe the 'lie' or to believe the 'Truth'?

1 John 4:3
"And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world."

Every spirit.... Every person... Every life..... Regardless of age, gender, sexual orientation, sexual preference, gender identity, socio-economic standing, job title, profession of faith, family members.... Every Body that does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh, bodily form, is not of God and has that spirit of 'antichrist' within them....

I can say that I'm a christian but still say that I don't believe Jesus Christ had come in the flesh in bodily form.... How? A myth made up... Even the Jews, who do not believe that Jesus Christ was/is The Messiah, know that He came in the flesh in bodily form...

Hating Him means you believe He was here.. He may not have left nice memories but at least you believe and know He was here.. You can't hate something that was never even part of your life...

So to hate Him would mean that you were more of God than those that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh...

"And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God..."

So-

Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh, is of God.

And/But here is something strange:

Jude 1:4
"For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ."

Acts 20:28-30
"Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood. 29For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock. 30Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them."

Matthew 24:24
"For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect."

How are these men claiming that Jesus Christ had never come in the flesh? Do they profess 'A' Jesus but not 'The' Jesus Christ?

Is it possible for someone to say, 'I believe in Jesus but I don't believe in Jesus Christ'?

If someone should come in among you and says 'I believe in Jesus' and you in turn say, 'Oh, you believe upon Christ Jesus' and he turn his head and disagrees, he is one on whose lips is no knowledge.

There could be false Jesuses and false Christs, but can there be false Jesus Christs?

That is a pet peeve I've had to work hard on.

The real way it is said in the Bible is "Jesus The Christ". The writers just sometimes leave out "the" because it's inferred.

Yes, there can be someone who comes along proclaiming to be Jesus, The Christ.

 

[Betty]

I was listening to the radio and someone was talking about how they were confounded how most believers don't read the Bible.

Then it dawned on me. How can you love something you spend no time with? Ever wonder why David was so close to God?

I have been there before. I spent more time reading books about the Bible than reading the Bible itself.

It wasn't until I stopped reading 'other books' and spent more time in the Bible that I really fell in love with the truth.

I'm not saying other books are evil. But it was something that sparked a thought about this thread.

I feel the same about studying the word. There's others who definitely can and do sharpen us in different areas, and I personally believe that it's part of our learning, growing and maturing. However, there's something about studying the scriptures, prayerfully and searching out matters, (like you're doing on this thread.) that we can't get from anyone other than doing it the way Jesus said to do. "Seek and you shall find, knock and the door shall be opened unto you." That's a promise.

II think those are the things that really establish our hearts.

Proverbs 27:17 Iron sharpeneth iron; so a man sharpeneth the countenance of his friend.

Ecclesiastes 10:10 If the iron be blunt, and he do not whet the edge, then must he put to more strength: but wisdom is profitable to direct.

 

[ezrider]

God is asking all to not die but live... That is all...

Yes. No.

Jesus did NOT come to save us from DEATH. He came to save us from the SECOND DEATH.

 

[Nathan]

Yes. No.

Jesus did NOT come to save us from DEATH. He came to save us from the SECOND DEATH.

Second death = eternal death(separation)

 

[ezrider]

Second death = eternal death(separation)

Which bring us back to the strong delusion, and those not written in the book of life

Isaiah 66:4
I also will choose their delusions,
and will bring their fears upon them;
because when I called, none did answer;
when I spake, they did not hear:
but they did evil before mine eyes,
and chose that in which I delighted not.

Psalms 69:21-28
They gave me also gall for my meat;
and in my thirst they gave me vinegar to drink.
Let their table become a snare before them:
and that which should have been for their welfare, let it become a trap.
Let their eyes be darkened, that they see not;
and make their loins continually to shake.
Pour out thine indignation upon them,
and let thy wrathful anger take hold of them.
Let their habitation be desolate;
and let none dwell in their tents.
For they persecute him whom thou hast smitten;
and they talk to the grief of those whom thou hast wounded.
Add iniquity unto their iniquity:
and let them not come into thy righteousness.
Let them be blotted out of the book of the living,
and not be written with the righteous.

They are blotted out of the book of life because they did not come to the knowledge of God's Righteousness that is only revealed through Faith, but they have fallen under the delusion that come from trying to attain to the righteousness the comes by the law.

