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Is the Trinity biblical and does it matter?

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Randy said:
To those who have been called by God, as no one goes to the Son unless enable by the Fathers Holy Spirit, Jesus is the wisdom and power of God.

I believe ALL that is written of Jesus and since I have the Spirit of Christ in me (for the Spirit was sent in His name) then I belong to Him and live by Him. (Jesus) Just as Jesus lives by the living Father. The first gentile believers starting calling themselves Christians (those that followed the way) because Jesus is called Christ. (In the beginning)

I believe Jesus to be the image of the invisible God and the exact representation of Gods being. The how that is so is where we differ. I don't believe Jesus always was I believe He is Gods firstborn and God (the one Jesus calls His God) was pleased to have His fullness dwell in His firstborn. In that context Jesus is mighty God, prince of peace, everlasting Father. And one with the Father. Paul="the fullness was pleased to dwell in Him". Jesus is not that fullness. The fullness was given and that fullness of God is the Father.

Jesus calls the Father the One true God. If Jesus always was and always was God then how do you believe in one God for Jesus stated on the cross, "Father into your hands I commit My Spirit"?

The Holy Spirit is the Spirit the Father calls "My Spirit" I assure you Jesus of Nazareth was not baptized with His own Spirit. Heaven was opened and the Spirit of the Sovereign Lord came down and remained on Him as John the baptist testified to.
John =>"I saw the Spirit come down from heaven as a dove and remain on him."
Jesus read from the scroll in the synagogue (He understood the Hebrew language as a 1st century Jew) =>Isaiah 61:1
The Spirit of the Sovereign LORD is on me, because the LORD has anointed me to proclaim good news to the poor. He has sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim freedom for the captives and release from darkness for the prisoners,

The testimony of the Father (God) about Jesus=>This is MY SON whom I love.....

The Father about Jesus=>
"Here is my servant, whom I uphold, my chosen one in whom I delight; I will put my Spirit on him, and he will bring justice to the nations.
(with light comes accountability)

Jesus=>.....
for it will not be you speaking, but the Spirit of your Father speaking through you.

The Spirit Jesus sent He received form the Father (Acts 2)
Peter addresses the crowd of Israelites
Exalted to the right hand of God, he has received from the Father the promised Holy Spirit and has poured out what you now see and hear. 34 For David did not ascend to heaven, and yet he said,

“‘The Lord said to my Lord:
“Sit at my right hand
35 until I make your enemies
a footstool for your feet.”’[f]


Jesus is the word of the Father.
Don't you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you I do not speak on my own authority. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work.

Jesus=>“If anyone hears my words but does not keep them, I do not judge that person. For I did not come to judge the world, but to save the world.48There is a judge for the one who rejects me and does not accept my words; the very words I have spoken will condemn them at the last day.49For I did not speak on my own, but the Father who sent me commanded me to say all that I have spoken.50I know that his command leads to eternal life. So whatever I say is just what the Father has told me to say.”

Jesus=>
Anyone who does not love me will not obey my teaching. These words you hear are not my own; they belong to the Father who sent me.

Hebrews 1
In the past God spoke to our ancestors through the prophets at many times and in various ways, 2but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom also he made the universe. 3The Son is the radiance of God’s glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven. 4So he became as much superior to the angels as the name he has inherited is superior to theirs.

The Son that was (his spirit) was in the tent of the body God prepared for Him. The Father was in Him.

Randy
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hello Randy, dirtfarmer here

The Trinity is important, without it how could God have reconciled mankind?
 
wondering said:
The trinity is a Roman Catholic concept?
You mean Protestants don't believe that God Father, God Jesus and God the Holy Spirit are one God??
Are they 3 Gods??
Click to expand...
I browsed a Bible site once wherein the insular group there were polytheist Christians. Meaning they believed in three separate beings in Heaven as, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

That was new to me and they were apparently quite adamant when numerous threads there extended to many pages of debate over their factual assertions to that end.

I accept that God said he is one. And as one he being also a spirit is also a Holy Spirit. And as such he created himself as Jesus Christ upon Mary so as to bring himself in the flesh to the world and directly effect the scriptures teachings about God. And the savior of the world. It's all the one Holy Spirit God.
 
dirtfarmer said:
hello Randy, dirtfarmer here

The Trinity is important, without it how could God have reconciled mankind?
Click to expand...
dirtfarmer said:
hello Randy, dirtfarmer here

The Trinity is important, without it how could God have reconciled mankind?
Click to expand...