Romans 10:1-4
Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved. For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

 

[Nathan]

Which bring us back to the strong delusion, and those not written in the book of life

Isaiah 66:4
I also will choose their delusions,
and will bring their fears upon them;
because when I called, none did answer;
when I spake, they did not hear:
but they did evil before mine eyes,
and chose that in which I delighted not.

Psalms 69:21-28
They gave me also gall for my meat;
and in my thirst they gave me vinegar to drink.
Let their table become a snare before them:
and that which should have been for their welfare, let it become a trap.
Let their eyes be darkened, that they see not;
and make their loins continually to shake.
Pour out thine indignation upon them,
and let thy wrathful anger take hold of them.
Let their habitation be desolate;
and let none dwell in their tents.
For they persecute him whom thou hast smitten;
and they talk to the grief of those whom thou hast wounded.
Add iniquity unto their iniquity:
and let them not come into thy righteousness.
Let them be blotted out of the book of the living,
and not be written with the righteous.

They are blotted out of the book of life because they did not come to the knowledge of God's Righteousness that is only revealed through Faith, but they have fallen under the delusion that come from trying to attain to the righteousness the comes by the law.

Romans 10:1-4
Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved. For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

I am glad you brought this up.

"I also will choose their delusions,
and will bring their fears upon them;"

What are their fears? I find this most interesting. Because it's also always said that unbelievers during this time will 'seemingly' have no fears. "Peace and safety". Like in the days of Noah, etc.

 

[ezrider]

I am glad you brought this up.

"I also will choose their delusions,
and will bring their fears upon them;"

What are their fears? I find this most interesting. Because it's also always said that unbelievers during this time will 'seemingly' have no fears. "Peace and safety". Like in the days of Noah, etc.

They fear SIN and DEATH. They think if they continue to repent from sin, that the offering of Jesus will keep them from their death; and so they wait at the cross for the return of the Son of Man. They fear if they are found with sin that God will not accept them, and so they trap themselves under the shelter of the law.

If we are IN CHRIST, then we are alive by His resurrection. If we are risen with Christ, then we have also been crucified with Christ. To be crucified with Christ is to come to the knowledge and understanding of our own DEATH. The intent of the law was to bring us to this knowledge. But like Adam and Eve, the knowledge Death causes us to seek a covering for our sins and hide from the presence of the Lord.

 

[daninthelionsden]

I think you have to look no farther than the mega-churches of today to see mass delusion. These churches each have their own flavor of populist theologies or a mixture thereof. If someone were able to pull all these pop-culture theologies together and have actual spiritual power to work wonders on top of that.....then there lies the close counterfeit to beware of.

 

[Nathan]

I think you have to look no farther than the mega-churches of today to see mass delusion. These churches each have their own flavor of populist theologies or a mixture thereof. If someone were able to pull all these pop-culture theologies together and have actual spiritual power to work wonders on top of that.....then there lies the close counterfeit to beware of.

I agree that those are delusion(s) - but Paul speaks of a very specific delusion. Singular in nature.

 

[Nathan]

They fear SIN and DEATH. They think if they continue to repent from sin, that the offering of Jesus will keep them from their death; and so they wait at the cross for the return of the Son of Man. They fear if they are found with sin that God will not accept them, and so they trap themselves under the shelter of the law.

If we are IN CHRIST, then we are alive by His resurrection. If we are risen with Christ, then we have also been crucified with Christ. To be crucified with Christ is to come to the knowledge and understanding of our own DEATH. The intent of the law was to bring us to this knowledge. But like Adam and Eve, the knowledge Death causes us to seek a covering for our sins and hide from the presence of the Lord.

Isaiah 66:3-6
He who slaughters an ox is like one who kills a man;
he who sacrifices a lamb, like one who breaks a dog's neck;
he who presents a grain offering, like one who offers pig's blood;
he who makes a memorial offering of frankincense, like one who blesses an idol.
These have chosen their own ways,
and their soul delights in their abominations;

I also will choose harsh treatment for them
and bring their fears upon them,
because when I called, no one answered,
when I spoke, they did not listen;
but they did what was evil in my eyes
and chose that in which I did not delight.”

Hear the word of the LORD,
you who tremble at his word:
“Your brothers who hate you
and cast you out for my name's sake
have said, ‘Let the LORD be glorified,
that we may see your joy’;
but it is they who shall be put to shame.

“The sound of an uproar from the city!
A sound from the temple!
The sound of the LORD,
rendering recompense to his enemies!

I don't think its sin and death they fear. Remember what was said about the people in this day - that they would seek death, but will not find it. So if it is death they seek, then it would not be feared.

Look at the prophesy. They are making offerings and such. And then they "hate" brothers and "cast" them out in the name of God......saying "Let the LORD be glorified...." all in the pretense they are 'helping' the people.

These people think they are doing good. There is no fear in them. So whats the fear?

Here is a thought. Those who are outside of the truth, who are not in love with the truth, are by nature not 'caring' about the Lord coming back - even if they do believe it and do want to be 'in heaven' - they are not looking forward to it like we are urged to do. Why? Because they are in love with their own desires and things. Its the desire to 'live forever' so you can do more and get more here on earth.

What would be the biggest fear of these people? We have to remember that this is about people who think they are true believers. Being left behind in the resurrection. That would be the biggest fear.

Think about it. If you thought you were 'saved' and then witnessed something that looked like the coming of Jesus and the resurrection of the dead - and you were left behind - would that not turn you 100% against what you 'thought' you believed? Then, a false christ comes and starts to 'explain' things to you and what actually happened. Then, he points to the true believers - the ones that still hold to the fact that Christ is coming - and says "those people are the false believers, see, what they have told you all along is wrong".

People who love the truth will not be fooled by such a person. But those not in love would be easy targets.

 

[ezrider]

What would be the biggest fear of these people?

Could you imagine the fear that would come over people if they were to witness something like what happened to Ananias in the book of Acts?


Acts 5:1-5
But a certain man named Ananias, with Sapphira his wife, sold a possession, And kept back part of the price, his wife also being privy to it, and brought a certain part, and laid it at the apostles' feet. But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land? Whilst it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God. And Ananias hearing these words fell down, and gave up the ghost: and great fear came on all them that heard these things.

 

[Nathan]

Could you imagine the fear that would come over people if they were to witness something like what happened to Ananias in the book of Acts?


Acts 5:1-5
But a certain man named Ananias, with Sapphira his wife, sold a possession, And kept back part of the price, his wife also being privy to it, and brought a certain part, and laid it at the apostles' feet. But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land? Whilst it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God. And Ananias hearing these words fell down, and gave up the ghost: and great fear came on all them that heard these things.

That would be fearful for sure. But they had Godly fear. The ones talked about in Isaiah do not have Godly fear.

 

[Nathan]

I was reading something today and it caught my eye. Different denominations, beliefs, revolve around the 2nd coming of Christ. What I mean is, each denomination(other than the obvious cults) believe in His coming again. This is what Paul was dealing with in Thessalonians, both letters.

Then it hit me.

The ones believing in a pre-tribulation rapture would be caught off guard if the man of sin was to appear. They would be bewildered because they are supposed to be taken up before that happens.

The ones believing in a mid or post tribulation rapture would be caught off guard if the man of sin was to appear and be very convincing he is the returning christ here to set up the millennial reign.

The only thing that would keep either of these two situations from turning believers is if they are grounded in the truth - having a love of the truth. Many love truth, but not the truth. There are many on both sides of the rapture opinion that trust more in their leadership, in their respected denominations, and other peoples opinions, than they do the truth. Without a love of the truth, how will you know what the truth is? I suppose it wont matter at that point because those without a love of the truth will have the strong delusion given to them.

So in all reality, the love of the truth is paramount in a believers life. Regardless, this gives credible thought, not withstanding the context the passage is in, that the strong delusion has to do with the man of sin.

 

[daninthelionsden]

I was reading something today and it caught my eye. Different denominations, beliefs, revolve around the 2nd coming of Christ. What I mean is, each denomination(other than the obvious cults) believe in His coming again. This is what Paul was dealing with in Thessalonians, both letters.

Then it hit me.

The ones believing in a pre-tribulation rapture would be caught off guard if the man of sin was to appear. They would be bewildered because they are supposed to be taken up before that happens.

The ones believing in a mid or post tribulation rapture would be caught off guard if the man of sin was to appear and be very convincing he is the returning christ here to set up the millennial reign.