There was no NT or doctrine of the trinity in the beginning. Were people saved? Did they call on the Lord? Weren't they baptized in Jesus's name? We follow Jesus and He uses truth. I don't deny God the Father or Jesus our Lord. Rather I speak of their relationship. Jesus has always been the Son and the Father has always been His God. Nothing has changed. Jesus has been given the authority to have life in Himself and to give life. He stated so and stated the one who gave Him authority to judge.

Those that listen and learn from the Father go to the Son and Jesus will raise them up on the last day. No one goes to the Son unless the Father enables them. The Holy Spirit bears witness. He speaks what He hears from the mind of the Spirit. Nothing has changed.

Baptize in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit and I add for this discussion note the word "Son"

Randy
 
Randy said:
There was no NT or doctrine of the trinity in the beginning. Were people saved? Did they call on the Lord? Weren't they baptized in Jesus's name? We follow Jesus and He uses truth. I don't deny God the Father or Jesus our Lord. Rather I speak of their relationship. Jesus has always been the Son and the Father has always been His God. Nothing has changed. Jesus has been given the authority to have life in Himself and to give life. He stated so and stated the one who gave Him authority to judge.

Those that listen and learn from the Father go to the Son and Jesus will raise them up on the last day. No one goes to the Son unless the Father enables them. The Holy Spirit bears witness. He speaks what He hears from the mind of the Spirit. Nothing has changed.

Baptize in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit and I add for this discussion note the word "Son"

Randy
Click to expand...

hello Randy, dirtfarmer here

Does "Baptize in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost" mean by their authority?
 
dirtfarmer said:
hello Randy, dirtfarmer here

Does "Baptize in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost" mean by their authority?
Click to expand...

I didn't read where the Lord, (the one who gave that command), justified Himself with a reason. But none of that takes away from Jesus always being the Son.

I assume its along the lines of 1 john 5:7. The source of the gospel witness is the Father. Whether His Spirit or His Son conveys His Will in words or deeds. The Spirit will act on Jesus's will as well as Jesus has a place on His Fathers throne. The miracles were performed by the Holy Spirit at the command/will of Jesus. Jesus has that authority from the Father. As all that belongs to the Father also belongs to the Son.

Randy
 
For me, I believe what came first in God's own inspired words. Deuteronomy 6:4. And Jesus' reiterating that passage in Mark 12:29.
 
Randy said:
I didn't read where the Lord, (the one who gave that command), justified Himself with a reason. But none of that takes away from Jesus always being the Son.

I assume its along the lines of 1 john 5:7. The source of the gospel witness is the Father. Whether His Spirit or His Son conveys His Will in words or deeds. The Spirit will act on Jesus's will as well as Jesus has a place on His Fathers throne. The miracles were performed by the Holy Spirit at the command/will of Jesus. Jesus has that authority from the Father. As all that belongs to the Father also belongs to the Son.

Randy
Click to expand...

hello Randy, dirtfarmer here

Why do you find water "baptism" in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost necessary?
 
Randy said:
I didn't read where the Lord, (the one who gave that command), justified Himself with a reason. But none of that takes away from Jesus always being the Son.

I assume its along the lines of 1 john 5:7. The source of the gospel witness is the Father. Whether His Spirit or His Son conveys His Will in words or deeds. The Spirit will act on Jesus's will as well as Jesus has a place on His Fathers throne. The miracles were performed by the Holy Spirit at the command/will of Jesus. Jesus has that authority from the Father. As all that belongs to the Father also belongs to the Son.

Randy
Click to expand...

hello Randy, dirtfarmer here

I can't find any where that water baptism, I am assuming that yo are referencing :water baptism", was given to the Chruch.
 
Mustard Socks said:
For me, I believe what came first in God's own inspired words. Deuteronomy 6:4. And Jesus' reiterating that passage in Mark 12:29.
Click to expand...
Deut. 6:4 is not a statement about the nature of God; it is a statement of monotheism.
 
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