The only thing that would keep either of these two situations from turning believers is if they are grounded in the truth - having a love of the truth. Many love truth, but not the truth. There are many on both sides of the rapture opinion that trust more in their leadership, in their respected denominations, and other peoples opinions, than they do the truth. Without a love of the truth, how will you know what the truth is? I suppose it wont matter at that point because those without a love of the truth will have the strong delusion given to them.

So in all reality, the love of the truth is paramount in a believers life. Regardless, this gives credible thought, not withstanding the context the passage is in, that the strong delusion has to do with the man of sin.

It is the love of the TRUTH that will show us the lie when it is revealed. Those who love the truth hold to it despite its consequences. An atheist once asked " but what if you aren't one of the ones who make it to heaven?".....I told him I still want Christ to return regardless. He is the TRUTH. May He return soon.

 

[ezrider]

I agree that those are delusion(s) - but Paul speaks of a very specific delusion. Singular in nature.

In light of Isaiah 66 where the word declares the Lord shall choose their delusion, why do you think the delusion that Paul speaks of is singular in nature? The delusion has a specific purpose, but could the delusion appear in many forms? A delusion that is fitted for each doctrine of man?

 

[ezra]

I don't think so personally. Islam is so far removed from Christ it's not even in the same realm of Christianity.

I believe it's false. And many are tested in their faith because of it. But it's no different than any other false religion. It's definitely a strong force being used by satan.

The writers of the NT and prophets of the OT indicate that it's directly related to Christianity.

agreed

 

[Nathan]

In light of Isaiah 66 where the word declares the Lord shall choose their delusion, why do you think the delusion that Paul speaks of is singular in nature? The delusion has a specific purpose, but could the delusion appear in many forms? A delusion that is fitted for each doctrine of man?

I don't think it is plural in nature. The way it's spoken of is singular in nature and purpose.

Just like Christ is singular, and not 'a' Christ, but 'the' Christ. 'The' strong delusion will be singular and unmistakable to those not under it.

I think it's a collective of the different doctrines of man, that will unite(in a sense) everyone under it. It's then we see the line in the sand with two sides opposed to each other.

 

[ezrider]

I don't think it is plural in nature. The way it's spoken of is singular in nature and purpose.

Just like Christ is singular, and not 'a' Christ, but 'the' Christ. 'The' strong delusion will be singular and unmistakable to those not under it.

I think it's a collective of the different doctrines of man, that will unite(in a sense) everyone under it. It's then we see the line in the sand with two sides opposed to each other.

I would say the singular and unmistakable is the Spirit of Christ, but the delusion itself is subtle and varied.

Consider the words of Jesus, where he said straight is the way narrow the gate that leads to life, but broad is the way that leads to destruction. Does the broad way seem singular?

Maybe we should back up for a moment and look again at the purpose for the delusion?

 

[Nathan]

I would say the singular and unmistakable is the Spirit of Christ, but the delusion itself is subtle and varied.

Consider the words of Jesus, where he said straight is the way narrow the gate that leads to life, but broad is the way that leads to destruction. Does the broad way seem singular?

Maybe we should back up for a moment and look again at the purpose for the delusion?

I think the broad way is singular in nature. It's the whole thing of; right vs wrong. Light vs darkness. Black vs white.

I use this analogy a lot, but it serves its purpose. Anything that is not 100% pure is false. So there is only one small 'number' that can be true. Whereas, anything that is 1%-99% is false. A broad range compared to the singular 100%.

The broad way is showing that it is easy to go down that path. You can be 55%, 10%, 79%, etc.

But only 100% is the narrow path.

But I agree, we could back up and look at the purpose again.

 

[ezrider]

But I agree, we could back up and look at the purpose again.

2 Thessalonians 2:10-12
And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

This would imply that the reason for the strong delusion is because they did not receive the love the truth because they had pleasure unrighteousness. If we look at this in the light of Romans 1, then we see that they hold the truth in unrighteousness.

Romans 1:18-19
For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

Romans 1:28-32
And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

1 Thessalonians 5:9
For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,


Do we see a relationship between they did not receive the love of the truth and that they did not like to retain God in their knowledge? The truth that they hold in unrighteousness is the knowledge of the law and the knowledge of sin.


Romans 10:1-3
Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved. For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.